Not an April Fools’ Joke: Army Officer Defies Orders Unless Obama Shows Birth Certificate

[...] Not an April Fools' Joke: Army Officer Defies Orders Unless Obama … [...]

[...] Not an April Fools' Joke: Army Officer Defies Orders Unless Obama … [...]

Good for him! The Emperor has no clothes. Why should any soldier serve under a phoney commander in chief?

Hi kids! Can you say “penitentiary?” I knew you could!

Oh, goody, has he hired Orly yet? Will his case get thrown out before Orly gets disbarred? Will she file in Judge Land's court? These and other exciting questions await the next episode of…

“As the Orly Turns”

This is sad. The man needs some mental health assistance. It seems the stress of being redeployed has caused some damage. He shouldn't be mocked, rather pitied.

Why would someone who has been promoted so far up in our military fall for unsourced nonsense from a conspiracy website?

Are there any other sources about this other than a youtube video and Whirrled Nuts Daily?

go straight to leavenworth, do not pass go, you cross burining redneck prick

Why hasn't this man been identified and discharged s an obvious mental case. Let's remember the Muslim doctor who was running around in native garb and giving off signs that something very bad was going to happen? He ended up killing 12 of his fellow soldiers in cold blood. Get rid of this guy asap.

Good question.

Unfortunately there are a LOT of wingnuts in the military, usually ultra-conservative Christians who went through the service academies. Fortunately the ones who came in through ROTC and OCS find them laughable, and since they outnumber the ringknockers….

It would seem there is a history of Lt. Cols. being nuts. See North, Oliver…

Sorry, I come down in support of the doctor. It is imperative that the commander in chief be a legal commander. Without a birth certificate and all those hidden school records it is plausible that the man is an imposter. Fess up Obama. Show me the birth certificate.

the is nuts, but what I want to know is why did he film this in a library ? was it really the only place he had access to a flag prop ?

LtC Lakin, meet UCMJ.

UCMJ, meet metally defective birfer……

and I insist on seeing Bush's, Reagan's… etc. etc. what a bogus bunch of bs

“the founding fathers, all devout Christians”

What is your basis for concluding that the Founding Fathers were “all devout Christians”?

Are you aware that Thomas Jefferson created his own version of the New Testament, in which (using a razor blade!) he removed all references to angels, miracles, prophecy, the geneaolgy of Jesus, the Holy Trinity, and the divinity and resurrection of Jesus? Does that sound like a “devout Christian” to you?

He appears to be saying not only that HE won't comply with any orders from his superior officers, he also doesn't think anyone else in the U.S. Armed Forces should. That would seem to meet the definition of “mutiny” under the Uniform Code of Military Justice:

894. ART. 94. MUTINY OR SEDITION
(a) Any person subject to this chapter who–
(1) with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority, refuses, in concert with any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;
(2) with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates, in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or disturbance against that authority is guilty of sedition;
(3) fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.
(b) A person who is found guilty of attempted mutiny, mutiny, sedition, or failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court- martial may direct.

When Judge Carter (a Marine Captain) dismissed the case brought by Orly Taitz and Gary Kreep, he noted that there is a term for officers who refuse to obey orders, but that he would leave it to the military to deal with the issue. The time has come.

This Lt. Colonel has been serving for 18 years. Did he insist on seeing Bill Clinton's birth certificate? Did he insist on seeing George W. Bush's birth certificate? I don't recall either Clinton or Bush being asked to prove where they were born. But that would be silly — they are white men, so of course they are eligible to be President.

Finally, Lt. Col. Lakin is a medical officer (flight surgeon). Did the United States pay for his medical training? Has he refused all other orders since President Obama took office in January 2009, or like Captain Rhodes, did he object only to being deployed back to a war zone?

Now I know I am living in a nation gone mad. Lt.Col. Terry Lakin is in serious need of psychiatric care and should not be in charge of any American soldiers in Afghanistan or anywhere else as he may well be insane. It has been shown with a 100% degree of certainty that Barack Hussein Obama was born in Honolulu HI on 4th August 1961 and there is indeed a certified birth certificate that has been viewed by thousands of people. In addition birth announcements were placed in the local newspapers which can be viewed today in the archives of those newspapers. People who question the President's citizenship are either insane or have a very dangerous and seditious agenda in mind.

If you look at the video in “full screen” mode, you can see that bookshelf behind his left shoulder is marked “World War II.” So I think they wanted the backdrop of the flag and books about the military.

‘What is your basis for concluding that the Founding Fathers were “all devout Christians”?’
Texas Board of Education?

Shown months ago, you traitorous filth.

List of all presidents who have had the governor of their birth state verify that they were born in the governor's state —

1). Barack Obama
2).
3),

I am sure that the good doctor is heartened to know that standing behond him is someone who has the same initials as BlowJob.
All he needs now is ClusterFuck and AssHat on his side.
Oh wait…

Article 92, Uniform Code of Military Justice;

TEXT.

“Any person subject to this chapter who-

1) violates or fails to obey any lawful general order or regulation;
2) having knowledge of any other lawful order issued by a member of the armed forces, which it is his duty to obey, fails to obey the order; or
3) is derelict in the performance of his duties; shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.”

ELEMENTS.

1) violation of or failure to obey a lawful general order or regulation.
a) That there was in effect a certain lawful general order or regulation;
b) That the accused had a duty to obey it; and
c) That the accused violated or failed to obey the order or regulation.

2) Failure to obey other lawful order.
a) That a member of the armed forces issued a certain lawful order;
b) That the accused had knowledge of the order;
c) That the accused had a duty to obey the order; and
d) That the accused failed to obey the order.

3) Dereliction in the performance of duties.
a) That the accused had certain duties;
b) That the accused knew or reasonably should have known of the duties; and
c) That the accused was (willfully) (through neglect or culpable inefficiency) derelict in the performance of those duties.

This affords little wiggle-room in LtC Lakin's defense. He would be guilty under both sections under the elements of Article 92. He knows this, of course, so he can stand in defense of his country, it's flag, it's President and it's people, or he can stand in a cell in Leavenworth.

Ball's in his court (so to speak).

I enjoy the path starting at 1:30 that goes like this;

The Constitution doesn't assign anyone the responsibility of verifying anyone's eligibility, so it should be fixed, and then immediately move into telling Obama it is his responsibility to show a signed birth certificate, to uphold the Constitution.

Amen, Amen, Amen!

Proceed directly to court martial. Do not pass go, do not collect $200.00. I don't want my tax dollars going to support a mutinous or seditious individual(s) who will not obey orders. I am willing to bet we paid for the education of his becoming a doctor. I would say he should lose that medical license as well as everything else he has gained being in the military. He should not be allowed in any way to profit for what we paid for. I wonder if he has a family that supports his decision to throw away his life's work? Probably divorced and another minion under Oily's spell!

You are wrong on so many levels it's not even funny. This man is a genuine American hero and patriot. How dare you attack him like that? Finnally, somebody with some backbone that will stand up and do what's right. I wore the uniform myself for 8 years buddy, and I would gladly do the same thing as this gentleman is doing. You probably didn't pay for jack #### of my training or his anyway so please be quite about how much money of your tax dollars were wasted. If that idiot Barack Hussein Obama would just show his ORIGINAL birth certificate, and not that stupid laser printed scan copy that is apparently good enough for idiots like you, then we wouldn't be in this situation. Also, why don't you do some research and find out how many lawsuites are going on right now against Obama on this issue and I wonder how much of your tax payer dollars are being WASTED by Obama's lawyers to have these lawsuites thrown out. It's been reported to be over one million dollars. Are you going to be bellyaching over that too? Lets be fair. What needs to happen is Obama should in fact produce the darn thing and if he can't, and if it's proven he wasn't born here, HE should go directly to “court martial” or rather impeachment hearings and then he should go straight to jail. Then, morons like you can cry about it.

your right but sometimes patriotism and respect for ones country and laws elevate people to make sacrifices that most of us wouldn't have the courage to do. This guy has what's called character, honor, and principals.

It's abundently obvious that Obama is in fact hiding something, we know nothing little about his past, he won't even admit to which hospital in Hawaii he was born at. Seriously, can anybody on this board look up and tell me which of the two hospitals in Hawaii Obama was born at? It's not listed anywhere and to make matters worse, he's already admitted at different times, to being born at both hospitals. After that contradiction, he won't even say anymore and neither hospital will claim him. So, we have a President, the first in history that we don't know the name of the hospital he was born in?

He's also the first President in history that has HAD to have a governor verify he was born there. Also, what did the governor base it off of, the same laser printed worthless scan copy that Hussien Obama put on the internet to “prove” he was born there. I guess I'm just not as nieve as most folks. I want more information, like the name of the hospital he was born at, the doctors name, etc. I can produce a copy of my sons birth certificate so he can get his drivers license but the leader of the free world who has access to “the button” can't do the same??? Something isn't right. Thank God for LtC Lakin, I wish I was still in the military so I could do the same thing!

Your an idiot. Total moron. Lt. Col Lakin is a bonafide patriot, plain and simple. It has NOT been shown with 100% degree of certainty that Hussien Obama was born in Hawaii on August 4rth, 1961. And, if you talking about that laser printed scan copy that he has tried to pass off as an original birth certificate, that is NOT an original one. First of all, do your homework. Just because there was a birth announcement doesn't mean he was born there. The hospitals have already said they could be phoned in and they weren't checked. It wasn't uncommon for people to do this back then, folks that didn't live there but had planned to move there. The state of Hawaii has already said that scan copies could and have been issued to people that werent born there. I guess I'm insane according to your idoitic standards since I think Obama is a fraud and don't believe he was born here. He could end all if it by paying 20 bucks for a copy of the ORIGINAL and letting us all see it. I guess he's got plenty of idiots like you that believe him though.

DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH

News Release

LINDA LINGLE
GOVERNOR
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________

CHIYOME LEINAALA FUKINO M.D.
DIRECTOR
Phone: (808) xxx-xxxx
Fax: (808) xxx-xxxx
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________

For Immediate Release: July 27, 2009 09-063

STATEMENT BY HEALTH DIRECTOR CHIYOME FUKINO, M.D.

“I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, Director of the Hawai?i State Department of Health, have seen the original vital
records maintained on file by the Hawai‘i State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawai‘i and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago.”

###

And why would he have to have that done — because you can't accept the fact that a majority of us voted for the man,unlike certain others who had more .. shall we say questionable electoral results.
Is it because some wacko dentist told you so, hell even Glenn Beck realizes he was born in the US — and Becks certainly not the sharpest knife in the drawer. .

The man is fulfilling the promises that he made and I voted for — get over it!

He's doing it to protect the Constitution of the United States of America!!! Does that mean ANYTHING to you????? If he gets court martialed and his career is ended, then so be it. It's not about that for him, it's about standing up for what is right. Do you know how much courage it takes for someone to do what he is doing?? Probably not. You and the other idiots on the board probably couldn't muster up enough courage between all of you put together to do what this one man is doing. Thank God for LTC Lakin.

About your other points, all the judges that have dismissed the cases so far are the opposite of LTC Akin. There not willing to sacrifice their careers in the name of defending the Constitution. I honestly believe they just don't want to be the one to challenge Obama on this, too much political risk for them. Bill Clinton and GW Bush were never asked for their birth certificates because it was never an issue. It was already very well documented on where they were born, which hospitals they were born at, who their parents were, etc. It's stupid to even make that comparison. Details of Hussein Obama's past are very vague and murky. The weisels in the media never seriously scrutinized him, we don't have any of his college transcripts, thesis, copies of passports,etc, etc. We don't even know WHICH of the two hospitals in Hawaii he was born at. Think I'm making that up? Go and research it then report back on this board on the name of the hospital he was born at? Obama in fact is the only modern U.S. President that we don't know the name of the hospital he was born at. Don't you find that odd???? Personally, I think Hussein Obama is a FRAUD. If it is proven he in not eligable, I expect him to be handcuffed and escorted out of the White House to a prison cell where he should spend a very long time at.

Wrong from beginning to end. Have you taken your lithium today?

Please define “nieve.” It is not in the dictionary.

Lt. Col. Lakin is a coward and false to his oath. That you could defend him speaks volumes about your own hatred for this country.

No, Barack Obama has never said that he was born at Queens Hospital. It you can provide a link to a statement from the President saying he was born at Queens Hospital, I will humbly admit I was wrong and beg your forgiveness. His sister (who is younger than he is, and therefore has no firsthand knowledge) once stated he was born at Queens Hospital, but to my knowledge, Barack Obama has never said that.

And if you can't find proof to support your allegation, I assume you will openly admit you were wrong. (Or else you will act like the idiot birfer you appear to be, and claim that the evidence was “scrubbed from the internet”).

What was shown “months ago”? Are you talking about the laser printed scan copy that doesn't show the name of the hospital or the signature of the doctor?? Your the only filth around here. This man has more character in the dirt under his fingernails than you have in your whole body. screw you.

hey, your a complete total idiot.

You have an interesting notion of burden of proof. Where in the U.S. Constitution does it say that a Presidential candidate, President-elect, or President must prove the place and date of their birth “with 100% certainty”?

And I guess I missed the reports of how the Presidents 1 through 43 met this burden of proof. Can you provide me a link to the historical records showing, for example, that Abraham Lincoln provided proof “with 100% certainty” regarding the date and place of his birth?

well, if that jack### Obama would just produce his ORIGINAL and not that laser printed scan copy that seems to satisfy all the liberal idiots out there, I'll bet we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

1. He’s refusing orders on bogus grounds. That’s not a hero or a patriot. That’s a coward who should be stripped of his decorations and have his sword broken in public.
2. Prove that you actually did more than march around with your local ROTC unit, REMF.
3. I’ve been a taxpayer all my life and never asked for a government dime. That you, this traitor, and that lardbrained idiot Borderraven lived off of my taxes is a disgrace.
4. The President HAS shown his birth certificate. He also seems able to punctuate, which is more than I can say for you.
5. It’s “lawsuit,” not “lawsuite,” you illiterate thug.
6. NONE of the “lawsuites” have succeeded because they’re groundless. That’s why they aren’t costing the taxpayers a dime, since the LOSERS are responsible for court costs in a civil suit.
7. The President isn’t the military and can’t be court martialed.
8. The President already produced his birth certificate.
9. The President has committed no impeachable offense.
10. The only crying I do over birther allegations is caused by hysterical laughter at their uniform level of stupidity, illiteracy, and racism.

how would you know? And, is there a problem with being a Christian? Do you have to be
“ultra conservative” to be a Christian? I guess the founding fathers, all devout Christians, would be “wingnuts” to you too?

See this is how mis-information happens. That is not her statement and she never said the words you quote “was born in Hawai'i and is a natural-born American citizen” The orginal statment can be found here http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2008/08-93.pdf. She only states she has “seen” the birth certificate and it exist.

1. I see no evidence that Lt. Col. Lakin has courage, morals, convictions, or anything more than a desire to avoid his duty based on specious grounds.
2. The President wrote a memoir published long before he even considered running for national office. If anything, we know more about him and his past than any previous President, since Dreams of My Father *wasn’t* written as a campaign bio or puff piece.
3. The President was born at Kapiolani Medical Center. This was reported in numerous newspapers and magazines. HE never said otherwise.
4. Hospitals can’t confirm or deny that anyone was born or treated there. It’s called HIPAA, and Kapiolani would be subject to legal sanctions if they made an exception for sub-normal fanatics like you.
5. The first President to be born in a hospital was Jimmy Carter. That’s not precisely a long history.

First, I don't laud his “courage”. That is relegated to the battlefield (something I know a little about). I consider him an idiot. Commisioned Officers are bound by many things, even more so than Non-Commisioned and enlisted. He knows what is at stake, and I wouldn't sacrifice my freedom or ethics for something that does not make sense. He sacrificed his character, honor and principles to something created by a toiler. Her racism and disregard for this country transcend anything she could conjure up by way of “patriotism”.

President Obama has hidden nothing. His BC is, and has been available to see for more than a year. The demands for “personal” viewing are immaterial.

Consider this, with all the crazy “justifications” and accusations, one thing has been proven by the birfers: We the People, ALL of us, aren't American. NONE of us can prove to anyone else, that we are who and what we say we are. That is the end result of Orly Taitz's ridiculous demand.

As far as Taitz, herself? Look up the laundry list of frivolous lawsuits (they were adjudicated as such by JUDGES) filed by her. Then look up the problems she faces as a result of them. This is not a conspiracy, any more than the President's BC is a conspiracy. That this whole thing still exists is pathetic.

STOP IT! It's over.

LTC Lakin is a genuine American patriot. I applaude him for having the backbone and courage to do what he is doing. He is willing to risk his career in order to “protect and defend” the Constitution, as he swore to do when he took his oath. I wish I was still in the military so I could do the same thing. As for all the liberal trash that's stinking up this message board with their hateful disgusting comments, you guys are either stupid, nieve, or both. I know Hussein Obama is hiding something and if in fact it turns out he's not eligable, he should be immeadiately handcuffed and led out of the White House to a nice prison cell where he can spend many, many years at. The man is a FRAUD!!!!!!

Firstly I am neither an idiot nor a total moron and for you to start off a
conversation in that manner is indicative of a person without manners who
cannot hold a civil conversation. Let's discuss this in a sane manner.
Assuming Obama is both sane and intelligent and I and most people on the
planet believe he is and I suspect that even a conspiracy theorist like
yourself must believe it too, then please tell me why a sane and intelligent
person would run for President knowing that under the Constitution it is
required that persons running for the Presidency must be American born
citizens. If he were not an American born citizen it would have been proven
without a shadow of a doubt at least 3 years ago if not earlier but there
has not been a single shred of evidence to indicate that he was born
anywhere other than on Hawaii on August 4th 1961. Do you suppose for one
moment that all the thousands of reporters who have been digging into his
past in minute detail would not by now have found the evidence they would
need to prove he was not an American born citizen if the evidence were
there. No evidence, none, zero.
Get it through your head OBAMA IS AN AMERICAN BORN CITIZEN.
Snopes, which is an apolitical site that takes no sides but simply reports
the facts as it finds them reports as per the following links:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcerti…
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/k…
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/citizen.asp
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/c…

Please read them and if you still insist on believing that President Obama
is not an American born citizen then there's no hope for you and I will wash
my hands of any further communication with you.
AC

Thanks for sharing your anger with us. When exactly did you discover that you can't stand the thought of a black man being President?

Have you read the opinion of U.S. District Judge David Carter (Captain, USMC, retired) explaining why the “birther” lawsuits are without merit? Try. Just try reading it, and then explain to us on this board exactly why Judge Carter is wrong.

Answer this, scholar: where in the United States Constitution does it give unelected federal judges the authority to rule on the eligibility of a sitting President? The Constitution provides only one avenue for removing a sitting President — impeachment by the House followed by trial and conviction in the Senate. The ONLY role the courts have in that process is that the Constitution designates that the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court presides over the trial in the Senate (but doesn't have vote).

If you think Obama should be impeached, then go complain to Congress. No member of Congress has introduced articles of impeachment. I don't think it is a lack of courage — any Republican who could prove that Obama is not eligible to be President would be a hero to his party. No, it isn't a lack of courage. It is that they know you birthers are simply wrong. You are blinded by your hatred of the President. And to get your way, you would be more than happy to completely sacrifice the separation of powers in the Constitution by letting unelected federal judges do what only our elected Representatives and Senators can lawfully do.

A person who tries to get out of service on bogus BS is not a hero in my book. And for your information I have been a taxpaying American citizen for 38 years so I object strenuously to an “order-dodger” getting anything more. My family has served honorably and proudly for as long as our family history has been traced, so I come from a long line of those who serve, as did my spouse.

The president has shown his certificate and his certificate has almost
identical information as my replacement certificate I got after misplacing mine and I know damn good and well I was born in the USA. When you add to that the Hawaiian Department of Health director issuing more than one statement confirming that she has examined the original document on file and the president was born there, the republican governor of Hawaii confirming the same thing, then it takes a stupid person like the Lt. Col. and you evidently seem to be to try to claim otherwise. You drank the Oily kool aid and you are the fool. If you indeed served in the military, we need to raise the standards again. I have helped to pay as has every other taxpayer in these United States. So we have a right to expect a certain level of behavior from those who we support. This wing nut is not living up to that and evidently you aren't either. If you are not already separated from service than that should be done immediately. I hope the idiot Larkin loses it all. That is what he deserves. Good riddance to bad rubbish! And you too.

See, this is how stupid happens.

Look at the date on the press release posted by “Make the Pie Higher”: July 27, 2009. Then check the link you provided: press release dated October 31, 2008. Note that the press release quoted by “Pie” refers back to an October 2008 press release. Is a lightbulb going on? Do you realize you have accused “Pie” of falsifying a press release that was issued 8 months after the one you linked to? Now try looking at this link:
http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2009/09-063.pdf

Finally, how about you admit that you are stupid, and you apologize to “Make The Pie Higher” for accusing Pie of spreading misinformation when in fact you are the one who is utterly and completely wrong?

Any State is free, as Hawaii has done, to provide proof of birth in a form other than a photocopy of the “original” birth certificate. If the document bears the Seal of the State, and the stamp/signature of the authorized official, it is proof of the place and date of birth for all legal purposes. You can use it to get a drivers license. You can use it to get a passport. It is self-authenticating evidence in court. If you don't believe me, look at Federal Rules of Evidence 902(1) and 902(4).

I won't hold my breath.

What an idiot. It seems to be a common trait of the ignorant, cowardly birfoons.

You say that you served eight years in uniform. Under which Presidents? Can you provide us with copies of his or their original birth certificates? Can you even provide us with a link to a State-issued “laser printed scan” showing where and when he or they were born?

If you think “100% certain” proof is required, why didn't you have the courage to insist the President(s) under which you served provide that same degree of proof?

I did, however, enjoy the irony of the conspiracy theorist's first sentence, “Your an idiot.”
It reminds me of the tea partier's sign that read “Obama is a moran.”

Well, jrj, you could do what Captain Cook did. Then you too could show how really courageous you are. So, when are you going to show that you're not just hot air?

Or was that Major Cook? Any idea jrj?

At least one Captain Cook (James) was killed by native Hawaiians in 1779. Is that what you had in mind for jrj?

Are any of you Obama supporters inquisitive at all, in any shape or form as to why Barack Obama refuses to produce any documents that would shed light on any part of his past, beyond his birth certificate?
This would include: kindergarten records, Punahou school records, Occidental college records, Columbia University records, his Columbia thesis, Harvard Law School records, Harvard Law review articles, Scholarly articles from the University of Chicago, his passport, his medical records, his files from his years as a Illinois state senator, his Illinois State Bar Association records, any baptism records and his adoption records.

*SIGH*

None of what you listed is relevant to anything. I support President Obama because he is my PRESIDENT. Of the United States. A leader of the free world.

The past demands and “logic” of the birfers have conjured up these “inimitable facts”:

The President's birth certificate is a forgery (hello, Orly Taitz). There is a long form which is either being withheld, or non-existent.
ACTUAL fact: There is NO long-form. They were discontinued in 1946/7.

The BC online is not valid, because it doesn't resemble BC's from other states.
ACTUAL fact: States have their own formats. It would be stupid to think that my BC resembles anyone else's, who was not born in the same Military hospital on Guam, and my siblings, who were born in Hawaii, ARE different. One was even born in the SAME hospital as Obama, and theirs is EXACTLY the same as the one online. Also, if the one online is a “forgery”, then every American's BC is. Realize what that means? None of us is who we say we are. NONE of us is American.

President Obama was born in Kenya.
for this, there are NO actual facts, because the burden of proof lies with the birfers, and there has been NO credible evidence to even “suggest” the “truth” of the claim. Forgeries don't count (hello, again, Orly).

Please, the ACTUAL facts are a matter of record. It is the fault of no one here, who doesn't believe the crap originally spouted by someone who should have her citizenship revoked, that you and other birfers don't get the message that this whole ridiculous thing is OVER.

LtC Lakin has taken an extreme view of this idiocy, and sacrificed everything soldiers who came before him fought and died for. Now, he will be languishing in a Federal Prison cell, for sticking to this nonsense. A high price to pay for something so stupid.

“Bill Clinton and GW Bush were never asked for their birth certificates because it was never an issue.”
I think that says a lot more than you think, or would be comfortable with, if explored further.
Do you use bleach for your white sheets and hood?

There must more than one Constitution in play here. There's just got to be…

His new roommate at Fort Leavenworth is looking forward to playing “Doctor.”

This thread is about a commissioned officer in the U.S. Army who is refusing to obey a deployment order from a superior commissioned officer in the U.S. Army, based on the inferior officer's supposed qualms about the President's eligibility for office. What, pray tell, do the records you mention have to do with that issue?

You drop in, posting for the first time ever, as if the exact issue you are raising has not been discussed dozens (if not hundreds) of times on the TWI blog. It has been discussed, ad nauseum. Let me fill you in:

(1) None of the records you mention are relevant to eligibility for the Presidency.

(2) Assuming you are a voter, and this being a democracy, guess what recourse you have if a political candidate refuses to provide you with personal information (medical records, Sunday School records, musical preferences, penis size) you would like to have? You, dear voter, can then choose (for good reasons, bad reasons, or no reason at all) to vote for someone else. Get it? And you don't get to dictate to any other voter what information is or isn't relevant to their decision.

(3) Most of the records you mention (all the educational records) are private as a matter of federal law (the Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act of 1974, which applies to any educational institution that receives federal money, including through federal financial aid to its students). You and I don't have a right to see them. If you want them out of curiosity, please refer to #2.

(4) I have no idea to what baptism records you refer, or why on earth that would be relevant to eligibility, given that the Consitution expressly forbids any religious test for public office. For myself, I don't know or care whether Obama, or any other President or politician, has been baptized. Being a Christian isn't a requirement for office, and being baptized is not required even in some sects of Christianity (see Religious Society of Friends).

(5) Barack Obama was not adopted by his step-father — he couldn't have been adopted without the permission of his father, or a court order terminating his father's rights. His father died in 1982, two years after Obama's mother and Lolo Soetoro divorced. But you would know all of that, if you were inquisitive enough to do the research.

(6) We know that Barack Obama was elected President of the Harvard Law Review by his fellow members of the Review. You will not find any Harvard Law Review articles with his name on them because, by longstanding tradition, student writing published in HLR is unsigned: “All student writing is unsigned. This policy reflects the fact that many members of the Review, besides the author, make a contribution to each published piece”: http://www.harvardlawreview.org/about.php
Of course, you would already know that if you were as inquisitive as Obama supporters.

(7) He was a Lecturer and then a Senior Lecturer at University of Chicago Law School. Those are not tenure-track positions (he was offered tenure track, but declined), and publication of scholarly articles therefore is not required.

(8) Why do you want Illinois State Bar Association records? Are you even aware that the ISBA is a voluntary association and does not regulated either the admission or the discipline of lawyers? Of course you aren't aware of that, because you copied your list of information you want from somewhere else, and are not inquisitive enough to do the research. The organization that regulates admission and discipline in Illinois is the Attorney Registration & Disciplinary Commission of the Illinois Supreme Court. You can look Barack Obama up on their website: https://www.iardc.org/lawyersearch.asp You will find that he was admitted to practice on December 17, 1991, and has no disciplinary record. But you weren't inquisitive enough to check, were you?

(9) What Illinois State Senate records do you want? Have you made a public records request to the State of Illinois to get them? If not, they must not be that important to you.

Thanks for dropping in. Next time, spend some time reading what the “Obama supporters” here have written before you start repeating birther talking points you haven't bothered to research.

Thanks, Bear, for filling in the blanks.

Well, at least he won't have to ever pay for proctology exams, huh?

Typical birfer: cuts and pastes from some frightwing site, and then accuses the “regulars” here of not being “inquisitive.”

I went to school with some Moran's but I don't remember the president being one of them. Of course they had a really big extended family???

Utter and total horse pucky. Go back to birtherland and don't come back.

Lakin, you're not really a soldier, are you? Anyone can SAY they're a member of the armed forces. Where's your proof? You could be anyone. You could be an Al Quada terrorist who speaks English flawlessly trying to demoralize real soldiers who are scared to deploy to Afghanistan — like Tokyo Rose did during World War II — or just someone who wants to be famous for a few minutes on YouTube. If you are a soldier, which I sincerely doubt, you're actually lying to whomever you're trying to bamboozle or ensight with your video. You're a poser, a fake, a phony, a con man. Maybe you plan to run for Congress when you get out of the “military” (which I doubt you're part of). Real soldiers do their duty as a matter of honor not politics. I wonder if you'd have done the same thing if McCain had been elected. McCain was born in Panama on an alleged Navy base not in a U.S. state — but where's the proof? McCain never showed his birth certificate to the American people when he was running for president. If you are a soldier — which I truly doubt — I can't help but wonder if you refused to deploy under the previous administration until a copy of G.W. Bush's birth certificate was personally delivered to you. No? Then how about we all withhold our tax dollars which pay for your alleged service, training, housing, health coverage and G.I. Bill, until such time as you deign to obey your orders? I don't want to deploy to Afghanistan either but this “birth certificate” issue is a ruse and you know it. For one thing, Hillary Clinton would have forced Obama out of the race during her campaign if there was the slightest possibility he wasn't a natural born citizen. Or would you have done this same thing if Hillary Clinton had been elected President? This phony contrivance dishonors all the other fine members of our military who didn't want to deploy — multiple times — to a combat zone, but went anyway. Lakin, if you are a solder — which I utterly doubt — you have disgraced your past service (if any) and you've disgraced the uniform, the military and all those who HAVE courageously done their duty and followed orders regardless of their political views or depth of personal fear, going all the way back to the shoeless, hungry, mostly unpaid soldiers under George Washington during the American Revolution. If you ARE a soldier — which I totally doubt — I have never been so ashamed of a fellow member of the armed services. Even if Obama showed up at your door, handed you his original birth certificate in person, you'd find a reason not to believe it's real. Because, you're not really a soldier are you? Visit Arlington National Cemetery — while you're waiting for Obama's birth certificate to arrive — and take a look at all those who DID follow orders. But then, I doubt your soul would be stirred because — you're not really a soldier are you?

When did the state issue birth certificate to Obama? Posting an image on a private web page is meaningles – no government agency would accept an image posted on a private web page as a proof of anything.

“hey, your a complete total idiot.”You left out illiterate.

“As I understand the Christian religion, it was, and is, a revelation. But how has it happened that millions of fables, tales, legends, have been blended with both Jewish and Christian revelation that have made them the most bloody religion that ever existed?”
– John Adams’ letter to F.A. Van der Kamp, Dec. 27, 1816

“The question before the human race is, whether the God of Nature shall govern the world by his own laws, or whether priests and kings shall rule it by fictitious miracles?” – John Adams

“Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced an inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth.”
– Thomas Jefferson, “Notes on Virginia”

“It is not to be understood that I am with him (Jesus Christ) in all his doctrines. I am a Materialist; he takes the side of Spiritualism, he preaches the efficacy of repentance toward forgiveness of sin; I require a counterpoise of good works to redeem it.”
– Thomas Jefferson, 1816

Historian Barry Schwartz writes: “George Washington’s practice of Christianity was limited and superficial because he was not himself a Christian… He repeatedly declined the church’s sacraments. Never did he take communion, and when his wife, Martha, did, he waited for her outside the sanctuary… Even on his deathbed, Washington asked for no ritual, uttered no prayer to Christ, and expressed no wish to be attended by His representative.” [New York Press, 1987, pp. 174-175]

“Lighthouses are more helpful than churches. – Benjamin Franklin

“Of all the tyrannies that affect mankind, tyranny in religion is the worst.”
- Thomas Paine

“Take away from Genesis the belief that Moses was the author, on which only the strange belief that it is the word of God has stood, and there remains nothing of Genesis but an anonymous book of stories, fables, and traditionary or invented absurdities, or of downright lies.”
- Thomas Paine

Supreme Court Justice David Davis: “He [Abraham Lincoln] had no faith, in the Christian sense of the term– he had faith in laws, principles, causes and effects.”

“Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise.”
- James Madison’s letter to Wm. Bradford, April 1, 1774

“The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries.”
- James Madison’s 1803 letter objecting use of government land for churches

Lakin's just another coward. He's not even getting much publicity out of this. He'll destroy his career for nothing. Just another fool.

Yawn. Learn to spell and write a proper English sentence. Come back when you figure out something else to say besides the same old, recycled Birther BS.

No, he did not HAVE to have the governor verify anything.

All he had to do is the same thing anyone else has to do: provide a state-issued birth certificate, which he did. He doesn't have to supplement this with a letter from the board of health, or his baptismal records, or his hospital records, or his masters thesis, or any other dang thing that birthers insist must be provided.

The Hawaii health director didn't make an official statement because Obama needed it; the director made that statement because thirty thousand mouth-breathing morons keep calling their office demanding a “vault copy long form” and a box of grid squares.

I guess I don't know how much courage it takes to refuse to be deployed to Afghanistan. All this time I had assumed that the people willingly going to war were the courageous ones.

Also, it's false to say that details of Obama's eligibility are vague and murky. His state-issued birth certificate had all the necessary details, and there were no “murky” parts.

You spoke of nothing but Barack Obama's BC, while the question I asked was about everything but his BC….Why do you ignore my question? Do you have no interest in his past? Isn't it intellectual laziness to have no interest in the history of someone you have such a high regard for?

Actually, your question was answered within the first couple of paragraphs. Perhaps you should go back and re-read.

No, as a matter of fact, I don't.

I didn't for Presidents' Reagan (who I did security on Air Force One for), Bush 41 (who sent me to Iraq the first time), Clinton and Bush 43 (who sent me to Iraq a SECOND time). They were MY presidents, as President Obama is now.

I have no need to question their birthrights, nor this one. While you may view this as “intellectual laziness”, I call it Patriotism and a responsibility to the ideals of this country, which LtC Lakin has forsaken. If we all thought as he does, this country would be f****d! Consider that, for a good, long while.

Why question MY intellectual status? Seems yours is in need of reexamination. Do your own research. All the records you are “requesting” are SEALED. And for a REASON. Yours are, too. BE GLAD OF THAT. This totally ridiculous “endeavor” was instituted by a crank-Orly Taitz. The Moldavian freak who has an obvious racist attitude, and no regard for the traditions of this country. She cooked up a forgery to “attempt” to heap disrepute on MY President. YOUR President. THAT should have been YOUR first clue that this utterly ridiculous quest was a sham, and run from it like the plague. All her other “attempts” have failed, as well. Know why? They have NO LEGAL MERIT, just like her forgeries. Taitz should be stripped of her citizenship PUBLICLY, and summarily deported. Why you would want to follow her lead is a mystery, but I (we) don't really care, anymore. It's been a year of this s**t, and the tenacity of this garbage is tiresome.

I can only assume you've read all the other comments on this blog. Ever wonder why there is so much enmity toward you and other birfers? I (we) can only suppose you are an American. Start acting like one.

I don't agree with all of his policies, but I respect him for his performance, and his willingness to get this country back on it's feet. What are YOU worried about? A laundry list of irrelevant nonsense, started by a Russian immigrant who should never have been allowed to enter MY country, YOUR country, in the first place!

WAKE UP! If you want to be treated as an American, START ACTING LIKE ONE!

If he goes for that, I have fifty feet of portable flightline and a couple of fifty-five gallon drums of prop wash for sale…….

Neither did President Obama, you lying provocateur.

*yawn*

Keeping digging. Maybe you’ll finally reach the Moho Continuum and drown in magma.

How interesting that you completely skip my response, which addressed your first post at length. Why? You are the one who is intellectually lazy. Do you have any idea how many times your list of “hidden” or “sealed” records has been posted at the TWI blog? I searched a chunk of your text, and found the same list posted numerous times on different blogs over the last 9 months. So, you have proven you can cut and paste. Can you think? If so, respond to my post.

Unlike the usurper-in-chief, Lakin has posted his long form birth certificate on the web.

snopes.com reported Obama's birth in the Queen's hospital – only to change it to Kapiolani in 2009 after the inauguration.

According to government statistics records, in 1961 there were 10 unattended birth registrations in Hawaii urban areas for non whites. The information currently available to the public does not exclude the possibility that Obama's was one of those registrations. The original birth certificate on file with the DoH would resolve this issue – it would either confirm the official story (Kapiolani Hospital birth) or deny it.

There should be no doubt whatsoever when it comes to the issue of eligibility for becoming the Commander in Chief of the US military forces.

None of the previous presidents had their birth reported in three different countries or two different USA hospitals.

LMAO ! !

When was it issued? Why don’t you just look at the dang thing?

The signature on the birth certificate has a date of June 6, 2007. That is presumably when it was issued.

“no government agency would accept an image posted on a private web page as a proof of anything”

Obviously he showed the paper to the people who mattered; you get an image on a web page because you’re not the government. It’s not like the president can take his birth certificate around the country so a bunch of conspiracy theorists can touch it.

What's the name of the hospital where Nixon was born? Johnson? Kennedy? Eisenhower? Truman? Any President before Carter?

You're a despicable bigot, a proven liar and a hypocritical ass. You don't deserve the privilege of living in the U.S.

It's funny you would take without question, a COWARD'S “representation” of something that NO LONGER EXISTS. He doesn't look Sixty-three or four years old.

How do YOU know the veracity of it? It's online. I, and many here, want to see it PERSONALLY! I question the attending physician and the hospital. How do WE know it's genuine? WE DON”T. Maybe Orly did up another one. DID SHE?

You'll have to do better than that. Since birfer claims were all proven as bulls**t, we just can't accept YOUR claims. Yes, CLAIMS. You have provided NO PROOF.

Go back to the birfcave and squeeze out something else. We'll be waiting……

Amscray, traitor.

Amscray, traitor.

What a splendid example of nativist wit and wisdom. I’m flattered.

What a splendid example of nativist wit and wisdom. I’m flattered.

Totally wrong. Most of the Founders were deists, not evangelical Christians. Tom Paine was an atheist and Jefferson was damn close.

Totally wrong. Most of the Founders were deists, not evangelical Christians. Tom Paine was an atheist and Jefferson was damn close.

As usual, you are wrong. In 1961, there were 12 unattended births registered for nonwhites in the Honolulu urban area. You can look it up: http://www.nber.org/vital-statistics/historical/nat61_1.CV.pdf

And every one of those children born in Honolulu was, by virtue of being born in Hawaii, a natural born citizen.

Of course, that stuff about his hospital or attending physician etc is pointless information, since it has no bearing on your citizenship.

It's like posting the form from your first drivers test with the name of the DMV office and examiner, and then daring other people to do the same to “prove” they are really licensed to drive. But no, all I need to prove that I am licensed to drive is my current driver's license. No details from my old paperwork will somehow overturn or contradict that.

Likewise, if I need to prove citizenship for my I-9 tax form, all I need is any state-issued birth certificate that says I was born here. No further details of my birth are required.

*slow clap*

Doesn't change him being a traitor to his oath.

If I want to know about the President's early life, I'll download a copy of Dreams from My Father onto my Nook, or maybe check out his Wikipedia entry if I just want the highlights. College transcripts and the like are none of my business.

Thank you for your service, and your demonstration of what true patriotism is. I didn't have much use for either of the Bushes, and think Clinton treated his wife abominably, but if any of them had made a public appearance in my town I would have been thrilled that the President was coming (and would have been polite and respectful because, you know, it's the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES).

“Bend over and cough, sir.”

Well stated. Kudos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfzXpE0QB2U

Fletch: “You have a very soft touch doc…ever serve time? Moooooooon riverrrrr ! ! !

I do have to clarify one thing…..

I did external security for Air Force One at Pt. Mugu when President Reagan went to his Santa Barbara ranch. Three times in 1981/2

I did not mean to infer that I was ON the plane when it was flying.

couldn't agree more with lakin. mcain was forced to prove he was american born and so should obama. he ran on transparency yet he wont release anything from his past at 3 university's or medical records etc. he is an imposter!

LOL!

I'm eating breakfast and almost blew milk out my nose!

John McCain wasn't “American born”: he was born in Panama. At least that is what his birth certificate says: http://www.scribd.com/doc/9934044/John-McCain-B…

; – p

Like many birfers, Lakin is a disgraceful, traitorous, pig headed coward and bigot with zero respect for U.S. law.

Yes, there is no requirement to provide these documents. But many politicians release them voluntary, even when “transparency” is not the motto of their campaign. Why would not Mr. Transperency release his personal document? Does not his unwillingness to follow his campaign promises makes him a liar?
He may be a naturally born US citizen, but why he spends half a million on those law suits when he can calm it down by signing $15 affidavit to Hawaii with request to release his long form birth certificate? Whatever he is, he has something to hide and he and his campaign are fully responsible for all these controversies.

He also broke TWO oaths. The first, his oath to his country. The second is the hippocratic oath, which he broke by refusing responsibility to the first.

It's a stretch, but doesn't the hippocratic oath refer to “causing no harm”? By refusing his federal duty, he is absent from the battlefield, which in turn, well….

The Hippocratic Oath (Modern Version)
“I swear to fulfill, to the best of my ability and judgment, this covenant:
I will respect the hard-won scientific gains of those physicians in whose steps I walk, and gladly share such knowledge as is mine with those who are to follow.
I will apply, for the benefit of the sick, all measures [that] are required, avoiding those twin traps of overtreatment and therapeutic nihilism.
I will remember that there is art to medicine as well as science, and that warmth, sympathy, and understanding may outweigh the surgeon's knife or the chemist's drug.
I will not be ashamed to say “I know not,” nor will I fail to call in my colleagues when the skills of another are needed for a patient's recovery.
I will respect the privacy of my patients, for their problems are not disclosed to me that the world may know. Most especially must I tread with care in matters of life and death. If it is given me to save a life, all thanks. But it may also be within my power to take a life; this awesome responsibility must be faced with great humbleness and awareness of my own frailty. Above all, I must not play at God.
I will remember that I do not treat a fever chart, a cancerous growth, but a sick human being, whose illness may affect the person's family and economic stability. My responsibility includes these related problems, if I am to care adequately for the sick.
I will prevent disease whenever I can, for prevention is preferable to cure.
I will remember that I remain a member of society, with special obligations to all my fellow human beings, those sound of mind and body as well as the infirm.
If I do not violate this oath, may I enjoy life and art, respected while I live and remembered with affection thereafter. May I always act so as to preserve the finest traditions of my calling and may I long experience the joy of healing those who seek my help.

Original, translated into English:
“I swear by Apollo, the healer, Asclepius, Hygieia, and Panacea, and I take to witness all the gods, all the goddesses, to keep according to my ability and my judgment, the following Oath and agreement:
To consider dear to me, as my parents, him who taught me this art; to live in common with him and, if necessary, to share my goods with him; To look upon his children as my own brothers, to teach them this art.
I will prescribe regimens for the good of my patients according to my ability and my judgment and never do harm to anyone.
I will not give a lethal drug to anyone if I am asked, nor will I advise such a plan; and similarly I will not give a woman a pessary to cause an abortion.
But I will preserve the purity of my life and my arts.
I will not cut for stone, even for patients in whom the disease is manifest; I will leave this operation to be performed by practitioners, specialists in this art.
In every house where I come I will enter only for the good of my patients, keeping myself far from all intentional ill-doing and all seduction and especially from the pleasures of love with women or with men, be they free or slaves.
All that may come to my knowledge in the exercise of my profession or in daily commerce with men, which ought not to be spread abroad, I will keep secret and will never reveal.
If I keep this oath faithfully, may I enjoy my life and practice my art, respected by all men and in all times; but if I swerve from it or violate it, may the reverse be my lot.

When challenged to provide proof that Obama was born anywhere other than Hawaii, you use the escape that “I'm not saying he was born elsewhere, I'm just saying that there are questions that need to be answered.” Yet you openly and unreservedly declare our President to be “the usurper-in-chief.” So you must have proof to support such a bold statement. Please provide it.

And it is nice to see that you now accept a document posted on on the internet, even if it isn't posted on an official government website. I'm glad that is settled.

Barack Obama promised transparency in government. If you can find any statement by Barack Obama in which he promised that he would open up all private records from his childhood and education, please provide a link to it. But I know you are lying.

Please provide a link to your source for the claim that “he spends a half a million on those lawsuits.” We have seen a lot of numbers tossed around (yours is actually on the low end), but funny thing is that no birther can provide a credible source for the information.

So you argree Barack Obama has no legal obligation to divulge personal information, but it is his fault that people are suing him, seeking that information? Do you always blame the defendant for the filing of frivolous (i.e., legally baseless) litigation?

Finally, if you think producing the “original” “long form” “vault” birth certificate (or whatever birthers are calling it today) will end the controversy, you are nuts. To begin with, it will simply lead to a new round of specious claims about the authenticity of THAT document. Moreover, Orly Taitz is the birther “lawyer” who is obsessed with the birth certificate. Others (including Leo Donofrio and Phil Berg) are focused on arguments that Barack Obama can't be a “natural born citizen” because his father had British citizenship (Kenya was a colony at the time) or because he was adopted by his step-father and somehow became Indonesian. Producing a “long form” birth certificate will not do a single thing to undermine those theories.

And to clarify my own post, there is no evidence whatsoever that Lolo Soetoro legally adopted Barack Obama. Soetoro was divorced from Obama's mother in 1980. Barack Obama's father died in 1982. With Obama's father still alive, Lolo Soetoro could not have adopted the son without the father's consent, or a court order terminating the father's rights. And none of that would have altered Barack Obama's U.S. Citizenship, which a minor cannot renounce and parents cannot renounce for their children.

As bearclaw states- McCain was born in Panama and not even on the base but in a Panamanian hospital. That was why there was a question by some if that made a difference. The Senate resolution made it clear they considered him to be a natural born citizen, just as the resolution passed by unanimous vote commemorating Hawaii as the birthplace of our 44th president.

“You usin' the whole fist, Doc?”

McCain wasn't FORCED to do anything. He VOLUNTARILY submitted his birth certificate. Same as Obama.

“but why he spends half a million on those law suits”

Birfer bullshit. Prove it or STFU.

Idiot.

Dr. Joseph Dolan: So where do you know Alan from?
Fletch: We play tennis at the club.
Dr. Joseph Dolan: Really? California Racquet Club?
Fletch: Right.
Dr. Joseph Dolan: That's my club too. I don't remember seeing you there.
Fletch: Well, I haven't been playing in a while because of these kidney pains.
Dr. Joseph Dolan: Right. Now, how long have you had these pains, Mr. Barber?
Fletch: No, that's “Babar”.
Dr. Joseph Dolan: Two B's?
Fletch: One B. B-A-B-A-R.
Dr. Joseph Dolan: That's two.
Fletch: Yeah, but not right next to each other. I thought that's what you meant.
Dr. Joseph Dolan: Arnold Babar. Isn't there a children's book about an elephant named Babar?
Fletch: I don't know. I don't have any.
Dr. Joseph Dolan: No children?
Fletch: No elephant books.

Lakin: Prove you are a member of the U.S armed services. You can't, because you are not a soldier, not a U.S. soldier anyway..

Are you stupid or what? He'sa doing what he should do, ignore stupid people. LOL!

He couldn't be an American!

Except that he doesn't HAVE to and the Senate already accepted that he was born in the state of Hawaii before the election even took place.

Usurper? No, not so much.

“responsibility to the ideals of this country”? Would you jump off a
bridge if the president asked or told you to? He is your highest elected
public servant , not your king.

You are really, really, really, really,REALLY good at name calling and you sound much more brave than the Lt. Col too! I think you are very impressive!

Could you please provide the link for Lakin's “long form birth certificate.” The reason I doubt the statement about Terry Lakin you made.

You make it sound as though every presidential and vice-presidential candidate requires your approval to seek office.

You can find links to various documents on this page:
http://www.safeguardourconstitution.com/who-is-…

It is quite interesting that it isn't his “original birth certificate” as it clearly states that it was issued “Apr 26, 1994.” I doubt that they had 14 years old soldiers in the American military. Yes, he was born in 1965, which doesn't make him 14 years old. So where is his “original birth certificate?”

Also, It isn't a long form but a “Certificate of Live Birth.” So where is his “original birth certificate?”

This is an exercise in transparency:
http://www.safeguardourconstitution.com/who-is-…

It is a HUGE difference when you compare it with games Obama has been playing with public.

My belief is that Obama was not born in Hawaii. It is based on his behavior, lousy records supporting such claim and unnecessary secrecy regarding trivial data. Couple it with reports of his birth in three countries, evasive behavior from DoH officials, Obama's character (habitual liar) – of course I am very sceptical of the official story.

And your point is?

Obama has not shown his long form birth certificate.

You have no idea what you are talking about.
ACTUAL FACT: Long form birth certificates for Nordyke twins (born in the Kapiolani hospital on August 5, 1961) were published by the Honolulu Advertiser last year.

Just because you don't want to accept the birth record that has been out for some time now doesn't mean it isn't true and accurate. You people are so transparent. YOU are playing the games. What you are really saying is he can't possibly be eligible to to be the president- no matter what. Your beliefs don't matter. You can choke on your beliefs for all most of us care. What ticks me off is a lying piece of pucky like you that will call our president a “habitual liar” with nothing to back it up. On the contrary, I believe him to be one of the most honest presidents we have had. What is a certainty is that you are a disgrace to this country that has evidently given you a home. You are the liar. You will stop at nothing and stoop lower than a snakes belly to disparage our president. Look up disgusting in the dictionary and your picture will be next to it.

Lakin- you are a coward. How many men and women will die because you are to cowardly to go and do your job? I hope you have no children that will have to live down the shame of their cowardly father.

One of the most honest presidents… LOL!

Grab a popcorn and enjoy the following clips:
http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/video/obama-li…

http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/video/obama-li…

My point is obvious. Obama has shown his birth certificate, and what Terry Lakin demands from the president he must also provide. Fair is fair. So, where is the “original birth certificate” that Lakin was given in when he was born?

So? This has nothing to do with the President’s birth certificate, as you’d realize if you had a brain under all that bleached blond hair.

So? This has nothing to do with the President’s birth certificate, as you’d realize if you had a brain under all that bleached blond hair.

Why not? He was born in Hawaii, raised by a single mother and his grandparents, and worked his way up from nothing. This is the American dream in a nutshell, unlike George W. Bush being given everything because he came from a rich, well connected family.

I see no evidence that anyone on this blog except birthers and right wing kooks has referred to the President as a king. Please provide links to same or shut up.

Which Air Force One was that, the Kennedy-era one or the 747?

Totally OT: I live near Westover Air Reserve Base in Massachusetts. The C5A-Galaxies sometimes fly directly over Springfield, where I used to live, and I swear they were bigger than the local skyscrapers. They had flown out every fifteen minutes during Desert Storm, which is how Western Mass knew that America was gearing up to attack Al Quaeda in the fall of 2001 – the big planes were the first aircraft to fly after the attacks, and we knew they weren’t headed anywhere in the United States….

How about some North Pacific Deck Peckers? A box of fallopian tubes? Some plaid paint?

[...] Not an April Fools’ Joke: Army Officer Defies Orders Unless Obama Shows Birth Certificate &laq… [...]

The significance is simple to understand. In 1961 it was easy to fraudulently register foreign birth as a Hawaii one. A form submitted by a relative and that was it. Publicly available information does not exclude this scenario.

The original birth certificate would clarify this issue. If you were right it will confirm Hawaii birth, otherwise we have a big problem, an usurper in the White House.

If you had followed the story carefully you would have learned that in June 2009 the Hawaii DoH changed their policy – they stopped issuing long form birth certificates. The short form document has been renamed as well. Until June 2009 the Hawai Department of Homelands did not accept short form birth certificates. It is a very interesting timeline of events – somebody is working hard to provide cover for Obama.

None of that would be necessary if Obama authorized the release of the original document that was used to to register his birth. How many more soldiers silently ask themselves the same question that LTC Lakin asked publicly?

A truly patriotic Commander in Chief would never have allowed the troops to doubt his eligibility. Obama prefers to hide behind Dr. Fukino's skirt.

I stated clearly that the president is NOT a king but the highest
elected *public
servant* in our country (which is a representative republic and not a
monarchy) So to use some of your written bravado….you shut up!

Fuck off, traitorous filth.

You've repeatedly demanded the name of the hospital as if that's in in the Constitution.

Your burden of proof fails for every President before Carter.

“somebody is working hard to provide cover for Obama.”

Paranoid bullshit. You're a fucking liar with no proof. You spread libel and you should be arrested.

You're a vile traitor, a mascara sucking cretin and an enemy of the people of the United States of America.

If you're going to question our laws, you damn well better have credible evidence or be prepared for the consequences.

And my point is that you have no credible right to question U.S. law.

Keep pushing it, traitor.

You're full of shit.
You don't deserve the privilege of living in the U.S.

You're full of shit.
You don't deserve the privilege of living in the U.S.

Unfortunately for you, naturalizecitizen, I have been researching all this subject for some time. I know that you statement about Hawaii Department of Health's change about it birth certificates is a gross misrepresentation of the facts. One reason is that those who want to dismiss an authenticated birth certificate have attempt argue of the value of “accepted” over “filed” on Certification of Live Births issued before 2009.

Just for your information the birth records are property of the Hawaii Department of Health.

There will be many more people who openly ask the questions as Lakin. This isn't because they have a honest inquiry. The reason is that they want to spread doubt about a known fact.

Obama has provided his birth certificate to the relevant people, and the authenticity of his birth records have been confirmed.

Just to be fair as I have stated before. Where is Lakin's “original birth certificate” that was issued when he was born? Just ask him.

The Hawaiian Department of Homelands deals with Native Hawaiian Islanders – you know, the POLYNESIANS WHO ORIGINALLY LIVED THERE. Its rulings have jack shit to do with haoles, as you would know if you'd bothered to look it up.

We do have a big problem: traitorous Balkans who come to America, accept all the benefits and blessings this country has to offer, and then do their best to overturn elections and foment sedition.

Sorry, but I have better things to do, like clean the cat box.

So? The hospital certificate isn't legally valid. Only the one produced by the state. He produced that. Case closed.

Please provide proof that any previous President has produced any of the following documents:

- Birth certificate
- College records
- High school records
- Kindergarten records
- Passport
- Parents' marriage records
- Parents' divorce records
- Parents' travel documents
- Parents scholarship records

I was not aware that any president has produced same. Thank you.

Also, the LOSER in a civil suit customarily pays the winner's court costs, expenses, and lawyers' fees. Please provide proof, in the form of actual court rulings, receipts, etc., that the courts have discarded this rule in the dozens of unsuccessful cases filed by Orly Taitz, Phil Berg, Mr. Putz, Leo Donofrio, or any other of the traitorous fools who seek to undermine our democracy through their faulty legal reasoning and outright lies.

I think that Lakin is planning or retiring. He should just retire and allow a more dedicated person take his place. Then Lakin can spend more time getting lost in his conspiracy theory. It is very disturbing having a person who can't think logically responsible for other peoples lives.

In American like many other western democracy their are things call privacy laws. These are things designed to protect a person identity and to prevent identity theft. Like all other states Hawaii has very clear privacy laws. Birth records are not trival information, it is the information that defines a person with in country. Providing proof of being a natural-born citizen isn't trival, and required authenticated proof of citizenship by birth.

There is only one report of birth in Hawaii, which has been verified. I would say if you doubt Obama's birth certificate then check that Hawaii has his birth record. However, Hawaii has already confirmed that they do have his birth records so your comment is just the regular misinformation.

One word for your comment. False.

If some people accepted Hawaii's word on this issue it would be over.

Sorry, but you and others have strongly implied that non-birthers DO think of the current President as a king or a messiah of some sort. That you are too dumb to understand the plain meaning of what I wrote is not my problem.

*makes shooing motion*

Go volunteer at a homeless shelter.

Dummkopf- he is talking about transparency in government not his private records. If you don't understand that there isn't much hope for you. In this day and age of identity theft and fraud, way too much of his info is already out there. That stupid Oily Taters has even put what she claims is his social security number out there. Nobody needs more. We know he graduated Magna Cum Laude from Harvard (which takes considerable work) as well as serving as President of the Harvard Law Review- a position that denotes a great deal of respect and trust from ones fellow students, even the republican ones.

You research is faulty. There are short form birth certificates that show different registration status “Filed by” and “Accepted by State Registrar”.
According to your logic we should only see one type – “Filed by…”

Whom did Obama provide his birth certificate – can you name names of those relevant people? Please don't tell me that you are talking about few left wing bloggers here.

In June last year the DoH stopped issuing long form birth certificates. They wanted to provide an excuse for Obama to allow him to claim that he produced the only document that DoH would issue. That way unsuspected public (those who had not followed the issue closely) can be deceived about the issue.

And thanks, coward.

Bullshit. You're a liar and you have no proof.
Ready to be deported?

And you are a despicable coward.

You demanded hospital names as if that was in the Constitution.

Where was Nixon born?

Save the privacy story for Obots.

There is nothing private about Obama's birth certificate – no information on that document should be different from the information already available to the public.

Fraudulently registered unattended birth in Hawaii – think about these words and see how this scenario fits available facts.

That is the same source I used for my claim. How did you calculate number 12?

1. Urban Areas for Non-whites: 6684
Physician in hospital: 6670
Physician not in Hospital: 4
Midwife:0
Difference (unattended births): 10

I looked even closer into the data, just the metropolitan counties
2. Urban Areas for Non-whites: 6246
Physician in hospital: 6234
Physician not in Hospital: 4
Midwife: 0
Difference (unattended births): 8

If anybody else is interested in seeing these numbers go to the page 205 of the report.

Your assumption is that none of those claimes were fraudulent.

NC has finally revealed her true form: a recording stuck on continuous loop. She's so determined to PROVE that she's right that she brings up the same tired, ridiculous, debunked arguments in hopes that we'll have forgotten that she said the same thing two months ago, or six months ago, or a year ago.

Her mind must be a very sad place.

Thought about them. Gave them all the time they deserve.

Guess what? You're still wrong, still a bigot, still not very intelligent, and you still can't read English.

Go have a tea party with your little alter ego Marie and your bum buddy Borderraven. Then go back to Sarajevo. I hear it's lovely this time of year, now that they've gotten rid of all the ethnic cleansers.

They always count the MOTHERS. His mother isn’t in the non-white catagory.

This is a simple concept that they fail to understand. The additional information is only required for verification of the facts, but this doesn’t diminish the validity of the government issued document. These conspiracy theorist stick to one idea and don’t seem to be able to comprehend the boarder issue. They make they seem to not understand the implications of their false claims.

According the Constitution there are only 3 requirements for a person to seek office the the president, vice-president, representative and senator. There are difference in specification for each, with only the president and vice-president being identical. These requirements are citizenship, age, and residency. However, unlike representative and senator the president can’t be a naturalized citizen. So only those 3 requirements have to be demonstrated as being met.

Transparency in government has absolutely nothing to do with a person producing a personal document.

“$15 affidavit”??? You seem to not understand what an affidavit is. Please some reading conspiracy theory sites.

This entire nonsense should have been “calm”ed down when the state of Hawaii issues the fisrt release that confirmed that validity of the birth record.

Lakin is a genuine fool. No reasonable person would engage in his behavior unless they had irrefutable proof to support his accusations. The only hateful “disgusting comments” are those used to argue away the legitimacy of a sitting president.

We believe in every state protects and is the final authority on birth certificates. Why don’t you believe this?

If Lt. Col. Lakin wants to sacrifice his career and record of accomplishment for a birther fantasy, he can choose to do that. One President in U.S. history has provided the public with proof of his birth in the United States, and that is the one President whose authority you, and Lt. Col. Lakin, cannot accept.

And thanks for confirming that you have nothing but your paranoia and bigotry to support your slander of the President.

What are you talking about, Naturalizedcitizen? You first statement is just wrong. You seems to not understand the meaning of “value” in the context that it was used.

What is frustrating about you arguments is that you are more interested in smearing everyone associated with ensuring a fair American election process. You really don't know what you are talking about do you.

Go off now, and Ask Lakin's where is his “original birth certificate” that was issued when he was born? It isn't that complicated.

Michelle Obama mentioned Barack’s home country, Kenya!

Enjoy the video before it is removed from the web:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ht1qeK3roU0&feature=player_embedded

If privacy isn't an issue then please show your real name and upload your picture. You want the president to be more transparent then you should take the infinitive and be more open. Don't be like Lakin and show your “original birth certificate”, this is the one that was given to your parents when you where first born.

“Fraudulently registered unattended birth in Hawaii – think about these words and see how this scenario fits available facts.” — Naturalizecitizen.

Please prove some proof to back up your claim. This doesn't mean the use of conjecture but actual facts and supporting proof.

Put up or STFU.

“What will it take to wake you up about the fact that Obama is not eligibile to be the POTUS?”When you appear in open court with credible evidence.

That’s your proof.

Birthers just don't seem to be able to make a logical argument. With no facts to support them they make bold claims and then try to make up new facts. They seem to throw out various information without thinking about the implications of their arguments. They also present evidence that contradicts or doesn't support their position, and later actively dismiss that evidence.

Imagine this entire nonsense is about one birth certificate. Birtherism is just nuts.

So that is your iron clad evidence. So what are you going to do now, prove that Ms. Obama met her husband before he was born. Most people understand what she met.

Social Security Number and naturalization papers would be nice, too.

I believe the same place he was buried.

You are welcome.

How about you take over the job he left. You could put all of your great wisdom to work.

Really? What department at the federal level handles that task? Who is the head of that particular department currently?

What kinds of consequences?

It is too bad that you look at yourself as irrelevant.

So what you are saying that no president in history has to provide health records or anything else during any presidential elections. I am in utter shock. When you can come up with an argument that doesn't dismiss any past election we would gladly listen.

As nationalizecitizen refuses to ask Lakin to produce his “original birth certificate,” I will ask you to do it. That is the one that was given when he was born. So hurry off and tell him to produce it, okay.

No. What I am asking is: What department at the federal level handles that task? and : Who is the currently the head of that department?

read: “there are people who job it actual is to verify that candidates are qualified.” Each word was carefully selected to make your questions meaningless.

What will it take to wake you up about the fact that Obama is not eligibile to be the POTUS?

Watch Michelle speak about her husband's home country, Kenya!
http://www.youtube.com/user/syc1959#p/a/u/0/dBJ…

What is the next video to surface – Obama saying to the public that we have been PUNK'D?!

Help me out – if Barack was born in Hawaii, why is it that Michelle is talking about his home country of Kenya?

http://www.youtube.com/user/syc1959#p/a/u/0/dBJ…

That's your evidence?

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ! ! !

You're an idiot.

You're an idiot.

Yes, you are a ridiculous fool.

And you're still an idiot.

And you're still an idiot and a bigot.

And you're still an idiot.

And you're still an idiot.

That’s been up for months. Stop being so paranoid.

I hope that what’s next is Orly Taitz being disbarred.

As for you, go back to Bosnia or whatever other wretched little ethnic enclave extruded you. You don’t deserve American citizenship.

So people who are 5th Generation Irish-Americans were born in Ireland. If you have difficulties understanding the English language there are people who can help you.

Why couldn’t he be? America is a country with differing political views. This doesn’t make a person not an American. A person is an American based on their citizenship. The simplest way is through birth, and the president was born in Hawaii. Don’t listen to people like Glenn Beck, because they work on your fears. It is understandable if you disagree with his policies. It hard to believe that 300 million people will all agree on everything.

Just make sure to hide the favourite “candy” from your familiy members before mailing it out.

Aren't you wanted for murder in your home country?

By that criterion, I'm either Welsh (through my father, seven generations ago) or German (through my mother, three generations back). Give it up, NC. You're still wrong.

Unlike you, the President was born in the United States. Jealous much?

Naturalized citizens who publicly advocate treason and sedition are subject to deportation.

The point is that Lt. Col. Lakin is a hypocrite, just like you.

A cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree.

There's your help.

I have no living relatives. Thank you so very much for reminding me of this on Easter.

What is your home country?

He is going to throw a tantrum and stomp his feet on the floor really hard.

Asked and answered.

You're the one who's almost certainly being watched by the Secret Service as a traitor. Why don't you tell us once you've spoken to them?

I take it you’ve traced it already….

[...] Not an April Fools’ Joke: Army Officer Defies Orders Unless Obama Shows Birth Certificate &laq… [...]

As an attorney, I have this hangup about evidence. Obama is the President. You have no admissible evidence of his ineligibility for office. All you have is your paranoia and bigotry. Must suck to be you.

And your point? As you have been told hundreds of times, the so-called long form isn’t even the legal certificate.

Of course, you actually don’t care about that. What you care about is somehow, some way, driving a legally elected President from office because you hate his guts and are willing to believe every smear imaginable about him. It would be sad if you weren’t such a lying, traitorous disgrace.

I sure got that impression.

By your reasoning, Ronald Reagan was born in Ballyporeen, Ireland. In fact, the evidence is even stronger: Reagan standing under a banner that says: “Welcome Home to Ballyporeen, Mr. President”: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:President_Rea…

In fact, we have never seen even an internet copy of Reagan's birth certificate. So he is even more suspect. You agree, don't you?

The difference, of course, is that white people are allowed to be proud of their heritage without being accused of being foreigners. Not so, apparently, for anyone who is black.

Their entire argument is “grasping at straws.” I am starting to believe that these people are all about manipulating English to present arguments.

Bearclaw, these peoples arguments just don't make any sense. It isn't the fact that the issues that they are talking about is complicated, or the terminology that they are using is complicated. It is that it just void of logic.

Instead of trying to understand where their arguments fit, they try to build their argument around something that they want to be false. I have checked some of their arguments. This is due to people who quote mine or misrepresent the facts that I have encountered in the past. It is interesting to see where their arguments are incorrect.

This latest example makes me scratch my head. Most people try to trace back their ancestry to country outside America. It is a kin to finding out about ones parents when their parents we their age. It is all about being part of something and an individual at the same time.

At least we'd have one less right-wing loon in the military.

Yep that proves it!! A city in Ireland put up a banner. He must have been born there! Or maybe your just an imbecile! http://terryfrank.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/0…

The Certification of Live Birth is not a copy of the original birth certificate. It is a computer-generated document that the state of Hawaii issues on request to indicate that a birth certificate of some type is ‘on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.’ And there is the problem. Given the statutes in force in 1961, the Certification of Live Birth proves nothing unless we know what is on the original birth certificate. There are several legal areas (involving ethnic quotas and subsidy) for which the state of Hawaii up until June 2009 did not accept its computer-generated Certification of Live Birth as sufficient proof of birth – or parentage – in Hawaii.

And who tf are you other than an anonymous douche bag?

There's your problem, dumbass. I'll trust the legal authority of the state of Hawaii over a mouth breathing ass muncher.

“Or maybe your just an imbecile!”

Too funny.

Your comment doesn't make any sense.

Please look in an English dictionary for the words “certificate” and “certification” you will see that they are synonymous.

Information is entered in to computers then exported. Most if not all documents produced now are generated by computers.

On the document it clearly states that it represents “the fact of birth.” Which is what a birth certificate is.

Did you know that Lakin hasn't posted his original birth certificate on his website, but one issued in 1994?

Did you know that some birther conspiracy sites have posted Certifications of Live Births that were issued as early as 2002?

The “state of Hawaii up until June 2009 did not accept its computer-generated Certification of Live Birth as sufficient proof of birth – or parentage – in Hawaii.” This is so factually false it is laughable. You are suggesting that a government issues a document then refuses to recognize it.

It is the irony of the illogical arguments, but you just don't realize it.

“Or maybe your just an imbecile!” is a funny comment. The comment about Reagan is mocking the arguments about Obama, by using the exactly same arguments. However, it seems that you missed that.

They seem to just understand.

Do you understand that until June 2009 Hawaii DoH had been issuing both versions: Certification (short version) and the Certificate (long version). The long form is equivalent to the document LTC Lakin posted.

The Department of Home Lands in Hawaii did not consider the Certification to be a sufficient proof.

The only reason why Hawaii DoH changed their rules (in June 2009, interesting timing, isn't it?) was to protect Obama.

Germany or Wales? If you agree with Michelle Obama that is what your choices are.

Yes, I do understand that you are making things up, and introduce irrelevant information.

NaturalizedCitizen is English your native language? The reason being is that this isn't an complicated issue Regan is a Irish-American, Bush is of primarily English and German ancestry, and Clinton is Irish-American.

Why don't you teach me: How many home countries can a person have?

That is mathematics. Go check a biology text book it will have a simple enough example for you to follow, without any complicated calculations.

If one follows your idiotic formulation, both. If one follows Borderraven's “sovereign citizen” nonsense, Pennsylvania (or Massachusetts). If one follows reason, logic, and the law, the United States of America.

Unlike the charred, blasted ruins of your ethnically cleansed homeland, America is a land of immigrants. We ALL came here from somewhere else, even the Native Americans who came over the land bridge from Asia thousands of years ago.

Unlike the Native Americans, the rest of us are descended from people who came to this continent recently enough that we remember our ancestors' homeland culture, religion, foods, superstitions, and (often) language. Italians have Dante Clubs, Germans have Turnvereins, Poles have Pulaski Clubs, Hispanic girls have quincenearas…the list goes on and on. It's common to refer to the country of one's ancestors as “the old country” or “home,” even if one is second or third or fourth generation.

That is exactly what the First Lady did: referred to her husband's ANCESTRAL country as his home land. She knows very well that he was born in Hawaii. She was simply following American custom.

You would know this if you knew anything about America beyond what you read on reactionary hate sites. Maybe you should go to Pittsburgh and spend a couple of hours at one of the multi-ethnic cultural festivals run to see how America really is, and why your rhetoric is so repulsive to anyone born and raised here.

Sorry to take so long, I was out for the weekend.

It was the 747. Nice on the inside, too. That plane is everything they say it is.

C5a’s are pipsqeaks, now. The new 117′s are gigantic!

Bigger than a C5-A ? Yow. That is going to be seriously scary.

Weird little optical illusion: the C5-A’s are so heavy and so slow that they almost seemed slower than the hot air balloons that float gently over the Holyokes. I swear sometimes they looked like they were standing still as slowly climbed toward their cruising altitude.

You sound like Borderraven on drugs. This not a compliment.

It's been a couple of days, and the Oily Taintz minions come out of the woodwork, “arguing the same, tired nonsense.

You birefers can justify almost anything, can't you?

It's time to shun these quacks, people. It's been over a year, and they're still content to argue things already shot down. No sense in it. No sense in themselves.

Maybe they think that someone telepathically entered the information on the computer, from a far away galaxy.

Maybe you should learn proper English.

Do you agree that Ronald Reagan's home country was Ireland, making him (according to your own logic) a “usurper-in-chief” for the eight years he was President?

If you don't agree, please explain why you don't, given that his “home” was in Ballyporeen, Ireland, and we have photographic proof of that?

mcain was forced to prove he was american born and so should obama.

Nobody forced McCain to do anything. Rather, he was politically pressured to show his birth certificate after Obama showed his. And unlike Obama, McCain wasn’t even born as a citizen of the United States. McCain didn’t obtain U.S. citizenship until he was one year old, and even then, it’s not clear whether his citizenship was – or could be – made retroactive to his birth.

Unlike the usurper-in-chief, Lakin has posted his long form birth certificate on the web. It includes the name of the birth hospital and the attending physician.

I’m surprised you’re willing to accept that Lakin’s birth certificate is real without first consulting with Polarik. It’s just an image on the web, now, isn’t it?

Until June 2009 the Hawai Department of Homelands did not accept short form birth certificates.

For good reason, which has nothing to do with the validity of the COLB.

It is a very interesting timeline of events – somebody is working hard to provide cover for Obama.

Can you offer some suggestions as to who that “somebody” is?

My belief is that Obama was not born in Hawaii.

So what is your belief, then?

There is nothing private about Obama’s birth certificate – no information on that document should be different from the information already available to the public.

That maybe your desired standard, but that’s not the legal standard that governs the disclosure of information from Hawaiian vital records.

Fraudulently registered unattended birth in Hawaii – think about these words and see how this scenario fits available facts.

It fits well, as long as you believe the following:

(1) Stanley Ann was an enthusiastic world traveler who married a foreigner from Africa but nonetheless had to have her son’s birth recorded in Hawaii for some reason.

(2) Stanley Ann traveled to Kenya as a pregnant woman, knowing there was a risk that her dream of having her son born in the U.S. was being jeopardized. In the meantime, she made sure someone back in Hawaii had her address falsely registered in a local Polk directory. (Smart thinking!)

(3) Stanley Ann traveled to Kenya on a ship, despite being pregnant and her worries that her son might not be born in the U.S. Alternatively, Stanely Ann traveled to Africa, not on her own scholarship, but on the generous scholarship of her new husband, which was willing to pay for her airline tickets despite the fact that they approached the average U.S. household median wage at the time. This despite the fact that the scholarship evidently was tight on funds and asked its recipients to limit their travel.

(4) Stanley Ann stayed for months with her husband’s family, despite the fact that they were disapproving of him marrying a white woman, and despite the fact he already had a wife and child in Kenya. And despite the fact that there’s not a shred of evidence that she ever set foot in the country – no eyewitnesses whatsoever.

(5) Stanley Ann somehow determined that her son would not be a U.S. citizen if born in Africa because of an obscure mathematical quirk in U.S. naturalization laws. It is not known who divulged this information to her.

(6) Stanley Ann gave birth in Mombasa, which is across the country from Obama Sr.’s family, without any reason for doing so. No one in Mombasa ever claims to have seen her there. Nor is there any explanation for why the more developed city of Nairobi, which is also closer to the Obama’s ancestral home, was not used for this purpose.

(7) Stanley Ann gave birth, and then without any rest, rushed from Mombasa to Nairobi to catch an unscheduled international flight. It is not explained how she traversed the rough roads from Mombasa to Nairobi so that she arrived in the latter city a mere hours after giving birth.

(8) Stanley Ann took an unscheduled flight out of Nairobi on the first leg of several legs back to Honolulu. Fortunately, this flight was able to take off almost immediately after her arrival in Nairobi. Also fortunately for Stanley Ann, she was able to come up with cash necessary for such a last minute jet flight, which in 1961 would have cost an exorbitant amount of money.

(9) While in Nairobi, Stanley Ann was able to make a phone call to her parents in Honolulu on non-existent intercontinental phone lines. Alternatively, she sent a telegram to her parents giving instructions on how to forge her child’s “unattended” birth. Although such a telegram would have cost a lot of money, somehow it was done.

(10) Stanley Ann’s parents were receptive to this message from Kenya and were willing to forge a birth certificate. Again, it is unknown why they felt it important that Obama have a Hawaiian birth recorded.

(11) This forged “unattended” birth certificate just happened to be given nearly the same number as twins born on August 5, 1961 in Kapi’olani hospital. Although this fact was unknown to the Dunhams, by incredible coincidence Obama himself years later concocted a story for the media years later in which Obama was born hours apart from the twins at the same hospital.

If you believe all that, then the “fraudulenty registered unattended birth in Hawaii” makes sense. If you don’t, it falls apart real fast.

I understand that you are willing to contort yourself into shapes undreamt of by Cirque du Soleil in an effort to smear the President.

The significance is simple to understand. In 1961 it was easy to fraudulently register foreign birth as a Hawaii one. A form submitted by a relative and that was it. Publicly available information does not exclude this scenario.

No one has ever provided credible evidence of where Stanley Ann was if she weren’t in Hawaii. Nor can anyone explain how Obama’s certificate number would up so close to the Nordyke twins, who are also known to have been born in Kapi’olani.

The original birth certificate would clarify this issue. If you were right it will confirm Hawaii birth, otherwise we have a big problem, an usurper in the White House.

According to your theory, however, a birth certificate which states Obama was born in Hawaii may still be fraudulent. Furthermore, I have little doubt that the Polariks of the world will swarm in and claim it to be fraudulent. So we’ll be right back where we are right now, even with the original birth certificate.

Are any of you Obama supporters inquisitive at all, in any shape or form as to why Barack Obama refuses to produce any documents that would shed light on any part of his past, beyond his birth certificate?

I’m not an expert on what documents Presidents generally make available to the public. Can you demonstrate to me that President Obama has released comparatively few documents in comparison with President Bush or President Clinton?

LTC Lakin is a genuine American patriot. I applaude him for having the backbone and courage to do what he is doing. He is willing to risk his career in order to “protect and defend” the Constitution, as he swore to do when he took his oath.

I admire his patriotism as well, even if I believe it to be entirely misguided in this case.

I know Hussein Obama is hiding something and if in fact it turns out he’s not eligable, he should be immeadiately handcuffed and led out of the White House to a nice prison cell where he can spend many, many years at. The man is a FRAUD!!!!!!

Your use of “Hussein” rather than Barack suggests the real foundation of your analysis.

That is not her statement and she never said the words you quote “was born in Hawai’i and is a natural-born American citizen”

I’m afraid you’re verifiably wrong. See:

http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2008/08-93.pdf
http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2009/09-063.pdf

that stupid laser printed scan copy that is apparently good enough for idiots like you

It is also good enough to serve as prima facie evidence of Obama’s birth in any court in the United States.

I stand corrected. Unlike the fringe right or the far left I will admit when I am wrong and not resort to name calling. That is the way debates are supposed to happen. But when the name calling starts rather than pointing out fact, too much gets lost. I am sure from the far right I will be called out as a traitor and the far left will say I did not say enough. So I will leave it at that and agree that she had made the statement on later posted document.

Was this Dave Weigel's last birther post here at TWI?

When does he start at the Washington Post?

Or foreign country, I believe.

Help me out – if Barack was born in Hawaii, why is it that Michelle is talking about his home country of Kenya?

By your own theory, President Obama spent no more than a few hours in Kenya before he was hustled out by his mother so his birth could be recorded in Hawaii. Why would that serve as a basis for anyone to claim Kenya as Obama's “home country”?

The Certification of Live Birth is not a copy of the original birth certificate. It is a computer-generated document that the state of Hawaii issues on request to indicate that a birth certificate of some type is ‘on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.’

The COLB, regardless of the manner in which it is printed, is a document copying the contents of the contents of a certificate on file with the DoH. It is certified by the DoH.

If you have applicable Hawaii authorities which state that “copy” means “photocopy,” please provide those sources.

Failing that…

HRS § 338-13(b): Copies of the contents of any certificate on file in the department, certified by the department shall be considered for all purposes the same as the original, subject to the requirements of sections 338-16, 338-17, and 338-18.

Hawaii law is crystal clear – the COLB “shall be considered for all purposes the same as the original.”

Given the statutes in force in 1961, the Certification of Live Birth proves nothing unless we know what is on the original birth certificate.

What do you mean, “[g]iven the statutes in force in 1961″? What are you trying to argue?

There are several legal areas (involving ethnic quotas and subsidy) for which the state of Hawaii up until June 2009 did not accept its computer-generated Certification of Live Birth as sufficient proof of birth – or parentage – in Hawaii.

The COLB provides details of one's birth, not one's parentage or ancestry. No Hawaii agency or official has never said the COLB is inadquate solely for purposes of proving one's birth. On the other hand, the COLB is not appropriate for state functions concerning ancestry.

The U.S. Constitution does not contain any ancestry requirement with respect to presidential eligibility, so any state restrictions on the use of the COLB in connection with ancestry would not be applicable for constitutional eligibility purposes.

The Department of Home Lands in Hawaii did not consider the Certification to be a sufficient proof.

You're hiding the ball. Proof of what is the key. To determine what that “what” is, we need look no further than the purpose of the DHHL, and the eligibility requirement based on that purpose:

“The legal basis for the establishment of the Department of Hawaiian Home Lands (DHHL) is the Hawaiian Homes Commission Act, 1920, as amended (HHCA). Passed by Congress and signed into law by President Warren Harding on July 9, 1921 (chapter 42, 42 Stat. 108), the HHCA provides for the rehabilitation of the native Hawaiian people through a government-sponsored homesteading program. Native Hawaiians are defined as individuals having at least 50 percent Hawaiian blood.”

http://hawaii.gov/dhhl/laws

Please show me how the COLB itself would be sufficient to satisfy this eligibilty requirement.

How many home countries can a person have?

Obviously, how many home countries a person has depends on his frame of reference and his life experience.

It's like talking about your “hometown.” If a person lives in Town A from age 0 to age 8, and Town B from age 8 to age 14, and Town C from Age 14 until adulthood, which one would be considered the person's hometown? And what is the criteria for making that determination?

Tomorrow, I believe.

Oddly enough, that's almost exactly my problem. I've lived in eight separate towns over the past half century and am not sure which really if my home town, or if I even have one at all. 'tis a puzzlement.

It would certainly seem to me that anyone claiming to be a Native Hawaiian would have to produce genealogical records showing clear descent from a pre-annexation Hawaiian family, plus marriage records showing that this descent had not been diluted beyond 50% through intermarriage to the Chinese, Japanese, Anglo, or African-American population.

Your statement makes no sense. So, the question is still: why did Obama's wife call Kenya his home country?

She did not refer to his heritage but to his home country which is quite different.

The same way Irish Americans refer to Ireland as the home country, or Italian Americans to Italy or African Americans to Africa. Same difference.

If Lakin was running for POTUS and the only proof of his birth was the image posted on a private web page, it would not be a sufficient proof of his birthplace.

In this case we are looking at a different scenario, the man is risking his career by inviting a court martial in order to force the clarification on Obama’s eligibility to serve as the Commander-in-Chief. He is obviously aware of the fact that anything he posts on the web will be scrutinized to the smallest detail. If Obama had nothing to hide he would have submitted his COLB to the court.

The only two persons I can name are Dr. Fukino and Janice Okubo from DoH. Others are in the background – find those who changed the DoH rules in the darkness of the night and you will have the answer.

You have ignored the most important question in my previous post: How many more soldiers silently ask themselves the same question that LTC Lakin asked publicly? A truly patriotic Commander in Chief would never have allowed the troops to doubt his eligibility.

OK Sherlock, tell us what is the reason that that the first image of Obama’s COLB – the one posted on Daily Kos in June 2008 does not show the state seal?

It was a high quality scan not the low resolution one.

Obama should not get a pass to show multiple improved versions of the COLB image until it looked like an original COLB. It is much more difficult to fake the original birth certificate.

Your statement makes no sense. So, the question is still: why did Obama's wife call Kenya his home country?

My answer remains the same. The only reason why Michelle Obama (and by inference, President Obama) would refer to Kenya as President Obama's “home country” is because it is the country of his ancestors, just the way President Kennedy referred to Ireland as his “home” during his visit in 1963.

Even the most ardent birther never claims that Obama spent anything more than (literally) a few moments of his childhood in Kenya. He was raised, by all accounts, in Hawaii and Indonesia – well on the other side of the world. Even if birther claims were true (and obviously I don't find such claims at all meritorious), it nonetheless seems ludicrous to believe those few moments in time which he spent in Kenya (while barely sentient) would result in the President going around claiming Kenya as his “home country.”

But of course, you are free to believe whatever you like.

She did not refer to his heritage but to his home country which is quite different.

Enlighten me. What is the difference?

Asked and answered. Why do you keep posting the same junk over and over when you know it will do no good?

A truly patriotic American wouldn’t advocate overturning an election by non-constitutional means.

Once again, all you’ve done is prove that you know nothing about America. Why do you live here since you’re so ignorant of our customs, and hate our President and our government?

Reading the comment you are referring it seems that you have digressed for the point of what was being explained. You seems to be mistaking culture and heritage for something it isn’t. It is hard to determine the actual point of your comment.

Excellent.
After the change of rules in June 2009 and the long form no more available, how will the short form be sufficient for DHHL if it was not sufficient prior to that time? The rule change does not have much sense other than providing a cover for Obama.

Raegan's home country is USA. Ireland is the home country of his ancestors.

Department of Homeland Security – according to your explanation of people having multiple home countries, it is an odd name to use for a government agency.

We ought to suggest them to either change the name or start providing security for all those foreign countries where immigrants came from, LOL!

How will the military deal with LTC Lakin?

He was asked to report for deployment to Afghanistan on April 12. What options do they have if they want to prevent the discovery of Obama's eligibility?

Clap. Clap. Clap. Now you seem to understand. Why do you continue to undermined your arguments?

Lakin will get a court martial, which will end his military career, and that will be the end of it. It is sad to see a good doctor damage his military career over a conspiracy theory. And, that will be the end of that.

DHHL is a Hawaii government agency responsible for managing “the Hawaiian Home Lands trust.” These are communities for native Hawaiians, who are at least 50% native Hawaiian* by their genealogical records. What are you know trying to suggest that Obama is 50% native Hawaiian?

Since the President was born in Hawaii, this idiot is no threat to his eligibility, as you well know. God willing, they'll court martial this idiot for refusing orders, or give him a bad conduct discharge, and then loyal, law abiding Americans won't be stuck paying his salary while he advocates sedition.

First, toots, it's “Reagan.”

Second, you've completely missed the point. You really like being shown to be ignorant, don't you?

The President isn't a Native Hawaiian so the law would not apply to him. Why do you keep bringing it up?

If Lakin was running for POTUS and the only proof of his birth was the image posted on a private web page, it would not be a sufficient proof of his birthplace.

I’m surprised you’re willing to assume you’re looking at a valid birth certificate at all just because you see an image of it online.

Department of Homeland Security – according to your explanation of people having multiple home countries, it is an odd name to use for a government agency.

Frankly, I’ve always thought the use of the word “homeland” was a little weird. I never heard it used in the U.S. on any regular basis prior to 2001.

What would have been wrong with “Department of Domestic Security”?

Did you look at the picture of President Reagan in Ballyporeen, Ireland? The banner doesn't say “Welcome Irish-American President.” It says “Welcome Home to Ballyporeen, Mr. President.” Home. HOME. Did you get that? So how is that different from what President Obama's wife said?

My point stands: white people can speak with pride about their ancestral “home” without being considered “foreigners.” Barack Obama apparently can't do that, even though he is only one generation removed from Kenya.

But what about the “Welcome Home to Ballyporeen” banner, which Reagan was willing to be photographed standing next to? And do you have even an internet image of his birth certificate? What hospital was he born in? What was the name of the doctor who delivered him?

Did you know that his lifelong nickname was “Dutch”? So isn't it possible he was really from the Netherlands?

Do I believe Reagan was born outside the U.S.? No. But the fact remains: if you want to be paranoid, and view everything with suspicion and an insurmountable burden of proof, then many Presidents can't “prove” their eligibility for office.

I already explained this on a different thread. He can be charged with missing maneuvers, or with disobeying the order of a superior officer. In either case, the President's eligibility is legally irrelevant under the Uniform Code of Military Justice. The Army also might be able to charge him with attempted mutiny, or mutiny, because his video statement plainly urges other members of the U.S. Armed Forces to disobey the orders of their superior officers.

Lakin is throwing his career away for birther fantasies.

Why did the Irish welcome President Reagan “home” to Ballyporeen? Does that mean that Ballyporeen was literally President Reagan's home? No. Of course not. But if Barack Obama visited Kenya, and stood next to a banner saying: “Welcome home to Nyanga Province, Mr. President,” you birfers would start yapping: “See, we knew it. There's the proof!!!!!”

Do you so deeply hate the very idea of a black man being President, you will engage in any and all intellectual dishonesty necessary to justify your hatred?

You want help? Really? Empirically, what you have proven you want is to persist in your birther delusions. Months of evidence and argument from us have not eroded your mountain of paranoia.

The help you need is from a mental health professional. You have an unhealthy obsession. Get thee to a psychiatrist.

After the change of rules in June 2009 and the long form no more available, how will the short form be sufficient for DHHL if it was not sufficient prior to that time?

The COLB never was and still isn't sufficient proof of Hawaiian ancestry, obviously. But the COLB was never rejected even before the rule change. The DHHL used to note that providing the COLB would simply delay things because it would require the DHHL to retrieve the records itself. Apparently, that is now the rule, not the exception.

By spending multiple millions of dollars to activley stop lawsuites that would pry their way into Barack Obamas personal history, Obama has invited skeptism into his true beginnings for many people- including me. However, I do not believe he was born in Kenya. What I do believe is that he is hiding several other things including who his real father is. I think his real father is Frank Marshall Davis. You should research that one and tell me how far off base I am for even suspecting that, that could be true.

The Department of Domestic Security. Keeping household pets safe all throughout the nation!

;-)

Sorry. It was just begging for someone to say it.

A local grocery store chain has a long-running ad campaign that urges listeners to “come back to your local market, come on home to Big Y.” NONE of people who hear that ad were literally born a Big Y supermarket. “Home” is used in a metaphorical, not literal sense.

This is, of course, yet another nuance of the English language that is obvious to a native speaker. Perhaps you should ask someone to translate this and other difficult questions into Croatian, or Serbian, or Bosnian, or Moldovan?

I would venture a guess that the answer to your question is “yes.” I would further speculate that nickblairtroutfish will vociferously deny being a racist.

By spending multiple millions of dollars to activley stop lawsuites that would pry their way into Barack Obamas personal history, Obama has invited skeptism into his true beginnings for many people- including me.

Skepticism is not the same thing as evidence of wrongdoing.

I think his real father is Frank Marshall Davis. You should research that one and tell me how far off base I am for even suspecting that, that could be true.

My only interest is in connection with President Obama's eligibility. I can't say I'm particularly interested in his life story to the extent it doesn't relate to that issue. I really don't care whether Barack Obama Sr. or someone else is his father. In nearly all circumstances, the parentage of a person born in the United States is immaterial to whether the person is a natural born citizen.

You have conveniently omitted the fact that Reagan's birth was not previously reported by various media outlets in several different countries including Ireland. There were no eligibility lawsuits several months before the election.

BREAKING NEWS

The Indiana State Supreme Court has refused to hear the appeal of the Arkeny case which lets stand the following lower courts ruling.

Based upon the language of Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 and the guidance provided by Wong Kim Ark, we conclude that persons born within the borders of the United States are “natural born Citizens” for Article II, Section 1 purposes, regardless of the citizenship of their parents.

You have failed yet again, bifers

I would ask Dick Cheney, if he can be located in his undisclosed location….

That's because it was not questioned.

Likewise, when the Senate voted to accept that Hawai'i was where Obama was born, that should have been the end of that.

For some reason, however, some people just can't seem to accept it…

That is what we have always said, but wait for the birther conspiracy theorist distortions. Anyways, this give Lakin ample time to change his position.

You seems be making things up again. Two articles which seems to have been tampered with doesn't make “various media outlets in several different countries.” One of the article was actually described the overlapping events of Obama's father coming to Hawaii and Obama's first years of his life.

Quite a bit. I'm of Irish descent but was born in America. Heritage and home country can be two very different things.

Thanks for the welcome news (not that it will alter the delusions of our resident birfers).

You have conveniently omitted the fact that the few foreign newspapers that identified Obama as “Kenyan-born” did so without identifying any factual basis whatsoever for their statements.

It is truly remarkable that bigots who fulminate at the thought of our black President are resting their case on factually baseless headlines in a couple of African newspapers.

Not to mention that there is no Constitutional requirement that a President be legitimate. One of the Founders, Alexander Hamilton, was a bastard, and if he hadn't been shot in a duel there's a good chance he would have run for President in the early 19th century.

By the way, there is no point in preventing “the discovery of Obama's eligibility.” The cat is already out of the bag on that one, NC. We already know Obama is eligible. No hiding it now.

“By spending millions of dollars . . .”

O.K., sport. What is your source of information for that allegation?

And the attorneys for the plaintiffs may be trying to get Obama's “personal history,” but the lawsuits are challenging — among other things — military deployment orders. I damn sure hope the U.S. Department of Justice will do everything in its power to keep unelected federal judges from meddling in the deployment of doctors and other military personnel. Or do you think the Department of Justice should just roll over and allow the precedent to be established that any member of the U.S. Armed Forces who is unhappy with a deployment order can march off to federal court to challenge that order? Do you really think federal judges should be deciding who is deployed and when?

Didn’t you understand the first sentence – the one you repeated in your reply?

What are the Constitutional means to challenge candidate’s placement on the ballot? The Judicial system is corrupt; courts could not make a trivial decision whether a person was eligible to run.

And NC has forgotten that ALL of the non-American reports have either been mistakes (that were corrected almost immediately) or outright forgeries. Those don't count.

NaturalizedCitizen seems to have a major misunderstanding. It is possible for an employee to be fired for refusing to fulfill their contract obligation by refusing to accept an assignment for their direct supervisor. However, they can demand information from the head of the origination to isn't relevant to their dismissal. For Lakin to say that he is refusing deployment because Obama's citizen is in question, isn't relevant now or after he is dismissed.

Where are the newspaper articles mentioning Reagan as foreign-born?

You claimed that you had paid attention to the eligibility issue. If you did, you would have known that Honolulu Advertiser published an article in 2006 mentioning Indonesia as Obama's birthplace. Several African newspapers published articles headlined Kenyan-born Senator…

Then we have reports of birth in Queen's hospital in Honolulu and finaly there is a claim of birth in the Kapiolani.

I hope you don't have problems with addition.

Yes, I do remember the article and the newspaper made the correct to the article. It was due to an over zealous reporter. I already rebutted everything you typed before you entered it. I really don't understand why you didn't any of the articles. You must have been in shock at seeing Kenyan beside the presidents name. Next time check what is written, articles do contain errors even after they have been proofread.

It seems that ferociously sticking to a conspiracy theory makes you miss the point. You seem overly obsessed with disproving Obama's Hawaiian birth. Many of the arguments support Obama's birth in Hawaiian is based on every American, not one person. This is something you keep overlooking.

Sounds like Lakin was another one sucked into Oily Taters tangled web. Too bad she is so wrong and she has managed to get another fool to throw away his career. You know he fingerprints have got to be all over this even if she isn't actually “representing” him. I wouldn't be surprised if he changed his mind just like Rhoades did when it came time to deploy. We'll see.

Yeah, right.

1. The “proof” of Obama's Hawaii birth is the fraudulent COLB image posted on the private web page.

2. A British citizen at birth is eligible to be a Commander-in-Chief of US military.

I have consulted David Ramsay. There are no delusions.

You ought to read the stuff he wrote about citizenship at birth. Before you do, have a heart medication at hand, you will need it, LOL.

Every time “fraudulent COLB image” is read we have to wonder who is the gatekeeper. We have to wonder if the proper authorities have been notified. However, after two seconds the answer is known. I know who the gatekeepers are and that the proper authorities have been notified. They have investigated and found your comments baseless about one year and a half ago.

David Ramsay or is it David Ramsey? Which David Ramsay? The radio host who discusses personal finance topics. Maybe, David Ramsay the Canadian politician. Or, Dave Ramsay another Canadian politician. Or could it be David Ramsay the congressman, historian and American physician who died in 1815.

The most relevant would have been the American politician and doctor, since none of the others are relevant. Did you know that he hasn't been around for almost 200 years. I really don't want to know how you “consulted” that David Ramsay.

“If Obama had nothing to hide he would have submitted his COLB to the court.”

To what court are you referring? Thus far, every court has found it lacks jurisdiction. Why should someone who has been sued in a court that lacks jurisdiction have to submit evidence to that court?

Only Congress can remove a sitting President. Go complain to your elected representative and Senators, and ask that they introduce articles of impeachment. In the impeachment process, Congress can subpoena any relevant documents.

But you’d rather complain to all of us than complain to someone who actually has the authority to do something, wouldn’t you?

Incorrect.

Obama's DUAL citizenship expired on Aug 4, 1984. That left him being a citizen in only one nation: the United States.

You know, the one he was actually born in.

You seem to have this odd compulsion to confuse the “courts” of your homeland with the American judicial system. Why?

David Ramsay the congressman, historian and American physician.

In 1789 he wrote an interesting essay about US citizenship.
Check Mario Apuzzo's web site.

more birthr nonsense

http://www.dakotavoice.com/2010/04/who-will-exp…

and even more birther nonsense

http://www.leagle.com/unsecure/news.do?feed=yel…

Francis Fitzgerald gets arrested again.

This time they put a mental evaluation as a condition of bond.

He wasn't a “congressman.” He was a “delegate” to two continental congresses (i.e., before the Constitution was adopted). He was not a delegate to the Constitutional Convention. An essay written in 1789 was two years too late to influence the drafters of Article II. Why should I care what he wrote?

One of the article actually described the overlapping events of Obama’s father coming to Hawaii and Obama’s first years of his life.

Why does a newspaper headline with no factual support, and without the endorsement of person it mentions, carry more weight than a photograph of Ronald Reagan happily standing next to a banner that acknowledges a town in Ireland as his “home”?

Where is the factual support for the very few examples of headlines describing Obama as “Kenyan born”? Did even one of those newpapers provide a source of information?

If you believe that anything printed in a newspaper is true, would you like to see what major American newspapers have to say about you birfers?

Your “logic” is so unfailingly funny: You believe that the Founding Fathers, out of concern that foreign countries would influence the selection of our commander-in-chief, chose a definition of “natural born citizen” that turns on the citizenship laws of — foreign countries (thereby allowing them, through the adoption and amendment of their citizenship laws, to influence who can be our commander-in-chief).

How utterly dishonest. You know full well that Will Hoover, the author of that article in the Honolulu Advertiser, issued a correction on January 15, 2006 and the article now sports the following introduction:

“CORRECTION: A correction on this story was published on Sunday, Jan. 15, 2006: Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., was born in Honolulu on Aug. 4, 1961. A Page One story last Sunday contained incorrect information about his birthplace.”
http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2006/…

As you also know, Will Hoover later wrote an article about Obama's birth and home(s) in Hawaii, in which he stated:

“Fringe theorists who insist Obama was born in Kenya are left to ponder how two independent Honolulu daily newspapers and the state Department of Health could be part of conspiracy half a century ago to thwart the truth about the future president of the United States.”

http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/20081…

Have a happy day, you fringe theorist.

How did you “consult” David Ramsay, given that he has been dead for nearly 200 years? Did you rely on Mario Apuzzo's website? I checked it, and found this page: http://puzo1.blogspot.com/search?q=ramsay&updat…

What is particularly interesting is that Apuzzo quotes a couple of sentences from an essay that must have been at least 7 pages long, but Apuzzo does not link to the entire text of the essay. So all I can read is the itty bitty piece that Apuzzo quotes. Do you have a link to the entire essay, or are you relying on Apuzzo?

Apuzzo is thoroughly dishonest in equating David Ramsay to a “Founding Father.” Ramsay wasn't part of the Constitutional Convention. His “essay” (if it exists and is not being made up by Apuzzo) was written after the drafting of Article II, and could not have influenced the drafters. More b.s. from Apuzzo, who with his fellow birfertorneys, is noteworthy for losing.

Oh, and I don't need heart medication. Running and cycling keep me quite fit, I assure you. Resting heart rate, 52 bpm. Blood pressure, 110/70.

1. The proof is his birth certificate, contemporary notifications in Hawaiian papers, contemporary accounts of his mother giving birth in Hawaii, and the clear and unambiguous statements by officials of the Hawaiian government that the President was born in Honolulu.

2. The President's dual citizenship at birth is not relevant, since he failed to affirmatively swear his allegiance to either Kenya or the United Kingdom at the age of 21, in accordance with Kenyan law.

3. You're still wrong.

Wrong again, old sport. David Ramsay wrote a polemic against his opponent in Congress trying to subvert the laws of citizenship to disqualify his opponent. Congress shot him down by a vote of 36-1.

As for Mr. Putz, he should stick to personal injury law because he's had his lunch handed to him in every birther suit he's filed.

Why? His attempt to challenge his opponent's qualifications failed. Besides, it had nothing to do with the Presidency. Why are you bringing it up?

I will have to take more time to read Ms. Gina Miller's article. It is good since it seems that she was able to have a general repository to all the birther conspiracy nuttery. Oversimplified nonsense is just nonsense.

Here is what Mario Apuzzo wouldn't provide, namely a link to the “essay” written by David Ramsay in 1789: http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/wp-content/uploa…

What is particularly funny is that it wasn't really an “essay”: it was Ramsay's argument that a political opponent, born in the colonies before the Revolution, should not be considered a “citizen of the United States” because he was out of the country during the Revolution and at the time of the Declaration of Independence. Ramsay was writing in order to influence a decision by Congress whether to seat Ramsay's political opponent, William Smith. Congress sided with Smith, and against Ramsay, 36-1. You can read about “Ramsay vs. Smith,” the first contested election case in Congress, here:
http://books.google.com/books?id=LuE9AAAAIAAJ&p…

So tell us again, NC, why this little screed from 1789, written by someone who wasn't a delegate to the Constitutional Convention, written after Article II was drafted, and utterly rejected by a Congress that included numerous men who were delegates to the Constitutional Convention and their state ratifying conventions, is relevant.

You might want to take your meds now.

Birtherism isn't even natural skepticism. 40 years of JFK conspiracy theorist. Francis Fitzgerald seems to be just another zealot.

It seems that you have many problems with this David Ramsay person. First his isn't alive, thus you didn't consult him. Maybe you consulted his writing, but not the actual person. Second, that was over 200 years ago when Native North Americans, women, Africa America, to name a few were not considered citizens. You have also a problem of time line, and those are just the few that I can think of.

Fascinating. You can actually find the Ramsay petition (which he had printed “at a great expense of time and money”) being referred to the First Federal Congress at p. 149 of the following document:

http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/ampage?collId=lla…

And from page 412 to page 425, you can read the entire debate over the issue. Please note that James Madison voted for Smith and against Ramsay. Here is what James Madison, sometimes called the “Principal Author” of the United States Constitution, had to say:

“It is an established maxim that birth is a criterion of allegiance. Birth, however, derives its force sometimes from place, and sometimes from parentage; but, in general, place is the most certain criterion; it is what applies in the United States; it will, therefore, be unnecessary to investigate any other.”

In other words, allegiance in the United States, according to James Madison, derives from where you were born. Madison goes on to reject Ramsay's argument on the grounds that, upon independence, Ramsay's prior allegiance as a subject of the King became an allegiance to the United States. He specifically relies on principals of British law.

You might want to take a double dose of your meds.

Not only did it fail, James Madison was one of the people who voted against it. And in doing so, Madison noted that in the United States, “allegiance” is based on the place of birth.

The birfers keep piling up the evidence — against their own position!

You don’t get it do you. I have repeated it several times on this blog in various threads. The newspaper articles illustrate the point that Obama was very secretive about his birthplace. Had he not been secretive about it in the past there would have been no confusion. The same way as there was no confusion about possible foreign birthplace for other candidates in the past.

I have a simple answer for Will Hoover’s question: A fraudulent registration of an unattended birth in Hawaii. That scenario explains the newspaper articles and gives cover to Dr. Fukino to say that Obama was born in Hawaii.

If Obama had been born in the Kapiolani Hospital, as the official story claims, he would have produced the long form birth certificate long time ago. There would have been no need to post an image of a fake COLB on Daily Kos.

No, we DO get it. You hate the President and are doing everything you can to smear him in the vain hope of driving him from office. You also don’t read very well, and are almost as bigoted as Borderraven.

You failed to see that foreign countries do not define a person's natural born citizen status in the USA. Take an example of a child whose parents got USA citizenship prior to child's birth. The law could care less whether parent's home country/(ies) consider a child their citizen. What matters is that child was born on US soil and parents are US citizens.

Exactly, why should you care. Keep your head in the sand.
Soon you'll need an excavator to make a deeper hole to ignore the reality.

Did you consider the possibility that Ramsay was actually recording events as they happened. Now we have two pieces of evidence that the late 18th century understanding of the term natural born citizen includes parental citizenship.

The score is 2:0(bama)

Their are Americans who sometimes call themselves Scotts, Greek, Italian, Chinese and we all know that they are talking about their ancestry. We also sometimes identify other people by how they perceive to be Indian, Japanese, Slovak and this doesn’t diminish their sense of being American. From the argument that NC is telling all African-Americans are people who has one parent who is an American citizen and the other an citizen of an African country.

I find nothing sinister about people telling a story and using a common link to identify with other people. It is all about story telling and engaging the listener. Words are parts of the story and not the story. Why are there some people who forget this.

LOL. That is the essay that Apuzzo submitted to the court.

The court case had nothing to do with the NBC status. Mr Smith was born before the Declaration of Independence.

Was it Madison or John Jay who suggested the use of phrase “natural born citizen”? Did Madison, Smith or anybody else bother to write down the definition of a natural born citizen?

John Jay gives you the motivation for the use of NBC phrase in the eligibility requirement. National security: It is a restriction on who can command the US military.

Your definition includes children of illegal aliens. How does it fit into the original intent? It does not.

2:0

1. Was he talking about citizenship at birth or a definition of a natural born citizen?

2. If your quote of Madison was correct, does it mean that children of US citizens born abroad would not have been considered as US citizens by Madison?

http://puzo1.blogspot.com/2010/04/kerchner-v-ob…

Select the first link on top of the page:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/29518614/Kerchner-v-O…

Except that is doesn’t. The terms for Citizen have been redefined. Anyone born on US Soil is considered a natural born citizen regardless of their parent’s status.

You can use a recent development in Utah as an example. Two parents are being deported for being in the country illegally. The issue centers around their newborn child who, since being born in the US is considered a “natural born” citizen.

As stated in the article: “The boy’s U.S. citizenship really represents a problem for them … My best-case scenario is to…get custody of the child from DCFS and let them leave the country together.”

Anything else you’d like to have contradicted while you’re here?

As NC does her famous pretzel imitation in an attempt to defend her ridiculous positions….

Your ability to distort irrelevant cases to support your position is amazing. Is it because you know nothing of America history, can't read English very well, or simply are a bigot?

End your post after “soil” and you are correct. The last four words are wrong.

1. He was trying to disqualify an opponent on specious grounds. Congress saw through him and voted accordingly.

2. Why do you pay attention to anything Putz writes?

Mario Apuzzo has had just as good a record as Orly Taitz and Phil Berg in these lawsuits. Why are you paying any attention to him?

“You failed to see that foreign countries do not define a person's natural born citizen status in the USA.” — It is strange that you actually wrote that.

“The law could care less whether parent's home country/(ies) consider a child their citizen.” — This is a total reversal of all your previous arguments.

We can disregard the last four words of your last sentence as it creates a misrepresentation of American citizenship laws.

It all boils down for you to a vast conspiracy, begun nearly 50 years ago, to place Barack Obama in the White House. Believe that if you want to. Obsess over it if it satisfies you. You are wrong, and nothing you believe is going to change anything in the world that exists outside of your tinfoil hat. And your hatred for the President, and apparently for black people in general, will steadily poison and shrivel your already miserable, stunted little life.

Of course, for the theory to work and them to be able to blame Obama, he’d have to have had a premonition in the womb that he would become president 50 years later and run the whole conspiracy himself…before he was born.

“Is it because you know nothing of America history, can’t read English very well, or simply are a bigot?”

Those aren’t mutually exclusive. I cast my vote for “all of the above.”

Perhaps they believe Obama has been using Jedi mind tricks since before his birth. And that he won’t reveal his medical records because that would tip off the birfers to Obama’s phenomenally high midi-chlorian count (higher than Anakin Skywalker). Why not? All the rest of their beliefs are based in fiction . . .

Let me reiterate: It was over 200 years ago when Native North Americans, women, Africa America, to name a few were not considered citizens. How much value is your statement “Keep your head in the sand” when you continue to ignore some simple facts.

Why don't you just provide links to your arguments instead complaining that the information is wrong? The problem you have is that you continue to refer to materials but never provide references to them. This results in others actually doing the research to verify what you provided is correct or a misrepresentation. Repeatedly doing this casts doubt about on what you have presented is an honest representation of the facts.

“Keep digging” is an ample phrase that describes your excesses.

The NBC phrase is not specifically defined in the US law. I challenge you to provide a link that will confirm your words.

Does the Utah article mention phrase “natural born citizen” or is it your fabrication?

The logic is absurd – children of illegal aliens born in the USA are eligibile to run for presidency and children of US citizens born abroad are not.

Did you consider a possibility that he may have writen what majority of people understood about the meaning of the NBC phrase at that time.

Did anybody in the debate challenge Ramsay’s description of an NBC?

I would rather be certain 100% that the Commander-in-Chief is eligible for the office, even if it meant that people would look at me as a fool, rather than worry about public image and live with the possibility that we have an usurper in the Whit House.

If I were wrong, the consequence is trivial. If you were wrong – the consequence is enormous.

Why take a chance that Obama’s birth might have been fraudulently registered as Hawaii one? The original birth certificate will tell us whether the official story were true.
Similarly it should be a priority for the Supreme Court to issue a ruling about the meaning of the NBC phrase.

Absolutely correct. It took an act of Congress (the 1790 naturalization act) to extend citizenship to children born abroad to U.S. citizens.

It may not fit into YOUR original intent, but it is completely consistent with the well understood concept of “natural born subject” in British common law. You would know that if you have been paying attention to John_C and his patient attempts to educate you over many months.

The ova that became Barack Obama must be blamed, because otherwise his mother would not have turned traitor to her race and married an African.

Find me another source from that time that defines NBC phrase differently from Ramsay’s description. The translation of Vattel’s book confirms Ramsay’s description.

With your knowledge of American history, it should be an easy task for you.

Do you get the fact that Ramsay: (1) had no role in drafting the Constitution; (2) was not influential on legal issues in the early history of our country; (3) submitted the “essay” to Congress in support of the petition to deny his political opponent a seat in the House of Representatives; and (4) saw his petition rejected, 36-1 by the House, including by James Madison?

Face it: you trusted Mario Apuzzo, and we have demonstrated why that is a huge mistake. You are a gullible birther fool. You seem incapable of doing your own research. You will continue to make a fool of yourself until you actually do some research and learn from it.

Where is the long form birth certificate that would confirm the official story? Instead we have a fake document presented on Daily Kos.

Why did Obama pack his “autobiography” with lies? He has lied about so many things – birthplace would not be an exception but a norm.

Hey stupid:

(1) Only Congress can remove a sitting President from office.

(2) Given that the Supreme Court cannot remove Obama from office, in what context would they rule on the meaning of “natural born citizen”? I told you months ago that your bosom buddy John Jay, when he was the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, sent a letter to President George Washington explaining that the Supreme Court cannot issue “advisory opinions.” It is a very famous letter. Look it up.

Absurd to your foreign mind. Not absurd to anyone trained in the common law tradition. That is why Madison said:

“It is an established maxim that birth is a criterion of allegiance. Birth, however, derives its force sometimes from place, and sometimes from parentage; but, in general, place is the most certain criterion; it is what applies in the United States; it will, therefore, be unnecessary to investigate any other.”

You will never understand this country or its history.

This just can't be…NaturalizedCitizen is back? I thought we'd pretty well shot her down the last time. What non-issue is so important now?

As always, NC, this is America and we WANT our people to have a voice. Multiple times I've asked you to spell out exactly what proof you have that Obama is not our legally elected President. Your last list was way too shallow to even be considered. Maybe now you've had a chance to redefine it and make it more impressive?

Actually, yes, it IS defined in US law. You’re willingness to simply overlook and attempts to have it read in ways that only benefit your point of view is your problem. I would challenge you to stop trying to make it everyone else’s.

And the child IS a natural born Citizen. Born in the United States, on US soil, in a US hospital, as a resident of Utah. Doesn’t get more natural than that.

We are talking about the “natural born citizen” status. No foreign law is important in determination wheter a person is an NBC.

If you were born in the USA and your parents were US citizens at the time of your birth, you are a natural born citizen regardless of any foreign country law.

NC: “If you were born in the USA you are a natural born citizen regardless of any foreign country law.”

There, fixed that for you NC.

NC has no proof. NC needs no proof. NC has erroneous headlines in African newspapers. NC has her conviction that the COLB is a fake. NC has her theory that someone fraudulently registered Obama's birth as an unattended birth, though NC has no explanation has to why anyone would do this and no evidence that Obama was born anywhere other than Honolulu.

But NC seems to have a huge crush on Mario Apuzzo. I think she wants to have his baby. She is using her little schoolgirl affectations (“lol” being the primary one) to try to attract him. She would settle for David Ramsay (“what a manly man — he wrote an 'essay'”), except he was murdered 195 years ago.

My mistake, I thought NC was looking for a threesome with her, Mario Apuzzo, and Charles Lincoln. Sex would be great, but not a single working brain cell in the group.

Another WND regurgitated talking points blog. Wonder if blowers are even capable of original thought?

Ramsay was murdered? You mean the conspiracy goes back THAT far?

I think Borderraven would be happy to film it and post the results on his Youtube channel.

You continue to quote Madison even after confirming that his understanding of citizenship at birth was wrong. Already in 1790 Congress contradicted the claim that in US only the place of birth was important.

The Naturalization act from 1790 is much more in line with Ramsay’s position than Madison’s.

Apparently so. It probably goes back to at least 1789, when the Justice Department lawyers who are illegally working for Obama intimidated the House of Representatives into rejecting Ramsay's petition by a vote of 36-1. (The $1.7 million Obama has spent on the coverup bought a lot of “muscle” in 1789). But NC and Mario will get to the bottom of this, once they are done conceiving their lovechild, who is destined to travel back in time and save the white race from any threat of Presidents born to Kenyan fathers.

“No foreign law is important in determination wheter a person is an NBC.”

I'm glad to hear you agree that “dual citizenship” at birth does not disqualify a person from being a “natural born citizen” of the United States.

“DUI Dummy and Taitz's Toy 'Do' the Brainless Bigot Bimbo from the Balkans”

If your parents were US citizens and you were born in the USA you are an NBC no matter what laws of other countries may say.

The trouble for Obama is – his father was a foreigner. He cannot be a NBC.

Madison was explaining what is referred to as the “common law.” The very fact that it took an Act of Congress to extend citizenship to persons born abroad to U.S. citizens actually proves Madison correct: the common law of the United States — the understanding of the basic principles of citizenship applicable without regard to any statute — was that place of birth, not parentage, determined citizenship.

Of course, you do not come from a country with a British common law heritage. It is not surprising that you wouldn’t understand the concept. What is surprising is that you won’t even try to understand, because it would undermine your bigoted opposition to our duly elected President. Instead, you will cling to your warped misunderstandings.

What are you complaining about? Bearclaw knows what I am talking about.

John Jay's letter has been discussed many times on this blog. It is easy to find it on the web. You could even search through previous posts on this blog.

NC: “The NBC phrase is not specifically defined in the US law. I challenge you to provide a link that will confirm your words.”

Can you prove your words?

Isn't that the plot of the latest Dan Brown novel?

“Orly Does Dummies”

As has been pointed out to you hundreds of times, and was recently confirmed by the Appeals Court in the Ankeny case, YOU ARE WRONG. All is that required is birth on American soil, with the exception of the children of diplomats or conquerors.

Child is born in the U.S.

Mother is a dual citizen of U.S. and Country X. Father is a dual citizen of U.S. and Country Y. Country X has law providing that child born overseas (e.g., in U.S.) to citizen of Country X is also a Citizen of Country X, but must affirm citizenship before age 21. Country Y has the same law.

Agree of disagree: Child, at birth, is a citizen of three countries (U.S., Country X, and Country Y).

Question: If child has, at birth, citizenship in three countries, but is born to parents who also are U.S. citizens, is child a “natural born citizen” of the U.S.?

Bonus points: Point to where you found the answer in the Constitution, a U.S. statute, or an essay written by a famous American, gameshow host, or American Idol contestant.

Extra bonus points: Does your answer change if Country X or Country Y has single-payer health care?

*laughs uncontrollably*

This shows how little you know, or care, about American history: you elevate a failed, obscure politician who wrote a polemic above one of the authors of the Constitution.

1. The only valid birth certificate was released almost two years ago.

2. It was not fake. It was not forged.

3. Obama’s memoir was not “packed with lies.”

4. You are an idiot.

5. Go back to Bosnia and ethnically cleanse yourself, you un-American hag.

Ask your pal Borderraven to use his mad research skillz. There’s no way on God’s earth I will work for a traitor.

Congratulations! You FINALLY got it right!

*wild applause*

No foreign law is important in determination whether a person is an NBC.

Yes, that is 100% correct. It is a foreign law that has bestowed dual citizenship on Obama, and this law has no has effect on whether a person is or isn't a natural-born citizen.

However, according to American law children born American citizens, as proven by a American birth certificate, are natural-born citizen irrelevant of their parents citizenship (foreign law).

Please direct us the American law or statute that explicitly states what a natural born citizen is. Please direct us the American law or statute that defines what citizen by birth is. Hint: it is a single request.

Look for it in the “Birfiction” section of Borderraving Books.

I am not sure what are you trying to illustrate here. You advocate that children of illegal aliens are NBCs if born in the USA.

The criteria for NBC is simple: US born of two citizen parents.

A country Z could have a law on books recognizing Nth generation child of their citizen as a citizen of that country; it would not matter when it comes to the NBC status of such child if born in the USA of citizen parents.

NC: “A country Z could have a law on books recognizing Nth generation child of their citizen as a citizen of that country; it would not matter when it comes to the NBC status of such child if born in the USA of citizen parents.”

You have now stated that dual citizenship doesn't matter for NBC.

NC: “The NBC phrase is not specifically defined in the US law. I challenge you to provide a link that will confirm your words.”

You have now stated that there is no such definition for NBC to be required of 2 citizen parents.

So, why do you keep arguing those points?

The change of Naturalization Law in 1795 (from the version adopted in 1790) clearly indicates that early Congress made a distinction between the phrases “natural born citizen” and citizen (at birth).

In the 1790 version, children born abroad (to US citizen parents) were considered as natural born citizens. This is the only law in US history (aside from the Constitution) that explicitly mentions the phrase natural born citizen.

Yet already in 1795 Congress changed the wording and children born abroad to US citizen parents were considered as citizens (at birth).

If you want to support your theory, you would have to believe that Congress changed the law and replaced one phrase with another that had the same meaning as the one being repealed.

As a bonus point, the judge writing the WKA opinion lied about this change by saying that another change in the Naturalization law was the ONLY change when comparing the 1790 to 1795 version.

Above on this same thread, you noted with complete derision the idea that “a British citizen at birth is eligible to be a Commander-in-Chief of US military.”

In other words, you indicated that Barack Obama's ineligibility arises from his dual citizenship at birth. Now, you say that dual citizenship has nothing to do with it, and that someone who is born with citizenship in the U.S. and two other countries could be eligible to serve. My point is that you are obviously making this up as you go. You have no consistent principles.

Let's say that a child is born in the U.S. to a mother who is a U.S. citizen, and a father who is a citizen of Country W. Assume that the laws of Country W provide that the child is NOT a citizen of Country W. That child will be born a citizen of the United States, and have no other citizenship. Yet your “reasoning” (and there is nothing rational about it) says the child is not a “natural born citizen” due to the divided allegiances from having a foreign father, but the child with two parents of dual citizenship, who is born a citizen of three countries, is a “natural born citizen.”

According to you, the law is whatever you declare it to be.

NC: “As a bonus point, the judge writing the WKA opinion lied about this change by saying that another change in the Naturalization law was the ONLY change when comparing the 1790 to 1795 version.”

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! A person who couldn't couldn't cite any statute to support his opinions calling a judge a liar!!! NC, you're such a f**king card!!!

This is how I interpret the original intention of using the NBC phrase in the Constitution.

Direct support is provided in the translation of Vattel and in the Ramsay's essay.

Could you provide one link to a document from that era that will explicitly define NBC as something else?

NC: “Direct support is provided in the translation of Vattel and in the Ramsay's essay.”

So your support is with something never said by Vattel but in a translation after the constitution was ratified and Ramsay's essay that was shot down 36-1 by the Senate? No wonder you're such a loser all you have left is this board.

You, NC, are a freak. The “judge” to whom you refer is more appropriately called “the majority of the Supreme Court of the United States.” Unlike you, when the Supreme Court interprets the law, it is authoritative. You do not understand our country, our laws, or our history. Yet you smugly presume to correct the Supreme Court. You are truly a freak.

Don't trust my words – read the WKA opinion; the part that addresses the change in the Naturalization law in 1795.

Then come back and tell me that the sentence used in WKA was not a lie.

Sure just as soon as you read the part about natural born subject and natural born citizen being the same thing and being born in the country makes you and natural born citizen. Or, do you just ignore that part since it doesn't fit your narrow view?

Of course you avoided the comment on the important subject and commented on the side issue. By the way, I did a favor to the judge and avoided the phrase Chester Arthur's appointee.

What do you think about impartiality of the “wise Latina” on the current SCOTUS writing about Obama's eligibility?

As you already know from John_C's unbelievably patient attempts to educate and potty train you, the majority opinion of the U.S. Supreme Court in Wong Kim Ark provides a lengthy and detailed analysis of the common law origins of U.S. citizenship, the parallel term “natural born subject” from British common law, citations to Massachusetts Supreme Court decisions from the first decade of the 19th Century, hundreds of years of British common law, etc. But you will probably tell us that the U.S. Supreme Court “lied.” And no, I'm not going to go through Wong Kim Ark with you. Go re-read what John_C told you.

In the end, you can interpret “natural born citizen” however you like. Your interpretation has no legal force or effect in the big beautiful world that exists beyond your paranoid cloister of birtherism. In the real world, as Dean Jesse Choper has said, “natural born citizen” means “not naturalized.”

Provide a link to a document from that era that will support your NBC definition.

NC, now you're confusing yourself. If you would read WKA it cites many sources the predate your citations. So, why won't you read them if you are truly curious?

(1) I explained months ago why the change in the naturalization statutes proves nothing. If you want to persist in your delusion that it is relevant, fine. I'm not going to waste my time explaining again why you are wrong.

(2) What does Justice Sotomayor have to do with any of this? Talk about side issues!!! I've told you before, there is virtually no chance that the issue of Obama's eligibility will be argued before the Supreme Court. Only Congress can remove a sitting President, and that is where any decision has to be made.

You lie constantly and consistently. Why should I trust anything you say?

You interpretation is not correct, as you well know.

Sorry, but your peculiar interpretation of American law is not valid. You are wrong.

Children born here are natural born citizens. Period. End of statement. Their parents' citizenship is not relevant.

It seems that NC is so dumb, and her English is so bad, that she doesn't understand that “dismissed with prejudice” means that the case is permanently dismissed and will never be allowed back into court, including the Supreme Court.

As for the knock against Justice Sotomayor, I'm not surprised. NC seems to despise anyone who isn't white, which is pretty amusing since it's less than a century since SHE would have been considered non-white since she's Balkan.

“Paranoid cloister of birtherism.” Beautiful. Just beautiful.

No way in the world am I downloading that onto my Nook.

Just be glad that Borderraven hasn't waddled up and started misquoting irrelevant case law, or directed people to his shiny new LiveJournal….

Would a child born to a soldier of an invading army on US soil get the same status?

If he was not eligible to run for the office, a SCOTUS ruling in any of the eligibility lawsuits would remove an usurper to the office, not the President.

NC: “If he was not eligible to run for the office, a SCOTUS ruling in any of the eligibility lawsuits would remove an usurper to the office, not the President.”

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! You go ahead and keep waiting for that to happen. Even though Judges have already straight up told you it never will.

Which means that none of these suits will succeed, since Barack Obama is a natural born citizen. Thanks for clarifying that!

Since Barack Obama Sr. was not a soldier and the United States has not been invaded since 1812 or thereabouts, your question is irrelevant.

Is it hard to understand that you don't realize that 1795 was over 200 years ago. Get over the laws in 1795, it makes you seem you do not understand American laws. The last Amendment to the constitution, Amendment 27 was ratified in 1992. That is it became law.

My statement was very clear. Please direct us the American law or statute that explicitly states what a natural born citizen is. To put it simple. With reference to the use of Amendment 27 as an example; Please provide the legal code, law or statute that defines what is a natural born citizen.

No. As you would know if you read the majority opinion in Wong Kim Ark. There are two historic exceptions in British common law to the general principle that place of birth confers citizenship: children born to foreign diplomats, and children born to foreign occupiers. That has been pointed out to you at least a half dozen times in the last six months.

He received over 69 million votes. He won a solid majority of the Electoral College. The Electoral College met, it voted, and Obama won. He was sworn into office. Congress has acknowledged him as the President by acting on his nominations, and sending legislation to him to be signed or vetoed.

You can continue your delusion that he isn’t the President. There is not one chance in a billion that anyone on the Supreme Court will agree with you. I guarantee you, they fully understand that your approach would amount to overthrow of the Executive Branch by unelected judges.

There are 435 members of the House of Representatives. Why can’t you convince even one of them to introduce articles of impeachment?

Referring to birtherism*. It is hard to understand how a person can stick to an argument with contradictory proof that undermines their position. It is hard to say “contradictory proof,” because the items that they have presented has various problems. These items either are not relevant or a gross misinterpretation. This it makes someone doubt that they are honestly presenting their position.

There is nothing new or original about the tactics that are used those who want to spread misinformation about Obama's natural-born citizen status. However, they're making themselves look unreasonable in the eyes of rational people. Their lack of caring is the reason that I will never be surprise by them reappear after a long hiatus.

With in almost 200 years there has been atleast 27 amendments to the US Constitution. So, taking that into consideration what you have presented is absolutely meaningless.

“You would know that if you have been paying attention to John_C and his patient attempts to educate you over many months.” — bearclaw

What did the above statement mean to you? Making a mistake or the occasional misunderstand is understandable. However, stick to a position which is has been disproved undermines a person’s arguments.

Depends…is the mother a citizen of the United States? Is she even someone who fled to the US to escape her home nation in search of a better life?

If so, then yes. The child born here would be considered a US citizen.

If the mother is the soldier in question, then no. The child would be born to a “foreign occupier” and would therefore be excluded from citizenship as parental loyalties lie with the home nation.

Sorry folks, going to state the obvious…again.

Orly goes down, again, keeping her winless record in tact.

http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/the-hilar…

A challenge for NC or any other birther:

Instead of wasting your time sharing your opinions on this blog, why don't you go online and start calling every one of the 435 members of the House of Representatives. All you need is one member to introduce Articles of Impeachment and get the ball rolling. If you think you have such a good case, surely you can convince someone (Rep. Bachmann, R-MI comes to mind) to help your cause by proposing to impeach the President for the “high crime” of being “a usurper.” So spend your day calling around to members of the House. Let us know how it goes!

Too bad. Orly would have added so much “flavor” to the lawsuit challenging HCR. It would have been fun to watch, at oral argument, as the various state attorneys general maneuvered to avoid sitting next to her or being in the same photo as Orly.

They offer free malware with every download. Guaranteed to cook your Nook!

Correction: It is, of course, Rep. Bachmann, R-MN.

Just to make it easier for you birfers to spread teh crazy, here is a link that will give you the phone numbers for every member of the House of Representatives: http://clerk.house.gov/member_info/mcapdir.html

Pull up the list, get out your phone, and start dialing for impeachment! Let us know how many members of the House sign on to your crazy crusade.

Barack Obama is President! Happy Friday!

That sounds peculiarly like a 1920s ukelele band song sung by drunk undergraduates in raccoon skin coats.

Bachmann's just nutty enough to try it.

Lakin posted an article a site called AmericanThinker.com. They refused to post my comment. Here is the comment the birthers did not want you or Lakin to see:

The good doctor is oblivious to the federal legal definition of “birth certificate,” set forth in Title V of the United States Code that he never mentions.

He seems unaware that the definition has been codified as a note following Title 5, United States Code, section 301 (5 U.S.C. 301 nt.):

http://law.justia.com/us/codes/title5/5usc301.html

The definition reads:
“(3) Birth certificate. – As used in this subsection, the term
`birth certificate’ means a certificate of birth–
“(A) of–
“(i) an individual born in the United States; or
“(ii) an individual born abroad–
“(I) who is a citizen or national of the United States at
birth; and
“(II) whose birth is registered in the United States; and
“(B) that–
“(i) is a copy, issued by a State or local authorized
custodian of record, of an original certificate of birth
issued by such custodian of record; or
“(ii) was issued by a State or local authorized
custodian of record and was produced from birth records
maintained by such custodian of record.

Under this definition, the COLB is a “birth certificate.” It is a “certificate of birth” issued to “an individual born in the United States” who is a “citizen or national of the United States at birth” and whose “birth is registered in the United States,” and that certificate “was issued by a State or local authorized custodian of record and was produced from birth records maintained by such custodian of record.”

He appears to be unaware that the Hawaiian Home Lands office only wanted original birth certificates to verify Hawaiian ancestry, and accepts the COLB for all purposes.

He seems that the computer generated COLB is the only certificate that Hawaii now issues, and IS the official Hawaiian birth certificate, since Hawaii no longer issues the old forms to anyone.

He seems unaware that the Hawaiian official who is legally responsible for the accuracy and security of all birth records has stated that she has seen the original records, that they show Obama was born in Hawaii, and the he is a natural born citizen.

He seems unaware that official Hawaiian public records of birth are entitled to full faith and credit under the Constitution.

He seems unaware that Hawaiian law restricts the release of birth records.

He seems unaware that the supposed Kenyan birth certificates were proven forgeries uttered by convicted forgers.

He seems unaware that Obama's grandmother never said he was born in Kenya, and that the false reports were based on mistranslation.

He seems unaware that his comparisons of himself to the situations at Nuremberg, My Lai and Abu Ghraib are absurd.

He seems unaware that the lawyer listed on his website, John Hemenway, has been reprimanded by the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia for bringing a frivolous claim in a birther lawsuit, and that the reprimand was upheld on appeal the U.S. Court of Appeals. Hollister v. Soetero, D.D.C., 2009, D.C. Cir, 2010.

He seems unaware that the media reports giving the names of two hospitals were clearly mistaken, that both hospitals in Honolulu were named for former Queens, that the confusion is common, and that Obama has consistently named Kapiolani Hospital as the place of birth.

He claims that “No one I spoke to was able to offer any evidence that the president is “natural born,” seemingly unaware that there is abundant credible evidence, beginning with the official COLB and the statements of Hawaiian official, for the birth.

The seems not to know that an official COLB expressly provides that it is prima facie evidence of birth in Hawaii.

He seems unaware that to state that there is not “any evidence” of Obama’s natural born status is an outright lie, or a statement in reckless disregard of truth or falsity. There is evidence, and the evidence is credible and reasonable. He just chooses to ignore it. He can say that there is no evidence that satisfies him, but he cannot say that there isn’t “any evidence.”

He seems unaware that there is no reasonable doubt about Obama’s natural born citizen status.

He seems unaware that there is only the unreasonable, irrational and invidious doubts of the birthers.

I'm not sure I'd seen the definition from 5 U.S.C. before. Thanks. That is consistent with the Federal Rules of Evidence, under which the COLB is “self-authenticating evidence” because it bears the state seal and the signature of the custodian of the records.

The birthers seem quiet for the moment, but I'm sure they'll be back. And this is what you will hear from them:

(1) The COLB is a “fake”.

(2) One of Obama's relatives fraudulently registered his birth as an “unattended birth” in Hawaii after his mother gave birth to him somewhere outside the country.

(3) Obama isn't releasing his “long form” birth certificate because it reveals other embarrassing information.

(4) Even if he was born in Hawaii, he isn't a “natural born citizen” because his father was a British subject at the time of the President's birth.

(5) Even if he was born a U.S. citizen in Hawaii, he was adopted by his Indonesian stepfather, Lolo Soetoro, and became an Indonesian citizen.

(6) If Obama isn't hiding something, why has he spent $1.7 million (or $1 mllion, or $2.3 million, just pick a big number) on lawyers to avoid having to produce his “long form” birth certificate?

(7) Every judge who has thrown out a birther lawsuit did so after being intimidated by the “Obama thugs.”

All of this is compete rubbish, of course, but we are talking about birthers, not rational people. Great post, Vince, but if you hold out any hope of convincing even one birther, forget it. They hate Barack Obama, they cannot stand the thought of him being President, and they believe whatever they need to believe to support their hatred of him. You can't change that. None of us can.

Thanks, bearclaw.

Know what you mean. Been dealing with them for two years at johathanturley.org.

jonathanturley.org

Indeed, your post was great, factual, obviously researched. But as bearclaw states, you will not make a scintilla of difference to a birther. They are more of a “don't confuse me with the facts” kind of “thinkers” that hate having a black man in the White House and will not admit it if you tortured them with water-boarding. They are determined to keep up the pretense that they are “above” racism and their hatred has nothing to do with it.

What is unfortunate is that a military man has allowed himself to be bamboozled into destroying his career, particularly since this president has already demonstrated his commitment to the military. One of the first things he did in office was to get more money for veterans, has increased the GI bill that even people like McCain opposed and has committed to doing more for our service men and women than any other president has in a very long time. He and the first lady realize what they and their families sacrifice in the name of our country. Ironic, isn't it? The best friend they have had in office for a long time and somebody like Lakin comes along and shows his ass. Oh well, thats a birther for ya!

Beautifully and concisely expressed.

Thanks for the link! I hadn't visited before. After reading a recent entry from “Les,” I now know that you fully understand the tenacity with which birthers will cling to their delusions. You've posted a lot of great material there.

It isn't clear what the future of the “debate” will be here at TWI. David Weigel used to blog regularly about news from the bizarro world of birthers, but David just started at the Washington Post. I doubt that any of the other TWI reporters will add birtherism to their regular beat.

I think the discussion here will die out soon — not that that is a bad thing. As the midterm elections approach, the folks who hate Obama have a natural political outlet for their limitless anger. What they don't seem to realize is that the issue has been a political one all along: they lost an election. They seem to believe that the Constitution provides a remedy for that via the federal judiciary. Given that most of the birthers are quite conservative (they are complaining about “socialism, communism and Marxism when they are not demanding to see “the birth certificate”), I have repeatedly asked them where in the Constitution they find the authority for unelected federal judges to remove a sitting President from office. They have never provided an answer. They just ignore the question, or complain that they hardly can expect a Democratic majority in the House to impeach a Democratic President. As if that gives the federal courts authority to do what the Constitution assigns exclusively to Congress . . .

Who has verified that the COLB image posted on a private web page was officially issued by the DoH?

The first published image of Obama's COLB does not show state seal. It is obviously a fake document.

Give us a rational explanation why would a presidential candidate release an image of his birth certificate on a left wing blog (Daily Kos)?
Why is it that we cannot see a state seal on that image? A high quality scan should have shown the state seal.

You are supporting an usurper to the office.

The discussion can continue at Native and Natural Born Citizen Explored:

http://nativeborncitizen.wordpress.com/

and at Dr. Conspiracy:

http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/

http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/

Doesn't matter, DoH says he was born in Hawaii.

We are supporting a duly elected President. You are supporting a delusion.

You had to get in a few lies before the end of the week, didn't you?

He posted the image on a campaign website: http://fightthesmears.com/articles/5/birthcerti…

He provided the original document to a journalist from factcheck.org, which provides high-resolution photographs, including photos of the raised state seal: http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in…

Now, of course, you will predictably denounce factcheck.org as a “left wing website.” And you will start yammering about folds in the paper, and how much ink bleeds through, and unattended births, and all your usual drivel. You have posted to TWI 2,254 times. You have persuaded precisely zero people. You are wasting your time. You are a very small person, with a very big obsession and a very deep hatred. The longer you hold on to the hatred, the more shriveled your life will become.

How many members of the House of Representatives did you call today? How many agreed with you that Obama is a “usurper”? How many agreed to introduce Articles of Impeachment? I'll bet you didn't call any members of the House. I'll bet you never have and never will. You would rather engage in the futility of repeating your same tired lies here, than face the fact that you can't persuade even the most conservative members of the House of Representatives to have anything to do with your bizarre birther fantasies.

Vince,

Lucky you. You now have a reply from “naturalizedcitizen,” the most persistent birther at TWI. She claims to be a naturalized citizen from the Balkans. She thinks Obama is the next Milosevic. Whatever she asks for, trust that her questions have been answered many, many times. Her particular dementia causes her to cycle between “the COLB is fake” and “the COLB doesn't matter because anyone with a Kenyan father can't be a “natural born citizen.” The more recent addition has been a swing through the fantasy that “his birth was fraudulently registered in 1961.”

BC

As Vince has said “He seems unaware that the Hawaiian official who is legally responsible for the accuracy and security of all birth records has stated that they has seen the original records showing Obama was born in Hawaii, and the he is a natural born citizen.”

Let me translate. The legal authority in Hawaii State of Hawaii has confirmed that the original records exist verifying Obama's birth in Hawaii.

Thus, whether or not you accept the authenticity of Obama's COLB, Hawaiian records being the final proof confirms a Hawaiian birth for Obama.

Vince, It is amusing that those who trumpets their righteousness would block dissenting views. Lakin and others are like bad teachers who make us want to learn more. Excellent comment.

It doesn't matter what he does. With all that has happened in the past month, it would be assumed that the authorities would have investigated the image almost 2 years ago on Daily Kos.

I am wondering if they have actually read a newspaper, watched TV, or listen to the news in the past 4 weeks. Birthers have so much reality to dismiss.

She hasn't ventured into that territory yet. When the House resolution was passed her strongest opposition was a quorum, even though the vote ended up being unanimous with Bachmann voting for it. It seem Bachmann has some good advisers who are able to talk her down from “crazy.”

Why do you take words of a single government official as a gospel? Have we not been lied to by government officials before?

Could you apply your analysis to the case of a high government official (much higher than Dr. Fukino) giving a presentation to the UN claiming that Iraq had mobile, WMDs that could be deployed in very short time.

How many people doubted Colin Powell at that time.

In Obama's case there is no need to invade a foreign country to find out the truth. Just release the original birth certificate. There is no harm to anyone if Obama is telling the truth.

I am talking about the FIRST ever posted Obama's COLB image (on Daily Kos). There is no lie about seal not being visible in that image. You can see it for yourself.

If you followed the story you would have known about gloating comments posted on Daily Kos about having the proof of Obama's birthplace. Few hours later when someone pointed out that document was a fake one with the list of errors they promptly closed the comments.

The factcheck image was posted TWO months later. How many attempts did Obama need to get the image right?

Factcheck “researchers” (two left wing bloggers) could not recognize that COLB was an original document because they never saw the original one before. It is laughable to accept their word as a proof of authenticity of that document.

What would you say if Bush released the report on Iraq WMDs on a right wing blog and their researchers confirmed it and asked for your trust?

Since the first posted image on the web was a fake one – Obama should authorize the DoH to release the original document. Simple.
A truly patriotic Commander-in-Chief would never have allowed a situation where his eligibility is doubted by so many people including the military personnel.

Well, lets see if I can put this in plain English. Oh, but that isn't your first language is it? Well, it will have to do. The Director of Health in Hawaii was looking at actual documents, on file in the states offices where they keep vital records, records that have now been computerized. The Secretary of State was speaking on behalf of the president who was being advised about what was going on in Iraq based on drone and satellite pictures from way up in the air and on informants who had cause to want the US to believe Saddam had WMD. They had to guess as to what they were seeing where Dr. Fukino didn't have to guess at all.

To suggest there is no difference is either very juvenile or disingenuous on your part.

You're obviously a war criminal in a clever cybernetic disguise. Why aren't you on trial at the Hague?

Why do you keep repeating yourself?

Give us a rational explanation of why a Balkan immigrant would come to American and promptly try to undermine our elections.

A truly patriotic American wouldn't be trying to overturn an election by non-Constitutional means.

Unfortunately for conspiracy theorists, I am have more faith in a government official who has direct responsibility in maintaining government records, that a person who of misrepresenting the facts is political motivated.

Why do you use false analogies? It is birthers who are the ones who are misrepresenting the facts, just as those who did to justify Iraq. However, it is quite interesting that you don't seem to understand the meaning of your last paragraph. It is the same contradiction that you seem to consistently engage in.

Ellid, the last paragraph is a quite interesting read. Read it again as the meaning is not the same as was originally intended.

1. Powell's presentation was based on evidence prepared for him by the CIA Director Tenet. Quote from the Washington Post article:

“…George, how confident are you?” the president asked Tenet, in an exchange depicted in Bob Woodward's book “Plan of Attack.”

“Don't worry, it's a slam-dunk,” Tenet said.

A war ensued, a presidency was redefined and a non-basketball player became forever affixed to the term “slam-dunk….”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A…

2. Even if Dr.Fukino told the truth, we know nothing about the original birth registration. Based on the behavior from both Obama camp and the DoH, I would place my bet on an unattended birth registartion (a fraudulent one that originated with Obama's grandparents)

Various State agecies in Hawaii have been asked to investigate and none would do it – it is not part of their job to investigate possible COLB fraud.

So much for your assumption that authorities investigated authenticity of the COLB image.

Please prove proof of your assertion that the responsible agencies have not looked into the valid of Obama's birth certificate.

A truly patriotic citizen has a duty to speak against the suspected usurper in the White House. I am sure you are familiar with the following quote:
“All it will take for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing”

Considering President Obama's maternal grandparents were members of the “greatest generation”, had both served this country admirably- him in the military and her as a “Rosie the Riveter” in an airplane factory, I have a great deal more faith in them than you. You have demonstrated your hatred and disdain for this country by constantly disrespecting the president that a large majority of American citizens voted for to become OUR president. I haven't heard you say you have given up a damn thing- instead you are here taking advantage of the freedoms that people like President Obama's grandparents fought to give you. Without people like them, your stupid ass might still be in some third world country where you would be dead for saying the crap you are saying. We real American citizens don't need to be shown any more proof than we have already gotten that we have elected a fellow American to be our president. You are evidently too slow to be able to remember half of what you post and even less of what you read. You should just go away. If you aren't happy with the way we do things in this country, we won't be stopping you from leaving. Finding someone else that will take might be difficult but…..

I stand by what I said:

A truly patriotic American wouldn't be trying to overturn an election by non-Constitutional means.

It is very clear that you are not a patriot.

Actually, bearclaw, the COLB was vetted by more than one independent news site.

The Pulitzer Prize winning site, politfact.com, conducted by the St. Petersburg Times of Florida, reviewed the original COLB and other dociments:

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article…

“As a fact-checking news Web site, we went to extensive lengths to sort out the truth. We got a copy of his 1992 marriage certificate from the Cook County (Ill.) Bureau of Vital Statistics. His driver's license record from the Illinois Secretary of State's office. His registration and disciplinary record with the Attorney Registration & Disciplinary Commission of the Supreme Court of Illinois. Not to mention all of his property records.”

They got the original COLB for review:

“When the official documents were questioned, we went looking for more answers. We circled back to the Department of Health, had a newsroom colleague bring in her own Hawaii birth certificate to see if it looks the same (it's identical). But every answer triggered more questions.

“And soon enough, after going to every length possible to confirm the birth certificate's authenticity, you start asking, what is reasonable here?

“Because if this document is forged, then they all are.

“If this document is forged, a U.S. senator and his presidential campaign have perpetrated a vast, long-term fraud. They have done it with conspiring officials at the Hawaii Department of Health, the Cook County (Ill.) Bureau of Vital Statistics, the Illinois Secretary of State's office, the Attorney Registration & Disciplinary Commission of the Supreme Court of Illinois and many other government agencies.

“Sounds like a Vince Flynn novel.”

I put a lot more trust in our free press, guaranteed to us by the First Amendment, than in the plethora of anonymous birther posters here and at the other websites examining this question.

And the readers can go to Politifact and judge for themselves.

anotherbird. NC is no problem. There have been a lot more like that at the Turley blog for the last two years.

BTW, Lakin’s own birth certificate from Colorado is like Obama’s from Hawaii – its is entitled as a “Certification of Vital Record” and “Certificate of Live Birth.”

It says he was born in 1965, BUT IT WAS ISSUED ON APRIL 26, 1994.

IT IS NOT THE ORIGINAL HOSPITAL RECORD. It is not the record made out in the hospital in 1965. It has different information in a different format than a Hawaiian COLB, but that is a matter left to the discretion of the State. Some States have policies that open up birth records to all, and others restrict access. State officials are bound by their State’s laws.

Lakin’s COLB is a valid birth certificate under federal law, just like Obama’s COLB.

http://www.safeguardourconstitution.com/images/…

I think that Lakin should reconsider the advice of his medical officer and consult competent legal counsel on the legal status of birth records.

If Obama were a GOP member, than it would be a patriotic thing to make sure that eligibility requirement was properly verified, right?

He was properly verified…through congress. Like McCain was. That's what it means when they voted unanimously to accept him.

Can you or anybody else find a single thing that appears to be wrong on Lakin's birth certificate?

Within hours of posting the COLB image on Daily Kos in June 2008, people have spotted multiple issues with Obama's document. Presenting an improved version of COLB two months later is suspicious. That is why it is important to verify that the original document is legitimate.

If that one existed and confirmed the official story, it would have been released long time ago.

I did not get the memo explaining the qualifications to be a “real American citizen”. Would you care to explain it further?

Is Jeremiah Wright a real American citizen? How about William Ayers?

Don't know about them, I know that the majority of the american people, the electoral college, and congress overwhelmingly think Obama is. Since that's what's important, go back to pounding your head on the wall.

Doesn't matter. Obama's our legally sitting president. Your delusions hold no water.

You are joking, aren't you?

1. They claim that Janice Okubo said in the email sent to them, quote:
“It is a valid Hawaii state birth certificate”

I am willing to bet that they misquoted Okubo. Repeated requests to DoH to verify that they issued the COLB presented by Obama campaign was met with a response that DoH is not allowed to make such confirmation by law.

Tell me who is lying here: PolitiFact or DoH?

2. PolitiFact goes on and lists valid questions raised about Obama's COLB image. Did they address them – NO.

Their “proof” is the COLB from another person born in Hawaii. They claimed that it was identical to the one published by Obama campaign. How could they tell – they did not have two paper copies side by side to see whether they matched.

The closest thing to comparing the two documents would be a comparison of Obama's COLB image and the scan of the document that PolitiFact had in their office. They should have used the same resolution as the document shown on Daily Kos and see whether the folding creases, state seal are visible. So much for their claim of looking into every possible angle to verify the document. They skipped the most obvious one.

3. A Late or an Amended birth certificate would have been fine for obtaining a driver's license or a marriage certificate – try to show it as a proof of your birth in a presidential campaign and you will invite more scrutiny.

If your birth was fraudulently registered by a relative as an unattended Hawaii birth, you would not want anybody scrutinizing the original document.

If NC were a true patriot, and believed the President was a “usurper,” you would think NC would be busy calling members of the House of Representatives and not wasting her time posting over 2250 times at TWI.

You are right, ellid. NC wants an overthrow of our government, not a constitutional process.

It is the utter hypocrisy of those that try to cast doubt about Obama's birth certificate who have a problem. There is no reason for us to demand to see Lakin's original birth certificate; even tough the president's birth certificate is presented in a more appealing manner. If Lakin's concerns were genuine then he would have put more care in preparing his birth certificate for displaying.

Doubt can be made about how many issues on Lakin's birth certificate, However, each concern can be explained.

The use of “real American citizens” is quite obvious. There is great pride in being American, and understanding why it is special to be American. Those who question Obama's authentic birth certificate just don't understand what is wrong with their conspiracy theory. No, this isn't their doubt about an American birth certificate, but the entire misrepresenting of America which is their problem. However, I doubt that they will ever understand this. Just like the Truthers, birthers just don't understand what is wrong with their conspiracy theory.

No, within hours of the President's birth certificate being posted, a bunch of racist idiots who couldn't tolerate the thought of a black President came up with “flaws” that only they could see.

Yep. Born and bred here, unlike you.

If you were actually a loyal American you would have a different hobby.

If you actually cared about America, you'd stop trying to overturn a legal election, right?

1. Are you talking about the 10-20 calls a week to the Department of health after two statements have been released to confirm Obama's Hawaiian birth.
2. Now that is an original argument. Still it is utter nonsense.
3. There was no amendment done to the birth certificate. The entire rumor about the amendment is based on an utter misunderstanding of a Hawaii law.

It is a hard to determine if you comment was intentionally write to sound silly, or it was just a mistake.

One publicly curses USA and the other is sorry for not planting more bombs.

Are you a US citizen?

LOL!
It is the flaw that we could not see that is important: (missing state seal)

The birther conspiracy theory would crumble like a house of cards if Obama could present the original birth certificate indicating the birth in the Kapiolani Hospital.

How many conspiracy theories are out there that could be quashed with a single document that is trivial to obtain for a person born in the USA?

Personally I’d say “idiotic” rather than silly, but I see what you mean.

They complained about the term “real American citizen” and then they come up with that “idiotic” comment. Do they know what “patriotic” means or is the ink still too dry on their naturalization papers that they just don’t understand.

No, the most important thing is that Hawaii says Obama was born there, backing up the document.

Doesn't matter, AB's not running for President. Which is the comment you always make when asked.

And neither is running for President. Another faux fact by NC.

No, the conspiracy would continue. The reason for the dislike has nothing to do with where Obama was born but the color of his skin.

Satellite photos of the Earth from orbit haven't stopped the flat earhers, so this assertion is even more disingenuous than usual.

Stop lying. You know better.

LOL.

AB is certainly more patriotic than you are, regardless of citizenship.

Neither is out to overturn a legal election, which puts them ahead of you.

There have been requests for birthers to produce the exact legal code that defines “a natural-born citizen.” However, you and other birthers continue to refuse. Now you feebly attempt to defect from the real issue.

Conspiracy theory is an oxymoron, it is neither a explains a conspiracy nor a theory. Is a belief where the known facts are dismissed as not being true, and replace with ideas that are inconsistent. It is a belief where people make up facts in order to explain away things that they are not comfortable with or just refuse to believe.

No one honestly believes believe that access to Obama's birth records will end this. In real investigations people follow the facts, and don't fabricate facts. The fabrication of facts includes; referring to laws that have been superseded, quote mining, straw-man arguments, or explaining away the facts. A person following the facts would not dismissing legal authorities, or be picky about titles for documents.

The real issue isn't Obama's birth records but with people who find that birtherism more conformable than the truth.

Yes, your comment is consistent with your lack of understand of how a 3 dimensional object appears in a 2 dimensional space. A hint: … think.

Still doesn't dismiss an authenticated birth certificate.

I don't care if Lakin is a citizen of the United States, San Marino, or Hi-Brasil. His status is completely irrelevant to Barack Obama's birth in Honolulu.

You will have to complete your thought. I don't see any connection between what you wrote and the fact that scanned image shown on Daily Kos shows no state seal. This is something that Obama supporters can't explain.

If you had followed this blog in the past you would have learned that I mentioned the fact that the Naturalization law from 1790 was the only legislation that contained the phrase natural born citizen.
That law declared children born abroad to US citizen parents as NBCs.
It was repealed in 1795 and such children were declared as citizens.
There is no SCOTUS case that directly answers this question. My opinion is that the SCOTUS should take one of the eligibility cases and rule on the issue.

If not a citizen, are you a legal resident of USA?

Interesting when you consider I can go to Daily Kos right now and see the COLB w/ the state seal on it.

You might want to try again…

Why do you care?

She doesn't, she just thinks when she finds something obscure it means she's right…which makes her statements even more hilarious.

The words are right there.

Wrong. There are legal codes that are as recent as 2009 about American citizenship by birth. That is a difference of over 200 years. So, produce the exact legal code that defines “a natural-born citizen.” If you can't produce the exact legal code then produce the title of the statue.

Phil Cave, a retired Navy judge advocate general who now practices military law as a civilian, said:

“They think that by using [servicemembers in a court-martial] they can get discovery like you could in any criminal prosecution,’ he said. “That ain’t gonna happen. They’re not going to have discovery where they’re going to get the president to produce a birth certificate because, I’m reasonably certain, no military judge, no appellate court and no federal court, and no U.S. Supreme Court is going to say they have a right to get that as a matter of discovery.”

Source: Military.com, “Army Calls Birther Doc’s Bluff”:

http://www.military.com/news/article/army-calls…
[copy and paste link on browser or go to military.com]

Get ready to get on the plane, Lakin.

We are talking about June 2008 not April 2010.

Did you read the first sentence of my previous post? That is your answer! No US law explicitly mentioned the phrase natural born citizen since 1790.
That was the first and the only law in US history to use that phrase.

Do you even live in the USA? An illegal alien hoping for Obama's amnesty?

I see, you avoided my question – what was the reason that the first image of Obama's COLB did not show the state seal?

You and other Obama supporters do not have logical explanation for that one. You also have no explanation for his refusal to provide the authorization to DoH for releasing the original birth certificate. The document is trivial for anyone born in the USA to produce.

Doesn't matter. The document was produced. The original image error could have been due to copy quality, scanner error, any number of things.

Now I know you'll come back with some reason as to why it could only be a conspiracy, but try to take into account that the image posted on the site is only as good as what is actually submitted in.

That is because if you're born in the United States that is your qualifiation for “natural-born”. The 1790 law and the subsequent repeal of it was to define citizenship in the respect for those born to US citizens but outside of the US in and of itself.

The actual phrase as listed in the Constitution is “natural-born Citizen”. The only word capitalized is “citizen” as it is the only word calling for definition as to what is required to be one. Those issues are covered by the 14th Amendment.

The full wording is “No person except a natural born Citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution…” What we're seeing there is the defining term; the only people who could be foreign-born outside of the United States and still be President were those present at the Constitution's ratification. All other had to be born within the United States and fulfill the criteria as set forth by the 14th Amendment.

Birth certificates are not “trivial to produce,” especially with a state seal, signature stamp, and registration number. Maybe they're easy to forge in Eastern Europe but they aren't here.

Give it up, NC. You were wrong in the beginning, you're wrong now, and you will be wrong long after Barack Obama has retired to supervise the construction of his presidential library.

My, my, we're desperate, aren't we? What's next, videos of you and Borderraven cosplaying as the Sta-Puft Marshamallow Man and Jabba the Hutt while you terrorize day laborers and take nasty pictures of little girls?

It did show the state seal. NC just refused to see it. Go to factcheck.org and politifact.com and check their articles on Obama birth. Go to obama conspiracy theories on wiki. Check with snopes.com.

The campaign issued an official COLB, signed and sealed.

What part of the following sentence cannot be understood by NC? The State official in charge of the records stated that she had seen the original documents and that they show that Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural born citizen.

You are trying to deceive people by saying that. The COLB image shown in June 2008 did not have the state seal visible. Two months later (in August 2008) Obama campaign released photos on FactCheck where the state seal can be seen.

The official story was that they photographed the document that was previously released as a scan. They had two months to improve the forged document shown in June 2008 based on the comments from public..

Dr. Fukino did not say whether the original birth certificate was based on record from the Kapiolani hospital. There is a possibility that the original birth registartion was a fraudulently registered Hawaii unattended birth.

Dr. Fukino would not even confirm that the COLB image published by the Obama campaign is valid. A direct question has been sent to DoH many times.

The 2nd generation of COLB image is useless. We need to see the document that was a basis for issuing the COLB.

If I were you I would not quote snopes.com in the eligibility debate. Until spring 2009 they claimed that Obama was born in the Queens hospital. They changed it after WND started inquiry into authenticity of the letter sent from Obama to the Kapiolani hospital. The snopes.com change happened several months after the inauguration.

I have sent several emails to factcheck.org asking about methods used to verify the document they photographed; they neither replied to me nor published it on their web page.

LOL! Lower quality scans of Hawaii COLBs show the state seal.

If your theory were correct, the Obama campaign would not have waited two months to release the version 2.0. Comments section on Daily Kos was disabled only hours after the image was posted there. They were aware that many people did not buy the version 1.0.

If Obama had a valid COLB document issued by the DoH he would have posted it immediately after the questions were raised about problems with the first image.

I have an additional question about Obama's motivation to release the long awaited proof of birth in the USA on an obscure left wing web site.Why hasn't he released it to the major media outlets?

Please provide the exact definition of “natural born citizen” in current American law. You continue to refer to laws that are over 200 years old. The conventional wisdom is those who are citizens by birth are those who are “natural-born citizen.” Unless, a definition can be provided then it must be accepted that those born citizens are “natural-born citizens,” and that their birth certificates are proof of citizenship.

Did you read my post before replying to it? I said that it would be trivial for person born in the USA to release the ORIGINAL birth certificate. I was not talking about the COLB image posted on the web.

Then senator Obama (now the Usurper-in-Chief) could have writen a simple letter to the Hawaii DoH authorizing the release of the original document.

If the official story were true, this would help in removing doubts about his birthplace and the DoH could go on doing their daily job without being asked many questions about Obama's birthplace verification.

I guess it is easier to hide behind Dr. Fukino's skirt.

Why do birthers insist on comparing a image taken by a digital camera and an imaged scanned? There is a huge difference between skepticism and conspiracy theories. Anyone with a basic understand of geometry will understand the difference between; a two dimensional object in a two dimensional space, and a three dimensional object in a two dimensional space.

I am sorry but your arguments FAIL.

You are too slow to realize that your claim that the natural born citizen is equivalent to citizen at birth was contradicted by the change of law I quoted in my previous posts. The early Congress did not consder the two to be the same – why would they change the law if the meaning did not change? This happened only few years after the Constitution was adopted.

1. The timeline of events makes no sense for a person trying to provide a proof of their birthplace as a condition of eligibility. Why wait two months to provide photos of the document knowing that people questioned the scanned image posted on the web?

2. The application of state seal damages the paper. The seal area and the surrounding areas will reflect light differently when placed in a scanner. That is why the seal should have been visible in a good quality scan that was posted on Daily Kos in June 2008. There are lower quality scans of Hawaii COLB's posted on the web and they show the state seal.

A change in over 200 years ago of a law written over 200 years. Now that is funny. There have been changes many changes in law over the past 200 years. However, it seems that there are people who believe that nothing has happened in American law in the past 200 years.

“Natural-born citizens” by default are those who are born citizens. That is any born under the 8 categories as listed in § 1401. Nationals and citizens of United States at birth. This is current as of Jan. 5, 2009. Wow, that is just over 1 year ago.

A Kenyan lawmaker told the nation's parliament last month that Barack Obama was born in Africa and is therefore “not even a native American.”

During debate over the draft of a new Kenyan constitution, James Orengo, the country's minister of lands and a member of parliament for the Ugenya constituency, cited America's election of a Kenyan-born president as an example of what can be accomplished when diverse peoples unite:

“If America was living in a situation where they feared ethnicity and did not see itself as a multiparty state or nation,” Orengo posited, “how could a young man born here in Kenya, who is not even a native American, become the president of America?”

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageI…

The document WND artcle talks about is linked here (read page 31)
http://www.bunge.go.ke/parliament/downloads/ten…

Read page 31
Kenyan minister talks about Obama being born in Kenya.
http://www.bunge.go.ke/parliament/downloads/ten…

So now are you going to convince us that no matter how far you walk away from the Statue of Liberty or what direction that it will always look the same.

“Scanning” is taking an image of an object in 2 dimensions, while “photographing” is taking an image of an object in 3 dimensions.

In order to present a document it is suggested that it should be scanned. It looks more professional, and is easier to do.

Taking a picture of a document is much hard to properly align the document. This is the reason the OCR images are scanned and not photographed.

Image quality for this issue is meaningless as there are various different factors that are used in deciding the picture quality. These include bit rate, number of bits, compression rate, compression technique, and image format. Each of these can effect image quality and image size.

Wow and that is your smoking gun? I assume that you probably still believe in “death panels.” A political makes an outrageous claim and those who what to believe it think it is true. However, when a government worker produces proof to the contrary those same people cast doubt. Learn the difference between a skeptic and a conspiracy theorist.

I'm sure a random Kenyan has intimate knowledge of both Hawaiian vital records and the Obama family's travel plans in 1961.

Go away.

Whoopee.

Your objections were addressed and debunked over a year ago. Stop repeating yourself.

And you are too stupid to realize that you are utterly wrong about American law.

Yes, and I stand by what I said. It is not easy to fake a birth certificate, and you are an idiot.

*yawns*

How nice to see that you're back to rehashing junk that you originally brought up over a year ago.

Factcheck is probably sick of morons like you demanding information they've already published it.

No matter what is done the doubt of those who can't accept an authentic birth certificate will not go away. No creditable evidence has been produced to challenge an Hawaiian birth certificate. Also, the use of the term “usurper” casts doubts about the genuineness of what has been expressed in your comment.

There are other things that cast doubt on the genuineness of what was expressed. The use of “original birth certificate” is just a deception. As, even the Hawaii law has outline conditions on when another birth certificate can be released, but these conditions have been ignored by birthers.

Another thing that cast doubt is that there are people who continually contact the State of Hawaii Department of Health asking the same question. Even though they get the same answer, they think that the answer will change.

Another thing that cast doubts is the clinging to the minutes words or phrases in a believe that they have found something that will dismiss the facts.

To put it simply. There are those who continue to; make things up, misrepresent legal code, cling to disproved arguments, and try to find something that would justify their disillusion. No matter what is produced they will still continue to; make things up, misrepresent legal code, cling to disproved arguments, and try to find something that would justify their disillusion.

You must be beside yourself with joy. You may never of heard of the term “pandering.”

“We are talking about June 2008 not April 2010.” — Now you want to recognize things that are current, but you were so determined to stick to something that was 200 years old. That is what we refer to as hypocrisy.

Lower scan on what colors, color deep, number of pixels, greater compression, smaller image.

* yawns *

* yawns *

Wake me up when something revolutionary is found.

Natural born, just like the President.

Read it. Yawned. Had breakfast. Petted the cat. Yawned again. Took a bath. Got ready for work.

We know with absolute scientific certainty that the age of dinosaurs ended many millions of years before the earliest hominids walked upright on the earth. Yet, you can go to the Creation Museum in Petersburg, Kentucky, where they believe that man and dinosaurs co-existed — they even have exhibits depicting this:

http://creationmuseum.org/whats-here/photo-preview/

Birtherism is based on belief, rooted in hatred and fear of an African-American President. No dosage of facts, including handing you or any other birther your own stamped, signed copy of the President’s COLB (or any other document), will ever cure what ails you.

“In Obama’s case there is no need to invade a foreign country to find out the truth.”

Thanks for acknowledging that Obama’s birth certificate would be on file in the United States rather than a foreign country, so that there is no need to invade a foreign country to get. In fact, all Obama had to do was send a check to the State of Hawaii, and they sent him the COLB. That really is a lot easier than invading a foreign country! Moreover, you birfers would have to decide whether you wanted to invade Kenya, or Indonesia, or both. After all, you have delusions about both!

Wow. So James Orengo is credible, and Hawaiian officials who actually have access to original records are not? That pretty much sums up the worldview of conspiracy theorists.

Are you planning on spending the day calling or writing the 435 members of the House of Representatives, who actually have the authority under our Constitution to remove a sitting President, or are you just going to spend another day spitting into the wind? Try calling a couple of House offices, and telling them all about James Orengo. I'm sure they will be impressed.

I should have stopped “at talks about.” Where were these people shortly after the 2004 Democratic, when there was a mention of a rising star in the Democratic party who one day would be president.

5 gets you 10 NC spends the day bloviating instead of calling Congress. It's so much more logical than urging the people who can actually bring articles of impeachment to act.

Remember, in the world of conspiracy only the statements that agree with your delusion are the truth, all others are dismissed without weighing the facts.

It is Dr. Fukino only and she never confirmed the offitial story of Kapiolani birth. She did not even confirm that COLB was issued to Obama on June 6, 2007.

Think about magic words: Fraudulently registered Hawaii unattended birth.

You refused to confirm that you are a legal US resident. Are you are foreign agent working on supporting the Usurper-in-Chief, LOL!

It is time to sell the shares of Obama Inc.

You believe in a conspiracy that began nearly 50 years ago. We don't. You aren't going to persuade us with quotes from people who have no personal knowledge.

Again: why don't you try calling members of the House of Representatives? If you think you are a great patriot, then why won't you use the one recourse provided by the Constitution?

Or do you already know that your theory is complete garbage, and they will just laugh at you?

It did not start as a conspiracy. Just a desire from a concerned grandparent to have their grandchild registered as born in the USA.

Do you still maintan the attitude that no official verification of Hawaii documents is necessary? Invested too much into Obama Inc?

Time to get off the boat while it is still afloat.

You are scum. You slander Obama's grandparents and you have absolutely no evidence to support you. Obama has a valid COLB issued by the State of Hawaii, indicating he was born in Honolulu on August 4, 1961. That is proof of his place and date of birth. End of story.

I have no reason to get off of any boat. Even you don't really believe in the birther fantasies. If you did, you would be spending your time doing something about it, by trying to persuade members of Congress. If you won't even do that, you are a joke and fraud.

Answer Bearclaw's question: if you truly believe the President is not eligible for office, why haven't you called your Congressional representative and demanded that s/he file Articles of Impeachment?

You still haven't produced your naturalization papers. Put up or shut up.

And here is yet more proof that racism is at the root of NC and the whole birther movement:

The President of the United States, of a race that was enslaved for hundreds of years, married to the descendant of slaves, is seen not as a human being, but as something to be bought and sold.

“Disgusting” does not begin to describe it.

Hey, NC, take a gander at this, beginning at page 36:

http://www.parliament.go.ke/parliament/download…

This is not an offhand comment by one member of Kenya's Parliament during a debate on another subject. It is page after page of discussion in Parliament about Obama's inauguration, just hours before Obama was inaugurated. If Obama was born in Kenya, you would think that a such a moment of national pride, all the members of Parliament would be describing how he was born in Kenya, where he was born, etc. Here is the statement of the member introducing the question:

“This event is of great significance to the entire world but even more so to us in Kenya because the President-elect of the USA has his ancestry in living memory of Kenya. His father was born, bred and died in this country and what was unimaginable in the many years you lived in America as a professor in an American university has happened and today an African-American stands poised to become the 44th President of the USA.”

“It is momentous in many ways for us not simply because Barack Obama's father was Kenyan but because he is the President of the USA with which we share a rich history or form of Government, constitutional history, the concept of the rule of law to which we cherish and our court system.”

“Mr. Temporary Deputy Speaker, Sir, therefore, as we celebrate this occasion, let us also pay tribute to those who made it possible like our own Tom Mboya who in the Kennedy administration arranged the Great Air Lift that saw so many Kenyans go to the USA and that, in many ways led to this great Kenyan who landed in Hawaii and married an American woman who has today given us the President of the USA. Tom Mboya and John F. Kennedy are people who saw so much hope for this country.”

“Obama has been in this country two times before. Once before he was a Senator and the last time when he was a senator.”

Mr. Affey says: “I would like to congratulate the people of the United States of America (USA) for making the bold decision to give this opportunity to a Kenyan-American. The blood that flows in him is Kenyan. The fact that today he has been given an opportunity, as an American citizen, to lead that country is an achievement for us and also an opportunity to learn many lessons.”

Mr. Musyoka (Vice President and Minister for Home Affairs): “Really, the world has reason and cause to celebrate! That the first African-American is able to be sworn in as the President of the United States of America. But, of course, we should remind
ourselves that the Americans elected an American President.”

In other words, the members of Kenya's Parliament, hours before Obama's inauguration, in a discussion focused on the meaning for Kenya of that inauguration, say NOTHING indicating the Barack Obama was born in Kenya. To the contrary, they make many references to Obama as being of Kenyan heritage, but he is plainly described as a Kenyan-American or African-American or just plain American.

So, have a fine day, birthers. If you believed a word of your conspiracy theories, you would be busy calling members of the House of Representatives. But even you don't really believe what you post here.

Try doing some actual research, instead of simply barfing up whatever you have swallowed over at WhirledNutD'Orly. I went to the records of the Kenyan Parliament, and sure enough, hours before Obama was inaugurated, they had a discussion about the meaning for Kenya of Obama's inauguration. Begin reading at page 36:

http://www.parliament.go.ke/parliament/download…

This is not an offhand comment by one member of Kenya's Parliament during a debate on another subject. It is page after page of discussion in Parliament about Obama's inauguration. If Obama was born in Kenya, you would think that a such a moment of national pride, all the members of Parliament would be describing how he was born in Kenya, where he was born, etc. I've posted quotes above. No one even suggests that Obama was born in Kenya. They talk about his father being born and raised in Kenya, and they refer to our President's Kenyan heritage, but they refer to him as Kenyan-American, African-American, or just American.

You have nothing. Nothing. If you did, you would call members of Congress and urge them to introduce Articles of Impeachment. But my bet is that you never will, because what you like about posting here is that you get attention, and having congressional staffers laugh at you or hang up on you is more than your twisted soul can handle.

Grasping at straws in no way of rebutting a statement. The important matter is the law. Cheap distractions for this issues wouldn't help change the matter of the law. It must be hard going from a communist country to a democratic country where people aren't afraid of their shadow. However, even though you and Ms. Taitz have both claimed to be born in a communist country, it is doubted that you were. Unlike the ex-model who is used to trying to be the center of attention, It is hard to determine your psychology.

Great catch, bearclaw.

Where did Kenya announce anything? It barely rose to the level of an offhand comment, since it was framed as a question.

Yes, a minister named Orengo asked a QUESTION. A rhetorical question never calls for an answer.

[[H]ow could a young man born here in Kenya,… become the President of America?”]

A question is not a statement. “Does he still beat his wife” is NOT a statement that the person beats his wife, since the person never beat his wife.

The answer to the question by Orengo is that no one born in Kenya has ever become President of America, because Obama was not born in Kenya.

Orengo’s question displays ignorance, and was probably politically motivated. If made in parliament, it was made with parliamentary privilege, making him immune from any responsibility for its truth or falsity.

Try to get him to repeat it off the floor of Parliament, or before the House Judiciary Committee, under oath. Fat chance.

She's a poor, scared, little nothing living in her momma's basement trying to find some worth to her petty existence. She lives by the psychology of paranoia.

I don't think there was anything intentionally sinister in Orengo's comments — just some rhetorical sloppiness. The point he was trying to make had to do with tribalism, and he was trying to argue that the election of Obama demonstrates that the U.S. has overcome what he refers to as “exclusion.” I think he was just being sloppy.

If everything statement uttered on the floor of the House and Senate were true, then Terri Schiavo would be alive and teaching graduate courses in astrophysics.

Here is an exercise to stretch NC's mind a little:

Step 1: Imagine that a Hawaiian official had said the following: “How could a young man born here in Hawaii, who is a native American, not be eligible to be President of the United States?”

Step 2: Imagine that I post that quotation here at TWI, and that I assert that the quotation proves Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.

Step 3: Tell us what your response would be to my post.

Having seen you in action for many, many months, I predict your response would be as follows:

(1) “The official cleverly never names Barack Obama. Therefore, the statement can't be assumed to be about him.”

(2) “The statement is posed as a hypothetical question, not as a statement of fact.”

(3) “The statement identifies no source of information to support the 'born here in Hawaii' assertion.”

(4) “If they want to prove Obama was born in Hawaii, just produce a birth certificate.”

(5) “LOL”

Last step of exercise: Take your own answers, and apply them to Mr. Orengo's question.

Factcheck probably has an anti-birther spamfilter on their incoming email: it halts any email with the word “usurper.”

Birthtard Scorecard, April 12, 2010

Disqus posts by naturalizedcitizen: 2,283
“Likes” received: 66
Rational persons persuaded: 0

Thank you. This has been your Birthtard Scorecard for the day.

Asked and answered months ago. Give it up, NC. You’re no less wrong today than you were a year ago.

Lets assume (for a moment) that you were right and Obama campaign posted a low quality image on the web. Few hours later they realized that there was a problem with the image because people questioned its authenticity.

Why would they wait for two months to correct the error if they had the original? The logical behavior would be to scan it properly with all details visible and post it ASAP. Instead they wait two months.

Not very convincing. It contradicts your assumption that the first posted scan was a low quality image – unfortunetly for you thay had no better image to present to the public.

There is a better idea: Show the original birth certificate to alleviate any doubts about his birthplace.

You are stuck on a story and still refuse to recognize the facts. Hawaii has confirmed the existence of the vital record that contains Obama’s birth record. That is all that is needed.

Please stop demonstration of your lack of understand of geometry. Get a good book on 3D graphics. It is not my responsibility for me to educate you in areas that your knowledge is lacking.

They seem to go back to the same sites and read the same disproved information without taking the time to understand what they are reading. They seem to lack the basic ability to be a skeptic on what they read. They are more concerned in reading anything to confirms their belief no matter how wrong it is.

The way you tread a needle is by sending the tread through the center of the needle. If you don't understand about digital imaging then just admit it. No one will thing you are any less of a person to admit that you don't understand something. You try to present the deception that the original image was remove and replaced by another image. The original image is still accessible. This simple fact makes your entire argument false. If you want to deceive someone try someone else.

Doubts about a birthplace. Obama is president because he has produced proof that he is a natural-born citizen. I understand it is hard for you to accept that, but that fact will not change anything. Defeating his nearest rival by about 10 million votes is proof that there is strong confidence that he is a natural born citizen.

The reason is obvious. They don't have no proof to support their allegations, and they know that there no facts that support their beliefs.

1. You need to pay attention to details when quoting others in your posts: The previous one contains a factual error that also exists in Obama's book. The JFK had nothing to do with the arrival of Obama Sr. to the USA.

2. The Usurper is the only White House occupant whose foreign birth was mentioned by a minister of that country.

3. Neither Orengo's statement can be used as a proof of Obama's birth nor the absence of such remark in other debates in Kenyan parlament could be used as proof that Obama was not born there.

However, the level of suspicion into the truthfullnes of the official birth story has been raised by a notch.

Obama has been fighting against the disclosure of the original birth certificate. I am free to draw my own conclusion about reasons for such behavior.

I know that you would rather deal with side issues and personal attacks.

We have not heard from John_C for a while. Maybe he has seen the light, LOL!

Everything you typed beyond step 1 is useless. Your excercise stalls there:
I thought that after all this time you would have rememberd what my position about NBC definition was: it includes parental citizenship.

If you want to play gotcha games – you'll need to pay more attention to details.

Valid COLB, LOL!

The DoH refuses to confirm it and no Obama supporter has an explanation on why Obama campaign needed two months to provide the COLB version 2.0 after the first version failed the authentication test.

1. What is the problem with reading a comment and not making things up? There was absolutely no mention of President Kennedy's administration airlifting Obama's father out of Kenya.
Grammar point: “in many ways led to” means a series of events. The keyword is many.

Yes, it is possible for anyone to come to the conclusion that you are a Martian spy. (This is using your logic, my belief that you are nothing more than a voter who is upset about an election lose.)

You are not addressing the real issue:
1 Timeline of events makes no sense ( I menetioned it several times in the previous posts). I understand that it is a problem for you to explain it.

2. Why would they post a low quality image in the first place? Why would you want to hide details from being visible?

Normally you post low resolution pictures on the web to reduce the size of the image. The size of the Daily Kos image is not low.
Why would you combine the high resolution picture with high compression rate? What is the benefit of such approach: It provides a cover to explain details missing from the image.

Before starting to explain grammar to me, check the TIMELINE of events. Obama Sr. was already in Hawaii when JFK got involved.

Maybe he got bored with you repeating yourself every couple of days. Do you have glossolalia, LOL?

I daresay the USS John F. Kennedy didn't have anything to do with Obama Sr. coming to the United States, since her keel was laid when the future President was three years old.

As for the rest of your nonsense, it's the usual blah-blah. Have fun wallowing in your own filth.

Before starting to explain anything to anyone, check the FACTS. Yours are non-existent.

Here's the best idea:

Go find another hobby.

And your position, as has been pointed out hundreds of times, is 100% wrong.

Wrong.

It is common knowledge that Obama's father came to America for educational purpose and not as an emergency assistance provide by the American government. The time line is just another birth fabrication. You fail because you insist on repeating misinformation on a birther site.

Yes, your postion on natural-born citizen is know. However, after several requests for current American legal code that matches your definition none has been seen. No matter how many times you repeat your misinformation it will not supplant American law.

I’m not sure NC can keep track of the location of her own cranium.

Get a new argument. The State of Hawaii has confirmed the existence of the birth record, and that is all that is need.

Sorry again, for such a long absence, but it was worth it!

Yah, C5a’s are like bumblebees. They shouldn’t be able to fly, but they do. I even had a chance to fly in one. Talk about uncomfortable. Military aircraft are uncomfortable to begin with, but the C5a has such a circumferentially large cargo area, it has a problem with cabin pressure. Add to that, the seats are faced backward, so takeoffs are a bit odd, like being pulled from your seat.

Oh, my bad. The new airframe is the C-17, not 117. It’s more like the C-141 in the way it looks and flies. I’ve never had a close look at one, I got out before they were used universally by the Air Force. I spent the last two decades in the Army.

I can keep track of my arguments. If you had a better memory you would have remembered that I mentioned three categories of birthers:

1. Those who think that Obama is not eligible because he was not born in Hawaii but in a foreign country. These are people who subscribe to the born in the USA = NBC theory.

2. Those who accept Hawaii as Obama’s birthplace birthplace but think that he is not eligible because his father was a foreigner (Donofrio is in this category).

3. Those (like me) who think that Obama does not meet either of the above conditions.

The easiest issue to deal with is the issue #1. The original birth certificate would help Obama convert many birthers.

I think that it would help him further deceive the rest of the population. If he could produce the original birth certificate consistent with the official story, it would be much easier to silence the parental citizenship requirement folks. Yet Obama has been fighting to keep that document from being verified.

Obama has tried to execute this scenario by posting the COLB image on the web. The initial version was an obvious fake – it increased the suspicion that something was wrong with the official story.

I stand by what I said: you can barely keep track of your head, let alone anything else. You repeat yourself constantly, you make the same asinine arguments despite being shown literally hundreds of times that you are wrong, and you never, ever, ever stop.

No doubt John_C got tired of trying to educate NC, who is determined to be ignorant.

Is there anything inaccurate in the scorecard? No.

Wouldn't surprise me.

What WND hairball are you going to cough up today?

How many members of Congress did you call yesterday? How many refused to talk to you? How many laughed at your paranoia? How many agreed to file Articles of Impeachment?

Have you even tried letters or email to members of the House?

Oh, that's right. You would never actually exercise your rights as a purported citizen of the United States. You just hang out here and whine. What a complete loser.

NC: “The easiest issue to deal with is the issue #1. The original birth certificate would help Obama convert many birthers. ”

Great, then let’s take care of that one for you. What proof do you have that he was born anywhere else? If you have none, then no need to show the state vital records…as stated under Hawaii law.

Congress has the power of subpoena. We don't. Why are you wasting your time here?

So the COLB doesn't matter. Thanks for clearing that up.

And as you know from John_C's patient efforts, your “two citizen parents” position has no foundation in American law and jurisprudence. But feel free to make that pitch to members of the House of Representatives, if you can ever get over your fear of going public with your paranoia.

How could she lose track of her cranium, when it hasn’t left her rectum in the entire time she has been posting at TWI?

I'll bet he's reading now, waiting for NC to pull another new BS argument…waiting to pounce.

We don't even know if NC *lives* in the United States, or is actually a citizen. She's consistently refused to produce any proof.

Good point. Her only proof of citizenship is that she chirps “LOL” just like a junior high school girl texting her friends from the food court of any American shopping mall.

Oh, oh…the sh*t has hit the fan for the good Colonel…

http://coloradoindependent.com/51209/%E2%80%98c…

Years of hard labor for the good doctor sounds nice.

Hey all, I'm back with good news!

I've spent the last week engaging a now-former birfer. He has disavowed any question as to President Obama's birth. It took a while, but after reviewing this and other TWI birfer blogs, and Jonathan Turley's site, he was convinced not by our (real Americans) reasoning, but the “nonsensical and idiotic” (his words) rantings of NC!

He also cites bearclaw, anotherbird,ellid and john_c for being credible. He saw the light of reason, truth and reality by way of you four.

Keep it up folks!

NC, just give it up. YOU won't convince anyone that your “quest” is valid. It's just wasteful horses**t you leave behind for others to clean up. Trouble with that is, they're putting it all right back on your lawn! LOL!

Thanks, Monkey. We've already declared NC an honorary Obot for the way she continues to prove that Obama was legally eligible to hold office. Now we see more fruits of her labor. Before she's done she'll have brought down the blower movement all by herself!

I'm reminded of the credit sequence for the old TV western drama “Branded” with Chuck Conners.

Hope he likes the accomodations at Leavenworth!

Yah, it's just sad an American taken in by this crap has to go to prison for something so stupid. It's his choice. I have NO sympathy for him.

“honorary Obot?” LOL! She'll have to kill herself now.

Your friend wasn't persuaded by NC's world-famous principle of the national allegiance of sperm? To wit:

A child born on U.S. soil to a U.S. citizen single mother artificially inseminated by an anonymous sperm donor cannot be a “natural born citizen” because we don't know who the father was, and gosh, that sperm could have come from a foreigner!

I will have to update my “Birthtard Scorecard” today to account for the fact that NC has persuaded at least one rational person to abandon birtherism.

Wait until Lt. Col. Lakin finds out that in the court martial process he isn't going to be allowed “discovery” of the President's personal records!

If all he is charged with is “missing movement” and “conduct unbecoming” then he is lucky. They could easily have charged him with attempted mutiny for making a youtube video that plainly encourages other members of the Armed Forces to disobey lawful orders.

But you have now clarified that any questions related to the COLB are irrelevant to you, because your argument rests on your bizarre “two citizen parents” theory. Or can you not even keep track of your own arguments?

He didn't actually give the reason, but now I'M curious. I'll ask him and get back to you!

Inquiring minds want to know!

Good work! *cheers*

I think NC is a coward, just like all the rest of the birthers.

You should cheer yourselves! I just showed him my BC, as well as my mother's and one siblings', and compared them to President Obamas'. Then we went online.

It bolsters your faith in humanity when things like this happen. You, bearclaw, anotherbird and john_c are MY heroes, now!

Conduct unbecoming is lock. It is my belief, however, that disobeying a direct order will clinch it. He IS an officer. That charge carries a heavy penalty for commisioned officers.

Did I miss the posting of the same information by any of the Obama supporters who regularly post on this blog?

Clean up your own yard before criticizing your neighbor.

You are arguing with yourself by switching the topic.

Nobody doubts that Obama Sr came here for educational purpose. The fact I was pointing out is simple: JFK got involved in helping that program later on after the arrival of Obama Sr to the USA.

That's not what you said.

Sorry, but we asked you first. In fact, I think I asked you back sometime last year for proof that you NOT Orly Taitz, preferably in the form of your birth certificate. You've consistently refused to produce same despite repeated requests.

So, I repeat myself: put up or shut up.

Where is the original birth certificate? Why is Obama fighting hard to prevent the US public from seeing this document?

None of the Obama supporters on this blog or otherwise could explain the motivation for his behavior.

Obama is a habitual liar – even his so called autobiography is full of lies. Why would he do that unless he wanted to deceive the public and create a false image of his past.

LOL?

Really?

Quote what I said and then comment on it.

He showed his legal one. The one issued by Hawaii to every person who requests one. Same explanation as always. And, you calling Obama a liar is a joke, since you've proven to be the biggest liar on the board.

Quote yourself, we have doubts you ever realize what you type.

ARMY TO COURT MARTIAL 'BIRTHER' OFFICER
Posted: Tuesday, April 13, 2010 4:10 PM by Mark Murray

From NBC's Jim Miklaszewski and Mark Murray

U.S. military officials tell NBC News that the U.S. Army will court martial a lieutenant colonel who refuses to deploy to Afghanistan because he considers orders from President Obama to be “illegal.”

Army doctor Lt. Col. Terry Lakin believes Obama does not meet the constitutional requirements to be president and commander-in-chief, because he believes (incorrectly) that Obama wasn't born in the United States.

Lakin refused this week to report to Fort Campbell, KY for deployment to Afghanistan, but instead showed up at the Pentagon, where he was confronted by his brigade Commander Col. Gordon Roberts, a Vietnam Medal of Honor recipient.

Lakin was informed by Roberts that he would face court martial, and his Pentagon building pass and government laptop computer were seized.

Does the U.S.D.B clinic at Fort Leavenworth need help cleaning bedpans?

I have no doubt.

How many people posting on this blog have made their citizenship status the focus of their moniker? One. That would be you, NC.

I don't care whether you think I'm a citizen or not. I'm just here to mock you for priding yourself on your ignorance, fear and hatred.

And the quote from the Kenyan MP does not say otherwise. The Kenyan MP is making the point about Tom Mboya, and what he did. It is beyond doubt that he helped get Barack Obama Sr. a scholarship and got him to the U.S.

And, of course, the extensive discourse by various Kenyan MPs on January 20, 2009 indicates that they were well aware that our President's connection to Kenya was through his father, not through birth in Kenya.

I agree. I think the hope for Lt. Col. Lakin was that he would be able to argue that he didn't “fail to obey a lawful order of a superior officer” because the deployment order can't be lawful if the Commander in Chief isn't “lawful.”

What I think he will find out is:

(1) Under the Uniform Code of Military Justice, an order is only “unlawful” if obeying the order would violate the UCMJ.

(2) The issue is whether the order came from a superior officer in Lt. Col. Lakin's chain of command. It is the authority of the officer issuing the order that is relevant, not the authority of the Commander in Chief.

He has thrown away his career for the delusions of the birthers.

“Clean up your own yard before criticizing your neighbor.”

Perhaps you should take your own words to heart.

Ha Ha Ha.

Page after page of Kenyan MPs bursting with pride and talking about the significance for Kenya of Barack Obama's inauguration as the 44th President of the United States. And not one even hints that Obama was born in Kenya. In fact, they make the point that is connection to Kenya is through his Kenyan father. And they say that he has only been in Kenya twice (both times well documented, as an adult).

Draw your own conclusions. You are wrong, but free to persist in your delusions. By the way, has it sunk in yet that only Congress can remove a sitting President, and that you are wasting your time trying to bring us over to The Dark Side?

And if you are tempted to answer that Obama isn't the sitting President, but a “usurper,” answer this little quiz:

(1) How many U.S. Senators have refused to act on nominations sent by Barack Obama to the Senate for confirmation on the grounds that Obama isn't really the President?

(2) How many members of Congress refused to attend the State of the Union speech, on the grounds that Obama isn't really the President?

(3) How many members of Congress have refused to accept Obama's authority to sign into law bills passed by Congress?

(4) How many members of Congress voted against the resolution commemorating the 50th Anniversary of Hawaiian Statehood, because it unambiguously stated BOTH that Obama is the 44th President of the United States and that he was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961?

They know where he was born. They know he got over 69 million votes. They know he won a majority in the Electoral College. They know he was sworn in. They know he is the President of the United States.

Now, take your suspicions, your misreading of law and history, your hatred of a black man being President, and try to convince members of Congress that you are right.

You kvass-sucking liar, you KNOW that's not true. John_C, Jim, Monkey, Bearclaw, AB and I have *repeatedly* given reasons why the President hasn't done what you want, from the legal (the Hawaiian government prohibits it) to the practical (it wouldn't do any good since birthers would find some reason not to believe it) to the exasperated (he's already released the legal copy, so why should he bother?).

You are a disgraceful and disloyal excuse for an American.

We should be so lucky.

To quote Argus Filch in Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets:

“Dear me, we are in trouble now.”

Do your own work for once.

My family came to what is now America when your ancestors were still enslaved by the Ottoman Turks. I have nothing to prove to the likes of you.

You seem to be a little confused. Your latest comment is proof that if Obama allowed you to hold his vital records that you would still proclaim it as false.

Let me be very clear. Being air lifted is “an emergency assistance.” When JFK was president he was the head of the “American government.”

Your continual spreading of misinformation has hampered your inability to demonstrate that you can comprehend an argument that disproves your position.

Thank you for helping persuade a wayward soul to abandon the error of birtherism!!!

I will be updating your Birthtard Scorecard later today in recognition of your great accomplishment!

A Kenyan lawmaker told the nation’s parliament last month that Barack Obama was born in Africa and is therefore “not even a native American.”

Gee, I remember a few weeks ago when you questioned Dr. Fukino’s authority to make pronouncements on the meaning of Constitutional law. Why are you now so interested in the musings on American law by an obscure Kenyan politician?

A Kenyan lawmaker told the nation’s parliament last month that Barack Obama was born in Africa and is therefore “not even a native American.”

Gee, I remember a few weeks ago when you questioned Dr. Fukino’s authority to make pronouncements on the meaning of Constitutional law. Why are you now so interested in the musings on American law by an obscure Kenyan politician?

Yes, that sounds about right. Number 2 is the subsection that's pertinent.

And yes, he's toast. Maybe NC can visit him when she's not wasting life trying to argue birfer nonsense.

Where is your common sense and decency? Why not give up the futile “quest”?

None of the birfers have made a cohesive argument for their stance, just forgeries. That still doesn't explain YOUR behavior.

Birfers are habitual bulls**ters. Why would we trust anything they (you) say? There is a vast throng of MILLIONS of Americans who DO NOT have a problem with President Obama's legitimacy. Why should we continue to cater to a minority who would rather throw disrepute on him, in vain attempts to discredit The President of the United States?
Stop getting your blowhard “news” from the right-wing noise machine. This all boils down to racism. Remove the crap, and that's all that's left.

Oh, and congratulations for helping steer a wayward American back into the fold. It's nice to know you are doing our work for us.

Maybe he'll be the subject of “exploratory examinations.” Of course, he won't need a hospital for that.

Well, maybe afterward.

Birthtard Scorecard, April 13, 2010

Disqus posts by naturalizedcitizen: 2,296 (+13 from yesterday)
“Likes” received: 66 (+0 from yesterday)
Rational persons persuaded to accept birtherism: 0
Rational persons persuaded to reject birtherism: 1*

*Based on report from Monkey99. Actual results may be higher.

Thank you. This has been your Birthtard Scorecard for the day.

Says the cowardly Balkan whore?

“Obama has been fighting . . .”

That's pretty damn funny coming from a proven liar. See you in court?

That's fucking hilarious. Keep it up.

Perhaps the self-destructive officer has decided that aside from thinking he's above the law like our resident Balkan whore, that trashing your career, your marriage, your family life and your sanity, that perhaps prison is a respite. He'll have time to reflect about what could have been.

TMZ is on it.

I've just spoken to the former birfer (let's call him Alex, since he's not a birfer anymore. It's not his real name, but he deserves a modicum of respect, now) and here is his take:

It was the last birfer marathon here, at TWI, and one other blog he saw a couple of days ago. What changed his mind was the refusal of birfers to accept proven facts when confronted with them (I think my BC comparo was influential, but not the determining factor), and the inability to stay on topic. He states that there is a line where one must accept what's presented, because in the absence of contrary, factual proof, the argument dies in the face of the presented information.

What's funny is he wasn't swayed by MY comments! It's O.K. though, my ego isn't so big that it needs to be stroked continually. He wanted me to say that bearclaw and anotherbird were incontrovertible, and that ellid's and john_c's comments were, to him, influential about halfway down the blog.
There was one other on the other blog who made very similar arguments that he could not refute.

To NC, from Alex:

Stop what you're doing. You have not, for as far back as he went, presented anything to bolster your argument, just wild questions. It is incumbent on you to provide contrary proof. That you have not done, and it badly damaged any credibility you have, or may have wanted. It was also the same with the other blog. You may have started this with the best of intentions, but time and lack of evidence for your case did you no favors. This is now a non-issue.

Funny. I and the other Americans here saw it a long time ago. Better late than never, though.

Think maybe they'll use him as an example for any other blowers in the military thinking about doing the same thing? I'd say, they've finally gotten fed up.

By the way, don't feel miffed if Alex missed you, he wasn't impressed with my comments, either. It's perfectly O.K. At least we were all instrumental in bringing another American back from the edge.

Where is the original birth certificate?

According to Dr. Fukino's official statement, it's in the possession of the DoH.

Why is Obama fighting hard to prevent the US public from seeing this document?

He isn't “fighting hard.” No one has propounded discovery of such a document in any court.

None of the Obama supporters on this blog or otherwise could explain the motivation for his behavior.

I offered my views on a number of occasions. You just don't agree with them.

Obama is a habitual liar – even his so called autobiography is full of lies. Why would he do that unless he wanted to deceive the public and create a false image of his past.

Even if he wanted to “deceive the public” for some reason, there is simply no credible evidence that Obama's mother ever traveled to or was in Kenya at any time in her life. Nor has anyone even attempted to explain why Stanley Ann Dunham had to give birth on U.S. soil, or where she got the money to galavant around the world.

We have not heard from John_C for a while. Maybe he has seen the light, LOL!

I hadn't checked back because frankly I was sure everyone would have gone their own ways after Dave Weigel headed for the Washington Post.

FYI – the Colorado Independent has a similar forum where everyone can exchange their views in the future. I've noticed a few familiar “faces” there already.

NC, I would concur that I've seen the light, but that moment occurred about a year and a half ago.

However, the level of suspicion into the truthfullnes of the official birth story has been raised by a notch.

I think I'll wait until Orengo gives some idea of where he got his “facts” from. For all we know, he's been reading WND.

Nah, that's too much fun to pass up for long. I just got busy with other things.

Even to pubs are getting as far away from Orly as they can. If she wins the party nomination, wonder if the party will try to keep away and not finance her for the election?

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-taxday1…

That's hilarious! I bet Oily is having an absolute conniption about being invited and then dis-invited! I wouldn't be surprised if she shows up anyway or files a police complaint or a lawsuit or something against them now. She will probably name all the candidates who didn't want her there as well as the sponsors/organizers. Too much!

I am not doubting Mboya connection. It is the reference to Obama Sr. connection to JFK that is a lie. The same one as mentioned in Obama’s so-called autobiography.

I am not doubting Mboya connection. It is the reference to Obama Sr. connection to JFK that is a lie. The same one as mentioned in Obama’s so-called autobiography.

This is my hobby, LOL!

I am starting up a blog devoted entirely to covering the eligibility question. Come on by, and post to your heart's content.

http://zevonsky.wordpress.com/

(Nevermind the name…)

Feel free to tell me what you think. Do you like it? Does it suck? How can it be improved?

“Look, the truth is the truth. It is important for the public to know. Just like it took time but Watergate was investigated and there was resolution.”

So now Taintz believes her stupid “quest” rates with Watergate?

She tries to get Dunn removed from the ballot by the same tactics she “tried” to get President Obama removed.

Classic. Classless. Yes, the state Republican party has a target on it's back. Put there by one of their own. You just have to love it!

I doubt NC knows what it really means

I doubt NC knows what it really means

I just have the paycheck credited to my Costco account to keep me supplied with Cheetos and Mountain Dew in bulk quantities while I sit in my bathrobe absorbing the latest communiques from ObotCentral.

Not only did the Repubs not let her “fineeesh,” they didn't even let her start.

If your story were true, why would you want me to stop. After all I am helping your cause, right?

I see a little contradiction in your words.

Unless Alex is a little voice in your head ask him to register on the blog and post in his own name.

Where is the original birth certificate?

There original birth record is with the State of Hawaii Department of Health.

Why is Obama fighting hard to prevent the US public from seeing this document?

Obama isn't fighting hard. No court has ruled for a discovery. Also, the State of Hawaii has consistently stated that there are limits on who can get access to those records.

“None of the Obama supporters on this blog or otherwise could explain the motivation for his behavior.”

You must have not read the news of Orly Tatiz being invitation to a Tea Party Rally rescinded because of complaints from Republican candidates. I never knew that the Tea Party or Republicans were Obama supporters.

“Obama is a habitual liar – even his so called autobiography is full of lies. Why would he do that unless he wanted to deceive the public and create a false image of his past.”

No matter how many times you repeat factually incorrect arguments doesn't make them try.

We have still not heard the real reasons for your disproved argument. However, we know it has absolutely nothing to due with the fact that Obama is a natural born citizen.

Every journey begins with the first step.
I'd like to offer several suggestions:

1. The name of the blog is not clear. Using the word Official implies a direct link to Obama. If this is not true and you still want to keep the same title – put a link to a page describing the purpose of your blog to make it easy for people to understand what is going on.

2. In addition to quotes from different media articles, you need to include your own opinion – after all that is the purpose of the blog.
You will attract viewers by offering a unique view: merely quoting others will not be as interesting.

3. Have a regular posting schedule for new topics covered (at least once a week). Of course nothing prevents you from commenting more often when you feel like it.

4. Could you include the description about the comments section on your blog: rules (if any), who manages the section, etc…
Is it possible to setup a login to use only username and password.

If my memory is correct you acknowledged the fact that the state seal was not visible in the first COLB image presented on Daily Kos.

There is no logical explanation for the two months waiting period to release the version 2.0.

If the first post was done in error – it could have been corrected the next day when people commented about its deficiencies. My conclusion from this timeline is simple: In June 2008 the Obama campaign did not have the document they presented in August 2008. Therefore it was not an official document issued by the DoH.

Couple it with the fact that Dr. Fukino was willing to ignore the law and mention Hawaii as Obama's birthplace. It is safe to assume that she would have ignored the same law and confirmed the COLB had it been issued by the DoH.

Advocating the overthrow of a legally elected President is not a hobby. It is treason.

Advocating the overthrow of a legally elected President is not a hobby. It is treason.

I think you’re jealous because no one would buy a copy of your account of killing people not in your ethnic group and then lying your way into America.

I think you’re jealous because no one would buy a copy of your account of killing people not in your ethnic group and then lying your way into America.

LET MEEEEE FIN-EEEEEEESH ! ! ! YOU HALF TO SHO SUM DEE-SUMCEE!

LOL! It's cool. I'm just here to ridicule birfers.
The mascara stained Balkan whore and war criminal who thinks she's American wouldn't last 12 seconds at Parris Island.

You have just demonstrated enough gall to be divided into three parts.

Unfortunately, the mascara stained Balkan whore lacks basic reading comprehension skills.

There is no logical reason for you to persist in your monomania, especially since all your allies have given up. You're not going to change anyone's mind here, and in fact your posts have convinced a former birther that the President is a natural born citizen. Why are you wasting your time?

I see nothing but lies in yours.

“Are you using your whole fist there, doc?”
– Irwin M. Fletcher

You're willing to believe that a heavily pregnant teenager was willing to spend as much as the average family made in a year to fly into a war zone to give birth in an area hundreds of miles from anyone who knew either her or her husband. Talk about voices in your head telling you what to do!

Still here, I see.

Didn't get the dig, I see. There's no contradiction. I still would like you to stop denigrating yourself, since you obviously aren't aware of the conclusion yourself. Still, it was surprising that it took a birfer to make another birfer see the light. And reality.

You see? can't even accept gratuity with grace.

Since I'm not in the habit of creating falsehoods and outright lies like the birfers, I have nothing to gain by making up a “little voice in my head” to convince anyone with anything. That's what birfers do.

I'll go ahead and ask him, as a final concession to you, but I CAN say that he'll not respond. He's the kind of guy that doesn't garner friendships with people he doesn't respect, and as far as I can see, he has NO respect for you.

He left you a message through me, but they are his thoughts, and I suggest you follow them. After all, he WAS one of you, once.

Unless her spatial orientation was in the horizontal.

Oh, maybe not. They ARE Marines, after all.

I know that the Democrats in Illinois had to disavow several Larouchies who managed to win primaries a few years back. I saw one of the candidates on Nightline and I swear she'd been brainwashed….

Great banner!
And nice job. I like the Snap previews.

Here's another blog some of you might find interesting.

http://barackryphal.blogspot.com/

Barackryphal – Birtherism Exposed

The Top Five Birther Debate Tactics from 4/1 is a good read.

Examples of Presidential/VP Candidates with Immigrant Parents*

Elected Officials

Barack Obama (President, 2009-present)
- Father was born in Kenya.

Spiro Agnew (Vice-President, 1969-1973)
- Father was a Greek immigrant.

Hubert Humphrey (Vice-President, 1965-1969)
- Mother was a Norwegian immigrant.

Charles Curtis (Vice-President, 1929-1933)
- Mother was a Native American.

Chester A. Arthur (President, 1881-1885)
- Father was an Irish immigrant.

Party Nominees

John Kerry (Democratic Presidential nominee, 2004)
- Mother was born in France.

Ralph Nader (Green Presidential nominee, 2000)
- Both parents were Lebanese immigrants.

Michael Dukakis (Democratic Presidential nominee, 1988)
- Both parents were Greek immigrants.

Geraldine Ferraro (Democratic VP nominee, 1984)
- Father was an Italian immigrant.

John B. Anderson (Independent Presidential nominee, 1980)
- Father was a Swedish immigrant.

George McGovern (Democratic Presidential nominee, 1972)
- Mother was a Canadian immigrant.

Edmund Muskie (Democratic VP nominee, 1968)
- Father was a Polish immigrant.

Primary Contenders

Mike Gravel (Democratic and Libertarian contender, 2008)
- Both parents were French-Canadian immigrants.

Dennis Kucinich (Democratic contender, 2008)
- One or both parents were possibly born in Slovenia.

Bill Richardson (Democratic contender, 2008)
- Mother was born in Mexico.

Andy Martin (Republican contender, 2000)
- Father became a U.S. citizen when he was 5.

Arlen Specter (Republican contender, 1996)
- Father was a Russian immigrant.

Popular Rumored Candidates

Mario Cuomo
- Both parents were Italian immigrants.

Bobby Jindal
- Both parents were Indian immigrants.

Colin Powell
- Both parents were Jamaican immigrants.

*You may notice that many persons on this list only have one immigrant parent each. That is because “Candidates with Immigrant Parents,” despite being plural, does not imply that each candidate in question had two immigrant parents. Such an interpretation would be grammatically foolish.

http://barackryphal.blogspot.com/2010/01/presid…

There's some typical and predictable birfer stupidity in the comments section too.
Looks like the Cheetos stained raving lunatic had some time to fat finger more inane drivel in between naps.

Let John_C be the judge whether my comments were of any help. I did not see you posting a suggestion or a comment.

Then there must exist the original birth certificate that would corroborate the official birthplace story. If that were the case, why would Obama engage in the campaign of lies and deception rather than release the original document?

Why did his lawyers made a reference to the online COLB image in one of the eligibility lawsuits. It would have been more credible if they submitted the actual document (shown on the factcheck.org) to the court.

The reason they cannot do it is simple. The scan of such document would have shown that the first image posted on the Daily Kos in June 2008 was a forgery.

That's because I didn't see anything to dislike in his blog.

Wow. Am I imagining things, or has Borderraven's grammar gotten WORSE?

The NIH should run a study on birtherism's causal connection to progressive mental disease.

My favorite assinine comments over there were:

(1) Orly's free speech rights are being violated (the First Amendment does not obligate any political party to give her a podium from which to speak); and

(2) The COLB isn't adequate for purposes of Homeland Security, so you can't get a passport with it (doubly funny because the COLB is perfectly adequate for getting a passport, and in any event the State Department, not Homeland Security, issues passports).

Excellent stuff!

Of course, we all knew this, but it serves as a warning to birfers that their tactics are known and watched for.

It's hard to BS someone when they are aware of the tactics and have the truth at their side.

EXCELLENT!

This is great stuff!

I've obviously been remiss in my studies. This, and the post below are the best yet!

Keep it going! More, more!

Excellent!

Objective, very well put together. Professional look, too.

Great job!

Thanks!

Here's a couple of favorites.

http://badfiction.typepad.com/

And this one is an excellent resource as well:

http://tesibria.typepad.com/whats_your_evidence/

Birthtard Scorecard, April 14, 2010

Disqus posts by naturalizedcitizen: 2,304 (+8 from yesterday)
“Likes” received: 66 (+0 from yesterday)
LOLs in past three days: 5
Futility Ratio*: 0.0286

*The “Futility Ratio” is the number of “likes” divided by the number of posts.

Thank you. This has been your Birthtard Scorecard for the day.

#2 in particular is ludicrous. I've been using my COLB (or equivalent since I'm not from Hawaii) for over twenty years, and no one has ever questioned it.

Is Lakin completely nuts? </rhetorical question>

“Evidently Lakin has posted his COLB as proof that the President's COLB isn't a valid birth certificate. Insanity defense?

“Lakin has made a big deal about Obama's birth certificate, and Margaret Hemenway has stated repeatedly that the State of Hawaii COLB image Obama posted is not a “birth certificate”.

Yet if you see the image of the “Birth Certificate” Lakin has posted that he's claimed he needed to provide for various military reasons, you notice something:

It's an image of a State of Colorado Certificate of Live Birth. In other words, a COLB.

By birther logic, what Lakin posted is not a real 'birth certificate' either.”

http://badfiction.typepad.com/badfiction/2010/0…

At badfiction, I couldn't stop laughing!

This “Sqeeky Fromm” has a thing for monkeys. Now I am PROUD of my niece's choice of screen name for me.

“5150″ is a term for stupidity and/or insanity (the standard) in the Army.

“and that he has been refusing to obey not just orders to deploy, but all military orders.”
Oh yeah, Lakin is toast.

Lakin's COLB isn't authentic? Well, by birfer standards. I wonder when they'll hang, draw and quarter him for not being a “real” American. It must really be grating to be bamboozled by someone they defend so vigorously.

The best were the vaccination questions for President Obama's mother, and the travel questions. I guess President Obama (the birfers must HATE every time I print out his full title) must have had a mental link with his mom to counterfeit money to have been able to afford the trip. Personally, I'd have trouble with that, since birfers are the ones who are all about presenting forgeries.

tesibiria is the almost definitive source for the facts the birfers continually deny. World Nut Daily, Fox noise and the rest of the right-wing noise machine really do attract the the most cerebrally-challenged in this country.

Echo chambers all over America will collapse when this is all proven out in President Obama's favor, as it has been, all along.

There are some other gems on the badfiction site that are really funny!

Like this:
“Pandas’ problems come from their basic refusal to act like real bears. First of all, real bears like to mate. Brown bears, black bears, and polar bears are all famous for their robust drive to procreate. Not so pandas. It’s just very low on their list of priorities. In addition, real bears eat what they’re supposed to. Again, not so with pandas. Even though they have the digestive tract of a carnivore and cannot digest cellulose effectively, they insist on keeping to a diet that is 90 percent bamboo. This means that they have to feed constantly, subtracting from time that could otherwise be spent not mating. In fact, it is entirely likely that pandas don’t ever mate because they don’t have enough energy after long days of eating their really inefficient food source.”

I can think of a few birfers who must be pandas. Right, ellid?
; – )

Almost missed your bit of garbage, here.

REAL, VERIFIED, ACTUAL FACT: My mother, born 1926, has a long-form. She was born in RURAL Oahu, which is the reason for the LFBC, understand? Non-hospital births had no other way of verifying them, without midwives having to fill out these forms. It is the ONLY reason they existed in the first place, GET IT?!

REAL, VERIFIED, ACTUAL FACT: My eldest sibling was born 1947 in Kahuku. their BC is NOT an LFBC, nor is there any record of one, nor is there a “Vault copy” or other bulls**t along those lines. Why no long-form? They were DISCONTINUED. I speak from family proof of discontinuance. How can those twins have LFBC’s when they were born in a HOSPITAL?

REAL, VERIFIED, ACTUAL FACT: My elder sibling was born 1950 in the SAME hospital as President Obama. THEIR BC is EXACTLY the format of President Obama’s. It is also NOT A LONG-FORM.

Either you know not what YOU speak of, or are just employing the same tired tactics birfers think they invented. As far as I’m concerned, you have been punk’d. The Nordyke twins were born 1961, yet the BC’s were published last year? That’s a big, red flag. That you accept this bit of chicanery confirms you are as stupid as we think you are. Either that or you lie again, in which case you are still as stupid as we think you are.

You really should heed “Alex’s” advice. You’ve pretty much lost all vig and cred with this crap, just like Oily Taintz, herself. Hope you don’t talk this nonsense in public where you live, otherwise you’ll be holding the s**t end of the stick. Just like Taintz is now.

I'd say they were platypus.

The platypus has no ecological niche, and the scientific community had a problem classifying it. Well, they finally did. it's a reptile. I don't know, but I'd say the reptile brain more closely resembles that of a birfer, wouldn't you think?

The platypus itself, cares not whether it is mammal OR reptile. That pretty much sums it up.

How many birthers does it take to change a light bulb? None. They don’t believe any of the bulbs are eligible.

This is also describes birfers very well:

“Perhaps not so surprising for an animal lacking a brain, the jellyfish developed only one gastrovascular opening for both the mouth and the anus. Known in the jellyfish community as ‘The Great Mistake,’ the mouth/anus serves to devour plankton, fish, crabs, barnacles and sometimes other jellyfish. And then to poop same meals back out later. Adorable.”

Now THAT is an apt description!

“The Great Mistake”. That's an infinitely usable term! I used to just say “a**hole under the nose”, but TGM is much better!

Went to the Colorado Independent, and there are familiar compatriots there. Couldn't post a comment, however. Odd, it's Disqus. Oh well.

You're a nice monkey. You're not like the mean monkeys that promise credit repair and an end to bad musicals.

One thing I've never done is throw excrement inside glass enclosures.

I leave that to the birfers. Don't believe we'll see much of that from them, though. They're too busy smearing it all over themselves.

The lies and deceptions are in your pathetic excuse for a brain.

Lt. Col. Terry Lakin, an Army doctor who’s refusing to serve his second tour of duty in Afghanistan until he sees President Barack Obama’s birth certificate, is under investigation by the Army.

Lakin was supposed to report for duty on Monday at Ft. Campbell, Ky., to a unit deploying to Afghanistan. Instead, he reported to his brigade commander at the Pentagon.

Lakin will be assigned to duty at Walter Reed Medical Center in Washington, pending an investigation into whether he violated two provisions of the Uniformed Code of Military Justice, said Army spokesman George Wright: missing the movement of a unit and violating an order.

Lakin’s brigade commander, Col. Gordon Roberts, read Lakin his Miranda rights and said the doctor was “about to be charged with serious crimes,” according to a press release from the American Patriot Foundation, a birther group coordinating Lakin’s legal defense fund.

Lakin’s decision not to deploy comes after he posted a YouTube video last month outlining his intention to “invite my own court martial” by demanding to see proof that Obama is a natural born citizen of the United States.

“The minimal invasion to any politician’s privacy from having to show an original, signed birth certificate is far less than the harms to our country by someone not qualified whose election would thus subvert the law and the truth,” Lakin said in the video.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0410/35823…

Check out the photo with WND. com in huge letters.

Isn't Walter Reed Medical Center where Presidents receive physicals and other medical care? The spirit of true irony may have something brewing.

It behaves more like a Frisbee stuck on the roof at times.

What is the motivation for the Usurper's behavior? The original birth certificate would tell us for sure whether the official story were true.

There has been no official confirmation that he was born in the Kapiolani Hospital.

Doesn't matter which hospital he was born in. There has been official confirmation he was born in Hawaii. Have a nice day. :-)

monkey99 wrote, in response to naturalizedcitizen:

Almost missed this bit of garbage.

FACT: My mother, born 1926, has a long-form. She was born in RURAL Oahu, which is the reason for the LFBC, understand? Non-hospital births had no other way of verifying them, without midwives having to fill out these forms.

FACT: My eldest sibling was born 1947 in Kapiolani. their BC is NOT an LFBC, nor is there any record of one, nor is there a “Vault copy” or other bulls**t along those lines. Why no long-form? They were DISCONTINUED. I speak from family proof of discontinuance. How can those twins have LFBC's when they were born in a HOSPITAL?

FACT: My elder sibling was born 1950 in the SAME hospital as President Obama. HER BC is EXACTLY the format of President Obama's.

Either you know not what YOU speak of, or are just employing the same tired tactics birfers think they invented. As far as I'm concerned, you have been punk'd. The Nordyke twins were born 1961, yet the BC's were published last year? That's a big, red flag. That you accept this bit of chicanery confirms you are as stupid as we think you are.

I still think you should heed “Alex's” advice.
========================================================

Are there any other Obots claiming that Nordyke twins' certificates were bogus, LOL!

Kenyan Parlament web site has been scrubbed
http://www.thepostemail.com/2010/04/15/kenyan-p…

Few days from now Usurper's supporters will claim that the statement from a Kenyan minister never happened.

You mentioned debate in Kenyan Parlamant in January 2009. They said interesting things in November 2008:
http://www.thepostemail.com/2010/04/14/kenyan-p…

You didn't print the entire text of my comment, number one (more revisionist nonsense, eh?).

I'll take what I can hold in my hand over ANYTHING a birfer says, especially when it shows birfer claims to be lies.
Do you still not understand that in Hawaii, the LFBC was filled out by midwives, for RURAL births, OUTSIDE a hospital so an official record could be kept of those births the hospitals had no control over? Slipped your feeble mind, I suppose.

Now it is up to you to PROVE those twins' BC's are valid. PROVE IT! Since it is my assertion that the LFBC was discontinued in 1946/7, and I can compare that with what I have to verify it, show proof, incontrovertible proof, that they are still in use. By the way, forgeries don't count.

I wouldn't be doing too much LOL until I could prove it. Birfers are known to fail repeatedly in the area of verification, and now the burden of proof lies with you.

Get to it, crank!

Obama's Birth Certificate: Why the controversy won't go away

by “DadBode”

This is why:

Birther: “Oh why won't Barack Obama release his birth certificate? If only he did that simple little thing, we could put this whole matter to rest. And it would only cost him ten dollars.”

Rational Person (RP): “Didn't you see the birth certificate he posted online?”

Birther: “Anyone could have Photoshopped that. In fact, I saw an anonymous guy on the Internet claim that he could prove it was faked. He's an expert in 'instructional media.'”

RP: “You do realize that 'instructional media' doesn't have anything to do with document analysis, right?”

Birther: “Regardless, it's still fake. If Obama truly had nothing to hide, he'd release his long-form birth certificate, not this computer printout.”

RP: “How should he release it? If he simply posted a scan online, wouldn't you accuse it of being faked?”

Birther: “Oh, certainly. Anything he produces shouldn't be trusted unless it's reviewed by a competent authority, like a judge.”

RP: “So if Obama obtained his long-form birth certificate, published it, had a judge review it, and then the judge announced that it was legit and he was born in Hawaii, that would be enough? You'd give up arguing that his election is illegitimate, stop filing lawsuits, and concede that he's eligible to be President?”

Birther: “Hardly. For all we know, Obama's parents could have lied to Hawaiian officials, and claimed he was born in Hawaii, when he was actually born in Kenya. Or Canada. For all we know, Hawaiian officials themselves might be in on the cover-up.”

RP: “What if it can be proven beyond a doubt that the birth certificate is real and accurate, and that he was born in Hawaii. Let's say there's a video of John F. Kennedy himself playing midwife to Ann Dunham. Would that settle the matter?”

Birther: “It'd settle the matter of where he was born. But that doesn't mean he's a natural-born citizen and eligible to be President.”

RP: “Why?”

Birther: “Because before he was born, his mother married a British citizen. That means she gave up her American citizenship even before he was born. And Obama can't be a natural-born citizen if neither of his parents were American citizens.”

RP: “So you're begging Obama to release his birth certificate, even though you admit it won't actually stop your complaints.”

Birther: “That's right.”

RP: “Well, what if I can show you that American citizens don't give up their American citizenship when they marry foreigners? Will that put this to rest?”

Birther: “Oh, no. Even if I accepted that he was born in Hawaii, and that his mother was still an American citizen, his father was still a Kenyan and British citizen, and that means Obama inherited dual citizenship and thus wasn't a natural-born citizen. So he can't be President.”

RP: “I see. For the sake of argument, then, let's say that I could show you that there's no requirement that a natural-born citizen be born of two U.S. citizens. Would that satisfy you?”

Birther: “Sorry, but no. Even if the birth certificate proves he was born in Hawaii, and he could show that his mother was a U.S. citizen when he was born, and that his father's citizenship didn't disqualify him, there's still the matter of Indonesia.”

RP: “What does Indonesia have to do with anything?”

Birther: “When Obama's mother married Lolo Soetoro, she gave up her U.S. citizenship, and by proxy, Obama's U.S. citizenship. So he can't be President.”

RP: “No, it doesn't work that way. Didn't we already cover this with her first marriage?”

Birther: “It doesn't matter. Even if her marriage didn't invalidate his citizenship, when Obama was adopted by Lolo Soetoro, he ceased to be a U.S. natural-born citizen. So he can't be President.”

RP: “A minor child can't surrender his U.S. citizenship that way. Besides, there's no evidence that he was adopted in the first place.”

Birther: “Even if that's the case, he's still not in the clear. Because when he traveled to Pakistan in 1981 on his Indonesian passport, he gave up his U.S. citizenship.”

RP: “Apart from the fact that that wouldn't have sacrificed his citizenship, do you actually have any direct evidence that he in fact did use an Indonesian passport?”

Birther: “Not direct evidence. But American passport holders weren't allowed into Pakistan in 1981.”

RP: “Do you have any evidence that that is actually true about travel to Pakistan in 1981?”

Birther: “No.”

RP: “I see. OK, if you put aside the passport, would you concede that he's eligible to be President?”

Birther: “Still no. When Obama was adopted, his name was legally changed to 'Barry Soetoro.' There's no proof he ever changed his name back, but he ran for President as 'Barack Obama.' And that violates election law. I will never accept his Presidency until I see the documentation where he changed his name back to Obama.”

RP: “That's impossible. How can he possibly produce that documentation, when he never changed his name away from Obama in the first place? What proof is there that he was ever legally adopted or changed his name? And even if he was adopted, what possible reason would there be to legally change his first name to a nickname?”

Birther: “A school application in Indonesia says his last name was 'Soetoro.' They take those applications very seriously in Indonesia, so this is solid legal proof that he was adopted and had a name change.”

RP: “And the fact that the same application says he was born in Hawaii?”

Birther: “That was a mistake.”

RP: “OK, so to recap, you wanted Obama to release a birth certificate, but when he did, you accused it of being a forgery? Right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “And you say that if he simply shared his long-form birth certificate with the public, that could be forged too? Right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “So you want him to release his long-form birth certificate and to have that birth certificate reviewed by a judge, to satisfy his critics and answer the questions they're asking? Right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “And if the judge affirms that the birth certificate is legitimate and it says his place of birth was Hawaii, you say it might be falsified, right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “And even if he proves he was born in Hawaii, you claim he's still not a natural-born citizen because of his mother's first marriage, right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “And if he then proves that the marriage isn't an issue, you claim he's still not a natural-born citizen because of his father's citizenship, right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “And if he then proves that his father's citizenship isn't an issue, you claim he's still not a natural-born citizen because of his mother's second marriage, right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “And if he then proves that his mother's second marriage isn't an issue, you claim he's still not a natural-born citizen because of his supposed adoption, right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “And if he then proves that he didn't give up his citizenship via adoption, you claim that he's still not a natural-born citizen because of his 1981 travel to Pakistan, right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “And if he then proves that he didn't give up his citizenship via passport, and even when you run out of citizenship arguments completely, you then claim his election is illegitimate because his legal surname is Soetoro, right?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “So you want to know why Obama won't take the simple measure of releasing his birth certificate, when you already have at least eight consecutive fall-back arguments you'll make if he does so, whereby you'll continue to insist that he's ineligible for the Presidency even after he proves that he was born in Hawaii?”

Birther: “Right.”

RP: “Y'know, if I were Obama, I think I'd save my ten dollars too.”

http://www.hawaiifreepress.com/main/ArticlesMai…

What's President Obama's “behavior” have to do with anything? He's done what you toilers asked. Your lies and fabricated nonsense have you totally confused. Can't keep track of them, eh? That's the problem with that, you know.

There has been no official confirmation that your toiler's quest is valid, either. Especially when proven forgeries are all that fill the file.
The burden of proof lies with you. Don't come back without it.

You are a complete jackass. The “Hansard” pulldown from the menu of the Kenyan Parliament site indicates that all of the minutes from 2008 and 2009 are currently unavailable. 2009 says it is being “updated.” Go ahead and be paranoid — assume that Kenya would wipe out 2 years of records of debate in Parliament because of statements on November 5, 2008 that never state Barack Obama was born in Kenya. Add that to the list of “evidence” your chickenhearted self will vomit up here, but never discuss with any member of Congress.

I can't fully comment on the November 5, 2008 statements until I can read a full transcript. But let's use the example of Ronald Reagan again. He could be welcomed “home” to Ballyporeen, Ireland (as he was), he could take pride in his Irish heritage, the Irish could take pride in having someone of Irish heritage in the White House (as they did with Reagan and JFK), and no one suggests that every reference to “Irish” means he is a foreigner. If you want to play that game, here is further proof that Ronald Reagan was born in Ireland:

“We were flying into Los Angeles in June 1976 after a weekend campaign swing in his chartered jet, and I was seated next to him for the last half hour of the flight. As Reagan began gaining on him, Ford was attacking Reagan as a warmonger. He had refused to personally criticize Ford, but when I asked him about the attacks, his Irish temper exploded.”

http://www.hoover.org/pubaffairs/dailyreport/ar…

“Let’s roll the tape back to 21 springtimes ago. It is the Shamrock Summit in Canada. The Irish eyes of Brian Mulroney are trained on those of Ronald Reagan.”

http://www.proudtobecanadian.ca/blog/index/writ…

“John FitzGerald Kennedy and Ronald Reagan were entirely Irish.”

http://macdonnellofleinster.org/page_4f__irish_…

“That we inhabit this enviable island of trade freedom in an age of rising currency manipulation, subsidization, and regulatory protectionism, we 452 million beneficiaries of NAFTA can credit two Irishmen, Ronald Reagan and Brian Mulroney.”

Followed by this musical confession from the 40th President:

“The Shamrock Summit concluded with what Reagan described as “an evening's delightful entertainment,” a nationally televised gala capped off with two leaders and their wives walking onstage, singing When Irish Eyes are Smiling.”

http://www.vancouversun.com/story_print.html?id…

And if your tiny little brain, brought up on a different language, still can't wrap itself around the ways that national heritage is discussed in the English language, consider this news story:

“MONEYGALL, Ireland — Here they call him O'Bama.

Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois, Democratic candidate for president, is the talk of this village because recently unearthed records indicate that he is a son of Moneygall.”

And what does it mean to be a “son” of an Irish town? It means only that “Obama's great-great-great-grandfather, Fulmuth Kearney, was reared in Moneygall, then left for America in 1850, when he was 19.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/ar…

So Obama can be a “son of Moneygall” based on the birth there of his great-great-great grandfather, but if a member of the Kenyan parliament refers to him as a “son of this soil” it proves that Barack Obama was born there. Do you realize how twisted you are?

If members of the Kenyan Parliament are really claiming that Obama was born in Kenya, then where are birth records? Where are the records that his mother ever entered or left the country?

Hey, idjit, you can be a “Son of Italy” even if you are a woman and even if you aren't even Italian or of Italian descent:
http://www.osia.org/about/who-we-are.php

Same with Sons of Norway! http://www.sofn.com/PDF/membership/Memberapp.pdf

All anyone has to do is sign up for one of these organizations, and — POOF — their U.S. birth and citizenship just vanish!

They just won't get it.

NC says this nonsense IS her hobby. That confirms her as a basement dweller.

I laugh at all the conclusions reached since the start of this illegitimate “quest”.

I don't think I have ever seen a better, more comprehensive answer to the birfers' favorite claim: “If he would just produce his original (or “long form” or “vault copy”) birth certificate, he could make the whole controversy go away.”

Thanks for sharing that. I think it will be reposted many places.

You're welcome. Like so much of the birfer stupidity it's funny and sad at the same time.

I'm still laughing at the idea that someone desperately wants to be taken seriously but continues to cite World But Daily and the Pest & eFail.

The Weekly World News has more credibility (and better writing).

http://weeklyworldnews.com/category/mutants/

I don't give a twopenny damn about the Nordyke twins or their birth certificate. Why do you?

So an Internet smear site is reporting something. What else is new?

Personally, I would like to see proof that NC is not Batboy.

In which case I'm a daughter of Germany, since not only was my mother's entire family from Karlsruhe, one of her third cousins was a genuine, certified, ancestry-checked-to-1800-for-pure-Aryan-descent *Nazi*. Not only that, Manfred was in the SS, which demanded even more genealogical evidence of “racial purity” for candidates. Mum's marriage to my Welsh/English/Scotch-Irish father was the first to a NON-German in my family going back at least two hundred years. If anyone genuinely claim Germany (or, more precisely, Baden-Wurttemburg) as her “home,” it's me.

And guess what? NONE of this changes the fact that I was born in Pittsburgh and thus am a natural born American. Just like NONE of the birthers' ravings change the fact that the President was born in Honolulu and thus is a natural born American.

Idiots.

I did cut and paste of the COMPLETE message from my inbox.

How do you explain the fact that until June 2009 the DoH was issuing both COLB (short form) and the long form birth certificates? It would not be possible to do that if they discountinued LFBC prior to Obama's birth.

Do you have any more gems like this one?

What usurper? President Obama is a legally elected head of state, not a Balkan princeling.

I will take Monkey over you any day, you liar.

1. Where is the explanation for Obama's behavior regarding the first posted COLB image (Daily Kos, June 2008)? There was no state seal visible in this image.

Why would it take Obama campaign two months to present version 2.0 to the public?

2. A long form birth certificate will either confirm that the official story is true (Kapiolani birth) or it will indicate birth registration by a relative. The second scenario would indicate that the official story is a lie and a formal investigation should be launched to determine his birthplace.

What are you doing back without proof? Was what I said too hard for you to comprehend (that means “understand” if that has escaped you)?

The burden of proof lies with YOU. Get to it. No evasions, pleadings, shifting burden, non-sequiters or moving goalposts allowed this time. PROVE what you assert, or STFU.

No brain. Consumes material at WhirledNutD'Orly and poops it out here, from the same orifice. naturalizedcitizen=jellyfish.

Thanks. You are on a roll!

Question: What is the state's policy for issuing a “Certification of Live Birth” versus a “Certificate of Live Birth”? My first, second and fourth children received certificates, but my third and fifth children received certifications. Why the difference? The certificate contains more information, such as the name of hospital, certifier's name and title; attendant's name and title, etc. The certification has only the child's name, date and time of birth, sex, city/island/county of birth, mother's maiden name, mother's race, father's name and father's race. Why doesn't the state just issue certificates? When did it stop issuing certificates? Is it possible to obtain certificates for my third and fifth children?

Answer: No, you can't obtain a “certificate of live birth” anymore.

The state Department of Health no longer issues copies of paper birth certificates as was done in the past, said spokeswoman Janice Okubo.

The department only issues “certifications” of live births, and that is the “official birth certificate” issued by the state of Hawaii, she said.

And, it's only available in electronic form.

Okubo explained that the Health Department went paperless in 2001.

“At that time, all information for births from 1908 (on) was put into electronic files for consistent reporting,” she said.

Information about births is transferred electronically from hospitals to the department.

“The electronic record of the birth is what (the Health Department) now keeps on file in order to provide same-day certified copies at our help window for most requests,” Okubo said.

Asked for more information about the short-form versus long-form birth documents, Okubo said the Health Department “does not have a short-form or long-form certificate.”

“The birth certificate form has been modified over the years and decades to conform to national standards and models,” she said.

Okubo also emphasized the certification form “contains all the information needed by all federal government agencies for transactions requiring a birth certificate.”

She added that the U.S. Supreme Court has recognized the state's current certification of live birth “as an official birth certificate meeting all federal and other requirements.”

The issue of what constitutes an official Hawaii birth certificate received national attention during last year's presidential campaign. Those who doubted Barack Obama's American citizenship called the copy of the Hawaii birth document posted on his campaign Web site a fake.

Asked about that document, Okubo said, “This is the same certified copy everyone receives when they request a birth certificate.”

We found a discussion of “the truth about Obama's birth certificate” on the Web site FactCheck.org — http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_us....

The organization describes itself as “a nonpartisan, nonprofit 'consumer advocate' for voters that aims to reduce the level of deception and confusion in U.S. politics.”

It says a “certification of live birth” is, in fact, a short-form official birth certificate. Information included in the document might differ from state to state.

http://www.starbulletin.com/columnists/kokualin…

1. None of the documents or proof you asked for are needed. Relevant birth records are in the Hawaii DoH. After releasing a COLB image with missing state seal (indicating fraud) the only document that should be used to check truthfulness of his claims is the original document used to register his birth in Hawaii.

That is the difficult position for you and other Obama supporters. There would be no need for speculation and arguing about his birthplace if Obama would authorize the release of just ONE document.

Let's see if that document confirms the official story of birth in the Kapiolani hospital. I am convinced that he was not born in the Kapiolani – his behavior does not make any sense if the official story were true.

2. I am perfectly aware that some people used a language that is normally used for the children of immigrants when referring to the homeland of their ancestors.
I was hoping that you would also comment on the statement in that article about one Parliament member mentioning receiving a phone call from Senator Obama in the middle of the night. I wonder what the problem was that needed to be taken care of.

Couple it with the most recent statement from a minister of lands and you see why people are suspicious about the Kenya connection.

I would like to see the original birth certificate from DoH – it would help Obama clear his name from accusations mentioned in the Kenya Parliament.

Why ask this again? looking for a different answer?

HINT: You won't get one.

Come back when you can answer MY demands.

REMEMBER, No evasions, pleadings, shifting burden, non-sequiters or moving goalposts allowed.

Don't come back without P R O O F ! GOT IT?!

This one IS especially stupid, but birfer tactics will not be tolerated by me any longer. I tried to be accomodating, but it's no use. Call me dense in that regard, but I've about had it with this crap, now.

I WANT to see her “proof”. I want her to provide incontrovertible evidence THIS time! The burden is on them, now. This “circular logic” crap has gotten old.

Let's see what she can do when the tables are turned.

Woo-Hoo!

Blow out all the stops! This is great! Your last one will be definitive, I believe.

Yeah, Pie!

I agree with bear. This is great!

I've printed it out in case I run into any more like “Alex”.

Congress has the power of subpoena. I do not. You have repeated these arguments endlessly, and you spiral downward into deeper paranoia and disconnection from the real world. Too bad for you.

Some more perspective, from a Kenyan (and written well before the 2008 election and all the birthysteria):

“The absolute support that Kenyans offer Obama comes from the fact that his father was Kenyan, which, according to our tradition, makes him our own. In most of our tribal cultures, a child belongs to the father. This overshadows the fact that his mother was a white American. Likewise, the fact that Obama doesn't hold Kenyan citizenship, or speak any Kenyan language, is insignificant. Kenyans, especially those from his father's home province of Nyanza, love him so much that they have already renamed a primary school and a high school in his honor. In Kenyan bars, you can order “Obama beer,” a brew that used to be named “Senator” long before he became one.”

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/blog/2008/01/…

I assume your concern about a “middle of the night” phone call from Obama has to do with paranoia that Obama was asking for his birth records to be destroyed. You are a piece of work. The quote was:

“At the beginning of this year, Senator Barrack Obama called me at midnight and told me: “Mr. Vice President, could you make sure you sort out this problem?” I want to assure him that the problem has since been sorted out.”

It was publicized in January 2008 that Obama had made phone calls, while campaigning in New Hampshire, urging an end to the post-election violence in Kenya. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-502163_162-3687705-…

The call was received in Kenya at midnight. Obama was campaigning in New Hampshire. Hint: there is a time difference between Kenya and New Hampshire. Nothing sinister.

http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/converted…

Now that you’ve been reduced to invoking Godwin’s law, go answer Monkey’s question.

And oh, one thing: I’ve only mocked you. Manfred and his fellow Nazis would have shot you and your dear friend Orly dead. Keep that in mind when you start complaining about how crappy America is.

Accusations????

*HOWLS*

You really are paranoid, aren't you? What a moron!

Asked and answered literally months ago. Why do you keep repeating yourself?

That's right, NC. No more lies, evasions, or changes of subject. Answer Monkey's questions or shut up.

That's right, old sport. Time to fish or cut bait. Otherwise, go join your buddy Bloatedraven on one of his famous seven miles hikes.

For those too lazy (like NC) to click on the link, midnight in Kenya is approximately 5:00 pm in New Hampshire, or right before then-Senator Obama would have been ordering dinner.

So much for the “sinister midnight phone call.”

That explains it – it's Manfred's spirit channeling the negative energy coming from your posts, LOL!

You are cheering the post that calls you a liar?

Your claim about LFBCs being discontinued in 1947 is contrary to what is said in the above post.

What exactly do you mean by “a formal investigation”?

Who do you propose conduct the investigation, and under what legal authority?

You cannot answer question #1.
I have not heard a logical explanation for it from any Obama supporter.

That is why I am asking it – don't run from inconvenient facts.

Look at the first published COLB image from 2008 – that is your proof. Where is the state seal. It is supposed to be visible – it is not.

It was a fake document. A person born in the USA would not have to post an image of a fake document on the web.

Congress should appoint a special prosecutor to establish the facts about Obama's birthplace claim.

The Hawaii Department of Health receives about a dozen e-mail inquiries a day about Obama's birth certificate, spokesman Okubo said.

“I guess the big issue that's being raised is the lack of an embossed seal and a signature,” Okubo said, pointing out that in Hawaii, both those things are on the back of the document. “Because they scanned the front … you wouldn't see those things.”

Okubo says she got a copy of her own birth certificate last year and it is identical to the Obama one we received.

And about the copy we e-mailed her for verification? “When we looked at that image you guys sent us, our registrar, he thought he could see pieces of the embossed image through it.”

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article…

Bears repeating:
“The birth certificate form has been modified over the years and decades to conform to national standards and models,” she said.

How can Congress appoint a special prosecutor? Prosection of crimes is an Executive Branch function (except perhaps for the historic practice of Congress trying people under the “inherent contempt” power). Congress can request that the U.S. Department of Justice appoint a special counsel.

Or Congress can conduct its own investigation.

In either event, pack up all that proof you don't have and take it to a member of Congress to ask for an investigation. Nothing we can do for you here.

Where's your evidence? What did I say, the last time? Was it that hard for you to understand? English getting too tough?

GET TO IT! Bring your proof, or STFU.

YOU cannot answer MY questions, and you haven't answered most of the folk's, here, as well as those who don't frequent birfer blogs anymore because of the evasions, pleadings (as you are doing now), shifting burden (as you are also doing now), non-sequiters and moving the goalposts.

What did I say? Can you remember that far back?

I don't run from anything. Armed combat does that to people. YOU run from them. Now I am putting YOU to the test. You saw the list of don'ts. I've repeated them three times, now. Should I send you an app for sylvan learning center?

Get your proof. Show it to me. THEN and ONLY then, will I entertain the thought of engaging you in ANY substantive discussion.

Oh, by the way, don't go crawling to anyone else here, because this is YOUR time to prove YOUR mettle, GOT IT? IS IT CLEAR, NOW?!

SHOW ME YOUR PROOF.

GET YOUR PROOF AND SHOW IT!

HOW MANY TIMES MUST I SAY IT? Are you a child? Still in school, little girl? I pretty much squared myself away by the age of four. What's your problem?

GET TO IT! DO WHAT YOU HAVE BEEN TASKED TO DO, UNDERSTAND?!

What are you crawling to ellid for? WHERE'S YOUR PROOF? GET IT, CRANK!

Show me you have more than a passing resemblance to a brain.

ellid has more intelligence, charm and grace under her fingernails than you could EVER hope to have. How do I know? intelligence breeds intelligence. it is also the way we come to concensus, among other things.

GET YOUR PROOF! WHAT'S SO HARD ABOUT THAT? DO IT!

Hello again, all!

I have tasked NC to prove her “assertion” that the Nordyke twins were, in fact born in Hawaii, and that their BC is a long-form.
I have asked for INCONTROVERTIBLE proof. Forgeries need not apply. I want to SEE the LFBC NC “claims” exists. I want to compare that to my mother's LFBC, just to be sure of it's authenticity.

There are certain questions that have NEVER been answered by her, or any other birfer thus far. All that has been offered is:

1) Evasions of subject matter.
2) Special/conspiracy pleading.
3) Shifting the burden of proof/refusing to prove “factual” claims.
4) Non-sequiters/changing the subject
5) Moving goalposts.

This is wholly unsatisfactory. Until some of my (and your) questions are answered, there can be no “meaningful” discussion on anything having to do with their ridiculous “quest”. I suggest, at the very least, that NC and all other birfers be held to the same demands put to me (us).

I cannot, in good concience, let this pass. It is now time to make your demands. The burden of proof has resided in their court for some time, and it's time to call it in.

Birthtard Scorecard, April 15, 2010

Disqus posts by naturalizedcitizen: 2,315 (+11 from yesterday)
“Likes” received: 66 (+0 from yesterday)*
Taxed: the patience of all rational people
Proof shown by naturalizedcitizen: 0. None. Zero. Zip. Nada. Zed.

*This statistic may be dropped from future scorecards. In medical terms, it has flatlined.

Thank you. This has been your Birthtard Scorecard for the day.

Asked about that document, Okubo said, “This is the same certified copy everyone receives when they request a birth certificate.”

You realize what this means? Everyone in Hawaii was born in Kenya.

Thanks for a monumental effort on the side of truth today.

You say that web images aren't proof. Then you cite a web image as “proof.”

You have no proof that Obama was born anywhere other than Honolulu on August 4, 1961. If you had any proof, you would have shown it by now. If you had any proof, you would be talking to members of Congress, instead of endlessly repeating yourself here.

In the immortal words of monkey99: SHOW US YOUR PROOF!

You're most welcome. Thanks to you as well.

“Everyone in Hawaii was born in Kenya.

Rod Serling lives! Doo-doo-doo-doo. Doo-doo-doo-doo.

“There is nothing in the dark that isn't there when the lights are on.”
- Rod Serling

The Kenyan Parliament's whole website is being restructured; all kinds of content that was available a few days ago isn't there now (e.g., the links to profiles of individual members of the Parliament are not active), and the front page is set up differently. I suppose in your view, and that of your frightwing sisters and brothers, that is all the result of a conspiracy.

Here is the full set of minutes from November 5, 2008 (not the carefully edited quotes from your frightwing source), available elsewhere on the internet to anyone who knows how to search, and no one says that Barack Obama was born in Kenya:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/11594015/Kenya-Parlia…

So, where is your proof?

Answer Monkey's questions or shut up. You're not wriggling out of it this time.

On what grounds? The President has not committed treason, accepted bribes, or engaged in any other high crimes or misdemeanors. Absent those, there are no grounds for impeachment.

I admire your tenacity but we all know the birfer clown is devoid of courage, honesty and ethics and lacks the strength of character required to face the pain of her own cognitive dissonance (hence the puerile nonsense of repetitive babbling).

Nope, not good enough. Answer Monkey's question or shut up.

Answer Monkey's question or shut up. We're tired of your lies and evasions.

I have developed a methodology. If NC can answer my current question, there are more. I have no intention of backing down from ANY birfer.

It's one thing for cranks and toilers to spout nonsense on occasion, it's insufferable to have to endure this s**t for more than a year. It's the same with the right-wing noise machine. It's a feeding frenzy of outright lies, misinformation, misdirection, and scare mongering.
This is supposed to be America. Land of the free, home of the brave. We are STILL the former, yet more and more, the latter is being “sacrificed” on the alter of racism and fear. I've tried to make light of them, in an attempt to shame them into reality, but I know now they have none.

Hence, my new methodology. If she fails to return, no worries. There will be more. they get sick satisfaction from putting me (us) in a position of constant defense. You don't win battles of any type that way.
And yes, you are absolutely right, and it's because NC would rather take notes from certified nutcases rather than doing research to verify whether she is right or not. They will never admit errors, or furthering falsehoods, so…..well, I don't want to give up too much, here. Let's wait and see how this pans out.

We are talking about two things here:

1. Proof of Obama's birthplace.
I do not have any proof of Obama's birthplace. I have said it many times.

The trouble for you is that you don't have a proof either. Publicly available information does not exclude the possibility of unattended birth registration.

2. Proof that COLB shown to the public is not a genuine.
The proof is self-evident for anyone willing to take the blinds off their eyes and examine the first COLB image shown to the public.

Since the first image had problems indicating a forgery – we need to see the original document – you don't get two months to work on the COLB version 2.0 and then claim it as the official one.

Sifuri. Gotta remember that.

See? You learn something every day!

Thank you, Sir!

Did you use the same approach with Alex? Is that the method used for “converting” him, LOL!?

I KNOW that the first COLB presented to the public was not a scan of a genuine document.

Based on that and the fact that version 2.0 was presented 2 months later I am 100% convinced that Obama is lying about his birth place. None of Obama supporters had provided any plausible explanation to explain his behavior.

I just can't prove the original birthplace.

What is so difficult about what I said?

Spending time sucking golf balls through garden hoses won't get you anywhere.

ANSWER MY QUESTION! WHERE IS YOUR PROOF? YOU WANT TO MAKE SCURRILOUS CLAIMS ABOUT PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA'S BIRTH, YOU ANSWER MY QUESTION.
IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH PRESIDENT OBAMA, BUT EVERYTHING TO DO WITH YOU. YOU WANT TO BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY, START ACTING LIKE IT!

ANSWER THE QUESTION. QUIT WASTING THESE GOOD FOLKS' TIME, AND ANSWER ME!

I guess you didn't read up before posting, so I'll put this here for you:
________________________________________________________________

The Hawaii Department of Health receives about a dozen e-mail inquiries a day about Obama's birth certificate, spokesman Okubo said.

“I guess the big issue that's being raised is the lack of an embossed seal and a signature,” Okubo said, pointing out that in Hawaii, both those things are on the back of the document. “Because they scanned the front … you wouldn't see those things.”

Okubo says she got a copy of her own birth certificate last year and it is identical to the Obama one we received.

And about the copy we e-mailed her for verification? “When we looked at that image you guys sent us, our registrar, he thought he could see pieces of the embossed image through it.”

“I KNOW that the first COLB presented to the public was not a scan of a genuine document.”

No, actually, you don't.

WTF is the matter with you? PROVE to me your “assertion” about the nordyke twins. DO THEY OR DO THEY NOT HAVE A LFBC?

SHOW IT. PROVE TO ME YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.

Otherwise, you're just a cheap knockoff of Oily Taintz. C**ksucker extraordinaire.
I am 100% positive you are just a bulls***ter.

You want cred (your chance at respect is all but gone), prove to me I am wrong. At this point, I give two s**ts about your claims.

ANSWER THE QUESTION.

Google Nordyke twins and birth certificate.

[...] here to read the rest:  Not an April Fools' Joke: Army Officer Defies Orders Unless Obama … Read full story » 01. Apr, [...]

Not good enough. YOU have to do the work, old sport.

Answer the question YOURSELF or shut up.

When are you going to answer Monkey’s question?

When are you going to answer Monkey’s question?

Who cares? Monkey asked you to prove the authenticity of the Nordyke twins’ alleged document. Where is it?

Quit changing the subject. Where’s your proof about the Nordyke twins?

Where’s your proof, NC? Come on, show us your EVIDENCE that the legendary Nordyke twins even exist! It can’t be that hard! Maybe you can get your good buddy and Dessert Shield veteran Bloatedraven to schlep his 200 pack, of, SEKRIT SUTF to Hono,lulu to find, the birth certificate!

If you want the proof that Obama is lying about his birthplace ask the Hawaii DoH for a copy of birth certificate for one of your siblings who were born there. You should receive a COLB (short form) document.

Then scan the image without doing any manipulation. Check if you can see the state seal. Once you see the seal you will realize that Obama tried to deceive the public when the first image of COLB document was posted on Daily Kos in June 2008. Then ask yourself: Why would he do that?

http://images2.dailykos.com/images/user/3/BO_Bi…

Check the comments section. Look for the comment made by aspergirl close to the bottom of the page. Notice that few posts later the comments were disabled. Somebody realized: Houston (Chicago), we have a problem….

http://theobamafile.com/_images/NordykeBirthCer…

Where is Obama's equivalent? Remember the words spoken by Kenyan minister few days ago.

What you failed to quote is a follow up interview with Okubo where she said the following:

“I don't know that it's possible for us to even say beyond a doubt what the image on the site represents.”

You have been watching too many military movies, tough guy, LOL!

The proof that COLB shown to the public is not a genuine one is self-evident for anyone willing to take the blinds off their eyes and examine the first COLB image shown to the public. State seal is not visible:
http://theobamafile.com/_images/ObamaBirthCerti…

Obama's COLB is forged:
http://nobarack08.wordpress.com/2009/03/16/138/

Enjoy the reading, LOL!

What do you continue to contract yourself. On the state of Hawaii Department of Health's Certification of Live Birth there is a phrase that clearly states that if the document is altered it becomes void.

Your argument centers on the idea that by obtaining a Certification of Live Birth from the state of Hawaii Department of Health it is possible to check the authenticity of another Certification of Live Birth. However, anybody knows that the easiest why the check the authenticity of the second Certification of Live Birth is just to contact the Department of Health directly (more on that later).

Your less than scientific experiment is to scan the first document and compare it to the second. The reason your suggested test isn't reliable is because you need to reproduce the exact condition the second document was treated. There are two methods of comparing two images. One is by having different apparatuses and the same object. The other is by having the same apparatus and different object. Your experiment suggests different apparatuses and different objects. Actually, your experiment suggest different apparatuses at different settings and different objects. This should have been obvious.

Now about your real problem. If you are willing to accept the state of Hawaii Department of Health authority on issuing an individual with an authentic birth certificate labeled as a Certification of Live Birth, then you have to accept all Certification of Live Births as authentic documents. However, with the state of Hawaii has confirmed the authenticity of the records. The seal is a way of the state of Hawaii confirming the authenticity of the birth certificate. So, by accepting the seal on an individuals birth certificate you are also accepting the authenticity of Obama's birth certificate.

However, as you are more concerned in engaging in spreading misinformation you just don't realize this.

Wow. No, one in Kenyan has confirmed that they have Obama's birth records. However, the state of Hawaii has twice.

You must be disillusioned. The state of Hawaii confirmed that it is authentic. Did you know that unlike Lakin that the state of Hawaii has a direct relationship to Obama's birth certificate? With the state of Hawaii stating that they have Obama's birth certificate, that they are confirming that his birth certificate is authentic. However, if you were more concerned with spreading misinformation this would have been obvious to you.

1. Several exmples of Hawaii COLB scanned images. The state seal is visible.

http://nobarack08.wordpress.com/2009/03/16/138/

2. The easiest way to confirm the authenticity of COLB would be a direct answer from DoH. Unfortunately repeated requests sent to the DoH asking for confirmation that they issued a COLB to Obama on June 6, 2007 have been ignored.

Even better proof would be an authorization from Obama allowing the release of the original birth certificate. We know it is not going to happen voluntarily because he would have shown it in the first place, if such document confirmed the official birth story.

It seems congress has one upped you by passing a resolution on confirming Hawaii as Obama's birth place. Oh. I forgot you missed that event.

When they run for presidency I will be concerned about the authenticity of their birth certificates. For now it is sufficient that none of you Obots can point out a deficiency in those images shown to the public.

Where’s the proof I asked for? You’ve had a day. More than enough time to prove your assertion. Don’t have any, Hmmm?

Just another crank liar. Typical.

It’s a pretty easy thing to do. It’s a small thing I ask.

Where is the proof? Or is it you don’t have it. Scurrilous claims again. Typical birfer bulls**t.

Where’s the proof?

You cranks won’t give this up, neither will I. Go get your proof. I realize it’s tough when you s**t where you eat, but you aren’t eating, now.

Get your proof. And stop crawling to others before you answer me. They can’t get it for you. Do your own work.

GET YOUR PROOF. Toiler! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Your desperation is lovely to see.

When are you going to answer Monkey's question?

Then why bring them up? What was your motivation for that, then?

You can’t prove s**t, just spread it around.

By the way, you STILL can’t prove your assertions about President Obama, either. Your world of make-believe is crumbling, gasbag.

The burden of proof STILL rests with you. You claim President Obama isn’t American, PROVE IT!

Maybe you can call Oily on this one. She’ll give you good advice!HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Monkey asked you for incontrovertible proof of the authenticity of this document. Where is it?

When are you going to answer Monkey's question? Quit changing the subject!

Where's your proof that the Nordyke twins' document is authentic?

The idiot birfer never does. “she” expects others to do the work.

They whine over verified proof out for more than a year, yet cannot do a simple thing like answering a question that should be a slam-dunk by their standards.

Every time I read their claims I have to shake my head, in how utterly wrong they are. They read into things that are not there, while refusing to read the words that are there.

I know.

This time, I want them under the same standard they put us to.

It’s only fair.

And what YOU have failed to mention…repeatedly…is the Hawai’i has verified his COLB TWICE.

Anything else?

1. If you didn't understand the second paragraph just say so. The State of Hawaii has confirmed that the document is authentic.

2. The State of Hawaii has confirmed that the document is authentic.

Why would he. The state of Hawaii has firmed the authenticity of the document, but people like you continue to argue against it.

Please stop reading birther sites.

The issue of what constitutes an official Hawaii birth certificate received national attention during last year’s presidential campaign. Those who doubted Barack Obama’s American citizenship called the copy of the Hawaii birth document posted on his campaign Web site a fake.

Asked about that document, Okubo said, “This is the same certified copy everyone receives when they request a birth certificate.”
_______________________________________________________________

Try again.

I guess you are going to have to find a member of the House or Senate who didn’t vote for these:

House Resolution 593: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bi...

Senate Resolution 225: http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-sr225/text

“Whereas the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama, was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961;”

Allow me to translate the request these others have been making:

Weer eez yewer aveedance?

Understand now?

Oh no, not again. Answer Monkey’s question or shut up.

Gosh, that is so impressive! One anonymous person provides a link to the blog of another anonymous person! Try sending that link to every member of the House of Representatives:

https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml

I'm sure they will take that more seriously than a state-issued COLB, repeated confirmation from the State that Obama was born there, the investigation of several (not anonymous) reputable news organizations, contemporaneous newspaper announcements, and repeated confirmation that the form of Obama's COLB matches what the State issues in response to any other person's request for a birth certificate?

And you admit you have no proof he was born anywhere else. An international trip by a pregnant young white American girl and her Kenyan husband, returning with an undocumented child, and not a scrap of paper to support this scenario and not a soul who remembers it.

Some hobby. Have you thought of collecting Barbie Dolls instead? Then, at least, you can do something productive by making outfits for them: Tea Party Barbie, Birfer Barbie, Hutaree Militia Barbie . . . the possibilities are endless.

Serbian War Criminal Barbie, Barbarian Barbie, Klaus Barbie, Mascara Stained, Tammy Faye Wannabe Barbie, Works Street Corners and Made One Hundred Dollars But It Was All in Nickels Barbie?

Crazy Moldovan Barbie sounds SO nice.

Not only that, Kenya has repeatedly stated that President Obama was NOT born there, that his father did not return until he'd finished graduate school several years after the birth of his son, and that his mother never once in her life set foot there.

Lord Monckton, questioning Obama's citizenship
Look, I don't like writing “birther” posts. I don't jump onto the latest story of an attention-seeking lawyer demanding proof of Barack Obama's citizenship. I'm working on other posts about last night's FreedomWorks-organized tea party on the Mall. But it was jarring to hear Lord Monckton, the British politician who has become a celebrity in the climate change skeptic community (the BBC was following him for a documentary it was filming), claim that Obama was born outside the United States.

“America!” said Monckton at the start of his speech. “Land of opportunity! You can be born in Kenya and end up as president of the United States!”

That remark was well received in the crowd, if not as boisterously applauded as Monckton's other jokes. After the speech (and after rapper Hi-Caliber included a line in his latest song about how “the media calls us birthers”), a reporter from USA Today and I both asked Monckton whether he was joking.

“I have no idea where he was born,” said Monckton, who was working the crowd and signing autographs. “What I do find strange is that the public records of his Hawaiian birth have been sealed, and can not be obtained by the public. His lawyers have spent a lot of money trying to seal the records of his public life. All of those records should be open to the public, as they always were for previous presidents.”

I pointed out to Monckton that the state of Hawaii released Obama's certification of live birth nearly two years and ago, and that the persistent challenges to his citizenship have inspired some members of the military to refuse to serve under Obama. “The effective classification of all of these documents of his early life is surely contrary to the spirit of freedom and openness in the Democratic west,” said Monckton. “It's bound to raise questions in some peoples' minds. However! I have no idea where he's born, but it made a nice joke.”

By David Weigel | April 16, 2010; 8:51 AM ET
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/right-now/

The authenticity of Obama's COLB document was never verified by the DoH. It is your fabrication.

Repeated requests to DoH for such verification have been ignored.

I have a suggestion for Weigel and his ilk. They should ask Obama directly about his birthplace. Or even better, ask him about the motivation to keep the originalbirth certificate hidden from US public.

State of Hawaii confirmed that they issued COLB to Obama on June 6, 2007, really? That is news to me. Links to such an article would be helpful.

Little entertainment piece for Manfred's ears: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBi2BQq_IPg&feat…

Where's the proof, jellyfish?

Can't think up another lie to pass off?

Where's the proof?

I know it's tough having one orifice to do everything, but this isn't going away.

How about you and your “ilk” ask Obama directly? Why do you always want other people to do your work for you? Remember, YOU are the birfer. So go ahead and ask. Here is how to write to the President electronically:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact

Have fun. Let us know how it goes. Or don't.

Where's the proof? Do those twins even exist? Bring it on, toiler.

Where's the proof? All this other is just yap, yap, yap. Why go crawling to others, when you can't even answer one, simple question?

GET TO IT!

Where's the proof? You want to be taken seriously, provide proof of your claim. Or maybe you can't. Just like Oily.

Another jellyfish that can't tell when it's eating or defecating.

Where's the proof? Can't be that tough, can it? Or is your claim bulls**t, like all the others?

Per the Kenyan Government; March 25th 2010
If America was living in a situation where they feared ethnicity and did not see itself as a multiparty state or nation, how could a young man born here in Kenya, who is not even a native American, become the President of
America?

After all the statements about Barack being born in Kenya
After all the claims about being born in Hawaii
After Barack spending $1.8 million to keep from showing a valid Birth Certificate
After dening access to all his records
The state of Hawaii refuses to confirm the COLB as valid

ONLY the Kenyan Government has stated he was born there.
Barack Obama is a foreigner!

I have a suggestion for you.

Get your proof. It's that simple. Quit spouting more garbage and answer my question.

Where's the proof of your claim about the Nordyke twins?

Go get it, toiler. Don't try to slime your way out of this . You started this crap, finish it!

Nutz. I actually read the document. It reads a followers. link:

http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2008/08-93.pdf

“…, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai'i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has stationary authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai'i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama's original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures”

Let me translate it for you. First Janice Okubo has confirmed that she is responsible for ensuring the integrity of the vital records. Also, she states that the she and the person directly responsible for the vital records have seen Obama's vital records. She also admits it is they who have Obama's original birth certificate. This statement dismisses people who suggest that Obama should release his original birth certificate. With Okubo admitting that they are responsible for the the vital records she is stating that the vital records, specifically Obama's original birth records, are property of the state of Hawai'i.

This statement is designed to address various questions about Obama. The first an most important is the authenticity of Obama's Certification of Live Birth. The second is that they actually did issue him the Certification of Live Birth.

Anyways a person who wants to read Hawaii's response to the various inquired about Obama's birth records can check the below link:
http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/obama.html

Sorry, but you again have demonstrated you have either don't understand what you are talking about, or just trying to confuse yourself with illogical arguments.

There are times that I believe that you are unemployed at worst, or don't have a professional job. With birth records they are valid from the time of a persons birth. The date that the document is re-issued is irrelevant.

By the state of Hawaii confirming the existence of Obama's indicates that his birth certificate is valid and that they did issue it on June 6, 2007. They actually have computers in Hawaii and most likely seem the Obama's birth certificate. This allowed them to confirm that nothing has been modified on the document that the day that they issued it. They also do keep records, but this seems to be too complicated of an issue for you to understand.

You have been wrong so many times it is hard to understand why your are still trying to find ways to justify our paranoia.

Yesterday, a breathless NC reported (citing the post&screedmail) that the Kenyan Parliament's website had been “scrubbed” of the evidence of a MP's March 25 question about a “young man born in Kenya” becoming President of the U.S:

“Kenyan Parlament web site has been scrubbed
http://www.thepostemail.com/2010/04/15/kenyan-p…

Few days from now Usurper's supporters will claim that the statement from a Kenyan minister never happened.”

Of course, the truth is that the Parliament's website was undergoing some redesign. The March 25, 2010 “Hansard” (i.e. minutes) can be found on the Parliament website today:

http://www.parliament.go.ke/parliament/index.ph…

Now the question for the ages: will NC admit that she was wrong, and that she let her considerable paranoia get the best of her? What will Balkan Barbie do now?

Dr. Chiyome Fukino “…, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai'i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has stationary authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai'i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama's original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures”

http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2008/08-93.pdf

When you spend misinformation they will always be someone that proves that you are wrong.

All you have to take your hand off your eyes and then you will see the presidents birth certificate. It is the first step to dealing with the reason that you are disappointed with Obama being president.

Excerpts from guardian.co.uk:

Is there no end to the delights of his lordship Christopher Monckton, also known as Viscount Monckton of Brenchley? Or perhaps it would be accurate to ask: is there no beginning to the delights of Lord Monckton?

To the list of his eccentric views on climate change, Europe, HIV/Aids and … well, most things, we can add his public subscription to the “birther” cause: the idea that Barack Obama may have been born in Kenya and is therefore not the legitimate president of the United States of America.

In fact, the public record of his Hawaiian birth have been released and confirmed by the Republican governor and state of Hawaii. There is no question of that, and to suggest otherwise is to put yourself into a very small and unhappy subset. Monckton's “nice joke” is on himself.

Luckily for the Conservative party, it parted ways with Monckton some time ago. His lordship is currently a member of the UK Independence Party.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/richard-adams-b…

Besides anotherbird's proof, President Obama has spent less than you probably have in your wallet, on all this birfer garbage.

I have cold, hard evidence in my possession, that proves he is who and what he says he is. It's another BC, of a family member, who was born in the same hospital as President Obama, and the two BC's are EXACTLY the same.

Stop watching the right-wing noise machine. They'll keep you stupid if your not careful.

Like dogs chasing their tails, birfers won't stop because they look foolish, only when they realize that licking their nuts sounds like a better idea.

Dealt with already. Quit making sockpuppets, okay, NC?

I have a suggestion for you: answer Monkey's question about the Nordyke twins.

Sorry, but I don't have a Ouija board to communicate with my dead third cousin once removed.

Where's the proof about the Nordyke twins?

Where's your proof about the Nordyke twins?

Too chickens**t. They saw what happened to Oily, and can't work up the courage it takes to confirm their convictions.

You have to remember, the burden lies with them.

Utter rubbish. You have it exactly backward. No one in charge of birth records or citizenship records in Kenya has ever stated that Barack Obama was born there. As “anotherbird” has noted below, Hawaii's Director of Health has expressly confirmed Hawaiian birth records for Barack Obama.

And what do you mean by “Per the Kenyan Government”? A hypothetical question by ONE member of Kenya's Parliament, in the context of a debate over the new Kenyan Constitution? That is your proof? That constitutes the official position of the Kenyan Government? So any statement made by any member of the House or Senate of the U.S. Congress during a debate constitutes the official position of the U.S. Government? Is that what you believe?

You want on “Official” government statement? How about resolutions adopted by the House and Senate, without dissent, plainly stating that Barack Obama is our 44th President and was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961:

House Resolution 593: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bi…

Senate Resolution 225: http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-sr225/text

Now, that is what official government action looks like.

Thanks for the laughs. Another total birfer fail.

LMFAO!

Lightsocket Barbie, Shrimp on the Barbie, Demon Barbie (oh, wait. That's $arah Palin. Sorry).

Yes, bear, the possibilities ARE endless!

Maybe the jellyfish doesn't want anyone taking a second look at her naturalization application. One lie, one omission, and it is back to the Balkans.

I wonder if anyone has put Oily to the test. She's recent, so MAYBE she's legit. Ol' “Orifice for Everything” should be put to the same standard, I agree.
I wonder if it would stand the smell test.

Do you actually know anything about scanning documents? Do you know anything about scanners? There are flatbeds, handhelds, and multi-purpose machines that all can give you different results. I have a flatbed and a printer/fax/copier/scanner and I can guarantee you that if I ran the same item through them both I would get different results.

Then you have to consider how the scanned image was treated after it was scanned. Frequently, the size of the file is too large for publication on a web site, therefore it must have the resolution reduced to a web friendly size. This act can reduce clarity in itself as can other types of photo clean-up options available on most scanner software packages. I am sure I can say, with relative certainty, the task of scanning the birth certificate was given to some person within the campaign office, possibly even a volunteer. The knowledge and ability of that person in regards to scanning and the methods they may have used to reduce the scan to web friendly size is an unknown, but due to my experience in that arena, I would be willing to bet they weren't trying to insure the stamp on the back of the document was showing on the front- more than likely they figured the info on the front was the important part of what needed to be posted. You know, the part that gives his name, his parents, the date and lists the place of birth as Honolulu, Hawaii.

I am positive the then Senator didn't do the work himself. He was much to busy, just as he is now with much more important things going on then worry about little gnats flying around screeching “he isn't a citizen” when he knows he is and has already submitted the information acceptable to all governmental agencies, the Congress and the Supreme Court. Your know, important stuff like saving the economy, changing the way things have been done that allowed the near crash to happen, trying to get international agreement on the proliferation of nuclear weapons and a host of other items that require his attention almost 24-7. I prefer he stay focused on those things and not the Oily Taters of this country.

There is no need for debate about the technical issues related to scanning. If they gave this task to a volunteer and the person made a mistake (yeah, right), why did Obama’s campaign wait two months to fix it. That is the question that you have no logical explanation for.

Comments related to this document were disabled on Daily Kos shortly after people pointed out at errors and there was a claim by the “aspergirl” that the document was a fake one. The Obama campaign knew what people were saying about the document posted on the web. If they had the official document they would have posted the proper scan promptly after realizing that the first scan was not good. Since they did not do it, my conclusion is that they had nothing better to present to the public until August 2008.