Paglia: ‘Birthers’ Aren’t Racist, and They Have a Point

By
Thursday, September 17, 2009 at 8:45 am

Camille Paglia, the lone Salon.com columnist who can count on her ramblings getting regular links from The Drudge Report, appeared on NPR’s “On Point” yesterday and made a spirited defense of the “birther” movement. The exchange came about 36 minutes in, after one caller to the show recounted his experiences at the 9/12 march on Washington. Paglia snapped back at him:

First of all, I reject the idea that the “birther” campaign is motivated by racism. There may be racism among it, but there are legitimate questions about the documentation of Obama’s birth certificate. I’m sorry, I’ve been following this closely from the start. To assume that all those signs about the birth controversy were motivated by racism, that is simply wrong.

Paglia has been on this beat before, writing in April that “there were ambiguities about Obama’s birth certificate that have never been satisfactorily resolved.” But this particular interview is compelling, especially for Paglia’s convoluted explanation that she despises victim politics but thinks “The Sopranos” was a bigoted portrayal of Italian-Americans.

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Comments

1,465 Comments

Paglia: ‘Birthers’ Aren’t Racist, and They Have a Point | The Lie Politic
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Dissident1
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 1:45 pm

Actually we love Obama so much we want to visit his place of birth, but he won't give us the address.

PRESIDENTIAL BIRTH PLACES

Jimmy Carter, Wise Hospital, Plains, GA (The first president born in a hospital)

George H. W. Bush: 173 Adams Street, Milton Hill, MA

Bill Clinton: Julia Chester Hospital, Hope, AR

George W. Bush: Grace-New Haven Community Hospital, New Haven, CT

Barrack Hussein Obama: ???


Mike
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 2:53 pm

Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital in Honolulu, Hawaii
Try again.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 3:15 pm

Not true. . .At least nobody at the WH, hospital, nurse or doctor will confirm it was Kapiolani.

His sister said it was Queens. His grandmother said it was, Coast General Mombasa.

Qestions questions. . .something's fishy.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 3:23 pm

Pelosi and the DNC knew obama was ineligable. . .proof of that is available here:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread50036…

See two DNC certification documents. . .one skips the constitutional eligibility statement.

MUST SEE!!!


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:43 pm

It was not confirmed by Hawaii. Gov. Linda Lingle made a very attorney-like meaningless statement.

Go read it yourself people!


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 3:53 pm

At least nobody at the WH, hospital, nurse or doctor will confirm it was Kapiolani.

There are federal laws preventing hospitals from discussing patients, dumbass.

His sister said it was Queens.

No she didn't. A student newspaper got their facts wrong.

His grandmother said it was, Coast General Mombasa.

No she didn't. You are a liar.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:55 pm

“I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago….”


jack wilson
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:00 pm

It didn’t work for me in 1985. i had to find the long form- with the name of the doctor, etc.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 4:08 pm

I'm right about every point.

The privacy laws don't prevent Obummer from releasing that information and his other records. He hasn't, and he won't, because he's a fraud.

Morons like you aren't smart enough to see the obvious. You'll be first in line to collect your government hand-out though.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:20 pm

Read your history. He was a registered Republican. You delude yourself if you think Southern Democrats were the only racists. We were in Philly on trains that were stopped. We were in Boston and beaten. Stones were thrown at us everywhere we went including Chicago. The biggest lie out there is that racists are only in the south. I still go to Maine and hear racist comments in stores I shop in all the time. And racists do not only exist in the white southern community. Many blacks today are sexists and they make fun of Jews. It’s time to stop all of it. And it’s time to support the truth, which is not Obama. Too many people march like sheep behind him. Have a mind of your own. Question. Think. Connect the dots.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:28 pm

You’re really crazy. You don’t know me. You have no proof of your claims. You just say things because you have nothing better to say. And you’re really stupid to believe in Obama.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 4:36 pm

I'm right about every point.

In Bizarro World, maybe.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:59 pm

By sheer coincidence, I just finished reading the section of Crossing the Waters discussing Dr. King’s conflict over whether to endorse Kennedy or Nixon in 1960. Have you read it? Or were you hiding under Daddy King’s dining room table when he endorsed Kennedy?

Why won’t you tell us *how* you knew the Kings? Were you their gardener? Coretta’s hairdresser? The children’s nanny? A school friend? The fireman? A teacher? Bayard Rustin’s lover? WHAT ARE YOU HIDING?????


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:01 pm

What country do you rule? I can’t think of any other reason for a single poster to refer to him/herself as “we.”


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:01 pm

That statement proves the existence of a document other than the online forgery. Let’s see it!

Unless Linda Lingle is a constitutional expert, her statement is MEANINGLESS!

Obummer’s father was Kenyan, thus he’s not natural-born.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:02 pm

Sorry, but I have better things to do than read the trash produced by any publication owned by Sun Myung Moon. I can’t imagine why any patriotic American would.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:04 pm

Kindly produce your name, photographs of yourself with Dr. King, school records, arrest records, and so on to show exactly how and when you were involved in the Civil Rights movement. Thank you.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:06 pm

A state-issued certification of birth is all that is required. It was all that was required in 1989 when I applied for a job in a new area, and it’s all I’ve ever needed for my dealings with two states, three colleges, and the federal government.

Sorry.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:09 pm

Law firms are subject to attorney/client privilege, which means that any law firm that employed the President would not be able to produce a client list.

As for the kindergarten records, that’s absurd. There’s no reason in the world why anyone would want to know when the President learned to finger paint.

*rolls eyes*

You really need a productive hobby. Maybe teaching adult literacy classes would use up your copious free time.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:09 pm

I have responded several times. You are just blowing smoke. If Obama presented his long form birth certificate, or college entrance application, it would end this discussion. He shouldn’t have anything to hide. Hawaii has it and can provide it, even if they don’t for the average citizen. He’s the president. He can tell them to release it. He does obviously have something to hide. I have my birth certificate in long and short form, all my past and present passports, my driver license, college applications and papers. I present them whenever necessary. What’s the big deal?


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:09 pm

Please cite the federal law stating this. The Constitution does not count because it says nothing of the sort.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:10 pm

Cite the actual law, please.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:13 pm

Wrong on all counts. You really need another hobby, or an explanation of why your employer lets you troll dozens of web sites spreading ridiculous rumors.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:14 pm

I am neither brain washed nor fearful. I am, however, extremely amused.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:17 pm

Fine “I”. Either way, I’m not sure why you are afraid if I knew Dr. King unless you are afraid that Dr. King would probably not have supported the “lies” of Obama.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:20 pm

Because he’s not legally obligated to, and what he did do (put it on his web site) satisfied all but most crazy.

__________________________________________________

It satisfied only the Obots. And why is he spending thousands not to release it? He’s not an average citizen? He’s the President!


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:21 pm

Last time I looked the Constitution counted unless you’re a commie.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:24 pm

Didn’t work for my child either that I adopted. I had to provide the long form birth certificate, full adoption records, and name change records, and what people are forgetting here is that Obama was adopted too.


Bruce
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 5:24 pm

Birthers have no point, whatsoever, and ZERO evidence


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:26 pm

So Paglia is a feminist and Orly is a loon. Sounds like you’re a sexist, and a woman hater.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:34 pm

It doesn’t count for things that aren’t in it, dimwit.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:36 pm

Read your history.

I read US history. You’re the one with your own personal version, reality be damned.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:38 pm

You’re really crazy. You don’t know me. You have no proof of your claims.

Oh, how irony is lost on the stupid and insane.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:39 pm

I have told you already. I was involved with my family and church in the civil rights movement in the sixties. I lived in Maryland at the time, and was responsible for leading a church movement at both the March on Washington and the March at Selma. I have no arrest records. I met Dr. and Mrs. King many times and was part of one planning committee for these marches. If you look at the black and white historical photos of the marches, you’ll see myself, other church members, and one of our church leaders at the White House with Dr. King. I went to Howard, but don’t know what good that info will do you. Obots have threatened me enough because they are scared that my claims of Dr. King wanting honesty from politicians would discredit Obama. But there were many people who knew and worked with Dr. King who can tell you what I tell you. There are national politicians with their own political agendas who cry race at every turn, but not everyone who knew Dr. King agrees he would have endorsed Obama.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:41 pm

It satisfied only the Obots.

You mean a majority of the voters?

And why is he spending thousands not to release it?

He’s not, as Obama has participated in few few of these suits.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:41 pm

It counts plenty moron.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:45 pm

I understand you believe that the Constitution says things it does not, but that don’t make it so.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:48 pm

Obots have threatened me enough because they are scared that my claims of Dr. King wanting honesty from politicians would discredit Obama.

Hah. They’re threatened because you say King wanted politicians to be honest? Please.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 5:51 pm

Here's the truth about birthers, nicely summed up by Judge Land, in reference to the Birther Queen Orly Taitz:

She has presented no credible evidence and has made no reliable factual allegations to support her unsubstantiated, conclusory allegations and conjecture that President Obama is
ineligible to serve as President of the United States. Instead, she uses her Complaint as a platform for spouting political rhetoric, such as her claims that the President is “an illegal usurper, an unlawful pretender, [and] an unqualified imposter.”

You too, captainstupid


Anonymous
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:52 pm

You are a complete and total idiot. You have absolutely no idea what you are saying. You’re just saying it. You’re afraid because you’re wrong. You’re afraid because you’re afraid Obama may not be the man you look up to. You’re afraid to really examine the facts. It wouldn’t matter if Obama released his long form birth certificate. One day a court will ask for it. And when that day comes, we’ll see who is right. Good night, total moron.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:54 pm

No, don’t tell anyone else King advocated honesty! The truth will destroy us! Ahhh!!!!!1!


patgund
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 6:11 pm

Captain Steve aka Sam Sewell – Did your Mensa membership tell you that? Or your status as an unlicensed “pastoral counselor”? Or was it simply the voices in your head?


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 6:50 pm

Camille Paglia is a “feminist” only in her own mind. She's a nasty right-wing “intellectual” whose scholarship is so poor she could get barely get tenure at a third-tier school, let alone anything decent. She knows nothing about this issue, and quite frankly appears to be opening her mouth solely because she's been out of the limelight long enough that she's hoping to revive her miserable excuse for a career.

She's also wrong from the get-go. The only “irregularities” about the President's birth certificate were raised by reactionary loons like Orly Taitz.

What a joke.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:15 pm

Right. . .and you think,

ACORN is really honest

Van Jones is really a great guy

Iran would never build a bomb, and

Bill “never had sex with that woman, Miss Lewinsky.'

You are a brain-washed idiot loudmouth. The truth will get out. He can only hide so long.

You better go get your welfare check.


Saladdin
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:31 pm

Um, what does this have to do with your birther argument? Again, you can rant and rave like a lunatic all you want, but face facts, Barack Obama IS the President, and the only way you can get him out would be to vote him out….

Again, can you name me a single suit that had ANY merits? The case decided did not. Again, the burden of proof lies with the accuser not the accused. Do you have REAL, unbiased actual evidence, or are you simply going to keep referring us all to kooky right wing blogs all day long?


jack wilson
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:36 pm

Try presenting the Obama version of a birth certificate when applying for a passport. Rejected!


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:40 pm

“See two DNC certification documents. . .one skips the constitutional eligibility statement.”

So? The “constitutional eligibility statement” is required by some states' laws, but not all.


Adam
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:41 pm

Curious how the media got ahold of records showing that Dubya had a haemmorhoidectomy (really), but claim 'confidentiality', when something as mundane as a birthplace comes up.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:43 pm

The issue is that Obama has supplied zero credible evidence that he's a citizen. His orginial birth records are sealed. His college records are sealed. The birth announcement in the newspaper confirms only that he was born, but it doesn't say where. Posting something on the internet is not proof of citizenship. If I told my boss to check out my birth certficate as proof of my citizenship for a job on the internet, he'd laugh. You have to provide the original documents in person according to federal law to get hired for any job in the US. Millions of Americans have to do this everyday for employment. Why can't Obama? Why is he spending hundreds of thousands of dollars hiding his records birth and college records. It doesn't pass the smell test, and he's the President of the US.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:48 pm

Every American who wants to re-enter the country when they travel abroad should say go check out my birth certificate or passport on the internet. That's what Obama did so it must be right. Do you think any border patrol agent would let you back in the US if you did that, so why should Obama post his birth certificate on the internet and be taken seriously?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:48 pm

so what. . .not a single state says it cannot be there. . .there is NO reason to have two different documents, especially two that are signed on the same day, with the same notary, and with unusual discrepancies in the appearance of the signatures. The only logical explanation is,

FRAUD!!!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:52 pm

You're slow aren't you? It's about fraud and the media's lack of insight and investigation.

The proof is obvious to all but the brain-washed and fearful. Go collect your welfare check.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:53 pm

I see we've got some sock puppets running around.

Riddle me this, bither. How did Obama get a US passport? Magic?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:53 pm

Good post. You're right!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!

.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:55 pm

The media doesn't claim confidentiality. Bush released his military records of his own accord, to combat the TANG allegations. Just like Obama released his birth certificate to combat the birther allegations.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:55 pm

The US Constitution does not say that Factcheck.org is allowed to verify a candidate's birth certificate so that he/she can run for President of the US. It seems the Obots and media surrogates want to believe that it's perfectly acceptable to allow Factcheck.org to verify that the birth certificate is real. Everytime someone challenges the President's birth certificate they say, hey look it's on Factcheck.org. Sorry, but that's not legal verification according to federal law. No one verified Obama's orginial long form birth certificate, and that's because he's sealed it. It seems pretty clear now that Obama won't and can't show that he's eligible.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:56 pm

We might know more about his passport, but people that have tried to find out have mysteriously turning up dead!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!

.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:58 pm

There are more logical questions than answers.

What hospital was he born in? Who were the witnesses? Who was the doctor? Those answers are only on the long-form (the one that is sealed, even though some say nothing is sealed). Some say it doesn’t exist. But if it doesn’t then what did the people see that makes them sure of his birthplace?

Three different COLBs (Certification of Live Birth (short-form)) have been posted online by Factcheck etc. The first 2 had issues and were replaced. The current one has issues too (too detailed for here).

Some sites have said they “examined” the document. Which one, since they are all different? Why are they all modified? Why not release it/them to independent skeptics? Why not release the long-form?

Three different hospitals have some claim to his birth-place, two in Hawaii, One in Kenya.

Why spend millions of dollars in attorney fees to prevent all documents from being seen?

On top of that, the issue of his Kenyan/British father exists. The concept of natural-born citizenship was to prevent dual allegiances. Why was that never addressed? They did for McCain (not “natural-born” either).

And today, new question, why did Nancy Pelosi sign two different campaign documents, one without the usual constitutional eligibility statement?

To me there are more serious questions than serious answers. . .so I continue the search.

http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/11/why_the_…

http://countryfirst.bravehost.com/phpBB3/viewto…

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 7:59 pm

Sticks and stones, and before you call me a racist, we were personal friends of Dr. MLKing, Jr, and won honors for our efforts in the civil rights marches. Obama is president today because of our efforts and I doubt he'd approve of OB. The author is correct. There are questions to be asked.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:01 pm

The US Constitution does not say that Factcheck.org is allowed to verify a candidate's birth certificate so that he/she can run for President of the US.

The US Constitution doesn't say anything about birth certificates, dumbass.

It seems the Obots and media surrogates want to believe that it's perfectly acceptable to allow Factcheck.org to verify that the birth certificate is real.

Why isn't that acceptable?

Everytime someone challenges the President's birth certificate they say, hey look it's on Factcheck.org.

Yes, because what's there makes it perfectly obvious to the non-insane that his birth certificate is, in fact, real and accurate (not to mention the fact that the State of Hawaii confirms it).

Sorry, but that's not legal verification according to federal law.

Who said it was?

No one verified Obama's orginial long form birth certificate, and that's because he's sealed it.

No, moron, the State of Hawaii no longer issues such forms, and has moved all the birth records to a digital database. The COLB is what you get from them, and it's a perfectly legal document, sufficient for identification in any state of the union, not to mention the US State Department.

It seems pretty clear now that Obama won't and can't show that he's eligible.

Only to a crazy ass birther.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:03 pm

*smiles sweetly*

Sorry, but I already did that with the Pennsylvania equivalent in 2001. I received my passport with no problems or questions, and have used it as identification for employment and travel foreign and domestic.

You really should read something besides World Net Daily. Really.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:04 pm

And I'm a close, personal friend of the Queen of England.

FAIL.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:07 pm

Obama is a fraud. You can see it in his fake speech patterns, in his fake stride, in his fake posture, and in his fake background with hidden records.

He’s clearly a puppet. The question is who’s puppet? Soros? The Saudi King? Putin?


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:07 pm

Why do the only people who say they were witnesses to Obama's birth, including his own grandmother, claim that he was born in Kenya? Why did fightthesmears.com, Obama's own site, say his Kenyan citizenship expired? Why do many citizens of Kenya, if you travel there, themselves say he was born in Kenya?


pffp
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:07 pm

Race Baiters are the latest conspiricy therorist, Led by Jimmy Carter. I guess we can just call them “Baiters” .

Tim Rogers


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:08 pm

Exactly.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:10 pm

Utter bullshit. Why don't you do something useful, like volunteer at a homeless shelter?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:10 pm

And who is responsible for the lack of evidence? Obummer is.

Here's a list of the evidence.

• Original, vault copy birth certificate — Not released — over $1,000,000 spent to conceal — birth certificate — $15.
• Certification of Live Birth — Released – probable counterfeit
• Admitted British/Kenyan citizenship at birth — Admitted
• Hospital of birth — Three hospitals have some claim — 2 in Hawaii 1 in Kenya
• Obama/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Obama/Dunham divorce — Not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Kindergarten records – “lost”
• Soetoro/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Soetoro adoption records — Not released
• Fransiskus Assisi School School application — not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Punahou School records — Not released
• Soetoro/Dunham divorce – concealed by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Selective Service Registration — Released – and proven counterfeit
• Occidental College records — Not released
• Passport — Not released — investigation witness shot dead
• Columbia College records — Not released
• Columbia thesis — “Soviet Nuclear Disarmament” – Not released
• Harvard College records — Not released
• Harvard Law Review articles — None
• Illinois Bar Records — Not released.
• Medical records — Not released
• Illinois State Senate records — None
• Illinois State Senate schedule — “Lost”
• Law practice client list — Not released
• University of Chicago scholarly articles — None


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:11 pm

No, the only logical explanation is that you've inhaled too much dust from Orly Taitz's makeup. I wonder if there's a twelve-step program for that?


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:11 pm

If Jimmy Carter didn't support Sarah Palin or Hillary Clinton in 2008, is he a sexist? He is if you follow his line of thought that if you're against Obama you're a racist.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:13 pm

Obummer didn't release it. . .during the campaign, when it was questioned, the online fake “magically appeared”! Three generations of fakes at that.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:14 pm

What hospital was he born in?

Kapiolani Medical Center

Who were the witnesses?

Who cares?

But if it doesn’t then what did the people see that makes them sure of his birthplace?

His birth certificate says he was born in Honolulu. His mother lived in Honolulu at the time. Concurrent newspaper reports in Honolulu confirm. The State of Hawaii has said he was born in Honolulu.

Three different COLBs (Certification of Live Birth (short-form)) have been posted online by Factcheck etc. The first 2 had issues and were replaced. The current one has issues too (too detailed for here).

You lie. There's only been one.

Some sites have said they “examined” the document. Which one, since they are all different?

They aren't.

Why are they all modified?

They aren't.

Why not release it/them to independent skeptics?

They did. FactCheck.

Why not release the long-form?

Hawaii doesn't do that anymore. Not for years.

Three different hospitals have some claim to his birth-place, two in Hawaii, One in Kenya.

Wrong. Only one. Kapiolani Medical Center.

Why spend millions of dollars in attorney fees to prevent all documents from being seen?

He hasn't, and what small amount of money that has been spent to efficiently get these cases this dismissed will be recouped by the defendants lawyers because the plaintiffs are filing frivolous, fact-free lawsuits and abusing the courts.

On top of that, the issue of his Kenyan/British father exists. The concept of natural-born citizenship was to prevent dual allegiances. Why was that never addressed? They did for McCain (not “natural-born” either).

The concept of natural-born citizenship was to prevent naturalized citizens, who were not US citizens at birth, from becoming president. Obama was a US citizen at birth.

And today, new question, why did Nancy Pelosi sign two different campaign documents, one without the usual constitutional eligibility statement?

Different states, different forms. Get over it.

To me there are more serious questions than serious answers. . .so I continue the search.

You're about as serious as silly string, crazy ass birther.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:16 pm

I wasn't going to call you a racist. By the way, I'm close friends with Jesus and Mahatma Ghandi, you crazy ass birther.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:17 pm

Obama's step-grandmother never said he was in Obama.

Obama was granted Kenyan citizenship because his father was Kenyan. By the terms of the Kenyan Constitution, Obama's Kenyan citizenship expired when he turned (at the very latest) 23.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:17 pm

points for a funny comment, but

Obama is still a fraud and a fake with a lot of questions surrounding him (not to mention all the questionable people and institutions around him).

Obummer's minions are great at dishing personal attacks, but they can't seem to address the factual issues.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:17 pm

points for a funny comment, but

Obama is still a fraud and a fake with a lot of questions surrounding him (not to mention all the questionable people and institutions around him).

Obummer's minions are great at dishing personal attacks, but they can't seem to address the factual issues.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:19 pm

Only one, real certificate, has been released, by the Obama campaign, and confirmed by the State of Hawaii.

Tell me, how'd you get to be so stupid? Huffing paint? Mom did too much acid when pregnant? Pituitary disorder?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:22 pm

Natural-born citizenship is not available to dual-citizens after the date of the signing of the Constitution (except maybe for frauds that buy-off the system)


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:23 pm

“The issue is that Obama has supplied zero credible evidence that he's a citizen.”

Other than his COLB, of course.

“Posting something on the internet is not proof of citizenship.”

There's no competent evidence that the digital copy of the COLB differs from the paper COLB.

“Why can't Obama?”

Because he's not legally obligated to, and what he did do (put it on his web site) satisfied all but most crazy.

“Why is he spending hundreds of thousands of dollars hiding his records birth and college records”

He isn't.

Any more birfer lies?


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:25 pm

Children are not held responsible for dual-citizenship automatically granted to them by other countries. Obama would have had to renounce his US citizenship for this to matter. He is a natural-born citizen, born to a US citizen in these United States. He is not a naturalized citizen, which is the only other kind.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:25 pm

That not a list evidence, that's the birfer moving-goalpost list, as most of those have absolutely nothing to do with eligibility.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:25 pm

Because it's not the procedure required via the federal law. Go read your law.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:26 pm

At least you're consistent! Wrong on every point again! Repeating a lie doesn't make it true, Moron.

To quote Obummer, “the ACORN doesn't fall far from the tree.”


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:26 pm

Obummer's minions are great at dishing personal attacks, but they can't seem to address the factual issues.

You haven't raised any. Ever. You are impervious to facts.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:26 pm

“there is NO reason to have two different documents”

The obvious reason: Different states have different requirements.

That they are different versions in no way demonstrates fraud.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:27 pm

Repeating a lie doesn't make it true, Moron.

Then why do you keep doing it?


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:28 pm

What procedure is required “via the federal law,” exactly? Please cite specific statutes.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:29 pm

Good for you. Don't defame the efforts of those who came before you. We had a dream. Obama is not that dream. We faced the police and were beaten for it, and we didn't bleed and sweat so that Obama could be President. It's fine to dream that a woman or an African American or an Asian American or Latino American will grow up to be President. That's the promise of America. But we don't want them to be a fraud. What I find so funny is that the Obama supporters called for people not to call Obama a liar, but it's perfectly okay for you to insinuate that I'm lying. That's why you're a hypocrite.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:30 pm

Wrong again, just like everything else you've written, Moron.

Google:

Lt. Quarles Harris Jr.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/apr/19…

.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:32 pm

Who Am I?

I was born in one country, raised in another. My father was born in another country. I was not his only child. He fathered several children with several women.

I became very close to my mother, as my father showed no interest in me. My mother died at an early age from cancer.

Later in life, questions arose over my real name.

My birth records were sketchy and no one was able to produce a legitimate, reliable birth certificate.

I grew up practicing one faith but converted to Christianity, as it was widely accepted in my country, but I practiced non-traditional beliefs & didn't follow Christianity, except in the public eye under scrutiny.

I worked and lived among lower-class people as a young adult, disguising myself as someone who really cared about them..

That was before I decided it was time to get serious about my life and I embarked on a new career.

I wrote a book about my struggles growing up. It was clear to those who read my memoirs that I had difficulties accepting that my father abandoned me as a child.

I became active in local politics in my 30's then with help behind the scenes, I literally burst onto the scene as a candidate for national office in my 40s. They said I had a golden tongue and could talk anyone into anything. That reinforced my conceit.

I had a virtually non-existent resume, little work history, and no experience in leading a single organization. Yet I was a powerful speaker and citizens were drawn to me as though I were a magnet and they were small roofing tacks.

I drew incredibly large crowds during my public appearances. This bolstered my ego.

At first, my political campaign focused on my country's foreign policy. I was very critical of my country in the last war and seized every opportunity to bash my country.

I knew which group was responsible for getting us into this mess. It was the free market, banks & corporations. I decided to start making citizens hate them and if they were envious of others who did well, the plan was clinched tight.

I called mine “A People's Campaign” and that sounded good to all people.

I was the surprise candidate because I emerged from outside the traditional path of politics & was able to gain widespread popular support.

I knew that, if I merely offered the people 'hope' , together we could change our country and the world.

So, I started to make my speeches sound like they were on behalf of the downtrodden, poor, ignorant to include “persecuted minorities” like the Jews. My true views were not widely known and I needed to keep them unknown, until after I became my nation's leader.

I had to carefully guard reality, as anybody could have easily found out what I really believed, if they had simply read my writings and examined those people I associated with.

I'm glad they didn't. Then I became the most powerful man in the world. And the world learned the truth.

*Who am I? *

I am ADOLF HITLER

Welcome to Barry's world!


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:32 pm

You are a liar, and I never “called for people not to call Obama a liar.” You go ahead and call him whatever you want. Doesn't change the fact that you are lying.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:33 pm

You're a total idiot. We marched, we sweated, we planned, and we dreamed. And it seems we did this so that you could insult me today. Dr. King, and yes we knew him very well, wanted everyone in the marches to be dressed up. Did you ever notice this in the photos of the marches? People were respectful. Young people today are rude. Don't support someone just because they are black or female or whatever. Support them because they are true.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:34 pm

I like the use of “we.” Are you referring to you and all the people living in your head?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:35 pm

He's definitely not natural-born or naturalized.

He's an illegal alien. He needs to be shipped out with his Aunt.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:35 pm

Nope, he's a Hawaiian. Thank you for playing, crazy ass birther.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:37 pm

Completely and utterly wrong. Why don't you use your allegedly high IQ to look up the constitutional law professor at an accredited law school and ask? Orly Taitz and her little friends are using an 18th century Swiss model that has never applied in the United States.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:38 pm

Exactly. You can not be President of the US if you ever had, or have, dual citizenship.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:38 pm

Nothing about Obama makes sense. His own Myspace page says he is 52 years of age. That would mean he was born in 1957, not 1961 as the fake Factcheck COLB says.

The questions won’t go away until obama releases his hidden records. All he has to do is make the following official public statement,

“I Barack Obama authorize the State of Hawaii to release and make public all of my records on file.”

That's it. Issue over. But he won't because he's a fraud!! Obama knows that millions of citizens want to see it yet he continues to hide it. What and why is he hiding?

And maybe more disturbing is why don't BHO's supporters want to know the whole truth, especially since there's a reward that continues to be increased (currently $25 million) for proof that Obama is a “natural born” citizen of the United States? The answer is that Obama’s very own supporters also know he’s a fraud but choose to overlook it for political agenda reasons!

Link to a current lawsuit. . .(very thorough).

http://69.66.218.3/public/patriotsHeartVsObama/…

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:41 pm

Why is Obama not releasing his college application? Is it because he came to this country on an F-1 student visa under a scholarship? Why does his college record have to be sealed too? What is he hiding? I have to release my college record to apply for a job to show I have the degree I have. Why can't Obama do the same?


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:41 pm

And Hawaii wasn't even a state in 1957! And his mother would have been 14 when she gave birth to him! All because myspace says so!

And the Patriots Heart's lawsuit was dismissed, BTW.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:42 pm

Why is Obama not releasing his college application?

Why should he? Because crazy ass birthers say so?


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:43 pm

Because he won the election nearly a year ago.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:43 pm

Ooh, tell us what else you've learned from myspace…


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:44 pm

I am ADOLF HITLER

This is not the place to tell us your fantasies, pal.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:45 pm

Wrong. Stupid, or lying? You be the judge.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:45 pm

Now all you have to do is prove that death is in any way whatsoever related to Obama.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:49 pm

How about the US Constitution and every state election law and the FEC rules and regulations. The election laws have procedures for showing you are a citizen. None of them allow Factcheck.org to provide verification. In addition, the electors of the Electoral College are suppose to verifiy eligibility, and not one is on record of doing so for Obama. McCain they verified, but not Obama! Read your laws!


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:52 pm

I use we because my total family was involved.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:53 pm

The Constitution, once again, does not mention birth certificates. Name the laws, link to the statutes, do something to support your claims.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:53 pm

I hope they've disowned you.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:53 pm

Exactly. he has hidden everything.

Why did he hide the video of the meeting with Khalid Rashid?


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 8:59 pm

Dr. King was a Republican. The racists in the 60's were Democrats.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:01 pm

Nope. Everyone is very proud, and you should be ashamed of what you've brought to America. Dr. King preached love and peace, but truth and honesty, and self-respect. We were loyal to each other. And he hated pretenders.


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 2:02 am

Lying is not nice. Why are you lying? And where is your picture of yourself with Dr. King? WHAT ARE YOU HIDING?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:02 pm

Hawaii? Isn't that the state that Obambi was going to protect with Reagan's missile defenses, but now he wants to cancel them all? You mean that Hawaii?


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 2:03 am

Please cite the federal law stating this.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:03 pm

Then he would have hated you, if he had known you, which he certainly did not. Pretender.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:04 pm

Did they move Hawaii to Poland when I wasn't looking?

Idiot.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:05 pm

You Adolf? I believe you. It's obvious that you are more than a run-of-the-mill nut-case. I'm sure Nobama will have a job for you in his civilian-army of thugs.


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 2:06 am

For the same reason that you think the President lied about his birth certificate. The only difference is that the President has offered evidence to support his citizenship and his birth, and all you have done is boasted of a history of activism and a friendship with a man who has been dead for forty years.

Why won’t you provide a single measly little picture of yourself with Dr. King? Just one? WHAT ARE YOU HIDING????


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:08 pm

Southern Democrats. And King was certainly not a Republican.

Pretender.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:09 pm

The US Constitution says you have to be a natural born citizen. And you know that. Every state has election laws. The US Consitution requires the Electors of the Electoral College to verify citizenship. The Secretary over the elections have to verify eligibility. Obama presented a birth certificate via Factcheck.org which is not stated as being acceptable for verification anywhere. Show me where it is allowed or part of any procedure.


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 2:10 am

Please provide a photograph, church program, newspaper article, your college records, or any links to same proving that you are as old as you claim, that you have met the Kings, or that you were involved in any way with the Civil Rights movement.

WHAT ARE YOU HIDING?????


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 2:11 am

Please provide a photograph of yourself with Dr. King. Just one.

In short, kindly do what you have demanded that the President do. Otherwise, you will proved yourself to be a hypocrite and a liar.

WHAT ARE YOU HIDING?????


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 2:14 am

Prove it. By that I mean provide a link to the state or federal law, as well as any correspondence with the agency that required you to do so. Also, please provide a copy of a photograph of yourself with Dr. King, as well as any evidence besides the ravings of Orly Taitz that the President was adopted.

WHAT ARE YOU HIDING?????


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:16 pm

Not quite, but you bring up another good point. Your Marxist Messiah is throwing another good friend under the bus. Lefties are good at that.

Your fraud-friend-of-the-world is destroying our credibility as a ally.

Hope that make you happy.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:17 pm

The US Constitution says you have to be a natural born citizen.

And he is. He was born in Hawaii.

“I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago….”

The US Consitution requires the Electors of the Electoral College to verify citizenship.

It does? Where?

Obama presented a birth certificate via Factcheck.org which is not stated as being acceptable for verification anywhere.

No one claimed it was provided as official verification of anything.

Do a little research and come back to us with the details of citizenship verification provided by all the past presidents.


oldmagicman666
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:17 pm

His Myspace has listed him as 52 for over a month at least. It has not been scrubbed nor changed and no comments by him or the White House has been put out that I know about. The question is – what is the reason for this yet undisclosed ploy? He's up to something, and we as of today, do not know what. If there are tricks being played, there are lies to hide, and facts to keep hidden. Beware!


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:19 pm

What makes me happy is people like you going apeshit and wasting all your time on birther nonsense. It's quite entertaining.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:20 pm

I can't wait for Orly Taitz to try bringing up myspace in court. Comedy gold.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:26 pm

How about stop enabling his fraud, and help get the truth out, so we can all return to our normal lives?

Obama is a liar. I’ll believe his new promises AFTER he keep some old promises.

Watch this video about his past health-care promises. You’ll see obama lie in his very own words.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3JKDTBOYKg

JUST SAY NO TO obamaCARE!!!

.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:30 pm

Obummer fails our friends again.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/eur…


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:36 pm

Godwin's Law applies. You lose.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:38 pm

His stepgrandmother said nothing of the sort, as you would know if you'd listened to the whole phone call. She insisted that he was born in Hawaii despite a birther doing his damnedest to get her to lie.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:38 pm

Wrong on all counts. FAIL.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:39 pm

Maybe because there WAS no meeting with Khalid Rashid?


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:56 pm

What puzzles me is why birthers are demanding that the President release his kindergarten records. I'm a year to the day older than he is and I don't even know the *name* of my kindergarten. Why is this anyone's business?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:56 pm

You listened to the tape did you? Guess that proves you're a know-nothing liar (unless you speak Swahili).

I read the transcript. . .she said she was there. So did the ambassador.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 9:59 pm

Not good enough. Cite the actual law, please.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:00 pm

I thought Obama was suppose to be the president of truth and all things good. What's the big deal by presenting the long form birth certificate, medical records and college records? I have my long form birth certificate. I have no problem with presenting it when asked. Most presidents have displayed all sorts of documents in their presidential libraries. Every photo and baby hair clipping practically is presented in these libraries. Obama demanded in the campaign that Hillary Clinton and John McCain release all sorts of documents, yet Obama seems to hide things himself. It would all go away if he were as open as he claimed. He isn't. That's a fact. No amount of calling people names will hide that.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:03 pm

The LA Times said they have the tapes, but wouldn't release them.

Obummer is hiding too much.

Only frauds do that.


ayatollaobama
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:05 pm

Why is Obama with holding this information? why is he with holding this information? I have read all the rants on here with no legitimate answer found as to why he is keeping this secret. This whole thing could end if he would simply comply with whats been asked. Obama continues to run and hide behind the Department of Justice lawyer bulldogs on our dime to not answers those questions and telling us we have no right to know this information. He is also found to have lied about his christian faith on which he ran on to be elected only to find out he is in fact a muslim. End this now by showing the American people the necessary documentation, transparency and willingness to cooperate. Quit hiding behind the lies and show us the long form and all your records on eduation that are sealed. When somebody has to hide something and spend a fortune doing it he has something he doesn't want you to see. Maybe Obama backers need to ask themselves why he is doing this? You people deserve also to know these answers and the questions are legitimate. Why is he doing this? Why not get it over with and show us and put this to rest finally? If Obama backers turn out to be right fine then it will all go away but if the people that question his legitimacy are right what do you have to loose? We should all get behind this for all our sake who knows what will find but were not gonna find out by bickering and fighting one another lets get the answers together and put it to rest then all could be satisfied and we can all stand behind this president. If this isn't looked into then what precident and signal are we sending about a candidates legitimacy in the future by not looking into this? Do we want a Hugo Chavez in the whitehouse in the future elections due to poor oversite? Or Joseph Stalin czarisms and ideals? Frankly it scares the crap out of me! Seems like it won't matter if we don't stand up and take a look at whats going on and put this to rest for the safety of all Americans not just right or left. We should all be concerned about this and quit fighting and see where this takes us for all our benefit. This whole thing could end if he would simply comply with whats been asked. Obama continues to run and hide behind the Department of Justice lawyer bulldogs on our dime to not answers those questions and telling us we have no right to know this information. He is also found to have lied about his christian faith on which he ran on to be elected only to find out he is in fact a muslim. End this now by showing the American people the necessary documentation, transparency and willingness to cooperate. Quit hiding behind the lies and show us the long form and all your records on eduation that are sealed. When somebody has to hide something and spend a fortune doing it he has something he doesn't want you to see. Maybe Obama backers need to ask themselves why he is doing this? You people deserve also to know these answers and the questions are legitimate. Why is he doing this? Why not get it over with and show us and put this to rest finally? If Obama backers turn out to be right fine then it will all go away but if the people that question his legitimacy are right what do you have to loose? We should all get behind this for all our sake who knows what will find but were not gonna find out by bickering and fighting one another lets get the answers together and put it to rest then all could be satisfied and we can all stand behind this president. If this isn't looked into then what precident and signal are we sending about a candidates legitimacy in the future by not looking into this? Do we want a Hugo Chavez in the whitehouse in the future elections due to poor oversite? Or Joseph Stalin czarisms and ideals? Frankly it scares the crap out of me! Seems like it won't matter if we don't stand up and take a look at whats going on and put this to rest for the safety of all Americans not just right or left. We should all be concerned about this and quit fighting and see where this takes us for all our benefit.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:06 pm

“II have my long form birth certificate. I have no problem with presenting it when asked.”

Present it here, please.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:08 pm

Did you read the full transcript, or the doctored one that omits where says he was born in the United States?


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:10 pm

Same here.


Ellid
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:11 pm

Please provide a link to the article in question.


tinam2
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:14 pm

Because most presidents release almost everything in their lives, and because he demanded the Clinton and McCains do so, but Obama is too good to do so. What are you afraid of?


ayatollaobama
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:20 pm

Boy its amazing how Obama backers answer with name calling and insults but won't ask their candidate to produce the documentation he has sealed from our view to show that your the idiot!


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:31 am

Richard M. Daley


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:33 pm

You said you had no problem presenting your birth certificate when asked. You're being asked.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:33 pm

Obama demanded Clinton and McCain's kindergarten records? Prove it.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:37 pm

I have read all the rants on here with no legitimate answer found as to why he is keeping this secret.

There are several; you care not to acknowledge them.

This whole thing could end if he would simply comply with whats been asked.

Oh that's not true at all. There's the two-citizen-parent claims, the still-a-Kenyan/British-citzen claims, adopted-in-Indonesia claims, none of which require the birth certificate.

Why not get it over with and show us and put this to rest finally?

Because that's not true, either; that's why he doesn't.

Do we want a Hugo Chavez in the whitehouse in the future elections due to poor oversite? Or Joseph Stalin czarisms and ideals?

Will they get elected?


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:41 pm

He has documentation sealed from view that shows I'm an idiot? What's Obama doing with my drunken college scribblings?


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:43 pm

I'm afraid you won't ever have a normal life without the aid of powerful antipsychotics.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:44 am

Why Article 1, Section 2, Paragraph 3 of the Constitution, of course.


alaphiah
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 10:51 pm

Cheers to Camille!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:03 pm

Have a lot of fears do you?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:09 pm

You ask lots of very good questions. The ONLY logical answer to them is that Obama is a fraud, a usurper, and his story has been a lie.

His Obots try to obfuscate, but the overwhelming fact is that a lot of information has been hidden for no apparent reason, therefor there must be a hidden reason, fraud.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:15 pm

That's obviously not the issue. Your stupid request only proves to brightly highlight how morons like you do everything possible to try to hide from the real issue, Obama's fraud.

We all know he's a fraud. Instead of addressing that issue, you redirect the conversation.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:23 pm

Let tinam2 explain why she won't me honor her offer to show her birth certificate.

Her answer maybe, just maybe, might explain Obama doesn't respond to yours.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:36 pm

Redirecting again huh?

Tinam2 didn't run for a government job with specific citizenship requirements. Obama did. He works for me as much as any citizen. He carrying the nuclear football. I wan to know who he REALLY is. I want to see his records.


Bob
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:39 pm

I want to see his records.

And I want to see Tinam2's. Glad that's out of the way.

At least Obama was born in Hawaii, and thus a natural-born citizen.

He works for me as much as any citizen.

And if you want him “fired,” you get to vote in 2012. See you then, “boss.”


captainsteve
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:40 pm

They use a combination of Clintonian “politics of personal destruction,” Saul Alinsky's “Rules for radicals” RULE 5: “Ridicule is man's most potent weapon.” and plain old redirection,

but they never answer the questions!!

It's the same with the courts. They just keep tossing it without review.


mantis
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:45 pm

There's one other way. Get the Congress to impeach him. Good luck to you.


cindychristy
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:51 pm

Please, please birthers — keep up this nonsense for the next seven years.


cindychristy
Comment posted September 17, 2009 @ 11:53 pm

– He is also found to have lied about his christian faith on which he ran on to be elected only to find out he is in fact a muslim. –

Oh brother.


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 2:01 am

Also, please present photographs of yourself with Dr. King, at the Selma March, and with other prominent Civil Rights leaders, including, but not limited to, Bayard Rustin, Jesse Jackson Sr., John Lewis, Coretta King, Mahalia Jackson, Ralph Abernethy, Vernon Johns, and at least one Kennedy brother. Also, kindly include at least one letter, greeting card, or Civil Rights fundraising program to prove that you really did march on Selma, plan protests with Dr. King, and sit on a planning committee for SNCC, CORE, the SPLC, or a group of Freedom Riders.

WHAT ARE YOU HIDING??????


ayatollaobama
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 2:59 am

7 years huh? your that confident Obama will get a second tern LOL hahahahahahahhahaha!


ayatollaobama
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 2:59 am

Still lied didn't he?


ayatollaobama
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:02 am

That still doesn't answer the question Bob. Why doesn't he show us the long form and the rest of his secret muslim life? Stop side stepping the issue just like your candidate and get down to the answers as to why he won't comply.


ayatollaobama
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:12 am

If Obama is legal lets see the evidence he's hiding end of story. Show us the long form then I'll believe it. Only crooks and swindlers hide from the truth I don't care if your dumocrat or repooplican LOL. If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck and quacks like a duck I'm sorry but its a duck. Maybe his czars can run to office depot and make him a birth certificate rather than a birth certification. LOL.


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:29 am

B.O. is hardly a charismatic speaker. When he was in Canada, he made self-confessed dullard Steven Harper seem dynamic and exciting. Without the aid of an army of speechwriters, Obama's lost. When his teleprompter crashed to the floor recently, all he could mutter was “oh…my goodness!” He occasionally forgets what city (or state) he's in–leaving his poor daughter to correct him–and thinks America has 57 states. Oh–he doesn't “speak Austrian”, either. This 'his speeches make me tinkle in my slacks' (Chris Matthews, &c.) nonsense is media propaganda, to make their bought-and-paid-for candidate/politician look good. And, no, Scarlett Johansen and Aisha Tyler didn't leave their husbands for him.

As for POWER…look behind the vaguely nerdy guy with the Ratattouille ears to the REAL boss: Richard M[obster] Daley.


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:32 am

Considering the opposition, yes, we are.


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:33 am

Cut the man some slack about his MySpace page–he thinks America has 57 States, after all. :p


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:34 am

No, he didn't.


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:36 am

Maybe because President Obama has better things to do than appease racist asshats like yourself?


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:36 am

So where's your long form certificate? Bob asked an hour ago!


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:38 am

The questions have been answered, swabbiesteve. You just don't like the answers.


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:40 am

Swabbiesteve, 'i am rubber and you are glue' stopped being witty past sixth grade. Just thought you should know that.


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:43 am

If Powell, Condi, or even Rev. Jackson were sitting in the Oval Office now, even the most rabid racist nutjob wouldn't dispute their birthplaces. (Actually, most of the NASCAR crowd people here despise would be DELIGHTED to have Rice or Powell in the White House.) The irony, of course, is that left-wing Democrats would've gone 'birther', had McCain been elected. (The Van Joneses would've probably concocted some 'whites polluting people of color' conspiracy theory.)


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:46 am

I think the intent was SUPPOSED to be to guard HI from NK, or Russian nukes. The real point of Missile Defense, though, is to piss billions away on campaign-contributing contractors, for a fat porkbarrel of high tech garbage.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:17 am

Obama is a dirt-bag liar! I don't trust him for anything other than lying or screwing up. He's in the running with Carter for the worst pres ever,

Remember Obama's Cap-and-trade speech in April of this year? He said it would cost “a postage stamp per day.”

It was reported today (via a FOIA request) that the Treasury did the cost estimate in March (one month earlier) and it will really cost Americans up to $1,761 per family. That's… 12 times more than he said it would be. Liar Liar. Joe Wilson is a sage.

That's equal to about a 15% tax (on top of the 8% Obamacare tax).

Obama's a frickin' liar. People should wake up. Just say no. . .Nobama . . . and show me the birth certificate!!!


24AheadDotCom
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 5:12 am

Here's a question Weigel won't answer (probably because Mr. Soros would be upset): why did the judge in the recent case apply a different standard to the certificate Taitz supplied than he did to the one that's on BHO's site?

Please note: that has nothing to do with burden of proof, it's a simple matter of what the judge believes. He was rightly skeptical about the cert she provided, but he wasn't skeptical about the picture shown on BHO's site, despite the fact that it hasn't been authenticated by any gov't agency. Why, it's almost like he's an establishment hack who thinks there are two standards of justice: one for establishment leaders, and another for those who are disfavored by the establishment.


Bob
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 5:13 am

The irony, of course, is that left-wing Democrats would've gone 'birther', had McCain been elected

Which is exactly why Obama why a co-sponsor of S.R. 511.


Bob
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 5:17 am

why did the judge in the recent case apply a different standard to the certificate Taitz supplied than he did to the one that's on BHO's site?

Because the judge didn't rule at all about the admissibility of the COLB because none was presented.

he wasn't skeptical about the picture shown on BHO's site

It is undisputed that what was one Obama's site said that he was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961, which is precisely what the judge wrote.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 5:29 am

Good question DotCom:

The answer is obvious: corruption at the very deepest level. A fraud is in the Whitehouse.

Another question is: why does Obama hire people on Craigslist (like bob, matis et al) to scour the web day and night to attack those who question, and then report them to the White House as “fishy”?

Why doesn't he just release his records? OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


acerbic
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 5:30 am

If I were a reporter interviewing one of these “mainstream” birfoons like Paglia or Dobbs who like to coyly dance around “questions” or “ambiguities” about Obama's citizenship, I would press the critter to spell it out: WHAT “questions”? WHAT “ambiguities”?

Why is that so hard to do?


ayatollaobama
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 5:54 am

Wow i'm a racists? Because I question the documents he is hiding? I guess I'm also racists because George Busch was a liar and fool also! Why does that make me a racist please explain? I don't fall for the left or right propaganda like your dumb ass! What a stupid idiot keep your mouth shut your lookin more and more stupid as you speak. You have no clue as to what or why I am asking for this. I said I would get behind this president if he did what is right by showing what he continues to hide and dodge. So the only asshat here is you with your lame ass insults shows your lack of knowledge for the truth and absolutely no stand for our rights in this country. I don't care if hes white or black or democrat or republican if he is an imposter thats violated the law it must be looked into regardless of race or political party open your eyes and ears jack ass!


ayatollaobama
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 5:57 am

Are you a lesbian? Do you work for ACORN? LOL


ayatollaobama
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:01 am

Do you work for ACORN?


Bob
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:44 am

It is worse than you think: the Captainsteve Czar has already booked your passage to the FEMA re-education camp.


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:50 am

You seem much more frightened than Mantis.


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:53 am

That’s the Constitution. It is not a federal statute. Do not duck the issue. Cite the statute, please.


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:59 am

Please provide a copy of a photograph of yourself with Dr. King, or any other evidence proving that you are something other than a boastful, lying fanatic.

Thank you.


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 12:02 pm

It satisfied everyone except a handful of conspiracy theorists.

Speaking of documents, please provide a copy of a photograph of yourself with Dr. King, at the Selma March, or any other evidence that you were involved in the Civil Rights Movement. WHAT ARE YOU HIDING?????


RedGraham
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:48 am

The transcript from the Captain Rhoades case reveals the judge based his decision on the following:
1-The complainant stated she would deploy if Bush was still president as she had no doubts about his eligibility. Therefore if the ruling was in the captain's favor many other servicemembers would seek to avoid deployment thereby undermining “military operations”.
2-The Kenyan Birth Certificates in question were produced “for profit” so they could be fake (like Obama's COLB isn't).
3-”For the public good” since the 2008 election had such a large turnout and Obama had the most “expensive campaign” in history.
A news report interpretted this as “frivolous” and the judge on the California supreme court warned “never to waste the court's time” with another suit alleging Obama's ineligibility.
It saddens me so many don't even want to know the truth & ridicule those who do


Matt Taylor
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:43 pm

Yeah, don’t we know we are obligated to take every whackjob theory by every racist asshat with an internet connection as gospel?


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:07 pm

Cite statute.

Also, please include a photograph of yourself with Dr. King.


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:08 pm

Oh, one more thing while you’re producing that photograph of yourself with Dr. King….

What is “MORALES?” Does that mean your family church preached that God was a Hispanic surname?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:42 pm

Read that part of the Constitution again, I think you missed the joke.

(Hint: 3/5ths compromise, Birthers are crazy racist assholes…)


The Right Side of Life » Camille Sees “Birther” Questions as Legit; Maxine Wants to Probe
Pingback posted September 18, 2009 @ 1:31 pm

[...] Weigel, writing in the WashingtonIndependent.com, thought Ms. Paglia’s comment was “compelling” — very much of a u-turn from his thoughts on my blog not too long [...]


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:14 pm

Ah. Didn’t have a copy in front of me. Thanks!


Anonymous
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:14 pm

Does not matter if he was born here or not!!!!!!!!! Hist mother was a U.S. Citizen thus he is too end of story!!!!!!!! If you want to question his citizenship start with his mother!!!!!!!


mantis
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:34 pm

He released short-form which is available to non-natural-born citizens

You can get a certificate from Hawaii if you are a naturalized citizen, but it won’t say you were born in Honolulu, it will list your actual birthplace. Obama’s says he was born in Honolulu.

You are a dumbass.


Phoebe
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:50 pm

>Or Joseph Stalin czarisms and ideals?

You do realize the Joseph Stalin fought *against* the Czars, don’t you?

The Czars weren’t communists. They were the kings that the communists killed.


Guest
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:01 pm

You, sir, are a complete idiot. And either horribly misinformed, or a liar. All Hawaii will release now, for ANYONE, is the short-form certificate. It bears the seal and signature, as verification of authenticity. If you were born in Hawaii, as asked for a copy of your birth certificate, that is what they would send you. You can’t get the “original.” Obama can’t.

If you think Obama was born somewhere else, where is your evidence? As the Judge Land (a GWB appointee, by the way) noted, the plaintiff in these “birther” lawsuits bears the burden of proof. Where is your proof? And don’t tell me the crap about what his “grandmother” supposedly said. The part of the transcript you nuts don’t cite says the following (keep in mind, the interview was conducted through a translator):

MCRAE: Could I ask her about his actual birthplace? I would like to see his birthplace when I come to Kenya in December. Was she present when he was born in Kenya?

OGOMBE: Yes. She says, yes, she was, she was present when Obama was born.

MCRAE: When I come in December. I would like to come by the place, the hospital, where he was born. Could you tell me where he was born? Was he born in Mombasa?

OGOMBE: No, Obama was not born in Mombasa. He was born in America.

MCRAE: Whereabouts was he born? I thought he was born in Kenya.

OGOMBE: No, he was born in America, not in Mombasa.

MCRAE: Do you know where he was born? I thought he was born in Kenya. I was going to go by and see where he was born.

OGOMBE: Hawaii. Hawaii. Sir, she says he was born in Hawaii. In the state of Hawaii, where his father was also learning, there. The state of Hawaii.


Guest
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:07 pm

Yes, there is another explanation for the “birther” movement, “Captainsteve.” A certain portion of any population falls for complex conspiracy theories, and rejects the elegance of Occam’s Razor. Thus, we have people who think that 9/11 was an “inside job,” that a “Tri-Lateral Commission” secretly runs the world, nutjobs like you, Captainsteve, who seem obsessed with the notion that Obama was not born in the United States, but cannot produce any evidence to support your claims.

Put the tinfoil back on your head, cap’n. The government is trying to read your mind!!!


Guest
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:22 pm

You do realize, don’t you, that facts are irrelevant to people like ayaracistnutjob. History happened the way they say, because it is what they believe. Like their hero, George W. Bush, they base everything on belief rather than on facts. Poor guy or gal probably never graduated the 6th grade.


Guest
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:28 pm

Amazing, isn’t it, how someone with a 3rd grade education learns to type “LOL” or “hahahahaha” and they think they are making a cogent argument. Are you blogging because your mommy took your crayons away?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:30 pm

If Camile Paglia’s a liberal, I’m the Queen of England… and I’m not.
I’m leaning toward she’s dishonest AND stupid


Anonymous
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:34 pm

You are wrong about Hawaii having the copy on record, they don’t keep the paper copies anymore there is only a “prepresentation” probably micro-film or something copy of his original AND it’s not that they won’t release it unles Obama says so; they have stated that they don’t as a matter of policy release any other documentation of birth other than the Short form version that Obama has release.

The short form version is the only one available from the state of Hawaii and there is no possibility of long form being released. So give it up, stop the lies and either stick your fingers in your years for the next 3 to 7 years (hopefully 7) or get with the nation and at least support the office of our President.


Matt Taylor
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:36 pm

Holy crap, we get paid for metaphorically beating your stupid skulls in with reality? Hot damn, I thought I was doing it just for the fun of watching you inbred hillbillies squirm.


Matt Taylor
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:38 pm

See the difference is you are under the impression that just because you yammered some idiocy than the rest of the world is obligated to treat your idiocy like its legitimate simply because you uttered it.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:40 pm

bearclaw, great post. But, captain ditto head steve won’t understand.


Matt Taylor
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:41 pm

Hey dumbass,
a) Its highly doubtful Obama actually does his own myspace page
b) If I put that I am the captain of the USS Enterprise on my myspace page, would you believe that too?


Matt Taylor
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 3:42 pm

Damn us muslim/commie/leftists are sneakier than I realized. When do I get paid for posting Pro-Obama stuff again?


Aaror
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:56 pm

Yes, a natural born citizen is anyone who is born in the US, OR
Born to a US citizen, OR
found in the US under the age of 5 and US citizenship not disproven by the age of 21.
But birthers don’t care about what the constitution actually says and means, cause that would require that they know how to read, and neanderthals are not good at that.


Bob
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:06 pm

Many have the truth, but they don't like it, so like good Americans, they file frivolous lawsuits.


Bob
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:08 pm

Depends; where have you boldy gone to?


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:42 pm

Obama is busy sucking up to the nice Islamists, who want to kill us. Like Ronald ‘Mujaheddin-lover’ Reagan. Watch him bow (a GROSS violation of Presidential protocol) to misogynist antisemite Saudi despot Abdulla:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEUif1–r38

This was kept off of the network news by B.O.’s media backers, who realised the outrage it would’ve caused.


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:44 pm

So you admit he didn't lie.


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:48 pm

If you question a black man with a funny name and fully legal documentation of his citizenship of being both not American as well as a Muslim, then congratulations, you are a racist asshat.

And no, feigned indignance over being called out isn't fooling anyone other than your fellow racist asshats.


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:50 pm

Ah yes, more ad hominems. Surrender accepted.


thesheriffsani
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 4:51 pm

I'm sorry there aren't more racist asshats like yourself, but we're a modern nation now. Do feel free to join us at any time.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:57 pm

No she wasn’t sane back in April. She hasn’t been sane for a long, long time. There ARE NO AMBIGUITIES about the birth certificate. His educational records are private; I’m curious, too, but that doesn’t mean he’s obligated to satisfy my curiosity.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:06 pm

“Junk?” Like the Enlightenment, democracy, empiricism, etc.?

OH, East is East, and West is West, and never the twain shall meet,
Till Earth and Sky stand presently at God’s great Judgment Seat;
But there is neither East nor West, Border, nor Breed, nor Birth,
When two strong men stand face to face, tho’ they come from the ends of the earth
– Kipling

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
(Hanlon’s Razor, though it has the Twain twinge to it.)

Clothes make the man. Naked people have little or no influence on society.
Mark Twain (who else?)

Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen.
Albert Einstein, (attributed)US (German-born) physicist (1879 – 1955)

“… no grievances or policies will justify resort to aggressive war. It is utterly renounced and condemned as an instrument of policy.”
U.S.Supreme Court Justice Jackson as Chief Prosecutor, Nurenberg Trials


Guest
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:27 pm

Cap’n – please stop posting the same drivel over and over and over. Take your meds, put the tinfoil hat back on, and get some rest.


Guest
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:36 pm

Thanks. I realize the futility, but sometimes I take the bait anyway.

If cap’n reads the post, the best I can expect is that he’ll check e-bay to see if he can buy hisself one them thar “ukum’s razurs”.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:48 pm

not true. . .SOTUS didn’t rule on anything but standing. . .never on merit.


Penny Dreadful
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:50 pm

The people who take her seriously are conservatives who think she’s a liberal they can respect.


Guest
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:20 pm

And how do you arrive at that conclusion from the language of Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution?

Shall we begin impeachment proceedings against Chester Arthur, whose father was British?

If dual citizenship disqualifies a person, then we have real problems. Each nation determines its own rules for citizenship. For example, Russia could pass a law declaring YOU, cap’n, to be a Russian citizen (if you aren’t already, comrade cap’n sir). So you couldn’t be President, by virtue of dual citizenship.

Can you cite any Supreme Court decisions to support your interpretation? Didn’t think so. There aren’t any. The Supreme Court has never spoken on this issue. But fortunately for all of us, Cap’n has given us his authoritative reading!

Seriously, take your meds, put the tinfoil hat back on, and get some rest.


darknight1307
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:25 pm

I Find it amazing how many people just can't accept a black man is President. Why the Birther movement? because Obama sleeps with his wife not like Clinton. They can't out talk him because he isn't boring like Kerry and Gore. So you have nothing on him but wait he has a weird name and
he is from Kenya and if he were born he might not be eligible which by the way would be still true do to the fact his mother was born in the US and at worst some ambiguity in the constitution never mind the fact McCain was born in Panama. So what can we use on Obama oh yes it's a plot to get him elected president that in 1961 when blacks were being hung by trees or shot while being black. Fighting and dying for the right to vote do you really think anyone would project a black man as president of the United States in their life time. That's Stupid. If you said that in 1981 most people would think you were crazy
even in 1991 after Jesse Jackson had run twice you would say that's Crazy
When Colin Powell didn't run in 1996 because of racist conservatives a huge opportunity was missed by the Republicans who seemed to forget before FDR that blacks voted 90% for Republicans because the government wasn't exactly their friend (Jim Crow).
One last thing that if Obama really was some sort of sleeper agent he wouldn't have kept his father's name and taken his mother and gone by his nick name in High school Barry Dunham. I'm sorry I feel your paranoia and as a black man in this country you need to know every conspiracy under the sun has been perpetrated against blacks and other people of color. And the fact that he was a One term senator with no money it's just not plausible. Chairman Mao or
Joe Stalin in their wildest fantasies would not have thought of it. Sometime it is what it appears to be. Your problem is your against his policies and we see this sort of thing every time we see a democratic president and you have nothing else so you are grabbing at straws.


macrov
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:29 pm

I am VERY reluctant to make any comment here, as most of you people sound like you don't have both oars in the water, but here's a point I never hear made in this ridiculous “birther” discussion:

As long as Obama was born to a U.S. citizen who was physically present in the U.S. for a sufficient amount of time before he was born, then it doesn't matter where he was born. And if he was born outside the U.S., he would have been issued a Consular Report of Birth Abroad, and would have been issued a U.S. passport to get back to the U.S. (or at that time would have been included in his mother's). But nobody has absolutely any evidence that Obama was born outside the U.S., or was not born to the woman known to be his mother. So why doesn't Obama “produce” a certain document you're demanding? Because there is absolutely no basis on which to challenge his being a natural-born citizen. Get back on your meds, people.


bobby
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:32 pm

OMFG, these trolls just keep getting nuttier and nuttier.

As far as Paglia goes, it's clear that Slate only keeps her around because she gets lots of page views thanks to conservatives who will link to someone who describes herself as a liberal but admits that she gets her news from right wing talk radio. She must just be very dishonest because I can't imagine that she is really this stupid.


MoZeu
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:42 pm

Some states don't issue long form birth certificates anymore because they moved to computerized records. Hawaii is one of those states. So if your parents didn't get it when you were born or lost it somewhere along the way, then you have to take the form of birth certificate that the state issues. My mom lost my birth certificate and I had to get a copy from my state when I was older in order to obtain a passport. I have a short form, and no one has ever questioned it. It's as valid as any other state-issued form.

Demanding that Obama produce a “long form” birth certificate to prove he was born in Hawaii makes about as much sense as demanding he produce his placenta to prove he's human. In the absence of even a shred of evidence that Obama was born anywhere but Hawaii, why the fuck is anyone still talking about this?

Camille Paglia has a long history of publishing utter nonsense for the purpose of getting attention. She's about as cogent a thinker as my 15 month old.


ThunderMonkey
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:45 pm

They can't… their meds were cut off from the private insurance companies. They get their meds back if they campaign against health care and insurance reform.


gotborked
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:46 pm

I'm a conservative, but not a “birther”, because I don't see it going anywhere. That said, the only three explanations I can see for why Obama won't present his long-form birth cert. are:

1. he's not a U.S. citizen and he is committing a massive fraud on the people;

2. he's a U.S. citizen, but for one reason or another, he can't find the document, but he's in too deep to admit that now; or

3. he's a U.S. citizen, he has a long-form birth cert., but he won't disclose it out of pride or because he sees some political benefit in not doing so (making the right looking conspiratorial or something).

None are particularly presidential. Are there other logical explanations?


stormrdr
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:48 pm

Look, I've made this statement before other places, but I'll go ahead and make it here, too.
Whether or not Obama was a natural-born citizen when he was elected is now a moot point.
He's President, and has been President for going on 9 months now. In the interest of National Security, he's a legitimate citizen, and there will never be any conclusive proof otherwise. Consider, if you will, what would have to occurr if such proof were ever validated: Lit. 100s of Executive Orders would be invalidated, numerous Laws would be voided, the military would have no continuing right to operate based on ANY of Obama's orders, all of his appointments (including the new Supreme Court Justice) would be washed, it would be governmental chaos.
This is not going to happen, so we might as well find something else to bang on the guy about…Like Healthcare, Cap & Tax, or Govt. Overspending.
Also, consider what this would mean for Obama. As President, he has access to some of the most sensitive secrets of our goverment. Since he never naturalized, if he was shown to be not native-born, we would have a situation where an illegal alien has been exposed to a good chunk of our national secrets. What would we DO with him? We couldn't just deport him, and, to my knowledge, he has not knowingly committed any crime.
No, this debate is not going anywhere. If you had video evidence of his birth from a Kenyan security camera, it doesn't matter at this point. Barak Obama IS the President of the United States (at least until 2012), and that won't be changing over this issue.


JimCap
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:51 pm

So, Ms. Paglia, what exactly are those “legitimate questions about the documentation of Obama’s birth certificate”?

Can you be specific? Or, are you just continuing your bizarre reputation as someone who apparently wants to be disliked and distrusted by any and all parts of the ideological spectrum?

Is this just your latest attempt to continue your tired old act of the eternal adolescent?


Bob
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:52 pm

Are there other logical explanations?

He's got far more important things to do.


willhe
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:56 pm

i went through hurricane katrina i dont have an original birth certificate either


JimCap
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:57 pm

Actually, Barack Obama's birth certificate was presented well over one year ago.

The only reason people like you continue to talk about it is for political reasons. It makes you sound a little unhinged. Do you realize that?

You obviously didn't vote for Barack Obama. You're bitter and filled with rage and you spend your days spewing hatred and lies online. You lost. And you're whining and pouting that our country now has a liberal, black president.

I suggest you get used to it.

Maybe you need to go get a job,or do something of a productive nature. It's often the case with you typical Obama haters.


frankdunn
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:59 pm

I am from Texas (one of the states mentioned) and I agree with this post. I can't get the long form of my birth certificate either nor my son's because we lost it. I have my daughters and my wife's.

The state of Hawaii has repeatedly explained this


frankdunn
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:59 pm

I am from Texas (one of the states mentioned) and I agree with this post. I can't get the long form of my birth certificate either nor my son's because we lost it. I have my daughters and my wife's.

The state of Hawaii has repeatedly explained this


mark34
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 6:59 pm

Do people not “trust” the sate of Hawaii to get their records straight.. is that the idea?

/just askin.


EE KELLER
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:01 pm

I have to question Joan Walsh's hiring practices.


S9
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:03 pm

Because he damn well doesn't feel like sharing it with everyone, his choice. Seems presidential enough to me. He has released a Certificate of Live Birth, which has been confirmed by the Hawaii govt (Republican, btw) as legitimate and accurately reflective of the long form. The more you idiots spend time on this, the more pathetic you look. I love it everyday Orly Taitz is in the news – she's a dream come true for us reality-based people.

And stop pretending you are not a birther. It's all you Conservatives have left, since you lost all sense of reality some time back. Now go back to teabagging.


mech126
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:03 pm

Ya like he was born in hawaii like he said duuu


Guest
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:04 am

O.K., I checked the link. It doesn’t say that anyone can get a copy of the original birth certificate. It is World Nut Daily claiming that the Governor of Hawaii has put Obama’s original birth certificate under lock and key, but it doesn’t quote her saying that. In fact, there is no source for the story. And the Director of Health has explained that parents get to “self-identify” race. It isn’t surprising that someone from Africa would say “African” rather than use a term such as “negro” that they don’t identify with.

So why do you think the State of Hawaii would issue a certified “Certificate of Live Birth” if Obama wasn’t born in Hawaii? What is your explanation?


EE KELLER
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:06 pm

I think it is so wonderful that the 1st Amendment to the Constitution of the United States allows people to make fools of themselves.


genji11
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:08 pm

Paglia was one of my professors during my undergrad work and two things I took away from the class is that Paglia is 1) in love with the sound of her own voice 2)Functionally retarded.

I ignored her then when I needed her grade, it is even easier now. I suggest you all just do the same.


SCollins
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:10 pm

Here's one good reason for you. He has done all he is legally required to do to prove citizenship. No other president has been hounded for his original birth certificate and none have produced such a document.

Quesion for you: Why does Obama have to do more to prove his citizenship than any other president?

1. Birthers are racists
2. Birthers are racists
3. Birthers are racists

None of these are particularly intelligent. Are the other logical explanations for the birther movement?


Ellid
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:10 pm

As a matter of fact, no.

Also, the President never lied about his religion. Why don't you go volunteer at a soup kitchen with your copious free time?


trueamericam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:11 pm

stormrdr, President Obama has produced his birth certificate. The birthers just refuse to accept it.
The birthers are all liars. They represent the lowest form of humanity.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:11 pm

He released short-form which is available to non-natural-born citizens (a requirement to be POTUS).

He has not released his long form certificate.

He says in his book “Dreams” that he found it.

And Gov. Linda Lingle said they have it on file. Hawaii law prohibits them from releasing the long-form or any information without Obama's approval. He has denied all requests, including spending over a million dollars in lawyer fees to fight numerous court challenges.

That leads to the question of why?

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Sevenfeet
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:12 pm

Sure. Let's say the old paper long form certificate is back at their house in Chicago in a box somewhere. Let's say that it has all the information on it that Hawaii has already produced with the short form. Problem solved, huh?

Actually, no. First of all, Trying to appease kooks who can't take the word and documents vetted and supported by the Republican governor of Hawaii aren't worth trying to convince. You will never convince them. Second, let's say the document shows the name of the practicing physician and maybe a nurse. Birthers will then track these people down (assuming they are still alive) and ask them if they remember the Obama birth. Guess what they will say? No. And you know why? Not because Obama wasn't born in Hawaii, but OB/GYNs and nurses in Labor & Delivery wards deliver dozens of babies a week. You make a 30 year career out of it and that's thousands upon thousands of babies that you've seen. Are you going to remember one specific birth back in 1961? Unless he was a conjoined twin or something equally bizarre, the answer is no. Most people can't remember what they ate for lunch last Wednesday.

But birthers will take the “No” answer as proof that Obama must have been born somewhere else and you will have solved nothing by the release of the long form. Again, you can't appease these people, regardless of what documented evidence slaps them in the face. Politically, it only makes the problem worse. So the White House refuses to take the bait and moves on. Your third answer is therefore the correct one.


Sevenfeet
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:12 pm

Sure. Let's say the old paper long form certificate is back at their house in Chicago in a box somewhere. Let's say that it has all the information on it that Hawaii has already produced with the short form. Problem solved, huh?

Actually, no. First of all, Trying to appease kooks who can't take the word and documents vetted and supported by the Republican governor of Hawaii aren't worth trying to convince. You will never convince them. Second, let's say the document shows the name of the practicing physician and maybe a nurse. Birthers will then track these people down (assuming they are still alive) and ask them if they remember the Obama birth. Guess what they will say? No. And you know why? Not because Obama wasn't born in Hawaii, but OB/GYNs and nurses in Labor & Delivery wards deliver dozens of babies a week. You make a 30 year career out of it and that's thousands upon thousands of babies that you've seen. Are you going to remember one specific birth back in 1961? Unless he was a conjoined twin or something equally bizarre, the answer is no. Most people can't remember what they ate for lunch last Wednesday.

But birthers will take the “No” answer as proof that Obama must have been born somewhere else and you will have solved nothing by the release of the long form. Again, you can't appease these people, regardless of what documented evidence slaps them in the face. Politically, it only makes the problem worse. So the White House refuses to take the bait and moves on. Your third answer is therefore the correct one.


Sevenfeet
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:12 pm

Sure. Let's say the old paper long form certificate is back at their house in Chicago in a box somewhere. Let's say that it has all the information on it that Hawaii has already produced with the short form. Problem solved, huh?

Actually, no. First of all, Trying to appease kooks who can't take the word and documents vetted and supported by the Republican governor of Hawaii aren't worth trying to convince. You will never convince them. Second, let's say the document shows the name of the practicing physician and maybe a nurse. Birthers will then track these people down (assuming they are still alive) and ask them if they remember the Obama birth. Guess what they will say? No. And you know why? Not because Obama wasn't born in Hawaii, but OB/GYNs and nurses in Labor & Delivery wards deliver dozens of babies a week. You make a 30 year career out of it and that's thousands upon thousands of babies that you've seen. Are you going to remember one specific birth back in 1961? Unless he was a conjoined twin or something equally bizarre, the answer is no. Most people can't remember what they ate for lunch last Wednesday.

But birthers will take the “No” answer as proof that Obama must have been born somewhere else and you will have solved nothing by the release of the long form. Again, you can't appease these people, regardless of what documented evidence slaps them in the face. Politically, it only makes the problem worse. So the White House refuses to take the bait and moves on. Your third answer is therefore the correct one.


Sevenfeet
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:12 pm

Sure. Let's say the old paper long form certificate is back at their house in Chicago in a box somewhere. Let's say that it has all the information on it that Hawaii has already produced with the short form. Problem solved, huh?

Actually, no. First of all, Trying to appease kooks who can't take the word and documents vetted and supported by the Republican governor of Hawaii aren't worth trying to convince. You will never convince them. Second, let's say the document shows the name of the practicing physician and maybe a nurse. Birthers will then track these people down (assuming they are still alive) and ask them if they remember the Obama birth. Guess what they will say? No. And you know why? Not because Obama wasn't born in Hawaii, but OB/GYNs and nurses in Labor & Delivery wards deliver dozens of babies a week. You make a 30 year career out of it and that's thousands upon thousands of babies that you've seen. Are you going to remember one specific birth back in 1961? Unless he was a conjoined twin or something equally bizarre, the answer is no. Most people can't remember what they ate for lunch last Wednesday.

But birthers will take the “No” answer as proof that Obama must have been born somewhere else and you will have solved nothing by the release of the long form. Again, you can't appease these people, regardless of what documented evidence slaps them in the face. Politically, it only makes the problem worse. So the White House refuses to take the bait and moves on. Your third answer is therefore the correct one.


Sevenfeet
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:12 pm

Sure. Let's say the old paper long form certificate is back at their house in Chicago in a box somewhere. Let's say that it has all the information on it that Hawaii has already produced with the short form. Problem solved, huh?

Actually, no. First of all, Trying to appease kooks who can't take the word and documents vetted and supported by the Republican governor of Hawaii aren't worth trying to convince. You will never convince them. Second, let's say the document shows the name of the practicing physician and maybe a nurse. Birthers will then track these people down (assuming they are still alive) and ask them if they remember the Obama birth. Guess what they will say? No. And you know why? Not because Obama wasn't born in Hawaii, but OB/GYNs and nurses in Labor & Delivery wards deliver dozens of babies a week. You make a 30 year career out of it and that's thousands upon thousands of babies that you've seen. Are you going to remember one specific birth back in 1961? Unless he was a conjoined twin or something equally bizarre, the answer is no. Most people can't remember what they ate for lunch last Wednesday.

But birthers will take the “No” answer as proof that Obama must have been born somewhere else and you will have solved nothing by the release of the long form. Again, you can't appease these people, regardless of what documented evidence slaps them in the face. Politically, it only makes the problem worse. So the White House refuses to take the bait and moves on. Your third answer is therefore the correct one.


priscianus jr
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:13 pm

Your grasp of jurisprudence is truly breathtaking.


UmmOkay
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:13 pm

SHould he present it to please idiots like you. The birth certificate that he has is the same kind that I got when I lost my original. So does that mean that I am not a citizen either, even though I know I was born at the University of Chicago Hospital in 1982?


webwriter
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:13 pm

Doesn't President Obama have a U.S. passport? Then the federal government must have accepted his proof of citizenship at the time of his application. So what's the big deal now? Just a bunch of malcontents and troublemakers trying to stir up trouble.


aweshocks
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:16 pm

If it's no. 2 or no. 3… then there's nothing he needs to do. And the only reason anyone doubts that he's a U.S. citizen is because his father was from Africa. His mother was an American citizen and he was born in Hawaii. He doesn't have to present a certificate and a library card. But white supremacists and the blacks and ethnics who love them will DEMAND every form of deference from Obama. He's given them more than enough of it and I'm glad he isn't giving into it in this case. Send a detachment of U.S. marines to the congress and tell Boehner, Cantor, or DeMint that they don't enter until they present several forms of ID and proof of residence since the day they were born. Let's see how fast any of them would respond to such a challenge.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:16 pm

He was issued a long form certificate.

He says in his book “Dreams” that he found it.

And Gov. Linda Lingle said they have it on file. Hawaii law prohibits them from releasing the long-form or any information without Obama's approval. He has denied all requests, including spending over a million dollars in lawyer fees to fight numerous court challenges.

That leads to the question of why?

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


JohnC
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:20 am

“African” is not a race because a lot of nationalities are born on the continent of Africa, some of them are Caucasian.

As it turns out, back in the late 1950s and early 1960s, it was actually quite commonplace to use the term “African race” to refer to African-Americans. If you check legal decisions and statutes from that period, plus contracts and documents referred to in those decisions, there are actually numerous examples of that term.

So perhaps you personally may think “African” is not a logical term for a race – and that’s fine – but it is a historical fact that such a term was frequently used at the time President Obama was born.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:20 pm

Nice try. Next time you go home and a burgler is is inside, you can call it moot let him finish too.

He's a liar and a fraud. If he's busted he can go to Gitmo.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


theunrepentantliberal
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:21 pm

He could present every document and piece of paper in the world that has been requested and the 'birthers' would simply call them fake.

He is a busy man and is right to ignore them.


Jasel
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:21 pm

4. he's a U.S citizen, and is ignoring the whack jobs who won't accept regardless of anything he does short of taking them all back in time to actually WITNESS him being born in Hawaii.

The right looks like a bunch of conspiracy freaks all on their own. He's from Kenya, he's a Muslim despite the fact that the right jumped was all over him due to the Christian church he attended for 2 decades, how many fake “Kenyan birth certificates” have been “discovered” and debunked, he's going to set up FEMA concentration camps, he's the anti-Christ, 48 years ago his parents lied about his origin of birth in the hopes that he could become President of the United States, he's going to dissolve the country into socialism and fascism. Somehow (and impossibly) simultaneously. Then he's going to pull the plug on your sick grandma in the hospital. A public option for health care? Expand medicare benefits? Cover the poor and uninsured?? Reminds me of Hitler /sarcasm

Give me a break. The Republican party embarrassed themselves by taking a surplus they inherited from Clinton and turning it into a deficit. The Republican party embarrassed themselves by spending billions on a war they lied about (and Democrats are not without fault here too) to invade a country needlessly which cost thousands of American lives and tens of thousands (at least) of Iraq civilian lives. Not to mention all the millions and millions of dollars for Iraq that just “went missing” that Repubs and the right didn't seem to care about whatsoever. The Republican party tanked our economy and took us into a nosedive that brought us to the brink of economic collapse.

It's been obvious for quite some time that logical explanations tend to fall on deaf ears when it comes to Republicans and Conservatives. Unless of course it's the type of logic they want to hear (pretty much all the nonsense I listed above).


imavettoo
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:22 pm

I've never seen a “long form” copy of my birth certificate. With the short copy I have, I've gotten a US Passport as well as having had a US Military top secret “Q” clearance. I'm not sure thal “long form” certs. actually exist. Ask Dubya for his & he'll tell you they're with his National Guard discharge papers.


resignationsupergirl
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:22 pm

What is it you people do not comprehend about the MAJORITY of US Citizens do not have a Long Form. I do not.. and I have a DL and a passport.. So what are the reasons I couldn't show my Long Form BC? Is it because I am committing Fraud or am I just to prideful..

You may not be a “Birther' but you may as well be…


invirginia
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:24 pm

Proof of citizenship is not equal to being a natural-born citizen.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:24 pm

You cannot possibly have read the decision in the Rhodes case:

(1) The judge (Judge Land) is a U.S. District Court judge in Georgia. Why are you referring to a “judge on the California supreme court” (it would be “Justice” anyway)?

(2) Judge Land specifically said the claim was frivolous. It wasn't made up by a news report. And he clearly warned Orly Taitz not to file any more similarly frivolous claims in that district court, or she will be sanctioned.

(3) Judge Land's decision says NOTHING about a Kenyan Birth Certificate. Rather, he slams Orly Taitz for her silly argument that the Hawaiian certificate of live birth should be “presumed” to be fake.

By the way, Judge Land was appointed to the U.S. District Court by . . . George W. Bush.

It saddens me that you don't bother to get the facts before you post, and then you have nerve to accuse others of not wanting to know the truth.


Nonnie
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:24 pm

Have you ever requested a long form or even a birth certificate from any other elected president? Why not? Could it be that because they happened to be white or didn't have a foreign sounding name that there wasn't a need to ask? That's the stupidity behind this birther crap!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:25 pm

It's not #2.

He said in his book “Dreams” that he found it.

And Gov. Linda Lingle said they have it on file. Hawaii law prohibits them from releasing the long-form or any information without Obama's approval. He has denied all requests, including spending over a million dollars in lawyer fees to fight numerous court challenges.

#3 doesn't make sense to me.

That leaves #1. he's a liar and a fraud.

Possible #4 is the truth on the long-form doesn't fit to the life-story he has told (adopted, different father etc).

Regardless, he was a dual citizen . . .not natural-born. . .and ineligible to be POTUS.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


tuches
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:25 pm

Dear Stormrdr, I follow your writings that respond to other people's writings religiously, so I am keenly aware that you have written this elsewhere before, but I am still so glad you have written it again here.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:26 pm

He says in his book “Dreams” that he found it.

And Gov. Linda Lingle said they have it on file.

Hawaii law prohibits them from releasing the long-form or any information without Obama's approval. He has denied all requests, including spending over a million dollars in lawyer fees to fight numerous court challenges.

That leads to the question of why?

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


resignationsupergirl
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:26 pm

Show us Your White Sheet and stop hiding behind the Long Form BC Myth.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:26 pm

better yet, ask Dan Rather.


Michael
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:28 pm

As often as I have been asked if Camille is a man or a woman, my answer has never changed: Yes! Why does anyone pay any attention to her?!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:29 pm

None of these are particularly intelligent. Are the other logical explanations for the birther movement?

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Nice sentence fragment, genius. haha


IHATEIDIOTS
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:30 pm

Your an idiot. So you are saying that the State of Hawaii is involved in a conspiracy to smuggle a man into the United States 48 years ago???


mark34
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:30 pm

“there were ambiguities about Obama’s birth certificate that have never been satisfactorily resolved.”

WHAT??

HAWAII ISNT A STATE?

These people are trapped in a permanent sate of cognitive dissidence.


dsjulian
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:30 pm

I don't know what country's passport you are holding invirginia, but my US passport indicates my city and state of birth — and I had to provide a certified copy of my birth certificate to get that passport.


mantis
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:31 pm

That said, the only three explanations I can see for why Obama won't present his long-form birth cert. are:

Actually, you neglected to mention the actual reason. He is a US citizen, born in Hawaii, and that state no longer issues long-form certificates. They issue COLBs. Obama has released his.

By the way, yes you are a birther, dumbass.


genji11
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:31 pm

Please, are you really trying to say that McCain with his staff of thousands, hundreds of millions of dollars and behind the scenes access to government agencies couldn’t do what Oirly and her merry band pulled off with a couple of laptops at the corner Starbucks. It is a bunch of crap. If there was any truth to it at all we would have heard about it on Nov. 1st on the front of every newspaper in the country. McCain would have broken the story and he would now be the POTUS.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:36 pm

He kept quiet because he wasn't natural-born either.


filecabinet
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:36 pm

Paglia is a borderline nutter. Nutter because she is a climate change skeptic and now has thrown her lot in with the birthers too. But borderline because she's smart enough to hedge her bets and not be completely irrational. She mixes sensible statements with nonsensical ones.


jrob225
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:36 pm

No he's more of an idiot than that. He's saying that the long form certificate exists in Hawaii (which basically proves that Obama is a natural born citizen) BUT Obama doesn't want it released for the fear of ?????


bigrcube
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:37 pm

AND “Hawaii” was a state in the U.S. in 1961 WHEN Obama was born there.


mark34
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:37 pm

EVERY SINGLE MEMBER OF STATE AND FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IS SUBJECTED TO A RIGOROUS BACKGROUND CHECK.

These “birthers” are just insulting to all that serve this county.

To even entertain the idea that a Kenyan “sneak” or “slide” into the Whitehouse is TREASON.

As an employee of the DoD I can say I'VE SEEN MORE DOCUMENTATION ON INDIVIDUALS THAN INDIVIDUAL THEMSELVES HAVE.

Stop with this pathetic dribble.
These people are so clueless about the inter-workings of their own county.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:38 pm

No white sheet needed. I dislike all scummy liars and frauds like Obama. . .and you too. I don't care what color you are. You're a POS. Happy now?


theonlyseven
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:38 pm

Remember when the birthers and Regressives insisted that the proof Obama was not a US citizen was because he traveled to Pakistan at a time there was travel ban on Americans going there? To them that was absolute proof. Why don’t they make that case any more? Oh, that’s right, turned out none of it was true. There never was a travel ban. And that pretty much sums up the problems for the birthers. Someone out there played them for chumps, fed them a plate of bologna and they gobbled it up like it was filet mignon. They are still doing it.


beanniebabyjeebus
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:39 pm

Being able to type is not proof of owning a working brain, either. Next!?


alexandra421
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:41 pm

everyone working at FOX NEWS IS WHITE. the WHITE STATION making AMERICA PROUD.


dmbraddy
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:41 pm

If, as Camille Paglia claims, she has “been following this closely from the start” yet still maintains “there are legitimate questions” about President Obama's birth record then one must question either her truthfulness or her sanity. Aside from the fact that all the relevant pubic officials and records in Hawaii show that Obama was born there, two local newspapers printed birth announcements for Barack Hussein Obama. If Paglia has followed the story then she knows this. So, regarding those “legitimate questions,” either she is deliberating lying or she believes there is a conspiracy going back to August 4, 1961 that put false birth announcements for Barack Obama in Hawaiian newspapers so that when he became President of the United States 49 years later there would be proof of his being a natural born citizen. If it's the latter then Ms. Paglia is, along with the rest of the birthers, ready for the funny farm.


gotborked
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:42 pm

I see…even talking about it makes one a “birther”. got it. No wonder the MSM is afraid of investigating anything that has to do with this administration.


paolabutton
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:44 pm

Paglia's loves publicity. As a liberal who voted for Obama (as she'll gladly tell you), she gets a lot of attention making these kind of statements.


mantis
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:46 pm

Oh, they still make that claim. They don't care if all their claims are demonstrably false. The strategy is to repeat the lies as often and in as many places as possible.


Guest
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:47 am

No, he believes it because it is easier for him to believe in a broad conspiracy maintained since Obama’s birth than it is for him to believe that Barack Obama is the legitimate, elected President of the United States.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:47 pm

Thx to FOX for breaking the ACORN scandal!

Yeah FOX!!! Especially Glenn Beck!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Nonnie
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:47 pm

Name me one other elected president that had to produce a birth certificate to masses. ZERO! Only because they were white and didn't have a foreign sounding name and that's the main issue behind the birther movement crap.


MrJM
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:47 pm

Paglia = Ignore

This has been the case for at least 15 years…

– MrJM


theonlyseven
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:49 pm

To say nothing of the Clintons. The most ruthless politicians ever to grace the political stage, with tons of connections inside not only the US government but other nations as well. They had no problem leaking the picture of Obama in the “native” garb. Yet somehow, they never hit upon the Kenyan birth story.


mantis
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:49 pm

Asking stupid birther questions that have been answered countless times in every damned forum imaginable makes you a birther. You know your question is bullshit and ask it anyway. Birther.


blaspheme
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:49 pm

Paglia's jumped the shark.


Name
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:51 pm

If the Governor of Hawaii, and the head of the Hawaii HHS repeatedly say Obama was born there, and that they personally certify his citizenship, what ambiguities are left?

Precisely what are these “questions about the documentation of Obama's birth certificate” that are not addressed my the repeated, unequivocal statements by the state of Hawaii?

This was a very, very big mistake, Pags. You will never live this down, not ever, they'll be writing it in your eulogy. I hope it was worth it.


ijkmno
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:51 pm

If Barack Obama had been born outside the United States – oh, let's just say in the Panama Canal Zone, which is where John McCain was born, can you imagine the hysteria, not to mention the litigation that would be ongoing now?


johndoe1950
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:53 pm

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but didnt Mr. Obama run on a platform of getting us out of the wars and transparency? Haha, what a joke.


beanniebabyjeebus
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:53 pm

So, it has to be the 'natural-born' lie does it. So let's see, you don't know what the Constitution says but you'll be damned if you'll ever admit that the U.S. has evolved as a country in the 233 years since it's founding–thus meaning that whatever you “think” the Constitution says, you'll stick w/ it as 'interpreted'?? by who?? You?? Don't think so, I'm sensing from your ranting here that no one in your immediate family has evolved in all those years, either. Sorry if that seems harsh, but really,.. how much time a day do you spend w/ things like this that are never going anywhere? NOwhere!! and for good reason!!


theonlyseven
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:53 pm

See, that’s the thing the birthers will never admit to, but lets be realistic. Every charge they have tossed at Obama has not stuck mainly because the charges are totally without merit and are not based on facts. But these clowns know, its better to make crazy accusations that are obviously not true than to admit the real reason they don’t like Obama.


sngfx
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:54 pm

captainsteve: Prove to us you aren't an ignorant, racist ideologue! I want proof! Until I see proof, I am not convinced!


beanniebabyjeebus
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:56 pm

Thanks for the first-hand insight! i've been happily ignoring her for years, she's kind of like an over-educated Ann Coulter, you hear what she says but you know she doesn't believe a word of her own arguments, but only really loves to hear herself draw conclusions from them.


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:57 pm

Another reason Obama sucks:
http://axisoflogic.com/artman/publish/Article_5…


ronrodriguez
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 7:59 pm

Ms. Paglia's belief system is correct only in its attacks on Foucault, Derrida and the post-modernist, neo-Marxist movement.


theonlyseven
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:01 pm

TRANSLATION: There are too many Reality Based World People here using facts to make me look foolish. I need to change the topic to something totaly unrelated to what the thread is about. It's all I have.


ronrodriguez
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:03 pm

The birthers, et al., are pre-modernists; when a belief (or a conviction) meets a fact, the belief or conviction wins. Witness the debate over the geocentric vs. heliocentric theories of the solar system (then believed to be the universe). Ditto evolution, the expanding universe, Einstein's relativity, etc. et-plucking-cetera.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:10 pm

Take your meds, cap'n, and put the tinfoil back on your head.


mark34
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:13 pm

Ahh dreams!

You REALLY didn't think the tradition of the institution would be turned on its head when Barry entered the Whitehouse did you?

Those of us that have been following politics for decades know better.
There will ALWAYS be discrepancy between the president-elect and the president.


eaddabaggasaltedratdiks
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:13 pm

To her however slippery sanity-credit, let's give a full quote from Pag's April comments
on Salon.com:

“Conservatives seem deliriously drunk with their cartoon picture of Obama, to whom is glibly attributed every pathology in the book. Yes, there were ambiguities about Obama's birth certificate that have never been satisfactorily resolved. And the embargo on Obama's educational records remains troubling.”-

(yet here it comes..):

“But I am still waiting for hard evidence about the host of other charges that are continually being hammered against him — from his alleged fidelity to the crypto-tactics of Chicago leftist Saul Alinsky to the questions raised by right-wingers about the production of Obama's two memoirs.”-

(and here it is..):

“Out of respect for the presidency, conservatives need to put up or shut up about these issues.”

so, ok– at least back in April, she was still sane.


johnbohl
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:14 pm

It may not be racism, but it's at least xenophobia.


PHM1949
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:14 pm

The Birthers always revert to the “questions” surrounding President Obama's birth certificate, but never actually state what those questions are. They can't…all questions (stupid though there were) have been answered.

Camille is an Ann Coulter wannabe…she'll say anything to get attention, something she hasn't had in awhile.

Seems to me, while I ardently disagree with most of her ideas, Kathryn Parker is the sole sane Republican in America.


greybees
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:19 pm

One can only hope that Adam is under the age of reason.


Bronzeman
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:22 pm

Camille Paglia fancies herself as a “libertarian”, so she must often say things that appeal to that base which is a large part of the “birther, deather, czarer, conspiracy” wacko movement…. I joined the libertarians at one point because I believed (wrongly) that they held the intellectual high ground on the issues. Boy, was I wrong.


tristram
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:23 pm

Who was Camille Paglia??


ricmarc
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:23 pm

hey camille, NO THEY DON'T. they have no point they have never had a point and to claim they do makes you pointless. camille, you have invalidated yourself. you no longer matter anymore, neither does anyone else who says these obvious racist nut jobs have a point.

i think she said this just so there would be a story and she could get a link on drudge.

she is no longer relevant


ricmarc
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:25 pm

a woman that thinks too highly of herself and her theories. one episode of 60 minutes decades ago and this feminist studies person thinks she is the queen.


theonlyseven
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:27 pm

Lets see. Obama’s proof that he was born in the US is the birth certificate that the state of Hawaii (as well as its Republican governor) have testified as being true. Two birth announcements in local paper stating he was born in Hawaii. What do the birthers have? A document that is such an obvious fake it clearly was created to see if they would fall for it (and fall for it they did) and an AOL poll. Yes, that’s right. Evidence that Obama was not born in the US rests on an on line poll from an ISP hardly anyone uses any more. Brilliant.


obxartist
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:30 pm

Paglia is an attention junkie, not far removed from the likes of Ann Coulter.


Bluedog Alaska
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:30 pm

I can think of good reasons why he hasn't produced it. First of all, why should he give in to a bunch of nutcases and put himself on the defensive? Why on earth would he legitimize something so blatantly idiotic and farcical? Clearly these people have nothing better to do with their lives, so why not ignore them and let them shriek themselves silly? I can't stand Sarah Palin, but I don't think she should produce her son's birth certificate either, even though she also could stop all of the hoorah from Trig Truthers if she did.

Secondly, even if the president did go to court or produce a long form or some proof other than what's been verified NUMEROUS TIMES already, does anyone actually believe that this would shut people up? No, because they don't want truth. We'd just hear about forgeries or bribed officials or whatever conspiracy they can dream up. They simply want an excuse for disparaging a president they don't like and will never accept, no matter what he does.

Exhibit A: Orly Taitz. A judge just threw out her case and pointed out how idiotic she is. Now she's even more crazed.

If there's anybody worse than birthers, though, it's people like Paglia, Lou Dobbs, and the congressmen who keep this sham going by lending it the tattered shreds of their own authority. They are shameless and despicable.


madchemist
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:32 pm

Yes, science = BAD SCARY MEAN!!

I say bring on more speculation without evidence that go against published data. Just like the birthers… all speculation with fraudulent data to back it up. (referring to the “Kenyan birth certificate that proved to be a fake)


madchemist
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:32 pm

Yes, science = BAD SCARY MEAN!!

I say bring on more speculation without evidence that go against published data. Just like the birthers… all speculation with fraudulent data to back it up. (referring to the “Kenyan birth certificate that proved to be a fake)


Bluedog Alaska
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:33 pm

I can think of good reasons why he hasn't produced it. First of all, why should he give in to a bunch of nutcases and put himself on the defensive? Why on earth would he legitimize something so blatantly idiotic and farcical? Clearly these people have nothing better to do with their lives, so why not ignore them and let them shriek themselves silly? I can't stand Sarah Palin, but I don't think she should produce her son's birth certificate either, even though she also could stop all of the hoorah from Trig Truthers if she did.

Secondly, even if the president did go to court or produce a long form or some proof other than what's been verified NUMEROUS TIMES already, does anyone actually believe that this would shut people up? No, because they don't want truth. We'd just hear about forgeries or bribed officials or whatever conspiracy they can dream up. They simply want an excuse for disparaging a president they don't like and will never accept, no matter what he does.

Exhibit A: Orly Taitz. A judge just threw out her case and pointed out how idiotic she is. Now she's even more crazed.

If there's anybody worse than birthers, though, it's people like Paglia, Lou Dobbs, and the congressmen who keep this sham going by lending it the tattered shreds of their own authority. They are shameless and despicable.


Bluedog Alaska
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:33 pm

I can think of good reasons why he hasn't produced it. First of all, why should he give in to a bunch of nutcases and put himself on the defensive? Why on earth would he legitimize something so blatantly idiotic and farcical? Clearly these people have nothing better to do with their lives, so why not ignore them and let them shriek themselves silly? I can't stand Sarah Palin, but I don't think she should produce her son's birth certificate either, even though she also could stop all of the hoorah from Trig Truthers if she did.

Secondly, even if the president did go to court or produce a long form or some proof other than what's been verified NUMEROUS TIMES already, does anyone actually believe that this would shut people up? No, because they don't want truth. We'd just hear about forgeries or bribed officials or whatever conspiracy they can dream up. They simply want an excuse for disparaging a president they don't like and will never accept, no matter what he does.

Exhibit A: Orly Taitz. A judge just threw out her case and pointed out how idiotic she is. Now she's even more crazed.

If there's anybody worse than birthers, though, it's people like Paglia, Lou Dobbs, and the congressmen who keep this sham going by lending it the tattered shreds of their own authority. They are shameless and despicable.


johnva
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:35 pm

Wow, Camille Paglia! You just made two of the dumbest statements I have ever heard and that is saying something! The people who are questioning Obama's birth records are not basing their belief on anything logical or rational. They are basing it on the idea that of course he can't be legitimate and he must be removed from office by any means necessary.

The part about legitimate questions is just as rediculous. His birth certificate that he has released is a legal document that is endorced by our State Department, the Hawaii Department of Health and personally signed off on by the Republican Governor of Hawaii. I don't have the original of my Birth Certificate because my mom lost it and my wife's was lost in a fire; so does that mean that my documentation that I have from Rhode Island or my wife's from Florida is not valid? You better take our passports away and while you are at it you'll have to take away our daughter that we adopted from Colombia using said reissued birth certificates & passports as part of our documentation.


jombi
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:35 pm

Paglia is so passe, in fact I thought she had died years ago. And that photo doesn't do much to dispel the notion.


sg416
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:36 pm

Talk about an abortion producing a still birth!!


Lynn Dee
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:36 pm

I see Camille Paglia's quest — for attention so satisfying she'll never have to seek attention again — continues.


joeinmaryland
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:38 pm

It's like a man with his eyes shut so tight, they're bleeding saying “What sun? I don't see any sun. Where's the proof? If there's a sun in the sky, why won't it ever show itself.”


dino goposaur
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:40 pm

never heard of her


moxo
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:46 pm

Just call the RNC and ask to be put through to someone who can help you get a Swiss birth certificate, so you can legally open up a secret Swiss bank account to hide your income.

Then keep calling back.

The number is: Comment Line & General Information: 202.863.8790


moredegreesthanyou
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:46 pm

uhm, no. her attacks on post-modernism are based on laughable neo-classic junk.
but glad you brought it up.
.


Laura Harrison McBride
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:48 pm

Paglia is a graduate of Binghamton University, formerly Harpur College, once a very respectable institution of higher learning. I was there at the same time she was, and frankly, I never noticed her burning up the academic racetrack. Later on, I was aware that she had become a media darling after writing about sex, but then, Sherry Hite had blazed some of that ground for her, along with a dozen others who didn't grandstand about it and were not then, and are not now, as confused. Paglia is also notorious for singing both liberal and conservative tunes, all of them subordinated to her major GLBT theme. But I have to wonder, with this affinity for Drudge and after hearing her make imbecilic statements like these, if she has a gene that kicked in after she turned 60 that turned off everything she learned at Harpur, because she is an embarrassment to higher education at this point.


Aaror
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:49 pm

AOL, isn't that the service created for people too dumb to use the internet?
I hear that as internet programs get easier, their customer base gene pool gets shallower…


ulirose
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:50 pm

Too bad, I always respected her point of view. Now add her to the long list of village idiots.


Annie
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:51 pm

So sad. Why does anyone put her in front a microphone anymore? She hasn't had a cogent or rational thought in 20 years.


Aaror
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:53 pm

OK, lets say for giggles that Obama was born in Kenya, was his mother a US citizen? If she was, Obama is a natural citizen, and therefore qualified to be president, but lets go a step further.
Among the ways to be a natural citizen of the United States:
Being found in the US under the age of 5, unless proven to not be a US citizen by the time you are 21. Obama met the in the US under 5 test (on record), so the question is, did the birthers prove he was not born in the US or to a US citizen before he was 21 years of age? So go build your time machine, cause you are SOL!!!


kimi_is_pissed
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:54 pm

I'm sure that the Birthers wish they could welcome her into the fold, but that whole lesbian thing just won't let them. Get a clue Camille. I used to respect you.


Jason_M
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:55 pm

B***h. Anything for attention. And BTW, the Sopranos is not a portrait of Italian-Americans at all. It is a portrait of one Italian-American NJ crime family.


Mark Gottschalk
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:56 am

Standing here means the issue had NO MERIT and would not be worth the court’s time to debate. Thomas could not influence the needed number of judges to consider this an important issue. So it was left for the lower courts who have, IN EVERY CASE, ruled the petitions by such legal scholars as Mr. Alan Keyes and Ms Orly Taitz as not only without merit but, now, so frivolous cases that Ms Taitz is in legal jeopardy for not only wasting the court’s time but her insulting the court!!!


Jason_M
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:57 pm

Aww, poor baby.


Richter
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:57 pm

Camille Paglia is a trend setter — as this piece reminds us, she was one of the very first to blend right wing politics with obvious mental illness. Now that its the norm among Republicans, we sometimes forget that Camille was a psychotic reactionary long before that became as popular as it is today.


Artgurrl
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 8:58 pm

Camille Paglia has never been logical or rational, so why would anyone expect her to start now? The irony of her stance is that on one hand she hates victim politics but in this case she's siding with a group of know nothings who see themselves as victims. I rest my case.


mitzymoon
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:02 pm

Camille's descent into insanity continues. She used to be a hero of mine, and it's been sad over the years to see her reasoning deteriorate. Like Bobby Fisher, she seems doomed.


doubledave27
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:02 pm

Ok, Cam, if you're gonna defend the birthers you gotta post yours online. Where is it and how can we accept it without a forensic examination?


Mark Gottschalk
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:03 am

Interesting, BUT: you do not have to be Swiss by birth to have a Swiss Account (I used to work in Switzerland!!!)


sallyjohnston
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:04 pm

I am astounded by her ignorance. She has never had any credibility with me and now she has sunk even lower than before. I hope she goes away.


sgmorr
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:05 pm

Agreed about the photo!


Elderlady
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:05 pm

She probably DOES have a point.
Think about it.

For over 200 years, this country has done all in its power to hold non-white people back.
First, we enslaved them.
Then we segregated them.
Then we denied the (a) good paying jobs. (b) decent housing. (c) the vote. (d) decent schools and a good education.

So….. maybe Obama was born else where — in another country. Heck, maybe he was educated elsewhere. Maybe he got his first job — elsewhere. Maybe he didn't even live in that nice neighborhood in Chicago. Maybe he even served in the Senate of the some other country…… elsewhere.

Would have been hard as hell for him to achieve all that in this country.

But then….. nobody has shown me anything to disprove all that.

So….. maybe he was born here, was educated here, served in the United States Senate…. and took all that and achieved the Presidency of the United States.

Ok…… my tongue is out of my cheek. (Somewhat.)


Sonya
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:09 pm

Why do these idiots continue to ignore the fact that his mom was an American citizen? Her child is American.


Tom
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:15 pm

A classic shit-wit. She's another Anne Coulter, and always has been. Paglia's writing has always been about “shock” for shock's sake. She's latched onto this issue because it guarantee's this 90's era has-been a couple of inches worth of ink and a few hundred clicks on some web pages. If we're not careful, interest in this non-person's defense of this non-issue will bring her back into the media spotlight again, and no one wants that.


pericles21
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:16 pm

What is the prolem? Even the Supreme Court declared this a non-issue…AND THE “BIRTH” ISSUE WAS PALCED ON THE SCOTUS DOCKET BY..NON OTHER THAN….CLARENCE “WHO AM I” THOMAS!. Enough said.


davewtf
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:16 pm

It does not matter the citizenship of the parents. All that is important is that he was born in the US.


razmatazz
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:17 pm

Paglia is nut job. She started her career as morally ambiguous provocateur with a loose grasp of reality and has gradually descended into complete lunacy. Why anyone would give her a platform from which to spout her gibberish is beyond me. And why anyone would take her seriously is more important question. And why I am wasting my time commenting on her brings into question my own lack of perspective. ok… back to creating something useful….


larce
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:21 pm

Camille emerges every five years or so much like locusts with the certainty that she will be even more crazy in her commentary than the last time. I rather like her. Weirdness is a virtue.


DaveStPete
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:22 pm

Camille Paglia did not weather the effects of aging well. She has become a babbling incoherent mess on par with Bill O'Reily


ANTONIO567
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:22 pm

THERE'S FEE SPEECH, THERE'S RATIONAL DEBATE, THERE'S YELLING “FIRE” in a crowded theater, and there's decrepit, sleazy, tacky Camille. Take your pick. George Bush was born in the US and wrecked the country. Attacking Obama's supposed birth place and ignoring his policies is classic right-wing changing-the-subject. If the right wing doesn't like something they immediately start their ad hominem attacks. I'm not attacking Camille, I'm saying that if you can't have a rational debate you should shut up. If you don't, you should be taken off the media. The only reason people can get away with this nonsense is that schools don't teach THESIS (pro)ANTITHESIS (con) AND SYNTHESIS (the truth having elements of both). Every high school student should be able to handle these Hegelian ideas–they make for rational adults. Instead we have fat, hamburger-eating coupons-chasing adults who have gone through an irrational education system and will believe anything.


Allan Self
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:27 pm

Who cares what she thinks? Why does her opinion have any value whatever?


mike
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:30 pm

Hey Paglia is sometimes interesting and thought provoking. Give her credit. But she is also obviously nutters, and the two things don't exclude each other.

What is pernicious about this comment, and it does mean that I lose all respect for her, is the way in which she uses the “legitimate questions” argument. Well duh. OF COURSE there are legitimate questions, that's not the problem. The question is whether there have been legitimate or reasonable responses to those questions, and if she isn't aware that there have been, it's clear that she's not just playing dumb, she's playing vicious.

As for racism… again, duh. “Democrat” explains opposition to Clinton. To get to the level of vitriol and wing nuttery Obama gets, you have to have another explanation, and there is only one, and if you say you don't know and you are not sure and that's not the whole story and blah blah blah, then look inside your heart because you are lying to yourself and to everyone else.

Everything that goes beyond Clinton hatred (and there is plenty) is about the racism. Some Americans just can't accept a Black man as President. The election sent them into crazy zone.

Those folks are I believe a dying breed. Their time will pass.


mike
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:30 pm

Hey Paglia is sometimes interesting and thought provoking. Give her credit. But she is also obviously nutters, and the two things don't exclude each other.

What is pernicious about this comment, and it does mean that I lose all respect for her, is the way in which she uses the “legitimate questions” argument. Well duh. OF COURSE there are legitimate questions, that's not the problem. The question is whether there have been legitimate or reasonable responses to those questions, and if she isn't aware that there have been, it's clear that she's not just playing dumb, she's playing vicious.

As for racism… again, duh. “Democrat” explains opposition to Clinton. To get to the level of vitriol and wing nuttery Obama gets, you have to have another explanation, and there is only one, and if you say you don't know and you are not sure and that's not the whole story and blah blah blah, then look inside your heart because you are lying to yourself and to everyone else.

Everything that goes beyond Clinton hatred (and there is plenty) is about the racism. Some Americans just can't accept a Black man as President. The election sent them into crazy zone.

Those folks are I believe a dying breed. Their time will pass.


Kit
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:30 pm

The governor of a state has certified a birth certificate for his state. He has personally examinted the records and confirms they are true. That should be the final word.

People move, documents get lost. Lots of people no longer have the copy of the birth certificate their parents brought home from the hospital. That doesn't matter, the record with the state matters.

The official records of the state are the final word. If Camilia or Lou Dobbs or any one else won't accept the word of a governor, then no piece of paper will ever satisfy them.

She has never spelled out why she can't accept the governor of Hawaii as the final word.


Kit
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:30 pm

The governor of a state has certified a birth certificate for his state. He has personally examinted the records and confirms they are true. That should be the final word.

People move, documents get lost. Lots of people no longer have the copy of the birth certificate their parents brought home from the hospital. That doesn't matter, the record with the state matters.

The official records of the state are the final word. If Camilia or Lou Dobbs or any one else won't accept the word of a governor, then no piece of paper will ever satisfy them.

She has never spelled out why she can't accept the governor of Hawaii as the final word.


realobjectivity
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:35 pm

The “birther” issue is a fundraising opportunity that the GOP can't put aside until they have wrung it dry. Exploiting the opportunity requires careful tactical maneuvering based on solid GOP congressional districts.

To the GOP politicians brave enough to capitalize on the “birther” claims, mostly those in deep red GOP districts with no chance of contest from a Democrat, unhinged nutcase “birthers” offer money to the GOP/RNC on condition that they show support for the “birther” conspiracy. Somewhere in the unscrupulous politicians DNA is that trait that makes it impossible for them to turn down money, especially the kind that doesn't require them to deliver any results.

When you consider the dollar opportunity, it would be foolish for any deep red district unethical GOP politician to refuse the money. There may be broad indirect consequences, that might have to get cleaned up later, but the RNC can cash in and at worse, may have to replace one GOP politician with another GOP politician if their calculus blows up in that district.

Any GOP constituent who reveals their “birther” fervor is saying to an opportunistic GOP politician or the RNC – hey I'm an unhinged lunatic that would be willing to separate from some of my hard earned cash to attack the POTUS with this outlandish claim. I'd even be willing to fund a campaign to discredit the POTUS with this outlandish claim – so come get my money and promise to bring Obama down.

So dutifully, the GOP/RNC goes about separating the unhinged lunatic from whatever money they can shake loose. Carefully placing only GOP politicians unlikely to be harmed near the hue and cry with their hands out.

When the “birther” conspiracy breathes it's last breaths at the feet of a few more court rulings, the politicians will look blithely to those whose money they took and sigh while saying, “well, we gave it a shot”.

The GOP/RNC strategy is capitalize on hate, stir things up until they're white hot, and then calculate how to get close to the fire without getting burned.

So any of these ridiculous anti-Obama claims that are seemingly from outer space, that play like red meat to the base, indeed hurt Obama a bit, provide news cycle fodder and send most rational level headed Americans running for the medicine cabinet, but really they're cash machines for the GOP/RNC


Jennifer
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:38 pm

johndoe1950: I'm' only too happy to correct you. The President wanted out of Iraq, but has always stated that Afghanistan required greater attention and an increased presence. This is well documented.


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:38 pm

Yes, Monsanto = BAD SCARY MEAN!!

You want them in control of food and agriculture policy, then?


Ellid
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:39 am

A certified copy? I had to produce the actual certificate, and so did everyone else I know.

Guess what? The “certification of birth” I received from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania was all they would take! How did you get off so easy?


hoelscherb
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:40 pm

Look, Obama has been fishy on this from the start. If there is nothing there, show us the records and the documents. The truth is the best defense against the “birthers” I would be able to show a certified birth certificate if I were asked. My daughter can't even play in a softball tournament without a certified certificate. He is acting guilty, that is why people are suspicious.


janetcamp
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:40 pm

Those folks are I believe a dying breed. Their time will pass.

Not fast enough!


lousgirl84
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:43 pm

Great post and right on the money


janetcamp
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:44 pm

This is all nonsense about “certified”. As mentioned above, the Governor of Hawaii has said that the OFFICIAL birth certificate is on file. End of story. In what way is the President “acting guilty” as you put it? The birth certificate is available online; are you expecting him to come and knock on your door to assuage your irrational fears?


janetcamp
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:46 pm

She was pretty much the same years ago when I quit reading her.


Ellid
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:47 am

Oh, BTW – you just proved by your own words that you were not friends with Dr. King. He didn’t use “Commie” to insult people, and in fact was friends and allies with quite a few Marxists and pacifists like Bayard Rustin and the owners of the Highlander Folk School.

Of course, if you’d just produce a copy of a photograph of yourself with Dr. King or any member of his family….


Voncille
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:50 pm

Gosh, I had no idea Joan Walsh had such vile people working for her. I will not subscribe to this crap.


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:51 pm

For all the talk about how 'nutty' and 'racist' the 'birthers' are, everyone's forgetting that B.O. has had a TRUTHER and rabid racist in his cabinet–Van Jones:

http://www.quoterelish.com/person/100621/1/Van-…


liberalrapturedotcom
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:51 pm

It's not the end of the story until the records the gov. saw are released. Why is this so hard for people to understand. It is odd that we've only ever seen the abstract. And no, I'm not a “birther” I fully believe Obama was born in Hawaii. Yet – he won't cough up the one document that would settle the issue: the long form birth certificate. He could request it from hawaii and that would be that.

Paglia is not “nutters” she's intellectually consistent which is often viewed as “nuts” by Obama apologists.


Max_1
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:52 pm

Dear Camille Paglia,
Am I close?

Always FEAR the Socialist/Commie/Fascist/Muslim/Pinko Black man…
… ALWAYS! He may be a Kenyan who was raised in a Madrassa and who hates white people.


Max_1
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:53 pm

I will not give credit to people who argue that one plus one does NOT equal two.


Name
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:55 pm

These document empiricists are the same hypocrites who wouldn't stop whining until Dan Rather got fired for asking where Dubya's National Guard service proof was (and no I'm not defending Rather's shoddy journalism then). Knuckleheads.


katty65
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 9:58 pm

You don't have to be a racist to play to your racial biases. There are so many people who don't even understand their racial biases. They are masked with other things, like he is not American, he is a socialist, etc. Just because you have a black friend or a black president doesn't mean that you don't have strong racial biases.


NewYorker6699
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:00 pm

That's foolishness. Where were the arguments about the birth certificates of all the other Presidents? Ooops. Forgot. They weren't Black men with “funny” names.


OverHer
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:00 pm

Paglia who? Flashback to the 90s! Is this idiot still around, clogging the airwaves with her predictably contrarian viewpoints?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:01 am

I don’t support the birther movement, but I have seen the birth certificate that has circulated, the so called short form. It is missing names of attending nurses, etc. There are spaces, but no names anywhere on the form. Is this normal for the short form?


NewYorker6699
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:01 pm

Why don't they stop? The man's mother was an American woman, born in Kansas. That makes him a native-born American, by settled law, endorsed by the Supreme Court on numerous occasions. It doesn't matter WHERE he was born, or that his father was Kenyan. He IS an American, and legitimately the President of the United States, elected by a majority of the voters, and the Electoral College. END OF STORY!!!
Move on! He won! Get over it!!


katty65
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:01 pm

White people who talk about minorities being racist is always a nutty position. Whites have been consciously and subconsciously practiced racism for years! White people tend to call anybody other than whites who are proud of their heritage racist. Get real!!!!


katty65
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:01 pm

White people who talk about minorities being racist is always a nutty position. Whites have been consciously and subconsciously practiced racism for years! White people tend to call anybody other than whites who are proud of their heritage racist. Get real!!!!


Name
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:03 pm

He has provided all legal documents required (the COLB has a state watermark, that certifies that it is certified). He's been doing so since the 1987 DOJ I9 laws have been in effect (so have I, and so have you, if you've changed jobs since then.).

A “certified certificate” (whatever that is) may be required to play softball but you can't create a new standard for one kid than for others just because you don't like the player, which is what the birthers want. The Gov of Hawai'i is a Republican and a close friend and booster of Sarah Palin (did you know that?). Gov Lingle actively campaigned for Gov Palin (and was heavily criticized in Democratic Hawai'i for missing a lot of work to campaign for Palin), and Gov Lingle was the only Gov to refuse to meet with Pres-elect Obama when he met with the Governors in DC before the inauguration. And she guarantees the authenticity of his certificate of birth. Lingle is one of you, and still you refuse the truth.

Yes, there is something that stinks, and it's this nutty fixation with a racist lie that the most popularly elected President since Ronald Reagan is not a legit President. Get over it, you lost the election, big time. Now go and complain about President Obama for legitimate reasons, not this nutty birther fantasy.

Hate him if you will, just call him “Mr President”.


NewYorker6699
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:05 pm

To answer your questions, legitimate ones all, you'd have to ask Matt Drudge, himself a right-wing hatemonger and spinner of deception and untruth. You'll never get to the bottom of it. Actually, the truth is self-evident.


NewYorker6699
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:05 pm

Why don't they stop? The man's mother was an American woman, born in Kansas. That makes him a native-born American, by settled law, endorsed by the Supreme Court on numerous occasions. It doesn't matter WHERE he was born, or that his father was Kenyan. He IS an American, and legitimately the President of the United States, elected by a majority of the voters, and the Electoral College. END OF STORY!!!
Move on! He won! Get over it!!


kevdan
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:06 pm

Can Paglia name the documents associated with a live US birth and get them correct the first time? Can Rupert Murdock, Rush Limbaugh, Matt Drudge, mAnn Coulter name the documents associated with a live US birth and get them correct the first time? Murdoch-British citizen. Limbaugh-divorced three times, no children. Drudge and Coulter-gay, no children.

I have a copy of my child's long form. I have taken it two places: the Social Security Administration office and a middle school. I was told clearly at both places the long form is NOT legal proof of identity. For Lou Dobbs and anyone else yelling about it, Lou Dobbs is FULL OF CRAP. There is one or two specific uses for the long form. By now, the Obamas should not even have the long form in their possession. I have copies of my child's long form out of an abundance of caution. I am not going to reveal how the long form is used. I respect Republicans' right to make fools out of themselves.

The birth certificate Obama has released is the first and only document that is proof of US live birth. The birth certificate lists ONLY THE FATHER'S COUNTRY OF ORIGIN and nothing else about the father.


davewtf
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:12 pm

Unless you decided to preach to the choir, you are mistaking me for a birther. I voted for Obama. I am simply stating that, unless you can point out to me which Supreme Court case shows that a person born of an American, but born outside of America, is still an American, then you are incorrect.

All that it takes to be a naturally born American citizen is being born in America. Does not matter if both of our parents are illegal aliens. I don't care what Obama's father's nationality was. Because Obama was born in Hawaii, he is an American.


Max_1
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:22 pm

.

Dear hoelscherb,
What's a moron?

.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:22 pm

The “original” on file with the State of Hawaii is not Obama's to “cough up.” If YOU were born in Hawaii, the State would not release to YOU, even if you begged for it, a copy of your original birth certificate. Why not? Simple. The State of Hawaii has computerized the records, and provides ONLY the Certificate of Live Birth. It is all anyone gets now.

And if the State of Hawaii were to make an exception for Barack Obama? You nutjobs would say, “Well, the State doesn't provide the original for anyone else, so the fact that the State released Obama's means (a) it is fake and (b) the State is part of the conspiracy.” You will never be satisfied. Just admit it.


Adam
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:23 pm

So, you also blame white ENVIRONMENTALISTS for pollution, and think it was American Zionists (not Islamic radicals) who murdered 3000 people on 9/11?


Janet Ramos
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:25 pm

There was a time in my life that i actually admired Ms Pagila would read her stuff and such, but honestly i am so disappointed in her, i mean its like when you really like one of your kids best friends and abruptly she says and does things that are totally ambigous, I have started to follow her again but not for the same reason, i know longer appreciate her as i did before, now i listen carefully when she speaks cause you see she is the one whom taught me that, read behind the lines…there is usually something fishy…in the sea…..


Max_1
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:25 pm

.

Dear liberalrapturedotcom,
FACT: McCain was born in Panama.

.


evan_la
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:26 pm

Thank you. Camille – your 15 minutes have expired.


lucile
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:26 pm

do you have insurance so you can go to a mental institute and don't forget you pills.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:28 pm

Maybe my racial bias is masked. After all, I don't like you and I don't even know what color you are (other than yellow). Or maybe it's because you're an idiot.


janetcamp
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:30 pm

Call it what you will (abstract). The governor of Hawaii says it's the official birth certificate. I accept it, most people accept it; if you are not a nutter birther, why can't you accept it? There is no “issue” to “settle” except in the minds of a few “odd” people. Hawaii does not have a “long form” birth certificate and what would this “prove” if it did?
For the President to “cough up” any additional documentation is to feed this fantasy. He has a passport, so the State Department is satisfied; why not take it up with them? His only “mistake” was to post anything at all.
This is “hard for people to understand” because it makes no sense and is a non-issue to rational people. I don't know if my birth certificate from Washington State is “long form” or “short form” (it appears to be short), but it has been adequate to get me a passport, driver's license, and anything else I've required. I have never seen the birth certificate of any President or candidate for President or attempted to confirm that any of them were born where they said they were born. Why the sudden interest with Obama. Please, inquiring minds want to know!


Name
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:30 pm

I was born in Hawaii and have the exact same type of birth certificate as our President. Get on with your life.


Mark Gottschalk
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:31 am

As one who worked in University Admissions, applications THAT old would probably be have been shredded and only transcript are kept. Such is the case at my alma mater as there is simply no room to keep paper that old.


Anon
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:35 pm

I'd read a commenter once that said Paglia was one of the original investors in Salon and as part of her deal she can't be dropped. Don't really know if that is true, but it is the only thing that makes any sense.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:36 pm

More stupid. . .blacks behave in “blocks” far more than whites. And even that isn't wrong, it's normal to like people like you. Why do the poor dislike the rich? Or blonds vs brunette? Or North/South or blue-collar/white-collar.

Blacks need to quit whining, stop acting in ways that all people dislike, and take some personal responsibility for their situation.


stewartholmes
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:39 pm

The word of a Democratic governor that has “personally examined” the document but refuses to produce the documents so the public can see them. If the state of Hawaii had “official” records, they would be easy to produce. My sister was born in Hawaii in 1965 and my parents have a certified copy of the orginal birth certificate, My sister has a certified copy of the orginal birth certificate and the hospital still has a record and the state of Hawaii still has the orginal which can be viewed and produced to the person or a family member in certain circumstances. I cannot accept the governor of Hawaii as the final word because it is too easy to product the document instead of stating that he has viewed them. Mr. Obama could easily solve the issue it he would take a minute out of on of his nice speeches and present the ordinal document to the public.
If a request is made to the state of Hawaii for a birth certificate, you will receive a computer generated document. If you want a copy of the orginal you have to make a special request and only the person can request thier birth certificate in Hawaii.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:42 pm

Not true. . .he's shown3 different COLB's. All were fake.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rd5gm8XKv_w


Linda Wyatt
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:43 pm

Why doesnt it bother the birthers that John McCain was born in Panama? He is not a natural born citizen. He should not have been allowed to run for president. The Constituition makes no exception for being born in a foreign country. Obama is more of an American than McCain. He was born on American soil in Hawaii.


drrebel
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:43 pm

Jeez Adam, if you're going to make such an EMPHATIC POINT, you should make sure it has something to do with the comment you're replying to. What canyon did you leap over to connect white environmentalist pollution and Zionists responsible for 9/11 to katty65's post? You must have dubbed in a ton of your own projections.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:43 pm

All wrong. . .reread Lingle's statement. She said “it's on file,” but nothing about its contents. Get a clue.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:44 pm

Not true. . .they will only release it to the “direct interest.” Obummer can get it.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Penny Dreadful
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:46 pm

She's the least fondly remembered '90s figure since Jar Jar Binks. Does anyone take her seriously?


rebeldr
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:46 pm

Well this is just continuing silliness. His birth certificate HAS been shown to plenty of people who have recorded it, including a court, but the birthers who have decided to hate him won't accept any proof given. No matter what evidence is presented they keep saying it's fake, so how can this ever get resolved?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:46 pm

REJECTED!

His dad was British. He was a dual citizen. He could never be a “natural-born” citizen and is ineligible.


Matt
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:47 pm

I wouldn't piss on Camille Paglia if she were on fire.


Penny Dreadful
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:47 pm

Or maybe Paglia has incriminating pictures of Joan Walsh.

At least Salon also has Glenn Greenwald.


Name
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:47 pm

you believe it because it was on YouTube?


Penny Dreadful
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:49 pm

Hawaii's governor, Linda Lingle, is a Republican. She supported McCain in 2008. If there were ANY doubts about whether Obama was born in Hawaii, wouldn't she have stepped up with proof?

Paglia and the rest of the birthers should give it up already.

Oh, and Camille? Obama's birth was announced in a Hawaii newspaper.


Caz
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:50 pm

For Paglia, if by chance she actually reads anything. Which by this news is probably not the case.

Do you have a life, or are you some cave dweller, jotting down notes on post-its, mailing them in with absolutely no social life and no access to any media outlets.

This has been debunked. And debunked again and again and again. Face it Paglia, as even the GOP's lord and savior has stated, you won't believe it because you do not WANT to believe it. Even if you people somehow discovered a machine to take you back to the day he was born and witnessed the doctor walk out with him as a newborn you STILL would say that voodoo witches changed the historical time line.

Get on with your life. This is old news and bogus news. Join the real world and hey maybe you can then step out onto the street and not be laughed at like the rest of the loonies.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:50 pm

You're right. McCain was ineligible.

It did bother me. The New York Times endorsed him to quash this as an issue. Both parties are corrupt. They made a deal.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Penny Dreadful
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:51 pm

Someone needs to remind Paglia of Senator Moynihan's famous statement that you have the right to your own opinions, but not your own facts.

Birthers need to let it go.


Seatech1
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:51 pm

Heck, I was born in Pennsylvania, and have the same type of birth certificate as Obama. It's a computer generated record of my birth. The birthers are hanging on a technicality that they want to see the orignal, hand-written certificate. The problem with that is that a huge number of US citizens no longer have that original copy, and have to get replacements which are generated by computer. Does that mean that none of us are really citizens? I'll bet that a lot of those stupid protesters don't have their original and have one like mine or Obama.


janetcamp
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:53 pm

So the Governor (republican) of Hawaii is just making stuff up, eh? You people are completely unhinged! It's posted online–what is WRONG WITH YOU? Don't tell ME to “get a clue” you nitwit. And don't write me; I have no time for such nonsense. You wouldn't know a logical statement if it bit you on the ass. I'm sorry to resort to invective, but enough is enough of all this birth certificate nonsense. Paglia is well-known for her efforts to “shock” and her views are immaterial to me, as are yours.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:53 pm

You don't know what you are talking about. By statute (Hawaii Revised Statutes 338-13), the Director of Health decides the form in which the “certified copy” will be provided. That is the computer form now. There is no special “pretty please” process for getting what you seem to think of as the “real” certificate issued. Don't believe me? Try reading the statute. It took me less than two minutes to find it:

§338-13 Certified copies. (a) Subject to the requirements of sections 338-16, 338-17, and 338-18, the department of health shall, upon request, furnish to any applicant a certified copy of any certificate, or the contents of any certificate, or any part thereof.

(b) Copies of the contents of any certificate on file in the department, certified by the department shall be considered for all purposes the same as the original, subject to the requirements of sections 338-16, 338-17, and 338-18.

(c) Copies may be made by photography, dry copy reproduction, typing, computer printout or other process approved by the director of health.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:57 pm

Good points, Penny. And actually, birth announcements for Obama were in two Honolulu newspapers: the Honolulu Advertiser and The Star Bulletin.


Freddo44
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 10:59 pm

I would — gladly!


JohnC
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:02 pm

Actually, it's not that simple. Although many commentators casually assume that the “natural born Citizen” clause requires that the President of the United States be born in the United States, the legal question is actually more complex.

Throughout American history, courts have consistently recognized exactly mutually exclusive classes of U.S. citizens: (a) natural born citizens and (b) naturalized citizens. No court that I am aware of, federal or state, in American history, has asserted that a person can be a U.S. citizen, but neither natural born nor naturalized.

The U.S. Supreme Court decision which most closely analyzed the meaning of “natural born citizen” in context of its historic, common law roots, was United States v. Wong Kim Ark in 1898. That case based its understanding of “natural born citizen” in light of its English predecessor, “natural born subject,” which was based on birth within the jurisdiction of the monarch. This would seem to suggest that “natural born” status is limited to births within U.S. jurisdiction. Some argue that the Fourteenth Amendment is declarative of this concept, although it does not explicitly mention “natural born” citizenship.

However, as mentioned above, courts consistently divide U.S. citizens between “natural born” and naturalized. A 1790 statute passed by Congress referred to certain persons born abroad as “natural born.” Although the words “natural born” were stricken from this statute in a 1795 revision, history does not provide us with a reason for this change, so we do not know whether it had any legal consequence. Nonetheless, it presents us with an example where the Congress recognized that persons could be “natural born” even if they were born as U.S. citizens outside the country.

Although the Supreme Court has certainly given indiciations that citizenship by birth and natural born citizenship are two names for the same exact thing, it has never definitively ruled on the subject. Because of this ambiguity, certain federal publications have pointed out that it is not clear whether a person born outside the United States can be a natural born citizen.

Having said that, McCain personally faced an even bigger hurdle. Even if a person can be a natural born citizen by satisfying statutory requirements for being a citizen upon his foreign birth, McCain wasn't actually even a U.S. citizen at his birth. This isn't even really a debated point. In 1936, at the time he was born in the Panama Canal Zone, no U.S. statute conferred citizenship on him. It wasn't until 1937 when Congress passed a bill granting citizenship to persons born in the Panama Canal Zone to two U.S. citizen parents, and it was made applicable to persons born from 1905 onward. The statute was ambiguous in that it wasn't clear whether such persons only became citizens at the time the statute was passed, or whether such people were retroactively made citizens from the time of their respective births.

But even if the 1937 statute were retroactive in effect, scholars disagree over whether a person can be made a natural born citizen retroactively, when no law provided for the person's citizenship at the moment when he or she was born.


tomt
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:03 pm

And, what would that point be, you lunatic fanatic?


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:09 am

Pennsylvania doesn’t have the weird birth records laws that HI uniquely does. There IS both an origional, ‘paper’ copy on file at the Hawai’ian DPH, plus another, ‘unabridged’ computer printout record–the CertificATION Of Live Birth–that Obama has NOT released.


Freddo44
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:09 pm

McCain was born on American soil in the Panama and Obama was born in Hawaii as the Republican governor has affirmed more than once. Some people cannot stand the thought of a black man (half white) being President, let alone one of our greatest Presidents assuming someone doesn't do him in because “their” gods (Glen Beck & Tony Perkins) told them to. Both men have demonized Obama and put him at great risk; Christians they are not. They will be held accountable; we who want a strong, enlightened America not an America that is governed by the Law of the Jungle, will not stand idle any longer.


Thomas Braun
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:14 pm

I was incensed by Camille Paglia's recent pieces on Salon.com. I sent her an email telling her that I believe she is so full of shit. And now she is writing this nonsense. She is a publicity hound. She thinks she is an elite and that she is important in the world. She is irrelevant. She cannot accept that. She is like Glenn Beck. She is just like Glenn Beck.


Cevale
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:15 pm

Camille is the quintisential alien sent to earth from the planet Kurayzee! Anyone who has had the plesure to hear her speak knows she is addicted to caffine. It like listening to a 33RPM record being played like a 78RPM. We need to ask her for her intagalactic hatching certificate, or AKC documents.


jbeall
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:18 pm

How terribly independent and contrarian of Ms. Paglia to claim the birthers have a point! Her posturing might have looked a little more genuine if she'd stood with folks who are a little less crazy, but hey, sometimes you just NEED some attention, knowwhatImean? <Yawn>


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:19 pm

Should I trust Obama? No! He's a liar.
……………………………………..
Watch this video. You’ll see obama lie like a dog in his very own words.
…………………………………….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3JKDTBOYKg
……………………………


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:20 pm

Should I trust Obama? No! He's a liar.
……………………………………..
Watch this video. You’ll see obama lie like a dog in his very own words.
…………………………………….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3JKDTBOYKg
……………………………


stewartholmes
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:21 pm

Yep, the Hawaii governor is a repub. But interesting to say I don't know what I am talking about since as I mentioned, My sister was born in Hawaii in Honolulu and has recently got a copy of her orginial certificate and yes I read the law. Check this link. http://www.wnd.com/index.php?pageId=79174 Anyone can get a copy of their orginal birth certificate. Hawaii passed the law to make things easier for people. Both of my parents are “African-American” but the birth certificate says Negro. “African” is not a race because a lot of nationalities are born on the continent of Africa, some of them are Caucasian. So, Mr. Bearclaw I am happy there are people in the world like you the know what other people are talking about. And by the way, I an not a “birther” and I am a registered Democrate.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:23 pm

But be sure not to let a black President talk to our school children about the importance of taking personal responsibility for their education, because that will cause white folk to go absolutely batpoop crazy!!!


libertasdon
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:26 pm

I am not concerned about where the President was born. I can handle any ambiguity, if indeed there is any. But I do not begrudge it to others who may want to debate the finer points of any controversy surrounding the location of his birth. Ms. Paglia is a scintillating writer, which is not to say that she always has the better of the argument. The fact that she is on HuffPo with this topic has much to say about HuffPo, and less to say about what concerns her expansive mind these days. Her recent Salon column unfolded a very thoughtful complaint about the President and his priorities. It would have been better for HuffPo readers, if it were that topic presented here, instead of the relatively trivial.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:26 pm

OHHH, meesa no take her seriously. No. She one cra-zee Gungan!


bearclaw
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:30 pm

Cap'n, given that you have such a thorough knowledge of Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution (which the U.S. Supreme Court has never addressed), the citizens of this fine land hereby to appoint, annoint and confirm you as the “Committee to Determine the Qualifications and Citizenship of All Candidates for the Presidency of the United States.”

But first, please take you meds and put your tinfoil hat back on. Your mom called. She's worried about you. Have you changed your underwear lately?


libertasdon
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:31 pm

“. . . let alone one of our greatest Presidents . . . .”

Please, if you do not mind, the man has been in office only months, and so far, they have not been kind to him. He may become, as you say, one of the greatest. But, currently, he is looking less like FDR, and more like Jimmy Carter.


dick6518918941
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:37 pm

twat


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:40 am

Barbara Nelson did NOT witness the birth of Obama first hand. She claims to have discussed his birth with Obama’s mother’s physician (the late Dr Rodney West). No other actual witnesses–nurses, other mothers from either Queens, or Kapi’olani–have come forward.

The Hawai’ian government has confirmed that it has the paper (‘long form’) BC on file. The newspaper birth anouncement lists an address that was inhabited by another couple, from the 1950s-1970s. (There was a one-bedroom shack in the back, sometimes rented out to single students–NOT a place for a couple with a newborn, over an hour’s drive to the University.)

Apparently, you take the word of a politician as Gospel truth. Not the height of intelligence, either.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:40 pm

So, don't trust Obama. Fine with me. But the State of Hawaii has provided a certified record of his birth in Honolulu, Hawaii in 1961.

Occam's razor: when you have two competing theories that make exactly the same predictions, the simpler one is the better. You explain the certified record of his birth through a vast conspiracy. I explain it as resulting from the fact that he was born in Hawaii. Hmmm, which is simpler?

Your mom called again. She'll give you back your crayons if you get off the internet, take your meds, and change your underwear (she says it has been WEEKS).


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:44 am

Again, HI still maintains the PAPER birth records and provides photocopies of them…but ONLY to the parties involved, or their families and lawfull agents (like trustees, &c.). Obama has steadfastly refused to allow this. Why? After all, he DID admit to using cocaine, in his autobio.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:47 pm

It would be great if you could scan a copy (redacted as necessary), upload it to Photobucket and post the link for people to see it.

Thx


Lily B.
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:48 pm

And Ms. Paglia likes to call herself an intellectual…? How far she has fallen.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:55 pm

The state did not provide the online (fraudulent) copy. It was “created” with Adobe Photoshop by DailyKos. Nor did Hawaii certify anything. Their law prohibits that and considers it privileged information. Only obummer can release it. He should, but he won't, because he's a fraud. Occam's Razor leads to the same conclusion; Obummer is hiding something.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


macgregor57
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:58 pm

Captainsteve, the skipper of the S.S. Nut Hut.


tonymctones
Comment posted September 18, 2009 @ 11:58 pm

there are 2 different birth certificate forms a short and a long obama has indeed shown the short but refuses to show the long. He has even gone so far as hiring lawyers and having his documents sealed.

Why would he do this?

You dont have to believe that he isnt a natural citizen to understand there are questions that naturally arise under these circumstances…


macgregor57
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:06 am

I'm surprised that so many people feel it necessary to defend the established and the obvious. But , if you are entertained by doing so , have at it.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:10 am

FactCheck.org debunked that over a year ago. They have held the certified copy, confirmed that it is just like other certified copies, has the embossed seal, etc.

So there is nothing that would satisfy you. Except maybe some of your mom's meatloaf. She'd like you to get off the computer now, wash your hands, have some dinner, and then get your spelling homework done before bed. (Ms. O'Malley is giving a spelling test tomorrow, and you don't want to get held back in third grade another year).


kasinca
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:11 am

Idiot.


rogerinmaine
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:12 am

Actually, Occam's Razor would be to release a copy of the long form birth certificate if you have nothing to hide, instead of spending over $1mm thus far defending challenges to simply release it. If you are spending that much money to keep it hidden from sight, the logical explanation is that you are hiding something.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:16 am

Technically and ACTUALLY wrong – Obama has not spent ANY money defending these lawsuits, lawyers have been stepping up to do it pro bono.


kasinca
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:16 am

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in…

Hateful haters who believe that a single mother forged two birth announcements in newspapers forty seen years ago because she thought her bi-racial son would become president of the United States most probably cannot be convinced because they have their evil minds made up. Contempt prior to investigation is a gurantee to everlasting ignorance.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:16 am

Posting the same thing, over and over, cap'n. That's what your doctor calls “obsessive/compulsive,” do you remember? That's why he gave you those little pills.

So, please do us all a favor — take your meds, and get some rest. You'll feel better. Do it for yourself. And because your mom might let you watch “Spongebob” if you can drop this birther obsession.

The birther thing is costing your friend Orly $10,000, after she pissed off the wrong judge (a Bush appointee!!!) by filing a frivolous claim, followed by a Motion for Reconsideration. You don't want to be like Orly, do you Cap'n? Think of all the Legos you could buy with $10,000!


bearclaw
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:20 am

In other words, you don't have a better explanation of why the State of Hawaii would issue a certified Certificate of Live Birth for Barack Obama than that he was born in Hawaii. Thanks. Can we play “rational explanations” again sometime soon?


bearclaw
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:24 am

Cap'n,

Technically, that's not a mask. It's called a “hood.” But that's o.k., you can tell your mom that she doesn't have to make a Halloween costume for you this year. You are already set to go trick-or-treating as a Klansman!


themidnightreview
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:29 am

Any perceived ambiguities are just a rejection of fact.


Name
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:48 am

Lame, Camille. Lousy, lazy and lame. Will you people give it up and start thinking about something constructive? Argue about how we get our soldiers home from overseas? Argue about how we save money and get jobs and healthcare?
Jeemanetti, this is just sad.


pensivegadfly
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:49 am

Captainsteve,

Where is it proved that there would be a “long form” birth certificate in Hawaii in 1962?
And how do you explain the newspapers, two, count them two, announcing the birth in Hawaii on the same date as the certificate, plus the woman alive today who remembers the birth?

How can you cling to such nonsense. It makes me worry for America that there are so many mental midgets among us.


dirtylibrul
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:53 am

BEARCLAW IN 2016!
I must commend you for your humorous and factually watertight posts. very entertaining and informative.

sorry cap'n, but you have been PWNED by a white-trash pastry!


Bob
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:53 am

Except Obama hasn't spent a million dollar defending these cases.


janmes
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:02 am

WOW! Sorry you did not make it through grade school! You are a certifiable moron!!!!!!


janmes
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:04 am

DUH!!! Are you dumber than a 5th grader???? DUH!!! Try 2nd!


bearclaw
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:05 am

Mctonedeaf: Why is the “short form,” which has the embossed seal of the State, not adequate? Why do you think the State would issue it, if Obama wasn't born there? Why do two Honolulu newspapers (The Advertiser and the Star Register) have contemporaneous birth announcements?

Please provide proof that Obama has “hired lawyers” to have “his documents sealed.” Snopes.com says “bullshit”: The Republican Governor of Hawaii says that Obama hasn't asked for any different treatment of his records than anyone else gets.


nervousandsmall
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:10 am

Oh Most Dearest Camille, I have very seriously loved ALL of YOUR books, why get stupid on us now?


Freday63
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:19 am

Me too!


just-sayin
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:21 am

Is Camille Paglia a child molester? Perhaps someone should start one of these sites about whether or not Camile raped little school boys in 2003, since she hasn't produced documentation to prove otherwise then it mus be true.

http://glennbeckrapedandmurderedayounggirlin199…


mlmn08
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:48 am

oh. come on, Camille.


achen000777
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:53 am

This imbecilic woman is not only ugly, but stupid to boot! How did we Americans hatch such harridan in our beloved country.


lugnut
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:54 am

For people who think President Obama is not a citizen. Show the proof or shutup. The long form is referenced to creat the short form. In other words, the short form gets its information from the long form. Another thing, the hospital sent in birth announcements to the news papers. Oh, the birthers think the nurses and doctors were protecting him like the omen (anti-christ) so one day he would become President 47 years later. Some devil seed kind of stuff i guess. Woooweee!!!!


michaelhorton
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:07 am

what a friggin idiot. this bither crap IS all about racism and discrediting a president the was OVERWHELMING ELECTED un like the lat one.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:10 am

What saddens me is not just that we have The Great Usurper in the Whitehouse but that so many lemmings do not even want to know the truth & rudely ridicule those who do.


MisterPaglia
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:21 am

Salon's Shame! One day Joan Walsh is going to get up the nerve to cut this freakin' harpie loose.


everafter
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:21 am

I'm Black — I voted for Obama. AND I WANT TO SEE THE DAMN CERTIFICATE!


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:27 am

365:173 (Obama-Biden:McCain:Palin)
Popular vote quite out of synch with the electoral college vote.

286:251 (Dubya-Darth Vader:Mr Heinz-Sleazeball)
Popular vote closer.

271:266 (Straw Man-Tin Man:Hardy-Laurel)
The chubby fella won the popular vote.

Verdict: the Electroral College has got to go. Like appointed judges, this has no place in a democratic republic.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:30 am

being elected with a 50% majority beats being “selected ” by a racist supreme court. if obama was born on the moon..he was an infant that could neither converse nor be able to until he developed the ability to reason years later..so whats the point? bush himself is illigitimate because his grandmother kept secret… the fact that her father was allistair crowley a man who purported to be either satan or in league with the same.since bush never finished his reserve military means he was a wartime deserter which made him eligible for a dishonorable discharge and thus inelgible to vote or run for public office.


Guest
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:35 am

I don’t imagine I can change your mind about anything. I’d just like you to get some help for your condition.

Obama has provided evidence. The State of Hawaii backs him up. The contemporary newspapers from August 1961 back him up. Your evidence? Well, generously put, your evidence seems to be that Obama hasn’t produced more evidence. If I say, “On September 7, 1996, Cap’n Steve molested 10 kindergarten children at a bus stop in Athens, Georgia,” and you produce hospital records showing you were in a Los Angeles psych ward at the time, can I fairly accuse you of being a lying weasel if you refuse to provide more evidence? Or maybe do I have some burden of providing evidence to prove you were in Georgia?


progressbaby
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:49 am

He has shown the birth certificate. Hawaii doesn't retain the long form version of birth certificates, and he probably doesn't have the long form any longer. My dad was born in Hawaii 77 years ago and doesn't have a long form version either, but it doesn't mean he wasn't born in this damn country!!


MacDaffy
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:52 am

Don't you birthers think that with all the powers at the disposal of the Bush Administration, private corporations, and conservative foundations to gather adverse information–to read every email and to hear every phone conversation you make–that they could dig up any unrevealed facts about Barack Obama's birth?

It's no surprise that Camille Paglia would believe this claptrap. She has the intellectual coherence of a brain-damaged chimp.


katiebar
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:56 am

Please, no one has been demonized more than G. Bush. Where was your concern about risk then, or does it just matter when your candidate is in office? First the race card, then Nancy's crocodile tears. All part of the effort to silence criticism.


Name
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:05 am

Where's the certificate? How do we know Obama was even born? You have to be born to be President!


bth94131
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:20 am

agreed


tonymctones
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:20 am

FIRST OFF BRAIN CHILD where did i say it wasnt adequate?

WHAT I SAID BRAIN CHILD is that its natural that questions would arise about the situation given the circumstances.

Its obvious that he is a citizen but again why not release the long form?

The sealing of records is done in general to prevent Identity theft…whos gonna steal his identity? youre right he hasnt recieved any special treatment but given the situation it is odd as nobody was going to steal his identity…

I never said his lawyers had the BC sealed I said he has hired lawyers and do some research he has sat down with lawyers about this…

why do you think he simply wont release the long BC?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:44 am

BS. . .he said in his book he has it. Stop covering for him. He's a weasel a fraud a liar, a usurper, and probably an illegal alien.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:45 am

Thank you. Honorable people like you and race would cease to be an issue!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:47 am

So do you troll websites refuting kooks all the time? No you don't. You know we're not kooks; obummer is a liar and a fraud.


Reneesouflee
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:48 am

Because the state of Hawaii dpes not have the long form on file, as stated over and over again. I cannot believe this is STILL being preported by anyone. It is THE most ridiculous thing I've ever heard of, and the rest of the world is shaking their collective heads in disbelief. This whole debate is nothing more than bitter, angry people clinging to a non-existant argument. Whether you agree with President Obama on policy or not, attacking his nationality is absurd.

The definition of an absurd argument – where the actual facts given to debunk the argument have no bearing on those purporting it. These people could trawl the halls of Hawaii's record archives, see the data and STILL disbelieve. C-ra-zy.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:49 am

Technically true. . .He spent more than a million. . .and it's government money.

He's still a liar and a fraud.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:59 am

Elected by a good margin (52.5%), yes, but hardly 'overwhelming', or a 'landslide'. The 2008 election wasn't a squeaker, but hardly a massive win for Obama. Considering Dubya's relative unpopularity (and the tremendous amount of free, probama propaganda in the media), this meant that a lot of people had reservations about Obama and his platform.


scott_the_anti_republican
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:00 am

Steve, you're a knob!


ThailandEd
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:02 am

Right on.
This “birther” movement is not only racist it is a convenient vehicle to get us to take our eyes off the real prize(s):
Health care for all Americans.
Proper regulation of financial markets and the obscene salaries/bonuses.
An end to the “Endless War” and with it the end of the military/industrial complex that robs this country of the ability to take care of its' citizens.
Where were these people when Bush led us into an unnecessary war and created most of the debt we have today?


scyntar
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:04 am

What in the HELL has happened to the citizenry of the United States of America? Our collective history has been one of struggle, riddled with divisiveness, challenge … and yet – and YET – our ancestors managed to become heralded the world over as “members of the great melting pot,” where ANY comer was granted a fair shake, so long as they earned their keep. Perhaps the melting is done and the settling has begun; the spoon has ceased its stirring and sediment is evident. The contents of a pot set to boil unheeded will eventually bubble into chaos, burn or evaporate entirely. What, then, was the point of stoking the stove and placing the pot?

We are better than this. Truly.


lindaMC
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:15 am

Well if he has it then that's it, he said it, so you know he has it. Look, all I know is I had my long form years ago, but couldn't find it so when sent away for another I received a short form and that is what is now legal and is the acceptable form, get over it.


connie
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:16 am

This woman is bout as credible as the zany birther attorney. Don;t give her too much coverage folks, she is not worth it.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:16 am

The Hawai'ian Department of Public Health has stated that they have these documents on file. Photocopies can be obtained for a nominal fee. Additionally, there is another, complete document called the Certification Of Live Birth, printed from stored data. This is a more complete record than the CertifiCATE Of Live Birth Obama allowed FactCheck to photograph and 'verify' (and which was posted on the Fight the Smears website). Under very unusual HI law, the Certificate Of Live Birth can actually state that a kid was born in HI when they were, in fact, not–quite unlike the case in any other state.


obyoby
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:20 am

PETITION FOR PUBLIC RELEASE OF BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA'S BIRTH CERTIFICATE

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageI…


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:21 am

Here's an article from some time ago:

http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/11/why_the_…

What's interesting is that, soon after the 'birthers' pointed out that HI's Homestead Program requires origional birth records, the Hawai'ian gov't changed the requirments to allow a COLB:

http://hawaii.gov/dhhl/applicants/appforms/appl…


karen parker
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:22 am

Camille Paglia is doing what she has always done. She makes one reasonable and sometimes compelling statement (in this case the last sentence in the quoted text which falls into the reasonable category), followed by paragraphs of attention whoring drivel.

I only had to hear passages of Sexual Personae read aloud to realize this woman (who interestingly, thinks straight women can't hold up their end of a rational and spirited debate) couldn't argue her way out of a wet menstrual pad.


gordondr
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:22 am

This statement is totally wrong: “Under very unusual HI law, the Certificate Of Live Birth can actually state that a kid was born in HI when they were, in fact, not–quite unlike the case in any other state.” Given adequate documentation, Hawaii will issue a certificate to people not born in Hawaii, stating where they _were_ born. Hawaii will NOT issue a certificate saying someone born elsewhere was born in Hawaii. Stop believing lies propagated by rightwing jerks.


Elizabeth
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:25 am

My best friend is black, so I am definitely not a racist. I am not alone. I know many people who have no problem with a black man as President. In fact we are pleased that America could break that barrier. BUT we find it ugly to attack the CIA. No other administration has ever looked back to legally punish those who served the country. Why do they keep “bashing Bush?” He has not uttered one word against Obama. He and his wife were gracious in welcoming the new first family. They didn't try to take half the White House with them like the Clintons did. Nor did they break all the “Os” on computers like that administration broke the “Ws”. Talk about no class. We also aren't particularly proud that out President was a lawyer for the shockingly corrupt ACORN group. Thank goodness they won't be involved with taking the census. We think they would have counted the leaves on the trees to enforce redistricting to the advantage of those politicians who vote to provide them money. These are just some of the reasons my friends, acquaintances, and I “fear” what this administration is bringing to our country. We are not “frightened”. We “fear” that the people in the CIA won't be able to do their best to protect our country because they “fear” that they will be sent to jail for their efforts. We “fear” that our president will be smeared with the dirt coming from ACORN. We “fear” that we will have an unbearable tax burden trying to save private companies. We “fear” that our small businesses will not be given the same privileges. We “fear” that Nancy Pelosi will eat up our money with her private airliner. Why can't she fly coach like the poor ignorant common people. We “fear” that an elite group of intellectuals think we are unwashed masses who don't know what is best for us. We “fear” inflation is looming because the Fed just keeps printing paper money that resembles the paper in the game of “Monopoly.” We “fear” that our health care system will resemble others where people die waiting for the treatment that is available to everyone now. We “fear” that there will be fewer innovations in the medical arena due to over regulation of pharmaceutical companies. We “fear” that our tax dollars will go to abort unwanted fetuses. We “fear” that our grandchildren will have to bear the financial burden of questionable policies of the people in political office today. We “fear” that Americans will be subjected to the rule of a world government. We “fear” that the next elections will come to late to save the America in which we grew up.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:28 am

The Hawai'ian DPS still has the paper records on file–they've said as much. You can get a photocopy, for about $10…IF you yourself, a trustee, family member, &c. authorizes it. Obama has fought this, tooth and nail.


resplazapunchbowl
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:29 am

In 2001, the state of Hawaii, like other states, converted their birth records to digitized paperless data base, and no longer use the “old fashioned long form” which contained all sorts of unnecessary historical information. Now you birthers and doubters are so stuck on seeing the old style certificates that you can't accept the fact that times have changed and the new style certificate is as valid as the old. Your stubbornness is a sign of elitism of the worse kind. Why won't you accept our state officials repeated pronouncement attesting to the authenticity of the new certificate as supported by information in the “long form.” Get it thru your thick heads. Hawaii statutes prevent our officials from releasing any privacy information to disinterested persons. I was born in Hawaii in 1927 and my certificate reads “Certificate of Hawaiian Birth” and contains my name and DOB period. I had at least six BIs conducted on me by the FBI and Defense Investigative Service in my 42 years of military/federal service.
If you would research the internet you will find that the FBI conducts background investigations on the VP and President, coordinated by The Office of Presidential Personnel. The Office of Personnel Management's Federal Investigative Services Division conducts a Single Scope Background Investigation (SSBI) which is an extensive on-depth background investigation similar to the FBI. which starts with a check of birth records (Its authentication) and citizenship status. This is followed by a check of national agencies, local police, criminal, civil, credit, financial, education files, neighborhood checks, interviews of listed and unlisted references and developed sources for any indications of subversive activities and most importantly loyalty to the US. The final investigation is carefully adjudicated by a professional staff who renders decision for the issuance or denial of security clearance. All congressman are subject to the SSBI if their position requires access to Top Secret and/or Sensitive Compartmented Information (SCI). But there seems to be great reluctance to discuss these investigations because of the highly sensitive private matters involved. It is amazing that no one has leaked anything of an investigation conducted while Obama was a Senator or even President. Request for information under the freedom of information act will probably be rejected by the FBI for the same reason Hawaii's won't release information in the long form. Get over it birthers and conspirators!!


trackstar641
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:29 am

Captian Steve,
You are an idiot! That's right, I'm making it personal. If he was white and his name was Tanner Webester (or some other European name), you would not even think about Obama being a so-called illegal alien. If you think he is a liar, fine. If you think that his policies are flawed, fine. But for you, and the rest of your racist cohorts, YOU ARE THE FRAUD! Maybe you just don't see that you have a problem with a black man as President. Don't kid yourself. I see the CODED words every day when you types talk about Obama. At least be a man and say what you really feel. Stop hiding behind coded words and phrases. Be honest and say you can't stand a ni@#er in the office.


progressbaby
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:31 am

Why do you believe anything he says in his book, if you believe he is also a liar? If he does have the long form copy, I very much doubt he would release it so that the rabid masses could find out the name of his doctor etc. There would be serious safety issues for innocent medical staff listed on that doc.


progressbaby
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:33 am

Yeah, this batch of right wing lies is getting absolutely creepy. I fear for the safety of the President. This is totally wrong and sick.


ghm
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:35 am

Can you believe how stupid you people sound!
I know you really don't care about truth or facts, its all about you lost the election.
You don't know who the first president was,
the world is flat,
thesun revolves around the earth,
our president is a muslim,
he is hitler,
he is a commie
he is going to kill grandmon
he czars are different then Bush's czars.
His economy he iinherited from BUSH is his fault
The wars Bush screwed up and his fault
Blackwater killers are all his fault
He is brainwashing all the children at public schools
He la lair,
he not an American,
He is taking all the money away from or kids in the future.
He hates white people,
He is a recast.
We want our country Back,
I know i missed a whole lot of them – this is un real!


the Uninvited
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:43 am

Forget the birth certificate. Why couldn't we have heard more about the Bush family's connections to the Nazi's and the censure in 1942 under the Trading With The Enemy Act. Many other prominent and noteworthy Americans were trading partners with German Industrialists including Charles Lindbergh who was adamantly pro-Nazi. Also it was by an large not illegal. But why, compared to this story, was that story considered off-limits when it became au-courant?


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:46 am

What people should be queasy about is Obama's corporate and political conections, particularilly Chicago mob boss Richard M. Daley.


brianbovey
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:48 am

what an ass


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:51 am

Some cops in Georgia got busted for runing B.O.'s sheet through the computer. You need to submit to a criminal background check to buy a .177 gopher gun; apparently, you don't have to, in order to control the American nuclear arsenal.


brianbovey
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:51 am

instead of focusing on obama we should be investigating our other elected official's ties to business
and lobby money.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:09 am

Can you believe how stupid THESE people sound?

*They think George Bush II planned 9/11, with the conivance of the CIA.

*They think white environmentalists directed poison into 'people of color' communities.

*They think it's 'racist' to ask voters for any sort of ID (to prove they're actual citizens, not voting more than once, or voting under the names of dead people).

*They think AIDS was a CIA plot to kill black, Hispanic and gay people.

*They think Israel is an 'apartheid state'.

*They don't believe Saddam Hussein's Ba'athist, Arab-nationalist murdered Kurds with gas attacks.

*They think (or at least thought) that the attrocities of the Khmer Rouge and Viet-Cong were nasty rumours, concocted by CIA-bribed 'refugees'.

*They think Hitler was a “great man” and the Holocaust never happened.

*They think Mexico's narco-gangs' guns (Chinese-made AK-47s and other weapons NOT sold in the U.S.) come from U.S. gun shops.

*They think that a steady influx of hundreds of thousands of (mostly illegal and very fecund) immigrants is not actually causing urban sprawl.

*They think that Obama's HMO, IT firm, pharmaceutical company and union porkbarrel health bill is going to mean free coverage for everybody.

*They think that National Guard letter Dan Rather got involved with was printed on a typewriter, not a laser printer.

*They think Obama didn't REALLY bow to King Abdulla…he just had to bend over, 'cause he's sooo much taller (by an inch).

Guess who these people are? In no particular order: Van Jones, Michael Moore, Sean Penn, Jane Fonda, Danny Glover, Louis Farakkhan, most of the U.S. media and Obama's supporters.


propitiousmoment
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:09 am

We are not frightened, but we fear a long list of impending evils? Nice demonstration of why you people get labeled “ignorant.”

FYI, Nancy Pelosi is third in line for the Presidency, behind Obama and Biden. She is not allowed to travel like ordinary people, she has to have protection that is not feasible in public transport.


tfredmayer
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:13 am

After all these years why the H___ is this woman still given air space, or internet space, etc. She has been a whack job for 30 years. Send her back to Whackland!


scyntar
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:18 am

Instead of investigating everydamed body and pointing fingers, we ought just settle down. Regardless the person, the office of the President of The United States of America deserves some respect, already. Whether or not you voted for the individual, Mr. Barack Obama is our elected President. Had Mr. John McCain won the election, the same holds true. We should be doing our best to support our country and our elected officials; if you disagree then (a) you cast an uneducated vote, or (b) you cast an uneducated vote. Period. And for those of you who choose not to vote, shut up.


Tane_Lewis
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:19 am

No other administration has ever legally punished those who served the country? Are you kidding me?

Do you not recall the investigations of the Nixon administration and intelligence community by the Church Committee? “A bipartisan Senate investigation of activities by the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) and the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) is launched by a special congressional committee headed by Senator Frank Church of Idaho. On November 20, the committee released its report, charging both U.S. government agencies with illegal activities. The committee reported that the FBI and the CIA had conducted illegal surveillance of several hundred thousand U.S. citizens. The CIA was also charged with illegally plotting to assassinate foreign leaders, such as Salvador Allende, the democratically elected socialist president of Chile. In 1973, Allende was killed in a coup that the CIA secretly helped organize. The Senate committee also reported that the CIA had maintained a secret stockpile of poisons despite a specific presidential order to destroy the substances.”

Do you not know about the Senate investigation of CIA assassinations in the Congo in 1960-61? Did you forget the Iran Contra Hearings? What about the Aspin-Brown Commission of 1994? Check out this article about the history of investigating the CIA: http://anthonyclarkarend.com/humanrights/invest…

Furthermore, throughout the Clinton administration the Republican Congress investigated him relentlessly from Whitewater to Monica Lewinski. Do you not believe that our Presidents are people who serve this country? I'd say that they qualify.

You ought to take some time to do some non-partisan research rather than simply listening to FOX news and talk radio. Check out McCain's connections to ACORN while you are attacking the President. In 2006, McCain told members of ACORN, UNITE HERE, SEIU, and PAW that they were “what makes America special.” http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/20… Bush also gave ACORN more money that the current Congress, which incidentally just voted to remove all funding to ACORN.

And lastly, Obama has yet to send anyone to jail for torturing prisoners, but Bush's Justice Department did. They did an investigation (albeit weak) of the torture, they just refused to release the report. We just recently got a peek at that report, as parts of it were declassified
by the courts. That report if you were paying attention was written by Bush's Inspector General in 2004. Following that investigation, Bush ordered that the torture program be discontinued. He also called for the closing of Gitmo, he just couldn't figure out how to do it without releasing a lot of dangerous guys because they had tainted their evidence by torturing the prisoners.

Again, do some thorough research before you spout off a bunch of misinformation.


steve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:25 am

Camille Paglia, who is not an idiot, and the “birthers,” who are idiots, have, thus far, failed to explain the birth announcement in the Honolulu Advertiser which was published in 1961.
The State of Hawaii does not publish phony birth certificates.
This issue is bull. It is the product of a right wing devoid of ideas. Their opposition to the public healthcare option is completely disingenuous. Right wingers say they have “christian values,” but Christ preached charity, peace, and forgiveness. Right wingers say they believe in “law and order,” but they sat quietly by while their President, Vice-President, Attorney General, and Secretary of Defense committed crimes. They say they're for personal liberty, but they believe that the government ought to be able to tell people whether or not they can end a pregnancy or smoke marijuana. They say that they are against government providing services, but they support public education and the police departments.They have no ideas. They have no philosophy. They have no credibility. Blabber all you want, right wingers. You just sound stupid to thoughtful, educated people.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:31 am

My mother still had the original in a safe deposit box. It is very fragile since it is 62 years old. There are no extant copies of any original birth certificate in the county where I was born because they all became computerized years ago. When my son was in school, I had to produce a birth certificate for him and I had to go to the State Capitol to get a certified copy of his birth certificate. All they release now is a small 4×6 card with the State seal on it and the birth date and location and an official looking signature.

That, my friend, is all any rational person requires for proof of birth.

BTW, when I went to school my parents were required to present a birth certificate before I could be enrolled. But since the Viet Nam War, that’s no longer required because thousands of legal and amnestied illegal aliens don’t have any birth certificates. When I adopted my daughter, she was issued a new birth certificate listing us as her parents and her birthplace the city where the adoption took place. Only her birth date remained the same and the original birth certificate is legally sealed. (Some states will open the seal, some will not).


Beaulen
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:31 am

What was the Electorial College tally?


resplazapunchbowl
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:05 am

BACKGROUND INVESTIGATION
I need to add something further. All federal applicant for access to classified information must fill out a 13 pg Standard Form 86 (Access to Classified Information). Birth, marriage, divorce or naturalization certificates need not be attached to the application since these will be checked during the course of the investigation.. Documents may be requested only if discrepancies in SF-86 surfaces. President Obama absolutely has no obligation to produce any private documents, even his birth certificate (which he has produced) which has resulted in a frivolous demand for the “real birth certificate,” and other documents. These are duly checked in official files by investigators and all documents are accompanied by official authentication statements. The OPMs Federal Investigative Services conducted two million checks in 2007 and 100% of the investigations have gone “electronic” meaning no paper. Can you imagine the mountain of papers if applicants were asked to produce birth, marriage, or divorce certificates, diplomas, etc? I don't know what our Republican Congressman are thinking because they know well that SSBIs are an on going process while they serve in the various committees. All of these will be checked by investigators to determined its veracity against information reflected in SF-86. Any discrepancies will be followed up with direct interview of applicant. It gets pretty hairy for some who lead a fast life in their youth. It could involve arrest, charges dropped, probation, etc. But generally the applicant is completely unaware that an investigation had been conducted, especially if he is away from home. One may learn years later that the “FBI was inquiring about you with neighbors, but I put in a good word about you!”


Buck
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:09 am

Can you feel the wind gathering?

zero sum game

the future is coming

you can plan for life but you don't know what life is planning for you….

wingnuts…..fly if you can……

Read more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/18/barack…


joeinhell
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:27 am

Paglia is the reason that I stopped reading Salon. It no longer had any meaning after the first time I read something that I knew was a big fat lie. If Salon wants to go that way, fine, I don't have to read it.

Quoting one of my all time favorite political commentators, Molly Ivins, in her review of Paglia's book – Sexual personae wrote “There is one area in which I think Paglia and I would agree that politically correct feminism has produced a noticeable inequity. Nowadays, when a woman behaves in a hysterical and disagreeable fashion, we say, 'Poor dear, it's probably PMS.' Whereas, if a man behaves in a hysterical and disagreeable fashion, we say, 'What an asshole.' Let me leap to correct this unfairness by saying of Paglia, Sheesh, what an asshole.”


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:30 am

The President is protected by a limo with 50mm composite glazing and armour so stout that it takes TWO burly Secret Servicemen to hold the doors open, plus the best armed guards on the planet. He shouldn't fear external threats.

What SHOULD worry B.O. is his cardiovascular system. He used blow and smokes like a chimney; his lips are cyanotic and he has spells of stupidity. This looks a lot like transient ischemic attacks, or something. Maybe Obama and Cheney can go on the Ornish diet together.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:37 am

Why would anybody want this economy-sized can of worms to be opened, at THIS point? The Pantsuit Lady tried really hard to out Obama as a foreign-born closet Muslim during the primaries, with what limited corporate and government conections she had at that point. Actually, I'd rather Obama BE a natural-born/non-dual citizen…the implications of an illigitimate Presidency on the economy and political stability make me want to drink a bottle of Pepto.

A funny thing, though: why didn't Obama visit KENYA, whilst on his junket to Africa? Or, tour Kapi'olani, as a photo-op for his healthcare plan?


garystartswithg
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:37 am

Ms Paglia made a brief name for herself for being a “dissident feminist” — more like a one woman circus by deriding post modern theorists and then attempting to establish post modern feminist theory. If you think that sounds confusing try reading her sometime.

I really don't think she is that relevent in intellectual circles — i think of her more as a parlor game from the early 90s. So now she is doing her best Baby Jane meets Nora Desmond to get the spotlight back. Not that unusual.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:45 am

Good point. Like the Democrats, Dubya and McCain have been proponents of No Illegals Left Behind-type legislation. ACORN has been involved in voter fraud involving illegal aliens. Proponents of mass immigration–illegal, or otherwise–promote 'compassion' for immigrants, because a steady influx of warm bodies keeps the housing and construction industries going, the real estate bubble inflated (also helping Bush and McCain's banking industry backers).


alphonsegaston
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:50 am

Paglia is another loon.

@Elizabeth-the America you grew up in is gone. It's called time. The America my nineteenth century ancestors lived in is gone.

“Ou sont les neiges d'antan”?
“Where are the snows of yesteryear”?–Francois Villon


Donald_from_Hawaii
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:50 am

As has been sadly the case so often over the past decade-plus, Camille Paglia simply hasn't a clue. She can assert herself all she wants, yet she's still very, very wrong. Would she also like to question the legitimacy of my birth certificate, too?

This extraordinarily shopworn issue has been put to rest ad nauseum in so many different venues by Hawaii public officials, including the state's Republican governor. For Paglia to attempt its resurrection at this late date can only lead one to question her dubious political motives (if not her mental faculties), and wonder aloud how she ever attained her supposedly vaunted reputation as a rigorous academic.


buddhistMonkey
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:56 am

((( “You need to submit to a criminal background check to buy a .177 gopher gun; apparently, you don't have to, in order to control the American nuclear arsenal.” )))

Actually, you do. Barack Obama doesn't have a criminal record, unlike George Bush and Dick Cheney, who both had DUIs.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/bushdui1.html
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/cheney_doc…


RedGraham
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:59 am

Yeah it was on August 13th, 1961, a mere nine days after Obama's birth at an unknown location.


buddhistMonkey
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:59 am

((( “ACORN has been involved in voter fraud involving illegal aliens.” )))

No, they haven't. Voter fraud and voter registration fraud are not the same thing.


middlepassage
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:12 am

Ok, so these birthers think that Obama's mother would leave this country without any proof that she did or that his father did and go to Kenya which is under colonial rule to give birth to Obama in a white hospital that looked down on blacks or perhaps by some midwife in a house under very inferior conditions, Prove to me that she did that, then came back to the US surreptitiously because we have no records of her leaving or coming back. Dig up the papers proving all of that, then I'll question Obama's Hawaiian birth certificate.


JDL51
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:13 am

The newspapers get their birth announcement information from the hospitals. An individual can't call in and say such and such was born where ever. Hospital certificates are not official BCs. You don't request a copy of your birth certificate from a hospital, you get it from the state or county. Fortunately I have my hospital record, but I would never think to use it for an official purpose, driver's license, passport, etc. The repubs prey on ignorance and apparently there's quite of few folks out there in that category.


buddhistMonkey
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:16 am

((( “What people should be queasy about is Obama's corporate and political conections [sic], particularilly [sic] Chicago mob boss Richard M. Daley.” )))

Sorry, but after eight years of Halliburton and “Kenny Boy” Lay, Al Capone would be a welcome respite. But, no need to reach for the Pepto Bismol, despite your paranoid delusions: Richard Daley is one of the best and most popular mayors in the country. By this time next year, he'll be the longest-serving mayor in Chicago's history, having been elected and reelected six times. He's no more a “mob boss” than you are a strong advocate for rational discourse.


JDL51
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:18 am

Gosh, I didn't know there weren't any procedures or background checks in place for anyone with a top secret clearance. Of course, I'm assuming BO has a top secret clearance and probably has had since his senatorial days. When you assume……


bearclaw
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:21 am

(1) The announcement appears under the heading “Health Bureau Statistics.” Why would Hawaii's Health Bureau report a birth that didn't occur in Hawaii?

(2) There are other birth announcements that are for births prior to August 4 (including one on July 30).

Is it your contention that all the other announcements are fraudulent as well? Or that the Health Bureau only lied about Barack Obama? And they did this because they knew that someday he would run for President?

Occam's Razor. Simple explanation is that he was born in Hawaii, just as the certified Certificate of Live Birth says.

I'm happy to see you nutjobs continuing to froth about this, because you are showing how wacky you are. My only fear is that you are all so irrational that one of you will eventually try to kill the President.


Donald_from_Hawaii
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:22 am

Your mindless diatribe only reinforces your own isolation. You are wrong, you are spiteful, you are immature and you are ignorant. There's good reason why nobody with a lick of common sense pays people like you any mind.

I feel very, very sorry for you. Yours is nothing more than a life of clearly wasted potential, and you haven't even the personal character necessary to take responsibility for your own choices. Rather, you seek only to fill your soul with black clouds of dust, peddled by shameless political manipulators whose own path to power and wealth rests in their willingness and ability to pander successfully to your own worst fears and instincts.

To that effect, you and your fellow GOP white-wingers will always revel in your own self-perceived collective victimhood, and your own shortcomings will always be due to the fault of others who aren't just like you.

And I find that just so lamentable, because there are truly none so blind and deaf as those who simply refuse to see and listen, and you've rendered yourself unreachable. I can can only shake my head sadly, turn my back to you, and walk away.


JDL51
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:25 am

You must have missed it. BO has already released his BC and the State of Hawaii has confirmed that it is legitmate and correct. It states on the BC that he was born in Oahu. The republican administration of Hawaii said that that comports with what they have in their records. Case closed.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:27 am

Cap'n, this is what your psychiatrist calls “projection”, remember? Now take your meds, like your mom asked you to. It is past your bedtime. If you go to bed now, maybe she'll fix you oatmeal in the morning and tomorrow will be a better day.


deborahphelan
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:29 am

WtF? what are you talking about? Dan Rather's NG letter printed on a laser printer? Who believes that?
They think Obama didn't REALLY bow to King Abdulla…he just had to bend over, 'cause he's sooo much taller (by an inch)

can you please source all this. you think the MEDIA believes this stuff?
This is what our media has created http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUPMjC9mq5Y&feat…

brain dead, totally deluded masses who have no idea what the hell they are doing being where they are. They are mad as hell and they have no idea at all about what they are really in oppositon to. They can't get one step beyond their talking points. They mindlessly repeat faux news talking points.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:41 am

Both B.O. and his rivals have been less than forthcoming about their links to businesses and unions. Obama still refuses to release records of what lobbyists he met with as a Senator. Obama is well-conected to the Don of Chicago, Richard Daley. Contrary to the BS fed by his media donors, Obama's campaign dough ($700 million, or so) came, like McCain and Bush's, largely from corporate sources (Obama did get more union donations, though–not that that's any better). Donors never give money without expecting something in return.

A good example of how this works is the coal industry. Bush got most of his coal industry dough from [MID]WESTERN coal companies; Gore & Kerry, from EASTERN coal companies and the United Mine Workers of America (the union my grandfather belonged to, which was utterly useless…but that's another issue). Bush, to the surprise of environmentalists, introduced very stringent mercury limits on smokestack emissions. Guess which type of coal has less Hg? Powerplants switched from Appalachian anthracite, to low-mercury Western coal. There may or may not've been an environmental benefit, but the policy was enacted as a favor to Bush's donors.

A solution would be to completely ban corporate and union donations, and cap donations at around $1,000.00. Also, vigorously enforce equal time laws, dump the delegate system for a one member/one vote system andscrap the electoral college.


linda
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:42 am

Where has she been? I've missed her psychotic ramblings.


pascalimalamidis
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:01 am

Camille is an incredibly astute and relevant commentator on issues of culture, art, gender etc. But her political positions are embarassingly naive, border on the idiotic. This is just another example of her libertarianism seeping into the world of politics and sounding like the nutty right wing.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:05 am

Obama bowing to antisemite tyrant Abdulla:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEUif1–r38
This, BTW, was a SERIOUS breach of Presidential protocol. Not even U.S. citizens are supposed to bow to royalty, let alone the President of the Republic. No mainstream media, other than Fox, ran this. (George Bush's hand-holding hugfest with Abdulla was within the bounds of protocol, as affection between heads of state…though icky and gross.) When it went viral on Youtube, Obama's damage control team tried to explain it as Obama having to bend over ('cause he's such a towering figure), in order to shake Abdullah's hand:
http://www.globalpolitician.com/25569-saudi-ara…

That fraudulent 'National Guard Letter' Dan Rather got demoted over was the worst document fraud EVER (okay–that joke Obama Kenyan birth certificate came close–but it was a prank). Seriously, couldn't they've just bought an old Underhill at a yardsale, to bang it out on? At any rate, THESE idiots believe that that obviously word-processed/laser-printed (containing formatting that can't be done on a typewriter) document was 'real':
http://mediamatters.org/columns/200709250005
Here's the Wiki on the whole debacle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killian_documents_…


Susan
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:07 am

Thanks to her moronic articles,I have stopped reading salon. It's sad,because Joan Walsh had many good ones.But this right wing italian just disgusted me.And obviously she is still going on.She had this insane looking drawing of herself on that website.I always thought it was not possible,but from her picture it looks true to life.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:14 am

I hate the Gross Old Pricks as much as the Dumbasses. There is something seriously sad with people who idolize any sort of politician, be it a senile old buffoon like Ronald Reagan (who helped create the Mujeheddin-cum-Taliban), or the mob-backed media puppet B.O. These people have to answer to voters. However, they also follow the dictates of the big money–corporations, unions and zillionare patrons–who paid for their multimillion dollar campaign expenses.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:33 am

Some dirt on your beloved 'Da Mare':
http://www.chicagoclout.com/weblog/archives/200…
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=…
http://bitterqueen.typepad.com/friends_of_ours/…
Daley is a sleazeball, if there ever was one.

I agree about Darth Vader and Hellisburnin. However, I'm curious why The Left never takes Russia and China to task, for their vicious, imperialistic oil wars and colonialism, in the Caucaus region and Central Asia. Putin the Pederast's FSB faked a terrorist attack to justify attacking Chechenia. The Gazprom oiligarchy[sic] that runs Russia provoked a war with Georgia, to stave off the threat of an Azerbaijan-Georgia-Turkey oil pipeline, which would threaten their monopoly. (Obama;' equivocating, wishy-washy response to this was a joke.) China also continues to brutalise the Uighurs, in their own country, for oil and Lebensraum. Yet not a peep about this in the Left press.


Robert Gamble
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:57 am

The “birthers” may not be racist, but they are crazy!
Reality counts, not bureaucratic documents.
To comply with the constitutional requirements for President (besides being old enough, which nobody disputes) all we need to know is that Barack Hussein Obama WAS born on U.S. soil.
Can anyone imagine that 40-some years ago, somebody knew they needed to conspire to get a Honolulu hospital to include in their report to two Honolulu newspapers a false report the birth of a son to Stanley Anne Dunham Obama and Barack Obama (Senior)?
To me, that's irrefutable proof, and fussing about certificates is not “a legitimate question”, it's craziness!!
Robert Gamble


emmy
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:10 am

Wow! The whole “birther” thing is so…July. I'm surprised that anyone is still talking about it. I thought they all got out their magic markers and started ranting about death panels come August.


lamu
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:20 am

like i tell the nut,s if you can,t deal with the fact,s which are simple;President Barack Obama is a UScitizen born in us soil. if tha,s to much for you go find a rope and hang youeself,no one will look for you


Ellid
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:29 pm

The worst document fraud ever is The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, a violently anti-Semitic hoax that has led to more death and destruction than any other book in history.


Piepiepie
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:40 am

Paglia's an excellent and interesting writer; however, her “facts” and “logic” are quite lazy.


Piepiepie
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:50 am

I don't think it has to do with libertarianism at all — it has to do with finding issues to make her more popular with the lunatic fringe / palinites. If the “birther's” standards about inconsistencies are to be taken at face value, then it would be almost impossible to prove one's citizenship.

BHO has produced docuemnts that prove his birth and citizenship that are acceptable to the U.S. government for the purposes of citizenship, school, passports, driver's licenses etc.

If the birther's want a new standard for citizenship consistent with the technology we have today that's fine — essentially a full background check to ensure the documents of birth are accurate.

However, they don't want that, as evidenced by the constant shift in the rational. Additionally, the next step would be to add DNA checks, then they would not believe the DNA b/c there would be some small inconsistency with DNA — even though statistically there would be a high-level of confidence.

I love the birther issue, it is so ridiculous it gives the kooks a chance to out themselves.


Piepiepie
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:52 am

Well said, most of her salon columns are absurd mix of ramblings and conjecture. The writing is interesting; however the analysis is based on the acceptance of right-wing talking points straight from radioland.

That's Paglia's new audience.


jjsardo
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:03 am

Eh! Goombah,

You wanna come join a my organization. I have a to see you birtha certificate. You were a born in a Sicily, no?

But first a, you gotta buy insurance policy. It's a lilla bit a different. After you pay a da premium, you get to live a litte longer.

It's a no bigotry here. Everybody can a buy.


gusdad
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:31 am

I know who the first president was, and the world is not flat. Everything else on your list is true.


stlairport
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:48 am

Can anyone imagine that that over forty years ago a powerful man had an affair with a woman who then got pregnant. The powerful man then laid the foundation to cover up his affair and brought in Obama senior to be the father, pay his way through college and help him in life for being the father. Then, sent the woman to Kenya to further the cover up of his affair, but laid the foundation in Hawaii so the baby would be able to claim US Citizenship. That man has been overseeing Barrack Obama's life and paid ALL of Obama's education and helped him get set up in life. That man is who is behind Obama's push to the White House. That man is Frank Marshall Davis http://astuteblogger.blogspot.com/2008/09/obama…

Don't be sheeple simply because Obama is a nice guy and leans towards your political bent in life…he is a usurper. Obama senior and Obama's mother NEVER lived together and DIDN'T parent Obama together. Frank Marshall Davis is Obama's real father who needed to cover up the affair. So yes, one can imagine that a conspiracy accord many decades ago which led to the Hawaii papers listing Obama's false birth.

Who knew the boy would be so brilliant that he could one day become President? Problem is, he is not eligible.


lkinnc
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:13 pm

Paglia is a contrarian and an attention whore who comes up with ridiculous and convoluted arguments that sound quite erudite but are in fact are just rantings in the wind.


lonecrone
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:15 pm

Excuse me? Legitimate questions? No there are not. He has the same kind of birth certificate the rest of us have. When I first applied for a Social Security card, I took with me the hospital birth certificate given to my parents by the hospital.

It's a beautiful document with a pretty border,with an elaborate embossed seal (of the hospital) the names of the doctor, hospital, time of birth and so on, and signatures of hospital officials. Not all hospitals gave these to parents, and nobody born at home had one either.

The Social Security office wouldn't accept that as proof of birth. I had to write to the state capitol and get a certified certificate of birth signed by a state official. It had much less information on it.

A hospital “birth certificate” is no such thing. It's just a nice thing for a parent to put in the baby book and has no official standing.

The “birthers” have no legitimate case. And if you think that racism isn't playing a part, why not just look at the signs they carry in their astroturf protest marches.


Irish_Wake
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:21 pm

No, if were about fraud and the media’s lack of investigation, there wouldn’t have been interviews with doctors, hospital administration, county clerks and judges confirming that the evidence produced satisfactorily answers the charges.

You may not want to use words like ‘brain-washed and fearful.’ You do not realize it, but you are embarrassing yourself.


lonecrone
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:23 pm

Our local paper publishes birth, marriage and death announcements once a month only. We're a small community. The nearby city newspaper only publishes birth announcements, also once a month.


Subroutine
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:35 pm

Dear Miss Paglia, I have never seen your birth certificate. Paglia?? Is that Middle Eastern? I find you suspect.


lonecrone
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:40 pm

And yet, here we all are, giving her the attention she seeks. sigh.


qualtrough
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 12:51 pm

OK, I fell for it. I clicked the link about someone named Frank Marshall Davis being Obama's father. At the top of the page is a picture of Obama's 'alleged' Kenyan father, a picture of Obama, and then a picture of this Davis character, and finally another picture of Obama. The picture of Obama Sr. was the first time I have ever seen him. I was immediately struck by the resemblance between father and son. The Davis picture looked nothing like Obama, unless you consider being black a resemblance. And what was the first statement below the pics? This: OBAMA JUNIOR LOOKS MORE LIKE FRANK MARSHALL DAVIS THAN ANYONE IN THE DUNHAM FAMILY OR THE OBAMA CLAN. WTF?? I mean, the craziness just gets worse with these people!


Tom
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:11 pm

ABOUT CAMILLE PAGLIA: A lady with high class turned to be a stupid scourge of the Majority of Americans who elected a Black-White President of USA, Barack Obama.
I am a Republican turned to be Independent because of these few bad apples High Class White Society who humilate the rest of the decent and intelligent white nation – who believe that Pres. Obama is an intelligent and decent guy.
We have gotten a bunch of public figures around the nation and towns who need to be chopped out for lack of no American High Moral Ground and Character.

I use to love her discussions and writings – NO MORE:
Now she turns out to be a disgrace and scourge of humanity. She is a loser because she can't imagine that Obama is more intelligent that her and her hate mongers and racists… instead of standing high moral ground and dignity of human spirit she chose to play with other gang of so called uneducated ignorant BIG MOUTH falsifiers such as = Rush, Glen, Lou Doubs, Ingram, Fisher (one here in Greenville, NC by the name of “Henry”, a small radio transmitter host) …these guys have BIG FOUL MOUTHs and hate immigrants and University Educated People who they think are liberals….)


eelder
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:13 pm

What is the point of the Birthers? There is no legal, ethical or moral basis for Obama to provide additional information to people who are opposed to his presidency. If the Birthers had a point,they would be prevailing in court.

Orly Taitz has dual US-Israeli citizenships and has links to the government of Benjamin Netanyahu who is unhappy with the Obama administration.

Taitz was booted out of court this week and judge promised to put judicial sanctions on her if she goes back to court with her anti-Obama spiel again. Enough said.


lede3957
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:21 pm

Being a Birther does not equal being a racist; being a Racist does not equal being a birther but in the case of President Barack Obama, I believe the name calling equals a little of both plus a bit of unbalanced and crazy mixed in. Facts mean zero to the crazies – they just keep making up more crap.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:34 pm

Actually, something like THAT is a likely scenario. Another reason B.O. won’t reveal his records: the facts of his biography don’t mesh with his Oprah Book Club autobio.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:34 pm

Actually, something like THAT is a likely scenario. Another reason B.O. won’t reveal his records: the facts of his biography don’t mesh with his Oprah Book Club autobio.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:38 pm

Creepy thing is, that book is still sold at Islamic Bookstores (UK, Canada, America) and incorporated into the school texts of those nice Muslim countries Obama’s sucking up to.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:38 pm

Creepy thing is, that book is still sold at Islamic Bookstores (UK, Canada, America) and incorporated into the school texts of those nice Muslim countries Obama’s sucking up to.


sueno
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:39 pm

What a sick


Amy
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 1:44 pm

Paglia fell for this crap and she is too intellectually dishonest to admit that she was wrong. Sorry, Camille, being intellectual, if you ever were, means changing your positions when they are blatantly wrong and even crazy. Note she doesn't say anything specific The BC was confirmed by the Republican governor of Hawaii, and his birth announcement was in 2 papers. If Camille Paglia wants to be associated with Orly Taitz so be it.


pbg
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:08 pm

um…if he's Frank Marshall Davis's illegitimate son, then his mother and father are both Americans.So this conspiracy theory makes him more eligible, not less.
Are you making the fascinating assertion that illegitimate children can't be President?


Jason G
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:11 pm

Imagine this scenario.

An accused rapist brought to trial says to the judge, Your Honor, I didn't rape that woman, I just really, REALLY wanted to have sex with her.

Since when does the perpetrator get to define the crime?


Name
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:18 pm

Paglia is simply trying to make herself relevant again. She ceased being interesting years ago and no amount of crazy will save her floundering career as a intellectual, especially when she is stooping to the level of tea party nutcases.


cathylees
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:23 pm

Actually, if you have ever seen a pic of his Dunham grandfather as a young man you would swear yo were looking at a white Obama


alfeldzamen
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:24 pm

Ms. Paglia, some time ago, also expressed her skepticism about global warming. It seem the lady is suffering from what many of our more pompous posturing pundits also have, namely a profound ignorance about the world, due to a lack of any scientific education. Or education in logoic.

It's sad that we see this profound deficiency manifested so often among public figures, and commentators about them.


cathylees
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:26 pm

Brilliant!!!


Leslie
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:33 pm

I sure hope Salon isn't paying this nut job! She's just wants to be relevant, and she's not. She started this years ago when the feminist movement wanted no more to do with her. Next!


cba1
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:49 pm

yes i agree >> she has no life !1


jimmygee
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 2:51 pm

The only point obvious in this conversation is the one on her dunce cap.


donegal
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:03 pm

Birthers do have a point. But as “Dear Abby” used to say, if they wear a hat, no one will notice it.


zorrod
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:14 pm

Quite frankly, I’m glad that people like Paglia keep the issue of so many little “mysteries” alive. Here are just a few:

Panahou Academy, Grade 5-12 records-Not Released
Occidental College records – Not released
Columbia College records – Not released
Columbia Thesis paper – “not available”
Harvard College records – Not released
Selective Service Registration – Not released
Purpose of 1981 trip to Pakistan-Not disclosed
Medical records – Not released
Illinois State Senate records – “not available”
Illinois State Senate schedule – “not available”
Law practice client list – Not released
Certified Copy of original Birth certificate – Not released
Embossed, signed paper Certification of Live Birth – Not released
Harvard Law Review articles published – None
University of Chicago scholarly articles – None

This is just off the top of my head, with no research, and I freely admit I may be wrong about some of this. You could probably add a dozen more little “mysteries” to the list with a little digging. Kind of creepy. Makes you wonder if “Birthers” don’t have a point…

I think the issue is more about truth and openness in government. “Birthers” run the gamut of people who believe Obama is a space alien to people who believe public figures should be held to a standard of “transparency.” Let me make this absolutely clear: the document produced by the Obama people is a laser printed “Summary.” The original document shows much more information that may or may not embarrass the POTUS. The statements from Hawaii officials affirm that they have seen the original, so we know it still exists. Why does wanting to see this document, or for that matter, the college transcripts that are also being hidden make you a nut case…even a racist? When I applied for an entry level government job 30 ears ago I had to show those 2 documents, my DD-214, valid driver' license, and original Social Security card. I showed the stuff. End of discussion…


lc
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:17 pm

Paglia should stop using a 40-year-old photo …


mia
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:19 pm

stlairport, what's your point? IF Frank Marshall Davis is President Obama's farther—that means BOTH of his parents are AMERICAN CITIZENS!!!!!!
Therefore, under YOUR assertion, President Obama is an AMERICAN CITIZEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Therefore, President Obama is ELIGIBLE to be President of the United States!!!!!!
Even for the sake of an assinine argument, had he been born in Kenya—- the fact is President Obama's mother was an AMERICAN CITIZEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BTW, a HOSPITAL BIRTH CETRTIFICATE which includes the doctors' name, the hospital, the baby's footprints, and other additional information is on PRETTY bordered paper—and —it is NOT a certified birth certificate. Copies of STATE CERTIFIED BIRTH CERTIFICATES will contain abbreviated information EXACTLY as the one President Obama has shown!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


terbor
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:23 pm

I was reading aloud one of Ms. Paglia's essay's on sex to some graduate students just yesterday. Upon finishing the one particular section, the students in attendance all scratched their heads, and one blurted out, “That makes no sense at all.” Exactly…


xmw
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:35 pm

Okay everyone time to bombard Salon with emails…lets get to work to get her out!!!


Camille Paglia | Tea Party of Northern Colorado
Pingback posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:39 pm

[...] The Washington Independent covered this NPR exchange and headlined their article “Paglia: ‘Birthers’ Aren’t Racist, and They Have a Point” [...]


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:40 pm

Paglia is an idiot. She has been following this closely? Perhaps to closely. She has been inhaling the fumes left by the exhaust that the birthers have been putting out. The simple fact of the matter is this. The evidence that they have produced have been the following. Two punked birth certificates. A doctored tape from an Obama family member, and a demand that he convince them he IS a citizen. This very week a judge through out the latest of Orly Taitz's forged birth certificates and threatened to sanction her if she submitted another bogus one. Then through out a law suit by a birther Military Officer. I work at a county clerk's office and one of the things we do is produce birth certificates. There is nothing, nothing wrong with the certificate Obama has produced. enough with this nonsense.


dantheman25
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:43 pm

Our intelligence services do thurough background checks and investigations on all presidential candidates BEFORE they become President. That includes the FBI, Secret Service, CIA, AG, etc. Do the birthers really believe they know more than these departments do?


sean6886
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 3:47 pm

If this birther movement is not racist, then how come none of these same people were ever asking for GWBush's birth certificate, Bill Clinton's birth certificate, GHWBush's birth certificate, Regan's birth certificate, etc. None of those Presidents showed their birth certificates to the public and no one ever asked for them. Where they told us they were born, if they even said so, everyone believed it and that was that. This is racism pure and simple.


deborahphelan
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:04 pm

well, if we really want to get into “Rathergate” DonRather, one of THE most respected journalists of all time who had the backbone to call out EVERY president (including George W which aparently was the 'straw), who was then labeled 'liberal', which was natinally morphed into the ultimate condemnation in Newts 1990s camapain to re-create America's take on particular individuals and concepts by binging them irrevocably together through negative connotations, redefinitions and igiting those amydala fear/flight responses by immersion in/repetion of and careful use of intonation, visual imagery, etc….. therefore, the NYT is indelibly imprinted in most American's eyes as the 'liberal NYT' when in point of fact, the NYT was always considered the prime example of real reporting until the 90s, the pent-ultimate example of journalism at its best. Well, dan was the first big notche on their belt … and at the time I did extensive research on this. Plamegate and Dan Rather same architect http://www.jeteye.com/jetpak/e20ccf04-3b33-1029…

Roger Stone The Man Behind Rathergate: http://www.jeteye.com/jetpak/e20ccf04-3b33-1029…

Abramoff & Stone: less than 6 deg. of sep.. http://www.jeteye.com/jetpak/e21ead14-3b33-1029…

Morton Blackwell's Leadership Institute http://www.jeteye.com/jetpak/e22b10ae-3b33-1029…

& just for fun …

1st amend & freedo of press http://www.jeteye.com/jetpak/e21dc5b6-3b33-1029…

Yeah, there's a lot of info here… & (with emphasis) NOT SAYING I BELIEVE IN ALL ANGLES I PRESENT … JUST COLLECTIONS OF INFO I FOUND…
Roger Stone, the man who led the mobs who flew into florida to swarm into recounting area and demand an end to counting, is considered a potential 'co-writer' of the falsified documents which were intentionally made so that qs re their authenticity would immediately arise through the right wing blogosphere (within what was in minutes) AND is now working with the Armey crew on the campaign to bring down the President of the United States and in so doing the country itself.


Fred
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:13 pm

These demands to prove a negative are strongly reminiscent of the tack taken by Bush during his propagandizing for the war. He insisted that since Saddam couldn't prove he had no WMDs that he therefore must have them. But that's a logical fallacy. I can't prove I don't beat my wife; that doesn't prove I beat her. The so called “Long Form” would prove nothing.

How many of the birthers supported Bush being appointed President by the Supreme Court? Most, probably. The argument accepted by the court, as I understand it, was that taking the time to determine who really won Florida would cause too much uncertainty, so let's just settle this now and move on. Are we now to unseat Obama, based on far less plausible claims of illegitimacy, after he's been in office this long, with all the attendant disruption and turmoil that would cause?

More to the point, perhaps, is the obvious fact that his election will not be reversed. So get used to reality. It's not always going to conform to your wishes.


eris_kallisti
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:16 pm

Feep f*cking that chicken, Camille.


exxman
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:17 pm

“This is just off the top of my head, with no research”

Perhaps you should try checking the validity of your accusations before you make them.

“Why does wanting to see this document, or for that matter, the college transcripts that are also being hidden make you a nut case…even a racist?”

How many previous presidents have been accused of not being an American citizen after they were elected in a free and fair election, by a landslide I might add? Racism isn't always platent. It is sometimes subtle and insidious. Often the person holding racist attitudes doesn't even view his/her self as racist.

Wasting time on these non-issues is a distraction this country doesn't need right now. We are on the razors edge right now and we need to focus on more legitimate concerns like for instance how the cororations and they're lobbyists have taken control of this country and our government.


EL PINCHE
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:58 pm

CAMILLE PAGLIA SOUNDS LIKE ANOTHER FURENR LIKE ORLY . MURDOCH, ORLY, PAGLIA, ROMNEY, …THE REPUBLICANS ARE CRAWLIN WITH NON-AMERICAN FILFTH


rexozone
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 4:59 pm

They've a point alright, but like Paglia…it's between their ears.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:00 pm

Click this link to see what Obama’s real birth-certificate should look like. It’s for the two girls (Nordyke twins) that were born at the same day, time and place (supposedly). They also went to early school with Obama.

<img src=”http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g160/steveb777/Nordyketwinsbirthcertificates.jpg” border=”0″ alt=”Nordyke twin's birth certificate”>

As you could see, unlike the online fakes, the real ones are very comprehensive.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:02 pm

Maybe this will work better.

http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g160/steveb77…


patrick
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:30 pm

Camille Paglia is just the elderly lesbian version of Ann Coulter. She'll say anything to get attention.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:39 pm

Call this ‘classism’, if you like. It’s NOT a racist conspiracy.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:53 pm

Nothing ‘racist’ about pointing out that the people who murdered 3,000 civilians were Qur’an-thumping MUSLIMS. As Malcolm X was shocked to learn they come in all colors. In fact, many former White Power-types have patched over to Salafi Islam, since they still get to hate Jews. We can also expect the NAMBLA crowd to start going Muslim, too, since both the Salafi and ‘moderate’ Sufi sects tolerate pederasty. British police have found an alarming amount of kiddie porn in the posession of captured terrorists:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article4959002.ece


edmyers
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:54 pm

Two or three courts have ruled and have stated this is all a bunch of bunk. She doesn't know what constitutes a legal document and a hospital birth certificate is not a legal document. Go away you nuts.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:58 pm

You mean the coke-snorting (read his bio) Obama, who thinks America has “57 States”, doesn’t “speak Austrian”, bows to foreign tyrant antisemites, hires racists and tax-cheats into his cabinet and has Ratattouille ears?

I never liked George ‘No Illegal Left Behind’ Bush, either.


OP3366
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:59 pm

And those birth announcements in the Hawaii newspapers? I guess Obama's mother knew he would be presifent someday so she placed the announcements from Kenya — which, of course, was not called Kenya at the time. Oh, and you want to cause more distraction, delay legislation and undermine the presidency — then ask Obama to address this nonsense and cause a further circus. It is best for him to ignore it. That is, at least, until George Bush releases his college transcripts (now those would be fun to read), and his pseudo-military records.


zorrod
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 5:59 pm

I don't assert the POTUS is not a citizen. Only that for someone who is always talkining about Openness and Transparency there see to be a lot of opaque spots…Also note that you don't refute any of these assertions…


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:06 pm

Newspaper birth announcements are meaningless. They are triggered automatically upon application for a birth-certificate, regardless of birth-place.

Obama is a fraud. You can see it in his fake speech patterns, in his fake stride, in the fake posture of his head and neck, and in his fake background and hidden records.

He’s clearly a puppet. The question is who’s puppet? Soros? The Saudi King? Putin?

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:13 pm

They wouldn't've asked for Condi's, or Gen. Powell's, either. (Actually, the Guns & God crowd would've been ECSTATIC, had either of those two made it to the White House.) Neither would they have demanded this of Jessie Jackson (who, inlike Mr Teleprompter, actually deserves to be called a great orator and 'community activist'). Had Canal Zone-born McCain made it, some Democrats would've gone 'birther' (many did, before and after the election). Weird coincidence that, in one election year, there were THREE candidates (Obama, McCain and Calero) with birthplace eligibility issues…


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:15 pm

Also weird, when you consider that he admitted to COCAINE USE, but is hedgy with such mundane information.


Subroutine
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:22 pm

If those are signs of foreign birth….than it proves Bush was born on the planet Tralfidore.


deedee_houston
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:25 pm

The Hawaii officials have stated that they are satisfied with the birth certificate that is on record. If Obama's birth in Hawaii could be refuted don't you think the Clintons would have done that during the LONG primary battle?


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:28 pm

As for medical records…we all know McCain's a geezer, with health issues; we don't know much about B.O.'s health. I'm sorry, but you can't claim 'privacy' when so much is riding on you–you have to prove that you can run the country without dementia (Ronnie?), or croaking halfway through your term.

Obama has cyanotic lips. The bluish coloration seems to come and go. Nothing 'racist' about this. My (white, Ashkenazi-Slavic) grandfather had this, before succumbing to congestive heart failiure. A politician in Canada (Ujjal Dosanjh), of Sikh extraction, but about the same complexion as Obama, had this coloration about the lips…just before a massive MI. A bypass later and his lips were a normal pink/brown. Obama was a self-admitted cokehead and is still a chainsmoker–REALLY nasty for the cardiovascular system. He's had spells of stupidity (forgetting what city he's in, saying America has “57 states”). He could be having transient ischemic attacks. Also, Joe Biden had that aneurysm…Hillary (or Nancy Pelosi) may end up being the first female Prez after all.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:30 pm

You say 'racism'; I say 'antisemitism'.


youngblood360
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:39 pm

I can't believe people are still wasting energy over these outrageous assertions. The birthers, tea baggers, deathers etc. are the village idiots who will believe anything that the right wing propaganda machines tell them to believe. These people are KKK members, neo-Nazis et al and should be called out as such. Period.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:43 pm

Everybody here is calling for Camille's head for saying she thinks the 'birthers' have legitimate questions. However, NOBODY is taking Van Jones, Michael Moore, Sean Penn, Charlie Sheen (who still thinks his dad, not George Bush, was the 'President') et al to task, for being 'truthers'.


annoyed by BS
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:46 pm

listen, the fact remains, Obama's momma was an american citizen. Therefore, HE is a natural born citizen. end of story!


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:46 pm

How about nice racists, like Van Jones, who think pollution is a white conspiracy and that 9/11 was a Mossad-CIA plot? Oh, I forgot–Obama hired him, so he must be okay.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:54 pm

It seemed like Pantsuit Queen tried. SHe probably didn't have the connections, though. She did try to smear B.O. as a closet Muslim. According to Shari'a law, he was born a Muslim. However, his dad was one in name only (liked booze, pipes and Christian women) and Obama is a professed Christian who drinks beer, doesn't make his wife and daughters wear bags on their heads, and hangs out with race-baiting Christian ministers. This won't win him any favors with the Qur'an-thumpers, though–apostacy is punishable by death in Islam. (Rather than the 'birthers', he should fear those bearded crazies with names like 'Abdullah'.)


MYMY
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:54 pm

Paglia — definitely a foreign sounding name. How do we know she isn't an illegal immigrant from Italy or Roumania??


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:54 pm

If there wasn't anything to this issue, the obamabots wouldn't be here vociferously smearing those who question. Why aren't they at the “truther” or “area 51″ sites? They KNOW this is a real issue, and they don't want the truth to get out!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 6:56 pm

Dubya's edumacational records were made public. (He got better marks than Kerry.) Actually, his haemmorhoidectomy file–also public–is a more fascinating read.


tallydee
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:11 pm

Wow, you're a regular redneck racist, aren't you?


Kim
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:20 pm

I'm sorry, but you guys (CaptainSteve et al.) are silly. The Republican governor of Hawaii, and numerous other government functionaries have examined the long-form birth certificate and publicly declared its authenticity. Not to mention the birth announcements in two local papers. There are no questions left that reasonable people would ask. (Camille Paglia has a history–well, a career, actually–of making extreme claims that she knows will get her noticed.) You can't accuse the governor of Hawaii of being an “Obamabot”–nor can you get away from the fact that many states now use the short-form birth certificate, and actually make it difficult for an individual to obtain the long-form version. (Try, for example, asking for a copy of your birth certificate in PA, and you will obtain a document with even less information than the Hawaii short-form.) Admittedly, Obama could obtain a copy if he wanted–but I actually agree that he should not do this. If John McCain produced a short-form certificate, would you want more proof? What other president has had his nativity in this country questioned? When did you ask for the documentation of George W. Bush?

Finally: do you actually believe that the FBI and CIA do not fully investigate someone before granting full security clearance? And do you imagine that lying about your nativity would not present you as a security threat? Are you guys really this dumb?


hannabanana
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:20 pm

You first!


hannabanana
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:26 pm

Aw, he can't help it. He just misses his war criminal, drunken, coke snorting, awol, semi literate, pretzel choking little chimp of a former president.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:31 pm

Actually the little chimp did not get better grades and his course work was mostly basic and infantile. The “good” grades he did receive were due to tests taken for him by others.


nana4gj
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:35 pm

No modern, independent, educated, strong willed, American, young woman, such as President Obama's mother was when she was found to be with child, would have agreed to birth her child in Kenya. Her husband left for Kenya soon after and she still chose to remain in America.

Any “legitimate questions” about the documentation of Obama's birth certificate are as contrived as everything else such as “Death Panels”, “Socialism”, and “a government takeover of healthcare”. State the “legitimate questions” or shut it down.


tommcguire
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:39 pm

What exactly is her point? That there is a legitimate issue with respect of Obama's place of birth or whether some of them wielded signs suggestive of racism. She sounds like a drunken fighter looking for a fight. No one has produced any evidence – none- suggesting he was born anywhere except Hawaii. And that evidence is pretty damn good. As for the racism, it is often in the eye of the beholder.People don't often yell nigger these days – even though they would like to. They use other hated descriptions just because they are inhibited from using the words they actually prefer. Nigger is out but Nazi, Fascist or black face or Hitler look alike is just fine. No racism there, right?


djones94
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:39 pm

I think Molly Ivins offered the best description of Camille back in 1991. Well worth a read. http://www.its.caltech.edu/~erich/misc/ivins_on…


ricmarc
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:40 pm

looks like camille got her wish and drudge linked to this piece. it is obvious from the idiotic right wing birther comments. what a bunch of LOSERS!

camille, YOU DON'T HAVE A POINT AND NEITHER DO THE BIRTHERS!


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:44 am

no. . .he’s a fraud. I’ll never give up until he releases his records etc.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:44 am

No, you have stubborn, willful ignorance on your side.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:44 pm

Pure B.S., and you are a liar. Your post has appeared almost word for word on numerous other forums by numerous other posters. The only thing “off the top of your head” that you could possibly have contributed is dandruff.


Ralph
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:44 pm

It's both obvious and well-documented that waste dumps and factories that pollute are more likely to be located near lower-income populations than near higher-income populations where minorities live.


ricmarc
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:46 pm

the stupid opportunistic woman is saying people who don't have a point have a point when all they are trying to do is undermine the president with LIES. none of the other people you mentioned have anything to do with the subject at hand nor this administration with the exception of van jones and he really doesn't matter anymore, he resigned because he SPOKE THE TRUTH ABOUT REPUBLICANS.

you, just like camille and the birthers, DON'T HAVE A VALID POINT!


ricmarc
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:48 pm

IT IS OBVIOUS YOU WERE BORN ON THE PLANET RETARD. YOU PROBABLY TALK LIKE A RETARDED HILLBILLY.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:49 am

The only obvious thing to everyone, but not yourself, is that you are more
republican than you are willing to admit.


ricmarc
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:49 pm

amen. that dyke needs to stfu. i say this as a gay man.


ricmarc
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 7:51 pm

i can't believe that DECADES ago, she's OLD, i used to like camille. i read her book after she was on 60 minutes DECADES ago. she is old news looking for a last gasp of fame. she loves gtetting linked by drudge.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:53 am

Ignorance? I’ve made many factual statements on this thread, disprove a single one, or eff-off idiot.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:58 am

I too am independent. Didn’t vote for McCain. Pretty much hate em all.


Jim-John-James
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:58 am

Sure Steve, as soon as you show us yours.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:00 am

No, you’ve made only assertions which you are stubbornly, in your ignorance, insisting are facts.


socks22
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:07 pm

Excellent point, Kim. Very convincing and articulate.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:08 am

LOL.


nonr
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:08 pm

If Paglia was being sincere and not hiding her own acist tendencies she should have enumerated the legitimate questions about Obamas birth certificate documentation and the evidence needed to answer those questions to her satisfaction. Just because I ddo not like her writing I could as well say I have legitimate questions regarding her gender.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:09 am

You only THINK you know if something is being hid. See the difference between a statement of fact and your statement of delusion.

“He’s a fraud.”, is an assertion. You are a lunatic, is a fact.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:16 am

Hello Captainsteve:

Can you believe these people?

This is like shooting fish in a barrel!

Not one cogent argument…no facts..just name calling…rather childish…keep up the good work Captainsteve and I’ll see you at the Supreme Court.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:16 am

OK, then go get a copy of yours and post it on the net. It’ll stop raising questions about you.


mhoeee
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:18 pm

I can tell she is Italian: she sports a lite mustache !!


Gloria Stephens
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:20 pm

The thing is – it is so easy to kill all questions by obtaining and releasing the long version of Obama's birth certificate and when those actions are not taken, it does raise questions of why not?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:28 am

The question was “describe”, not “define”. Still maintaining your superior stupidity, eh stevie?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:30 pm

The energy spent here by the lefties to “eat-one-of-their-own” partially answers the question, why doesn't this issue get more press. But that doesn't make it right. We've got right on our side. Never give up!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Granny2
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:32 pm

The constitution says that a president must be a “natural born Citizen” which is interpreted to mean being an American citizen at the time of birth. This does NOT mean that someone must be born within The United States.
The Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952 specifies that American citizenship is passed to a child born outside the United States to an American citizen who “was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years.” President Obama's mother was an American who fulfilled those residency requirements. Barack Obama is a “natural born Citizen” even if he had been born abroad.


boxjob
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:35 pm

This Paglia woman is a bit insulated. You see back in 1960 a mere two years or so after statehood, a lot of records were informally kept the old fashioned way as it were. Way before computers. Not like a Bush, Kenedy or Rockfeller child where the inheritance rights or so substantial that this alone ensure that all documents are in perfect condition. Just some black folk not very welcome in Hawaii either in 1960 registering a birth. The clincher though are all the birth announcement in the local papers. How do these conspiracy nutters attempt to explain those? Aliens did it I suppose. But to prove that these “irregularities” were a relatively common occourance back then one would have to do a sample of all the birth certificates issued in Hawii in 1960 and that would not be worth the cost so these people get to rant on like they have a point. Maybe if they grow their hair real long no one will notice.


ziphead
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:36 pm

uhhh … because the State of Hawaii does not have a “long form” birth certificate to release?

Seriously, this “birther” thing is even nuttier than the “truther” thing.


jakash
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:37 pm

I can't believe people are still wasting energy on Ms Paglia. She loves pornography and thinks there is no racism except against Italians. Her mind has been addled for years.. and now the slide into dementia


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:38 am

Really, then we all can’t wait for the the listing of your entrance into a mental institution.


terry
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:39 am

I’d like to define it as this: An actual birth= Delivered from a mother, taking place in the US. This is as opposed to the only unnatural birth I know of: a fake born-again birth. All born agains have cancelled out their natural birth and are hereby disqualified from ever being POTUS. Could have saved us from Carter and Bush!


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:41 am

You are crazy. You say there must be a duistinction between citizen and natural born citizen in the context of the US Constitution. I say, of course there is. In the context of the requirements to be a senator you must be a citizen for nine years which leads to the fact that you do not have to be natural born. The requirement is that you must have been a citizen for at least nine years to be a Senator so obviously someone naturalized nine years ago can be a Senator today. However, using that same logic for the requirements to be POTUS you cannot be naturalized, but must be native born. Many of our early POTUS had British born parents and met the natural born requirement of the USC.


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:43 am

So a citizen of the US is governed by the laws of a foreign country? Don’t be silly. All that the above citation suggests is that Obama had the option of British citizenship.

And?


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 8:55 pm

No they aren't! What planet do you live on? The Hospital produces a certification of birth and sends it to the county health officer who authorizes it! In some cases the local newspaper then asks the health officer for a listing of births.

THAT HAS TO BE THE STUPIDEST POST I HAVE EVER SEEN!


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:01 am

Steve, at one point in this conversation you said that I seemed reasonable. I’m afraid that at this point you don’t. He was the editor of the Law Review at Harvard; there’s actually a pretty long paper trail. He has numerous articles, and credit on two books by one of Harvard’s top constitutional law professors. (Do you think that Chicago Law accepted him as an adjunct without some serious credentials? They are a top-ranked school.) This is a Whitewater/Clinton witch hunt all over (Vince Foster was murdered, right?) I only hope this time it doesn’t end in a national humiliation (for which I blame the Republicans, not Clinton) and a stained dress.


michaelmartinez
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:01 pm

This totally surprises me since Salon used to be thought of as a support outlet for progressives. Camille Paglia represents the opposite of what Salon has been identified as. Her validation of the “birther” movement is contrary to having a real discussion about real issues. Salon needs to fire her and let her work for Drudge…since all her stuff ends up there anyway.


phil22
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:03 pm

What is a long form birth cert? I don't have one (I think because I'm not sure what one is) and I was born in San Jose, California in 1972. My birth cert is white lettering on black and measures about 3 by 7 inches. And what other records does he need? You people are making no sense.


phil22
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:04 pm

clever.


Margie
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:05 pm

Get over birthers. Obama is President aandd it's time to accept the fact. STOP THIS NONSENSE!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:06 pm

Glad you asked. Click this link to see what Obama’s real birth-certificate should look like. It’s for the two girls (Nordyke twins) that were born at the same day, time and place as Obama claims, and they are known to have gone to early school with Obama.

http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g160/steveb77…

As you could see, unlike the online fakes, the real certificates are very comprehensive. Obama wrote that he has it, in his book “Dreams.”

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:07 pm

Sure they have a lon-form. Click this link to see what Obama’s real birth-certificate should look like. It’s for the two girls (Nordyke twins) that were born at the same day, time and place as Obama claims, and they are known to have gone to early school with Obama.

http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g160/steveb77…

As you could see, unlike the online fakes, the real certificates are very comprehensive. Obama wrote that he has it, in his book “Dreams.”

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


gjoh
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:07 pm

If there was any real legitimacy to the “birther” issue
Obama would have never made it thru the primary.
He would have been driven out of the race. The only
reason it is still an issue at all is because White leaders
like Ms Paglia keep mainstreaming the issue. If Professor
Gates was white, he would have never been arrested.
And if Obama was white, we wouldn't still be talking about
this. Yes, it's racist!


michaelmartinez
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:10 pm

Get past the truthers argument…it is so yesterday. It's just like you Repubs who kept dredging up Clinton for 8 solid years and you still won't let go. The truthers did not permeate town hall meetings, the truthers did not call for the illegitimacy of Bushes ascension to power. They didn't bring guns to places where Bush spoke. They didn't try to take Bush to court to prove their ideology. There is no comparison. The truthers were based on theory and rumor…the birthers are trying to use the courts to prove their points, despite the facts, and have become vitriolic in their objection to the current President. Finally, Van Jones, Michael Moore, Sean Penn, Charlie Sheen do not work for Salon.com. They spoke out as citizens and not for any organization, they didn't go to court to prove anything. You and your birther friends need to get with the program…put your guns away, keep your vitriolic statements to yourselves and debate the issues on their merit…not on your insistence that everyone needs to think like you or they are un-american.


pbg
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:10 pm

Why should he?
What does he get?
If he releases his long form birth certificate, you guys will just scream 'forgery!” and you will say “Why did he take so long?” and trumpet that you got him to back down.
You're not his friends, you're not his supporters, you won't move one inch from your intransigent ideological positions, and you take friendliness as a sign of weakness.
Why on earth should he do you any favors at all?


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:11 pm

Now what happens is that they take the certificate you have a copy it on to bank note paper. The thing that dummy Captainsteve ignores is “Informational” birth certificates. In California, who can and does get an unrestricted birth certificate is restricted. So now you redact certain information and slap “For informational purposes only” on it. Hawaii solves the problem differently by producing the document that has been generally shown. Its simply an informational certificate. Nobody with a bit of brains publicly releases their birth certificate for perusal. It can be stolen and used to make forgeries. By the way, the person who pointed that last little fact out is…ANN COULTER. Even she knows how absurd the birthers are…


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:11 pm

Now what happens is that they take the certificate you have a copy it on to bank note paper. The thing that dummy Captainsteve ignores is “Informational” birth certificates. In California, who can and does get an unrestricted birth certificate is restricted. So now you redact certain information and slap “For informational purposes only” on it. Hawaii solves the problem differently by producing the document that has been generally shown. Its simply an informational certificate. Nobody with a bit of brains publicly releases their birth certificate for perusal. It can be stolen and used to make forgeries. By the way, the person who pointed that last little fact out is…ANN COULTER. Even she knows how absurd the birthers are…


nunyabiz
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:11 pm

First off Hawaii does NOT have long form BCs.
The only ones they have is the one Obama has shown.
Secondly they have listed 2 different birth announcements in the Hawaiian news paper where he was born on the date he was born.
The official in Hawaii that handles birth certificates has verified his birth certificate as authentic.

Anybody that keeps questioning this is an idiot.


Name
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:12 pm

Paglia needs a Pricking !!


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:14 pm

That's a distortion. The one you see about Obama is an informational certificate. Who gets an unrestricted one is limited by statute.

http://msgboard.snopes.com/politics/graphics/bi…

This is a proper birth certificate.

Sorry..


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:15 pm

Because nobody with a brain does that. They can be stolen and forged. You almost never see anybodies actual certificate. Only an idiot does that.


Julie
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:19 pm

Camille, Camille, Camille:

Did you forget your Aricept or Namenda today?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:20 am

That’s the point. Dingle Barry was a dual citizen. Many (I’ll say the majority) constitutional experts have deemed dual citizens ineligible due to conflict of interest.

At the least, it should be ruled on by the SCOTUS.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:22 pm

Sure my post was correct. It's no different than how newspapers list home sales or bankruptcies. The persons involved don't report it those either. It's a routine recording of the public record.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:39 am

Gee, I “surmise” that from your attempts at insults made recently that you are a liar and that is the extent (not “extant”) of your pitiful wailing to try to get someone else to agree with with your delusional opinions. Now wipe the drool from your mouth, it’s unbecoming.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:39 am

Gee, I “surmise” that from your attempts at insults made recently that you are a liar and that is the extent (not “extant”) of your pitiful wailing to try to get someone else to agree with with your delusional opinions. Now wipe the drool from your mouth, it’s unbecoming.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:43 am

The banana can’t define NBC……It’s afraid!…but it’s fat, uncouth and shallow..just an old banana…


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:43 am

The banana can’t define NBC……It’s afraid!…but it’s fat, uncouth and shallow..just an old banana…


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:44 am

Oh my, really slow aren’t you. Do you have to wear the helmet all day?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:44 am

Oh my, really slow aren’t you. Do you have to wear the helmet all day?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:52 am

Fair enough. Forgive my snarkiness.

Not to nitpick (I agree with the bulk of your comment) McCain’s status was via a congressional “resolution.” Legally, that carries no weigh at all.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:52 am

Fair enough. Forgive my snarkiness.

Not to nitpick (I agree with the bulk of your comment) McCain’s status was via a congressional “resolution.” Legally, that carries no weigh at all.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:52 am

more slower …are u trying to be funny or stupid?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:52 am

more slower …are u trying to be funny or stupid?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:53 pm

Sure they do. Click this link to see what Obama’s real birth-certificate should look like. It’s for the two girls (Nordyke twins) that were born at the same day, time and place as Obama claims, and they are known to have gone to early school with Obama.

http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g160/steveb77…

As you could see, unlike the online fakes, the real certificates are very comprehensive. Obama wrote that he has it, in his book “Dreams.”

Newspaper birth announcements are meaningless. They are triggered automatically upon application for a birth-certificate, regardless of birth-place, in the same way as newspapers list home sales or bankruptcies. The persons involved don't report it. It's a routine recording of the public record.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:54 pm

Is that so? Then why are you here?

If there wasn't anything to this issue, the obamabots wouldn't be here vociferously smearing those who question. Why aren't they at the “truther” or “area 51″ sites? They KNOW this is a real issue, and they don't want the truth to get out!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Erin
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 9:55 pm

Embarrassing as it is to admit this, I used to love reading Paglia when I was in college. I officially stopped reading her Salon Column two years ago after all she did was complain about “Liberal Elites”. Camille, you have a PhD from Yale and your father was a professor–like you know anything else. Between a few other things and with this incident, she's lost all credibility, IMHO.

As far as sex-positive Italian Americans, I'll stick with Diablo Cody–her wordplay gets irritating, I'll admit. Paglia's only real usefulness these days is provide soundbites about Madonna (if she's worth that much)–another Italian American whose own relevance is fading.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:57 am

Exactly! That’s why I understand how stupid you and stevie are.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:57 am

Exactly! That’s why I understand how stupid you and stevie are.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:57 am

wear a helmet???? answer the question…you’re the clever one…make up some funny definition of NBC…come on banana….define NBC ….the BANANA says, “…..


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:57 am

wear a helmet???? answer the question…you’re the clever one…make up some funny definition of NBC…come on banana….define NBC ….the BANANA says, “…..


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:00 am

BANANA, answer the question…you clever banana you


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:00 am

BANANA, answer the question…you clever banana you


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:00 pm

You confuse the citizenship types. But since you're so expert on it, please explain the difference between these 3 citizenship types, since they are used differently in the US Constitution.

1) Citizen

2) Native-born Citizen

3) Natural-born Citizen

thx


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:03 pm

He said in his book “Dreams” that he has it. Let's see it! What's he hiding?

I know what he's hiding. He's a fraud.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:05 am

ROTFLMAO! More slower! That is priceless!

Banana, How do you conjugate the verb “to be”?

Let me guess, I be, you be, we be, they be. Is that right?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:05 am

ROTFLMAO! More slower! That is priceless!

Banana, How do you conjugate the verb “to be”?

Let me guess, I be, you be, we be, they be. Is that right?


aakalan
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:09 pm

Mental illness strikes every 30 seconds in America.
Your post is a case in point.

Can't stand that we have an African-American President, can you?


aakalan
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:12 pm

Please get a life.


hpatrick
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:14 pm

its like denying the holocaust. so the paperwork is not perfect. what are you camile? a bureaucrat? stop just looking for an issue to draw attention to yourself. go get…


aakalan
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:14 pm

You might be thinking of her “lesbian” period. Ms.Paglia changes ideologies and sexual identities with the wind. She is a Liberal-Conservative-Fascist-Lesbian-Straight-Feminist-Anti-Feminist. In other words, she is in love with reading her own words.

This is a woman with serious problems. I can't imagine why Salon publishes her – a throwback to her far-left past?


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:14 pm

This 'African-American' thing is getting a bit old. He's just as 'white' as he is 'black'.

Of course, Van Jones couldn't stand 'white environmentalists'…I wonder what he thinks of Al Gore?


George
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:23 am

Great. Now that that’s settled, go to bed and get some sleep. You have a big day ahead of you: lawyers to hire, legal briefs to file. And don’t forget to buy yourself a nice new suit and a pair of shiny new shoes for your appearance at the Supreme Court.


George
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:23 am

Great. Now that that’s settled, go to bed and get some sleep. You have a big day ahead of you: lawyers to hire, legal briefs to file. And don’t forget to buy yourself a nice new suit and a pair of shiny new shoes for your appearance at the Supreme Court.


VIPER
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:27 pm

First the RNC and McCain camps have said they investigated his birth records and found no problems.

The Republican Governor of Hawaii has attested to its authenticty.

And every document supplied by a Birther has been fake just like the pictures of the crowds of the Tea Baggers in DC. ( 2 million,… Ha ha)

Birthers, teabaggers have zero crediability.. Reagan trippled the Debt, Bush turned the only surplus a president started out with into the largest deficits losing 7 million MFG jobs and again trippled the national debt! He borrowed from communist China to pay for tax cuts, wars and the Medicare Durg plan .. a gift to the insurance and drug companies. No net private sector jobs created in 8 years.. just government jobs. And he left this country in the worst shape in 80 years with the two longest wars in our history still going on… 80% of our industrialization loss and since reaganomicreal wages have dropped 18%.

And where were the tea baggers as our country was looted and the greatest transfer of wealth in trade deficits in the history of the world occured as our jobs went to communist and sociallist countries.. where were the crys of Socialism? The only reason our country is afloat is because of Communist China! Try to buy a product in Walmarts made in our capitalist country!

Socialism.. how about the south spedning 32 billion to build the MFG plants for foreign companies? How about oru MFG going to canada becuase their helathcare as with all single payer cost half as much and thus goods can be made cheaper there and in Europe .. a 20% pricing advantage. How come they act as if all was well to jan 20th of this year?

Regards

.


Kim
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:33 pm

Steve, you are wearying. Of course there is a long-form certificate, as you say. It was archived when the computer-generated short-form was brought in. Numerous state government officials (as I stated in my previous posting) have examined the archived document—including the Republican governor of the state—and publically affirmed its authenticity. Yet another declaration from a mid-level Hawaiian official was released only a few months ago. Use google. It’s a helpful invention.

But I do wonder how you assume that Obama has lived in the US, obtained a passport, license, mortgage and all of the other accessories to modern life without a legitimate birth certificate and a Social Security number. Unlike how it is in Orly Taitz world, these things are actually difficult to acquire—except by the usual means of birth and/or citizenship in the US. (And any citizenship application on the part of Obama would leave a paper trail.) Taitz seems to believe that you only need a relative to speak in your defense—but she was also once claiming that both parents needed to be born in this county to qualify a person for the presidency. So, other than some hilarious fraudulent birth certificates from a nation that was not in existence when Obama was born, the woman’s not good for much.

The fact is that you cannot make up a social security number and not be discovered pretty easily by law enforcement. (I suspect FBI would pick up on that one.) And even the Hawaii short-form requires an archived long-form for support (until they abandoned the long-form altogether). If documentation were as easy to get as you suggest, we would not have so many undocumented workers in this country.

Finally, if you think Camille Paglia is a “lefty” as you say, you have obviously never read her.


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:36 pm

I'm not a Republican, or Democrat. I hate those party icons the Kennedys and Ronnie with equal venom.

Truthers, like Michael Moore, employed their considerable media connections to spread the lie that the Pentagon somehow knew and was actively involved in the mass murder of 3,000 civilians. And yes, the perps were MUSLIMS, motivated by Islamist ideology and admitted into the country by America's ridiculous immigration system. No amount of equivocating about religions can change the fact that the Qur'an–dictated by the child molesting, illiterate 'prophet' Mohammed (Aisha was NINE when he consummated their marriage) to his followers–promises mass murderers an orgy with 72 virginal whores in the afterlife. And these are the people that B.O. wants to appease.

'Birthers', on the other hand, are making the perfectly reasonable request that Obama provide proof that he was, in fact, born where he said he was. McCain was asked to do the same thing and complied; why is this a touchy thing for Obama's supporters, like yourself?

Also, the 'birthers' haven't roughed-up their opponents, as Obama's union thugs have been doing at the town halls. In New Hamshire and elsewhere, civilians are allowed to carry concealed weapons, with a permit (permits aren't needed, in Vermont and Alaska). You obviously don't have a problem with Obama and company waltzing about crowds, with a team of machinegun-toting guards. Another interesting fact: Mr Gun Control, Sean Penn, is one of a handfull of civilians in LA who has a concealed handgun permit. These are not easy to get. All the more remarkable, when you consider the fact that he's shot at a paparazzi helecopter, roughed people up and admitted to drug and alcohol abuse. Obviously, mob connections get you far.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:37 am

His skin is as white as he is black. Bothers you that only you nutty, Van Jones types and the KKKers care about ‘race’, does it?


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:37 am

His skin is as white as he is black. Bothers you that only you nutty, Van Jones types and the KKKers care about ‘race’, does it?


im1dc
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:38 pm

People still read Paglia?


Adam
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:41 pm

HI provides photocopies of vault (origional) copies upon request. The last I checked, it was $10.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:43 am

Until the Repugnants support actual socialized medicine–a la the old Dellums bill, not Obama’s HMO porkbarrel–I think they suck.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:43 am

Until the Repugnants support actual socialized medicine–a la the old Dellums bill, not Obama’s HMO porkbarrel–I think they suck.


pinkibus
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 10:44 pm

Personally, I think Obama is from a distant planet and if you get some kryptonite he will lose his superman powers. Kryptonite will prove he is not only not born in Hawaii but is not even born on earth.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:10 am

Unfortunately, single payer or an expansion on Medicaid is not politically
feasible, not just because the GOP is against it, but because a large number
of moderate/ conservative democrats hold a huge voting bloc in both the
house and senate. If a strong bill with consumer protections and a public
option is not passed…there will be movement by progressives to target
those moderate/conservative dems in 2010. The line has been drawn and ads
are already starting to hit the internet and TV stations in those
districts…in fact some are starting to acquiesce and support a public
option. The public option trigger is a farce and a gimmick to stall real
reform–don’t fall for it.

Keep in mind that Obama can’t give us HMO, cuz Nixon already did that. We
currently have HMO’s and PPO’s…with no real enforced competition or
consumer protections. I agree with you that Obama needs to stay away from
the “lets make the status quo better”…that will not fly with the
progressive wing.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:10 am

Unfortunately, single payer or an expansion on Medicaid is not politically
feasible, not just because the GOP is against it, but because a large number
of moderate/ conservative democrats hold a huge voting bloc in both the
house and senate. If a strong bill with consumer protections and a public
option is not passed…there will be movement by progressives to target
those moderate/conservative dems in 2010. The line has been drawn and ads
are already starting to hit the internet and TV stations in those
districts…in fact some are starting to acquiesce and support a public
option. The public option trigger is a farce and a gimmick to stall real
reform–don’t fall for it.

Keep in mind that Obama can’t give us HMO, cuz Nixon already did that. We
currently have HMO’s and PPO’s…with no real enforced competition or
consumer protections. I agree with you that Obama needs to stay away from
the “lets make the status quo better”…that will not fly with the
progressive wing.


hank139
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:10 pm

I REALLY expected more from Salon.


frankstclair
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:20 pm

Kim, don't be foolish. Congressional hearings were held on John McCain's eligibility. All relevant documentation was produced. Explain exactly why Mr. Obama should not produce his birth certificate. Hawaii certainly does not make it hard to get. They make it particularly easy to get a short form, though. If one relative will start you were born there, it will be issued. Why is this particular president immune from vetting?


The Old Man
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:21 pm

She needs to get out in the sunshine… She's lacking vitamins or oxygen, or something.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:29 pm

You seam reasonable. . .unlike most on you side that prefer to hurl insults (that you can see don't affect me). So, I'll “bite.”

I contend that there a logical counters to every point you have made. Only the most salient really matter however, unlike the SS # issue. I've studied this issue for 18 months.

Would you change your position if the evidence pointed the other way (fyi. . .I would)? If not, no use having a “debate.” Most people are set regardless and don't want to be “confused by the facts.”


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:32 pm

correction. . .I meant “seem”. . .let's people freak out.


DragonMama
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:33 pm

Obama provided his birth certificate almost a year ago, if not more than a year ago at this point. You can also find his birth announcement if you do a Google search for it – Honolulu newspaper printed the announcement automatically for all hospital births from the looks of it. But you can only see information that you are willing to look at, and if you're not even going to look…. well, intentional blindness is your choice as a human being I guess.


chrisjay
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:34 pm

Wow, Paglia must be desperate for exposure-throwing in with the Birchers—-er the Birthers. I seldom waste any time or energy rebutting Birther nonsense but I got a good nights sleep and have a minute or 2 so…I worked for the State Dept for several years authenticating birth certificates for the Passport Agency, and EVERY claim I have heard in support of these people is unmitigated gibberish.
End of story
Case closed


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:35 pm

Me get a life?

You're the one chatting on the internet with people you think are crazy! Explain that one, a**-wipe.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:36 pm

True, you can get a copy. But you and I both know the point is that nobody publishes them. I can get a copy of mine. But I will be damned if I show it to anybody. Obama is the same.


barbaraharshav
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:36 pm

Paglia will say anything outrageous to epater everybody with an ounce of sense


DragonMama
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:38 pm

Go look up the Honolulu birth announcements from the newspaper. They're archived on microfilm and have even been posted to the internet. There was a birth announcement in the paper announcing a baby boy born to Mr. & Mrs. Barack Obama. How much documentation and evidence would you require to convince you to change your position? The information is there, but only if you bother to look at it. Otherwise it's just a tree that fell in a forest where no one was around to hear it – does it exist? If the facts are there but birthers are unwilling to look at them, yes, the facts DO still exist.


Miranda
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:44 pm

Take your meds.


jonhogan
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:44 pm

Talking from her nether-regions again-


JimTreacher
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:50 pm

Questioning the circumstances of a birth in the early '60s is just like accusing George Bush of planning a mass murder that played out on live TV.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:52 am

Your listing is 100% B/S. Obama has proven he was born in Hawaii to the proper people and owes you and other idiots no information.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:53 pm

In order to be a “natural born citizen” one must be:
A. Born on US soil
B. Born of 2 US Citizens

Barry does not meet the eligibility requirements for POTUS. Barry's own website acknowledged that Barry's birth was governed by British law. Eventually a Federal judge, with stones, will hear the case on its merits.

The only entity that certified or “investigated” Barry's eligibility was not the FBI, CIA or any other agency but the DNC. Barry has much to hide and its showing. The MSM and the DNC did not vet this man. His background is actively being scrubbed and hidden. This should make every American very suspicious.

His life story should be an “open book.” Rather, we've only read about him through his own books. When Barry's campaign was questioned about his birth place, why didn't Barry order the Hawaiin Department of Health to release his long-form BC? Why doesn't he release his school records,selective service records, passport records? If there's no harm, then release them.

But he cannot and eventually he will either resign or not seek a second term. He's the “American Idol” President. The image and the story was sold to the American people. However, now bloggers, attorneys and the internet are doing the vetting that was once left to a “free press.”


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:53 pm

That's is a compelling question that birthers must answer. Here's mine.

Newspaper birth announcements aren't definitive. They are often triggered automatically upon application for a birth-certificate, regardless of birth-place, in the same way as newspapers list home sales or bankruptcies. The persons involved don't report it. It's a routine recording of the public record.

Additionally, back then it was very common for grand-parents to put announcements in their “home-town” paper for big events like graduations, births, marriages etc. That was done regardless of the location of the event itself.

Certainly those announcements would be effective arguments that he WAS in fact born (not in question), but they are not effective in answering where.


DragonMama
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:54 pm

I was born in Ohio in 1976. I have an unofficial xerox copy of my long form birth certificate that looks like the ones in that photobucket. However, I don't have an official embossed one of the long form. I went and requested my birth certificate a few years ago when I was driving up to Canada to visit my husband's family. That re-issued one looks very similar to the one Obama's posted. As a social scientist, I was very disappointed as I wanted the deeper data information my original shows, but that's what they give now when you request an OFFICIAL birth certificate. The long form he may have a copy of, but it may just be that – a copy – and would probably be accused of forging it if he tried to produce it anyway, so the man is kinda damned if he does and damned if he doesn't with this, isn't he? Meanwhile, you've got people from all parts of the political spectrum who have reviewed and verified the authenticity of Hawaii's records on Obama's birth, but that's not enough. McCain was verifiably NOT born in the US – he was born in Panama – but even Obama voted to say that was good enough since it was on a US military base. Hawaii has been a state since the 1950s, entering the union about 10 years before Obama was born if I remember my dates correctly (I just remember Hawaii became a state sometime after my mom was born in 1952 because it was profound to me as a child to realize that the flag hadn't had 50 stars longer than that).

Look into your heart. Would you really be making these demands in capital letters if his skin was fair and his hair non-curly? If his name was Barry O'Malley instead? All the evidence short of a time machine shows that he was born in Hawaii. He's has a US Passport since he was a child, his citizenship by birth has been long ago verified by much more qualified people than you or I.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 19, 2009 @ 11:56 pm

You obviously done your homework. You're are exactly right. You go to the front of the class!


Anteni
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:02 am

Birthers' have a point????

Here is a comment by a birther “Barry's own website acknowledged that Barry's birth was governed by British law. Eventually a Federal judge, with stones, will hear the case on its merits.” This is an obvious lie. Is this a birthers' point. We use “have a point” to express that someone has a legitimate question based on the facts. Making things up and ignoring the facts just mean that you have a personal vendetta or just hate someone because they are different. It is hard to determine what the president did to those who believe he was born in America. The only conclusion that one can come to is they hate him because he is different from them.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:04 am

Jim:

No one is questioning “the circumstances of a birth in the early 60's.” The question is:

Is the son of a British father and US Citizen mother considered a “natual born citizen?” In other words, if Osama Bin Laden impregnates a US Citizen, and that women gives birth to a child on US soil, then can the offspring of that union be considered a “natural born citizen” and thus eligible to be POTUS?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:09 am

His father was a British citizen. Whether he was born in Hawaii or not, British law did apply. He was a dual-citizen.


George
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:09 am

Absolutely nowhere in the Constitution does it define “natural born citizen”. The term is left wholly ambiguous. Now you and your Klan buddies may prefer to believe that conditions A and B must be met, and that's fine to state it as your OPINION; but it simply is NOT in the Constitution nor has any court EVER defined it.


aakalan
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:09 am

Everything's a battle to you, isn't it?

“Us” against “Them”, thus you start a whole new line of contention with the Van Jones issue.

Some of us want to work together to better America.
Some of us want to tear it apart.

Which are you?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:11 am

Anteni:

You said I lied? Well, here's what Barry's own website said about his birth:

‘When Barack Obama Jr. was born on Aug. 4,1961, in Honolulu, Kenya was a British colony, still part of the United Kingdom’s dwindling empire. As a Kenyan native, Barack Obama Sr. was a British subject whose citizenship status was governed by The British Nationality Act of 1948. That same act governed the status of Obama Sr.‘s children…’ “ Posted on “Fight the smears”. Com

In fact, Anteni, the only one as you put it who is, “Making things up and ignoring the facts” is you. Good day.


aakalan
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:11 am

That's right, set up a straw man.

Make an accusation, then when someone responds, you say “see, you wouldn't respond unless there was something to it”. Black is white and white is black and day is night and night is day.

Your trap is obvious and juvenile. That's why I previously recommended that you get a life.

I'm not playing your tawdry game any more.


George
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:12 am

But his skin is black and that's what tears you up inside isn't it?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:15 am

Then given what you've said, then you'll agree to have the Supreme Court define it?


George
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:17 am

I whole-heartedly endorse this whole birther conspiracy thing. By all means, I say knock yourselves out: spend every penny you can on any right-wing nut-job lawyer who will gladly take your money and pursue the issue all the way to the Supreme Court, even if it takes years, even if it takes a lifetime. The end result will be that you'll end up penniless and STILL have a black President.


The Kid
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:18 am

Should you ever get pulled over by the police and the police officer asks to see your drivers license refuse and tell him the other person in the car knows I have a drivers license and will swear on a bible that I do in fact have a drivers license. See where this gets you!
Obama is not just hiding his birth certificate. He hides ALL his records.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:24 am

Really, 18 months studying this? Wow, what a slow learner!


nunyabiz
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:25 am

Total BS.
Obamas BC is valid and has been proven more than any President in history.
Yes birth announcements are triggered upon “application for a birth certificate” .
Case closed.
Are you really that stupid to believe that this is some elaborate hoax 47 years in the making? ROTFL


JimTreacher
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:26 am

You're missing the point. That's not like 9/11 either.


George
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:26 am

Absolutely (not that the Supreme Court asks for my opinion all that often). But isn't that what usually happens when there is Constitutional ambiguity? The Supreme Court decides.
But as I've said many times before: I WHOLE-HEARTEDLY encourage birthers to spend every penny they can scrounge up on any lawyer who will gladly take their money and pursue the issue all the way to the Supreme Court, even if it takes years, even if it takes a lifetime. The end result will be that the birthers will end up broke, the lawyers will end up rich, and Barack Obama will still be President of the United States.


nunyabiz
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:27 am

Whats it like being stupid?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:29 am

Hello…hello George, are you there George??????

Do you wish to define “natural born citizen” in the Supreme Court?…Earth to George…come in please….Earth to George?


pbg
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:29 am

Or you could produce a document that constitutes legal proof in a court of law that you are qualified to operate a motor vehicle.

Of course, if you were in certain parts of the United States, and were black, the police officer might say, “I don't know. seems to me there's something funny about this hyar driver's license. Suppose we discuss this down at the po-lice station?”


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:29 am

You said it yourself..

It's a routine recording of the public record.

THAT IS THE POINT. There was a public record made. The registration is verified by the County and there you have it. Proof he was born in Hawaii..Geez that was too easy..LOL


traveldog
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:29 am

If she has studied it so thoroughly, then she should be able and willing to explain precisely what the “legitimate questions about the documentation” are. Apparently the State of Hawaii has no question about it, so what is her concern? Enough of this “I've studied it and so you can take my word” — how many times have O'Reilly, Limbaugh, Beck and the like used that …. and then been proven wrong. So my response would be “put up or shut up”: convince me (or any reasonable person) that there are some “legitimate questions” —- or keep quiet.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:30 am

US Constitution Lesson #1.

President requires:

Article II, Section 1 No person except a natural-born citizen or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.

Senate requires

Article I Section III No person shall be a Senator who shall not have been nine years a citizen of the United States

Clearly they held a distinction (for POTUS) between a “citizen,” and a “natural-born” citizen. The difference is that Citizen or Native-born citizen could have one citizen parent. “Natural-born” citizen was to prevent dual allegiances and meant two citizen parents and born on US soil.


Name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:31 am

Why is this so difficult? Obama does not like scrutiny of any of his records. His original birth certificate has never been released, and he could end it all right now if there wasn't something to hide. This is so simple! I don't think a President should have ANY right to withhold ANY record. The position is too sensitive and powerful for this kind of background secrecy.


traveldog
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:32 am

Good!! And I'll say to The Kid the same thing I indicated should be asked of Ms Paglia. What records has Obama withheld? Please be specific and give cites to a *reliable* source that says certain records were requested and refused.


citizenferrous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:34 am

that's bullshit … he could produce a filmed version of his birth and you whackjobs would say it was a fake … enjoy the freedom fries teabagger


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:40 am

You're right about damned if he does or doesn't, but it's not just the BC. If he was open about his past and was vetted during the campaign it wouldn't be an issue. He's hidden everything. Nothing makes sense. Here's the list of records.

• Original, vault copy birth certificate — Not released — over $1,000,000 spent to conceal — birth certificate — $15.
• Certification of Live Birth — Released – probable counterfeit
• Admitted British/Kenyan citizenship at birth — Admitted
• Hospital of birth — Three hospitals have some claim — 2 in Hawaii 1 in Kenya
• Obama/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Obama/Dunham divorce — Not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Kindergarten records – “lost”
• Soetoro/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Soetoro adoption records — Not released
• Fransiskus Assisi School School application — not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Punahou School records — Not released
• Soetoro/Dunham divorce – concealed by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Selective Service Registration — Released – and proven counterfeit
• Occidental College records — Not released
• Passport — Not released — investigation witness shot dead
• Columbia College records — Not released
• Columbia thesis — “Soviet Nuclear Disarmament” – Not released
• Harvard College records — Not released
• Harvard Law Review articles — None
• Illinois Bar Records — Not released.
• Medical records — Not released
• Illinois State Senate records — None
• Illinois State Senate schedule — “Lost”
• Law practice client list — Not released
• University of Chicago scholarly articles — None

If he said, here's all my stuff, and if what was there checked out. I'd say, I was wrong. But given the evidence, I say he's a liar a fraud and a usurper.

RE the race issue. . .I swear in the name of God. It's not the case. You're right I don't like him, but not cuz of his color. If he shared my morals and values, I'd be tootin' his horn. . .but still asking for his B/C.

McCain was ineligible. . .not natural-born. I think the two parties cut a deal.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:41 am

Well, good then you should file a “friendly brief” so that this issue, which should have been resolved before the election can heard.

As to your previous post the the term is “wholly ambiguous”, I suggest you read the Federalist Papers. It is in the letters of Madison, John Jay and Hamilton where the term is defined. Allow me to bring some Constitutional history to you. Here's what John Jay wrote to George Washington, the presiding officer, of the Constitutional Convention: “Permit me to hint, whether it would be wise and seasonable to provide a strong check to the admission of Foreigners into the administration of our national Government; and to declare expressly that the Commander in Chief of the American army shall not be given to nor devolve on, any but a natural born Citizen.”

So, since Barry's birth was governed by British law, then even a “Klansman” like me, knows what the tern “natural born citizen” really means……No Foreign Influence


dcf
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:42 am

Birthers are STUPID. The State of Hawaii has released the Birth Certificate for review. Few, if any, states give it's citizens their ORIGINAL BC. Why? Because if it is lost, then what are you supposed to get as proof? They'll send you a copy. This Birther nonsense is pursued by people too dumb or too bigoted to let it go. I doubt if many of them can even read the birth certificate, since it has been shown on many internet sites. OBTW. Was John McCain born on US soil? Noooooooo. But let's not question his qualifications to be a Senator or a POTUS.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:45 am

Jim:

Can you answer my question? Or, are you unwilling to answer it?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:46 am

You're right. It doesn't. It says this.

US Constitution Lesson #1.

President requires:

Article II, Section 1 No person except a natural-born citizen or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.

Senate requires

Article I Section III No person shall be a Senator who shall not have been nine years a citizen of the United States

Clearly they held a distinction (for POTUS) between a “citizen,” and a “natural-born” citizen. The difference is that Citizen or Native-born citizen could have one citizen parent. “Natural-born” citizen was to prevent dual allegiances and meant two citizen parents and born on US soil.

How do you explain it?


pam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:48 am

lol!


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:48 am

You don't know that it meant that at all. What you give is your own myopic interpretation, what you wish it to mean.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:48 am

I don't know, but you sure ought to. Fill us in.


jimmyboyo1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:48 am

BS NO one in america NO ONE!!!! can release the original copy of their birth certificate.

It is NOT anyone's document, it belongs to each STATE where a birth occurs as official STATE PROPERTY!

States only release a proof of live birth certificate and or a xerox copy of the original STATE OWNED document. The reason has to do with security. original birth certtificates taken out of state hands and released to anyone would result in massive forged documentation for illegals.

Hawaii has released proof of live birth as they do with every citizen. REPUBLICAN sec of state and REPUBLICAN governor Linda Lingel have both viewed the original in the state archives and have both verified that Obama was born in Hawaii


George
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:49 am

As I've said: by all means spend all of your money, your entire life savings taking this to the Supreme Court. Knock yourself out. Hell, go to law school, get a degree and try it yourself. Have a bunch of kids and raise them all to be lawyers. Make a family enterprise out of it: have generation upon generation of “Do Gooders” make this their life's work. I completely, 110 percent heartily endorse your right as a citizen of the United States to your pursuit of happiness and if this is what makes you happy then go for it! You have my blessing.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:50 am

No, how do you explain what you wish to be the definition being asserted as so.


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:53 am

Exactly so; the constitution does not define “natural born citizen.” If it DID define it, and in the terms that you describe, Obama could have never run for President. (His father's citizenship is hardly a secret.) And Obama's birth is hardly governed by British law–and nor are we. I don't know what twaddle you are spouting.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:53 am

That is still not a definition, moron.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:54 am

You're correct on only one point. John McCain was also ineligible to be POTUS…….just as barry is.

BTW, no state releases an original. States only provide a “certified copy” of a birth certificate. And that is what over 3 dozens lawsuits are attempting to do….get Barry to provide one.


Johnny
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:56 am

First, Obama has not provided a copy of his Certificate of Live Birth, he provided the recent computer generated Birth Certificate. In the first few years of Hawaii's existence as a state, it allowed foreign born children, with foreign Certificates of Live Birth to obtain a certified Birth Certificate from the State of Hawaii. People are demanding to verify whether this practice was done in the case of Obama. As for McCain, he was born in Panama on a military base to American Citizens serving abroad. LONG before he was born, it was settled by the legislature that this type of birth of a child in this situation IS qualified as a naturalized citizenry. Now was Obama actually born in Kenya? The proof of that as affirmative or negative remains sealed in Hawaii, and again, Hawaii has NOT released the Certificate of Live Birth OR a copy of it.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:57 am

Then, please enlighten the world. Please describe the term “natural born citizen.”


Johnny
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:00 am

QUOTE “BS NO one in america NO ONE!!!! can release the original copy of their birth certificate.”
You are either mistaken or a liar. I obtained a certified copy of my ORIGINAL Certificate of Live birth, complete with the signature of the doctor that delivered me, and complete with witnesses signatures. I was born ONE year after Obama was born.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:01 am

I think you're the stupid one. Senate and POTUS requirements are different. McCain was eligible for Senate, but not POTUS.


jimmyboyo1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:02 am

this whole Obama's father was a british citizen nullifying his “natural born citizen” status is BS as well

“natural born citizen” is not defined in the constitution and obviously the founders did not intend for it to be defined like birthers delusionaly think = negates George Washington (both parents british citizens) and many of the first presidents since their parents were all british citizens subject to the crown pre the revolution!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

idiots


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:02 am

Barack Obama, John McCain, and I.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:03 am

I'll tell you why, because Obama is a fraud. You can see it in his fake speech patterns, in his fake stride, in his fake posture, and in his fake background and hidden records.

He’s clearly a puppet. The question is who’s puppet? Soros? The Saudi King? Putin?

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


jimmyboyo1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:05 am

did you read my whole post?

“…release a proof of live birth certificate…..”

Otherwise called “Certificate of Live birth” U'r certificate of live birth is NOT the original birth certificate. It is what ALL states release to show they have the original birth certificate on record!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:05 am

You are correct. That guy was obviously a retard. . .after all, what is an “original copy”? haha


bobnagy
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:06 am

Here is how you explain it. No one can be a citizen for nine years and be natural born. Natural born means born in US period. A citizen for nine years must have been naturalized not natural born. get dummy.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:07 am

Tell us what it meant then dumbass.


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:09 am

I'm sorry, but I'm afraid that I think you are foolish here. I am not from the state of Hawaii (and I suspect that you are not either). But I find it extremely hard to believe that any state in the Union would issue a birth certificate on such flimsy terms as the declaration of a relative. What would prevent this state from becoming a back-door entry to anyone who wishes to enter the country–and prevent all illegals from flocking to the state? I am fairly sure that you don't know what you are talking about on this point–and I know that I do not–but I cannot suppose that other states would allow it. Birthers seem willing to believe that the FBI is inept, the CIA is a fraud, and the laws of the individual states of this country were drafted by morons.

And John McCain produced a birth certificate, and that was the end of the discussion. Would the questions have persisted is he had produced a short form? What if his parents had taken out birth announcements in local papers? What if the governor of the state in which he was born (who was from the opposite party) verified the authenticity of the documents in question? What if the House of Representatives declared that he was, in fact, a citizen?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:09 am

Now, now now…..you really can not or will not define it, will you?

Come on now…..once again…this time for extra credit,… define the term “natural born citizen.”

Can you do it?….Don't evade the question. Be a really big person and for all of the people who visit this site, define the term “natural born citizen.”

You're either going to be an adult an answer it or a child and not answer it.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:11 am

Some have taken a very loose interpretation at that. If you do,it would mean that Schwarzenegger could be POTUS? Can he?

Most have concluded he cannot.


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:11 am

Yeah. Evil is actually not hereditary.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:12 am

Oh so you admit you don't know and want someone else to tell you. Just as I thought.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:12 am

To quote a moron, “That is still not a definition, moron.”


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:13 am

That is still not a definition, moron.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:13 am

Bobnagy said: “Natural born means born in US period”

You are delusional.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:16 am

Not true idiot. George Washington was grand-fathered by the language included. Read on and learn

US Constitution Lesson #1.

President requires:

Article II, Section 1 No person except a natural-born citizen or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.

emphasis. . .or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution

Senate requires

Article I Section III No person shall be a Senator who shall not have been nine years a citizen of the United States

Clearly they held a distinction (for POTUS) between a “citizen,” and a “natural-born” citizen. The difference is that Citizen or Native-born citizen could have one citizen parent. “Natural-born” citizen was to prevent dual allegiances and meant two citizen parents and born on US soil.


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:17 am

Yes, a copy of the original; not an ORIGINAL COPY (as the man said). No one receives the original. Perhaps you should read more closely.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:20 am

Another re-issue of your “facts”, I see. What a superior intellect.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:21 am

The real issue is that he needs to demonstrate that he is a “natural-born” citizen.

He can't, because he isn't.

But none-the-less he could authorize Alan Keyes or World Net Daily to view to original in Hawaii, if it's really there (it isn't)


jimmyboyo1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:22 am

and where is “natural born citizen” defined as both parents being born in the US?

where oh where is that definition in the constitution?

Hmmmmmmmm

:-)

If you pull anything from outside text writen by a founder then heck, per Madison we should do away with all cleregy since “no just government needs the cleregy”

Anyway; “natural born citizen” is not defined in the constituion at all as both parents being born us citizens


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:23 am

Oh, so you admit you don't know and now want someone else to tell you. Tsk, tsk.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:25 am

It's like being you, stevie.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:25 am

STFU with the racist crap. If you're white and riding in the wrong bus you can get the crap beat out of you too, but that doesn't make all blacks bad or mean that they condone it.


jimmyboyo1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:25 am

The constituion does NOT define “natural born citizen” at all!

Alan Keyes and WND? LOL REPUBLICANS sec of state and governor of Hawaii have seen it and said VALID. Alan keyes and WND? I wouldn't trust them within 10 feet of it since the schizophrenic god voices in their heads would probably tell them to eat it if they casn't burn it

LOL

nice try though FAIL!


deane
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:27 am

Hawaii has never released the actual birth certificate. What they have released is what is call a “short form” of the birth certificate which is simple a statement written by the hospital that says 'yes, he was born here'. no one has seen the actual birth certificate. these are just facts.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:27 am

No definition…you're correct.

But then, where do you look to help define the term?

The Federalist Papers, personal papers and the laws of Nations…. and when you look at those sources, the only conclusion is SOIL and BLOOD. US soil and the blood of 2 US Citizens.

Read your history.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:27 am

Nor did I say it was defined. I posted the words. Define citizen, and natural-born citizen for us all.


jimmyboyo1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:29 am

repeat=

BOTH republicans sec of state and Linda Lingel (R) of Hawaii have both seen it and proclaimed it valid

Alan keyes and WND? LOL WND reports soy products are turning us all infertile and into women! despite thousands of years of chinese eating soy daily and the country having over a billion people and not all of them women

LOL WND= xtianista jihadists version of the weekly world news and BAT BOY/ aliens ate my baby


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:29 am

No, that's YOUR only conclusion, and thankfully your word is not law.


bdnb
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:30 am

How naive. It's easy to construe any President as a puppet for someone else. There are plenty of entities controlling policy, and oftentimes those people live abroad. Do you have an idea how much other nations have invested in our economy? Why so concerned about Obama, or is it because one of his parents was Ethiopian? Did the framers of the Constitution really envision such bureaucratic requirements? A long form birth certificate? You've got to be kidding. In those days I'm sure they didn't always have extensive paper documentation of births. A church would have a record, and that was enough. There's plenty of proof that Obama was born in this country and no need to belabor the point with hysterics. I'm sure there are more important things to get worked up over.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:30 am

So much for your superior intellect. I didn't post a single fact in that post. It was an opinion. There is a difference dumbass.


deane
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:31 am

no, no, no. Hawaii released a “short form” of the birth certificate. it's a statement that he was born at that hospital but NOT A COPY OF THE ACTUAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE. the copy of the actual birth certificate has info like mother, father, time of birth, weight, length, etc. the short form is just a statement from the hospital. political parties have NOTHING to do with what the hospital releases.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:32 am

Kim, you don;t think that Barry's birthh was governed by Britiash law? here's what barry said on his own website:

‘When Barack Obama Jr. was born on Aug. 4,1961, in Honolulu, Kenya was a British colony, still part of the United Kingdom’s dwindling empire. As a Kenyan native, Barack Obama Sr. was a British subject whose citizenship status was governed by The British Nationality Act of 1948. That same act governed the status of Obama Sr.‘s children…’ “ Posted on “Fight the smears”. Com


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:34 am

No, YOU jump through MY hoops.


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:34 am

Written at a time when it was legal to own human beings. A few things have changed since the framers.

This “intent of the framers” argument generally has always puzzled me. With due respect to Antonin Scalia, the Constitution is not a dead document. The framers certainly knew how to circumscribe a document; they didn't. The very fact that amendments to the document are possible proclaims their intent. They were aware that the society in which they live would change–and that the document that they wrote needed to have the capacity to change as well. Clearly, there was no expectation that their intent would remain frozen in time.

Do you know how many previous presidents had at least one parent that was not a citizen? Clearly, over time, the definition of “natural-born” has been taken to mean that the individual in question was born in this country. No more. Even courts recognize that the historical weight of an existing definition–the means by which a people has defined a term for some time–has legal precedent.


Alan Wood
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:34 am

Camille Paglia is trying to give credence to a movement which sprung up specifically because a black man was elected POTUS. Her contention that not all members of the birther movement are racists is probably from a statistical standpoint, true. It would be highly unusual for the birther membership to be 100% racist. But that doesn't mean the creation of the movement should be given credibility. There was no hearing this group early on when Romney or McCain were running and Obama was still seeking nomination. In fact, nowhere in US history does a birther movement spring up except for now, one year after Obama is elected. And from the other side of the argument, would it not be true that in order for a black man to even consider running for POTUS, wouldn't his birth records be more tightly scrutinized then the other candidates, fro both sides, especially Republicans, and wouldn't that examination had occurred much earlier in his campaign, for example when he announced his candidancy?
Camile Paglia says she has been following this controversy from the start. I think more that she's been watching for an opening in which she can stick her opinion and thus get a pinlight of
publicity. The birther movement was created from the discontent of the results of the election.


ejhickey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:35 am

this is not a classroom and you are not a teacher. I suggest if you have an opinion to counter what has been said , express it it writing . If not , go watch the telly.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:37 am

And you're afraid to define “natural born citizen.”

You have no credence just snide remarks.

No argument but insults. No historical precedence or law.

You had a chance to be an adult and define NBC or be a petulant child and rant from the sidelines. Go away or define the term.


bdnb
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:38 am

What's with all the name calling, idiot? Or do you insult anyone who doesn't agree with you? The point is that Obama is a natural born citizen. There's proof. It's not enough proof for some because they can't believe that someone like Obama would be President but by some kind of ruse. You know, we don't always get the exact government we want, but we work towards it. Your time would be better spent pushing the policy you want and not trying to frame arguments to delegitimize Obama because he may not have all the proper paperwork in order. A lot of people don't have extensive paperwork but it doesn't mean we assume they're not who they say they are. Though our modern bureaucracy suggests that unless a paper says it, it's not true (as if no lie can be framed on paper) Though would any amount of paperwork convince you that Obama is a natural born citizen?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:38 am

Wrong. . .read the fine print. Hawaii is legally prohibited for giving any information. They said that have “something” on file in accordance with Hawaiian law.

Soy is a phyto-estrogen. That means it's a testosterone antagonist. Americans do have low testosterone. Do yourself a favor a google it, jimmyBOY. . .Maybe you can become a man! If you do, you won't need to suck obummer's teet.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:39 am

Enjoying your waffle, stevie?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:40 am

“…just insult them” You pathetic losers feel compelled to stay on the offensive for good reason. You are running from our mocking laughter as fast as you can, but you can’t hide from the cold light of reality. You and Captain Scrotum are a couple of walking punchlines!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:44 am

I was responding to a post that concluded with calling people, “Idiots.” That's why. Or did you not see that?

He's not a NBC, and it's not just the birth-certificate. Here's the list of what he's hiding. That's a lot of hiding, coming from the hopey changey, transparent, openness-in-government president.

• Original, vault copy birth certificate — Not released — over $1,000,000 spent to conceal — birth certificate — $15.
• Certification of Live Birth — Released – probable counterfeit
• Admitted British/Kenyan citizenship at birth — Admitted
• Hospital of birth — Three hospitals have some claim — 2 in Hawaii 1 in Kenya
• Obama/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Obama/Dunham divorce — Not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Kindergarten records – “lost”
• Soetoro/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Soetoro adoption records — Not released
• Fransiskus Assisi School School application — not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Punahou School records — Not released
• Soetoro/Dunham divorce – concealed by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Selective Service Registration — Released – and proven counterfeit
• Occidental College records — Not released
• Passport — Not released — investigation witness shot dead
• Columbia College records — Not released
• Columbia thesis — “Soviet Nuclear Disarmament” – Not released
• Harvard College records — Not released
• Harvard Law Review articles — None
• Illinois Bar Records — Not released.
• Medical records — Not released
• Illinois State Senate records — None
• Illinois State Senate schedule — “Lost”
• Law practice client list — Not released
• University of Chicago scholarly articles — None

Where is all that? He's hiding it, because he's a fraud.


jimmyboyo1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:44 am

americans have low testosterone due to mercury and arsenic in our drinking water which bush allowed to be increased against reagan (u'r saint) prescribed levels

all studies show cell phones increasing infertility

Put down the xtianista jihadist crap that promotes listening to schizophrenic god voices in u'r head and pick up a real science book


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:45 am

You're the one, along with stevie, who is pissing his pants over the definition, not me. You're just mad and holding your breath because hardly anyone in the real world agrees with your opinion.

Nice try though. Now go back to sucking your thumb.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:45 am

Clearly, over time, the definition of “natural-born” has been taken to mean that the individual in question was born in this country

Citations please. Case law, please. Or is this your opinion?


jimmyboyo1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:46 am

PS

watch out for BAT BOY and those baby eating aliens. LOL WND LOL truly the xtian jihadist equivalent of weekly world news with its “Elvis alive and in my bathroom” stories LOL


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:47 am

Oh, I remember you now from network news: you were the fat sweaty pink teabagger dressed like a founding father with your tri corner hat and misspelled sign (you should have gone with the pre-printed one from the Freedomworks lobbyists) You looked like a real douchebag and I laughed myself sick. Thanks for the comic relief!


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:48 am

Hey, gotta hand it to you stevie, you catch on really slowly.


dcf
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:49 am

Your butt boy George Bush was a big fraud. Talk about not deserving to be President. Or have you forgotten 2000?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:51 am

Wow, you sure have been taking scrupulous notes while watching Glen Beck: got your Alinsky down real good. Gee, I didn’t realize I was in the presence of a serious political agitator. I should just throw in the towel and go fetal. Hahahahahahahahahah. Fux News puppets!


jimmyboyo1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:51 am

Well said

paglia is notorious for tossing out word bombs to get publicity

heck, noboday had heard of her pre her claim that many rape victims are asking for it. She became a darling of right wingers who gladly ignore her being a lesbian since she tosses out zingers that make them all drool that their delusions might be real


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:52 am

How do you know if I am or not, hickie? And what are you, a suggestion box? A stuffed one at that.


Ya Douche
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:52 am

Here comes MS Sellout USA. Lets not forget that when Camille was Bashing Porn in the 70s and 80s she was right beside the right wingers then too. Shes always been a turncoat to the cause she is just a Jesus freak with a pseudo feminist label.


rolitodavid
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:55 am

Folks:

You all have to chill for a second. For Obama to be born in Kenya, his mother would have had to go there and give birth. She was 18 and going to college in Hawaii. She was 3 months pregnant when she got married in February and Obama was born in August 1961. His father was graduating in 1962 from Hawaii but Obama's mom had already headed to Washington State. Since Obama Sr. was married in Kenya, he had to lie.

Also, Michael Dukakis is and was eligible for president even though BOTH of his parents were from Greece. He was born in Massachusetts. US Born. Question is what if someone is born in the U.S. from foreign parents that go back home and he later decides to move to teh U.S. to run for president? That is another mystery…..


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:58 am

One thing is very solid in law. It NEVER EVER changes on its own. To change it, the legislature has to re-write it, or the courts have to reinterpret it (directly or with case-law). Neither have been done with the natural-born clause, and it therefor is the same as the day it was written.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:59 am

Ho hum, more summer re-runs from stevie. These are his big, what he thinks are, “facts”. Maybe he'll offer better fiction in his new fall line up. Stay tuned everyone.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:01 am

Yea, like it happened the first time under Bush’s watch.


Name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:01 am

Why does he need to release all this stuff? Who else did? Are these documents not a matter of privacy? Do you want your college to release your records? Your doctor? Divorce/Marriage records of family members? There is an ethical code for lawyers that prevents the release of client information – you may have heard of attorney-client prililege. This is all just nonsense drummed up by the Faux news crew. Um about that Harvard Law Review article – I seen to recall him being brow beat over something he wrote about the constitution in a law review article. When you just repeat the same fact-free nonsense with no thought of you own, you end up looking quite foolish – case in point Orly Taitz aka the lost Gabor sister


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:02 am

The Birthers believe that if they scream loud enough, the pesky facts will just go away and leave them to luxuriate in their fantasy world. They seem to all have been weaned on Jerry Springer and that is how they deal with the indignities forced upon them by the real world. Orly Taitz? Really?


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:03 am

And thankfully your wishful thinking about what the clause means is not law either.


Monroe
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:05 am

The birther movement started before the election. Obama's campaign had a page debunking this and other myths.


bobnagy
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:08 am

Technically McCain would not be eligible to be POTUS. It has been proven that he was not born in the canal zone, but in Panama proper. He was declared natural born retroactively when the law was changed. Also, anytime there has been a quasi legal opinion regarding natural born it has fallen on the side of if you were born here you are a NBC as long as your parents were not under the jurisdiction of another country and that is defined as being a diplomat or official of another Government.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:10 am

Hannabanan wrote, ” You're just mad and holding your breath because hardly anyone in the real world agrees with your opinion”

That's not true. I just asked you three times to behave like an adult and answer a question. But you can not.

It's rather obvious and kind of sad that your defense of a position is offered only by insults, crude remarks and swearing. I have to surmise that this is the extant of your debating skills and intellect.

I have not insulted you nor do I wish to. That would only lower me to your inferior position. So, in an effort to leave you with an opportunity to correct all of your bad behavoir, you now have the chance, one last time, to act like an adult.

So, Hannnabanana, can you define NBC? Or, are you afraid?


pbg
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:10 am

Anybody who calls Columbia University Columbia College has no right to determine the accuracy of anybody's records.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:12 am

And so why are you here? Too ugly to get a date on Saturday night?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:13 am

re McCain. . .that's what I said. What's your point?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:14 am

More snide remarks from the fraidy cat, hannnabanana.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:15 am

but naannabanaa only throws bombs ans can't define NBC


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:16 am

only the hannnabana can say stupid things…small mind


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:17 am

She doesn't need a date…that's why she has a banana!


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:18 am

Aw, you forgot the “WAAA” that belongs at the start of your post. Poor dear.


bobnagy
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:18 am

Just agreeing with you. i don't think you said all of that, just the reference to Mc Cain


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:19 am

snide remarks from the banana…cause she has no argument…small mind


Leighyanna
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:19 am

Just one question (and it's been asked earlier in this blog): Exactly when do these 'birthers' give it a rest?? To keep pressing an argument that's been before several courts of law and rejected each time is nothing short of empty, obsessive behavior. I see no useful purpose to this whole thing other than to rant your dissatisfaction with the election of Barack Obama, whatever the grounds your dissatisfaction may be based upon. OK. We hear you, we see you, we understand you. In summary, you believe Obama to be a fraud, fake, bogus, illegitimate, accidental president, etc, etc. We get it. If you're correct, bingo, you win! You got it right and we got had. If you are wrong, well, who cares; the electorate of Obama figures you're very wrong and are really not paying much attention to what they consider miscreants' manufactured mess.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:19 am

You're still pouting, I see. Tsk, tsk.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:21 am

more comic relief….stay tuned for more from the banana


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:23 am

Wow, the banana is on a roll….the world waits for your, er, um comments…..come on banana ….


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:24 am

Really, it's not stevie's fault. He's plagiarized all this from numerous other sites and presenting it as his own and well, you see, he's just not a very good reader.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:24 am

Patriots don't rest. Freedom, liberty and the rule of law aren't something you “rest” on. If you rest, a lawless anti-American radical like Obama will destroy the nation.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:26 am

Hey Captainnsteve…these people are clueless…don't reason with them…just insult them…hey banana, where are you?


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:27 am

Bananas don't go on rolls, they go in splits. Don't you know anything? Fourth grade must be tough on you even though it's your third time around.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:28 am

and the banana is not very smart or funny…come on banana….more of your biting comments….you're so clever


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:29 am

Wow, an attempt at mimicking! Good effort!


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:29 am

oh…wow, the banana…using the 4th grade joke again..more banana ….more


steveom5
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:30 am

Well, BO is embarassed at being an illegitimate son of Old Pappy Iron Legs (who got drunk, crashed into a tree, lost both legs, got fitted for iron legs, crashed into another tree, or maybe the same one, and killed himself) and Little Stanley Ann the “anthropologist”. Being illiegitimate and having been abandoned by his pathological parents is embarassing, and I can't personally blame him for wanting to hide it. Of course, he is in the race to grasp for public power, and if I was embarassed about my past I don't think I'd run for public office, but maybe he's cool with that pathology too. Anyway, if he wants to hide the screwed up situation he comes from, and of course its implications for us, his victims, then what can be said other than “he's Teleprompter Jesus”, he's got the power. Clinton's pappy died in a ditch while selling Bibles (or vacuum cleaners) door to door. It's the new cool.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:30 am

I speak to your level of understanding and you seem only to understand stupid.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:31 am

banana's a fraidy cat and a sarcastic bnanana..she adds to the discussion..brillant anylsis…just visit her insightful posts


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:32 am

and if anyone understands stupid…It's the BANANA.!


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:33 am

And it's a big one and vibrates. Just like the one you wish you had. How's that chopstick working out for ya?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:35 am

Hey, Banana…answer the question you fraidy cat!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:35 am

You're a dumbass. . .look that up.

It's a description, not the full legal name. Where did Obama go to college? Harvard University. Go it? Here's more for you.

col?lege
??/?k?l?d?/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [kol-ij] Show IPA

–noun
1. an institution of higher learning, esp. one providing a general or liberal arts education rather than technical or professional training.
2. a constituent unit of a university, furnishing courses of instruction in the liberal arts and sciences, usually leading to a bachelor's degree.
3. an institution for vocational, technical, or professional instruction, as in medicine, pharmacy, agriculture, or music, often a part of a university.
4. an endowed, self-governing association of scholars incorporated within a university, as at the universities of Oxford and Cambridge in England.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:36 am

wow, big banana needs a big one…..fat too!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:38 am

And your grammar sucks, just like you and bananas. Do you know what a run-on sentence is?


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:41 am

Master speller at work!


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:42 am

Hard to believe, but you are even more slower to catch on and dim witted than stevie.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:43 am

Banana is a typical lib-lefty-loser. They can't win an argument on facts and evidence, so they resort to name calling. It's right out of Saul Alinsky’s “Rules for Radicals.”

RULE 5: “Ridicule is man's most potent weapon.”

But it's a bit like a magic trick, once you know how it's done, it doesn't work anymore.

Press on Patriot!


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:45 am

You're right Captain and I'm giving the BANANA the same treatment …it dishes out…..Let's roll!


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:47 am

Oh, the Banana is trolling for grammmmer….watch out she's …well, you'll find out what it's like


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:48 am

Apparently you do not. You do know run-on plagiarizing, that's obvious.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:49 am

only the REALLY slow can spot another slow one….the BANANA at work!


K Neelkantan
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:51 am

Have these birthers even bother to find out if President Obama's mother has even travelled to Kenya to give birth to the president.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:51 am

So, you're admitting you still can't figure how it's done because it continues to work on you, stevie.


hannabanana
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:53 am

I'm here with every else watching the horror of you and stevie circle jerking.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:54 am

Hey BANANA,,,end a question with a question mark…..like this ?

OK?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:55 am

I just plagiarized from the dictionary! haha My bad.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:58 am

You did it again; you really are a dumbass. You aren't smart enough to succeed on you own. You better hope Obummer wins so you can keep getting your hand-outs.


pvel
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:00 am

What an interesting argument about something so unimportant.
President(that sounds so good) Obama was born in Hawaii. How do I know? There were birth announcements in 2 local newspapers at the time.
Put that in your pipe, right wingers.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:01 am

Let's role is right my friend!

BTW I knew the pilots on that flight, and I flew one of their families to the funeral.

If it's up to Obambi, it'll happen again.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:03 am

The BANANA has spoken…..stop. hail. listen to the BANANA…It has announced…oh, the horror……Please BANANA, now you have the floor…tell us all your definition of NBC…….Or are you afraid?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:06 am

God Bless…those Patriots!…unlike the dolts here.


timmmahhhh
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:06 am

Patriots like Whorly Taintz – thanks for the laugh, idiot FOXbot.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:07 am

BANANA,,what's your definition of NBC? Banana????


timmmahhhh
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:07 am

Don't bother trying to explain the truth to conservatards. Just out them for the obstructionist idiots they are.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:08 am

I feel like a broken record, but newspaper birth announcements are meaningless. Many “legal events” were (and often still are) posted to the newspaper for things like births, deaths, home sales and bankruptcies. The notice for births was triggered automatically upon application for a birth-certificate, regardless of birth-place. That could have been done by the grand-mother. The persons involved didn't report it to the newspaper. It was a routine recording of the public record.

Additionally, back then it was very common for grand-parents to put announcements in their “home-town” paper for big events like graduations, births, marriages etc. That was done regardless of the location of the event itself.

Certainly those announcements would be effective arguments that he WAS in fact born, but they are not effective in answering where.

Obama is a fraud. You can see it in his fake speech patterns, in his fake stride, in the fake posture of his head and neck, and in his fake background and hidden records.

He’s clearly a puppet. The question is who’s puppet? Soros? The Saudi King? Putin?

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:08 am

yes


pvel
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:10 am

Stop yelling, Steve. I know it is hard to accept that your guy lost. Deal with it.


Amy
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:11 am

WOW. How does it feel to be crazy? YOu make no sense whatsoever.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:11 am

Indeed. . .inquiring minds want to know.

Banana, fill us in. Define NBC! And I don't mean the National Barack Channel!


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:11 am

Hey BANANA, are you getting ripe on me?

Answer the question…you're the clever one here.

What is the definition of NBC?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:12 am

Earth to BANANA?….Come in please…..


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:16 am

Is the BANANA dead?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:16 am

You brought up the newspaper. I responded to that point, and that's the best you can do? You're a loser; no wonder you like Dingle Barry.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:17 am

Bananas do rot quickly. . .not to be confused with more slower.


pvel
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:22 am

You mean President Barack Hussein Obama. Burns, doesn't it?


1beths
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:23 am

You are brain dead-and there will be no resurrection.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:24 am

Hey Captain Steve:

Good job…..use Alinsky's tactics agains these fools just like the Acorn situation.

I'm out of here. I think we got rid of the BANANA for now.

In the memory of Steve Bremmer….”Let's roll!”

See ya.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:28 am

I'm honest. Yes it does. And it's has nothing to do with color. It's because he's, an America hating, Saudi King bowing, dictator loving, former cocaine addict, racist Kenyan usurper Chicago thug that wants to take away freedom and liberty and leave everybody dependent on the government like in Cuba!


Mary Jane
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:29 am

OK. Gonna say it. Paglia is of Sicilian decent. As as a person of Sicilian decent myself, I'm well aware of certain dynamics in Italian/Sicilian/American culture.

To put it bluntly, Northern Italians look down on Southern Italians and Sicilians because it is believed that many of them have African/Arab blood in them.

Many American Sicilians, in an effort to separate themselves from the legacy that “stain”, have serious issues with blacks.

But, like Paglia, they don't recognize the racism within themselves.

I'm not surprised she's clueless in this regard, but at the same time is quick to claim that sort of racism against herself. It's very common in Sicilian culture.


americanabroad
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:29 am

It is irrevelent where Obama was born. As his mother is unquestionably American he is at birth a “natural citizen” of the United States. Where, when and how he was born do not matter in the slightest. Read your Constitution.


pvel
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:31 am

Um. No he isn't. What bullcrap you believe. So sorry for you.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:32 am

“Obama has proven he was born in Hawaii to the proper people and owes you and other idiots no information.”

And who are “proper people”? You seem to forget that the citizens of the USA are the “proper people”.


americanabroad
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:33 am

Capt. Steve, where were you during the Bush dictatorship?
BTW are you a serviceman or just a another Conservative posing as one?


americanabroad
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:37 am

Also Silence it was Scott Beamer who said “Lets Roll”. Try to get something right.


Doc Rock
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:39 am

Your argument is nothing more than your own unique speculation. Somehow Grandma “knew” that almost 50 years in the future that Obama would be president.

Maybe she's really Michelle Obama, but the Michelle Obama from the FUTURE, and she's traveled back in time to set it all up nice and neat and all.

You're just a hater. And a paranoid. Accept it.


Rockinrod
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:40 am

Captain Coo Coo Bird,
A Bird that only repeats coo coo thoughts said by others.
Looooooooooooooooser


WhiteHussian
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:46 am

Here Steve, this is what gets you. A foreign black man had sex with a white woman from the heartland. Yep Steve, the president is the issue from the union of foreign black man and an American white woman. But, she is a born and raised American citizen, so her offspring is also a citizen. Now Steve visualize it. Ha, There you go, now don't go all columbine on us ok.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:49 am

Southern Italy is where some of the best briar comes from. Totally random fact: Obama Sr liked his bulldogs–I'd respect Obama Jr more if he smoked a pipe like his dad. One thing I'll give B.H.O. Part II is that he likes mustard on his burgers…maybe Dijon isn't the best choice, but at least he's not like those wretches who like condimentless burgers. :@


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:55 am

Actually, again you are incorrect. Bankruptcies are published as part of the process for giving notice to creditors and come form documents released by the court. Home sales are usually tracked by CERTAIN papers and in some cases the county actually provides a list. The one I work for does not. Births and deaths are verified by the County Health Officer and then the Newspapers come and get lists. Articles that are placed in the paper such as memorial notices are placed there by the person. But death lists are not.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:57 am

Lets add something here, where are the Kenyan records of Obama's mother's entry if he was born there? Kenya did keep records…yet mysteriously the birthers are unable to produce any records at all…except for doctored ones…


Guido
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:59 am

If only one parent is a U.S. citizen and their child is born outside the U.S. the American parent needs to prove that they were resident in the U.S. a certain number of years, some of which had to have been after the age of adulthood. At the time of Obama's birth the total residency requirement was 10 years, five of which had to have been after the age of adulthood. Since his mom was only 19 this second criteria could not have been achieved.

This point seems moot, however, as Obama's certified birth certificate has been examined by FactCheck.org, and is posted on their website.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:15 am

Actually, a film that reminds me of Barry-O is 'The Great McGinty'…


tt333
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:19 am

Sicilians hate the Moolies anyway, so it's not surprising that Paglia harbors covert racism in her support for the Birther movement (BM).

I has a suprisingly satisfying BM this morning…


nana4gj
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:37 am

It is clear with these comments on this topic, because it is not an issue, as is clear with all other issues of the day, that FACTS are immaterial to some people. Although they are a minority, really, they make such scandalous allegations and such lies, distortions, and misrepresentations, that they seem like a “movement”. I don't know if it is “racism”, but, it is ignorance, and I guess racism is a form of ignorance. I do know that all “legitimate debate” on any issue is impossible because this minority is operating on emotion, raw, ugly emotions.

No amount of debate or argument or proof will satisfy them. I do remember the President had a roommate from Pakistan and they had become good friends and he said he traveled there with him to visit the country and stay with his friend's family. I am so glad he did. I am grateful that this President has the background he has because it is precisely what the Leader of the Free World or the President of the USA needs to deal with the world today.

I maintain that his mother, as smart and independently minded as she sounds, would never travel, heavy with child, to Kenya to give birth. That is the most simple of arguments, perhaps, the most obvious, in addition to the birth certificate presented by the state in which he was born. He really does not need to waste any time trying to assure and appease these people. They need this stuff and he doesn't.


thewaz
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:40 am

What a subject for Americans to tear themselves apart about. The invective is heart-wrenching and seems endless. With this level of discourse, one can only hope that it represents a tiny minority of public opinion. There is so much real stuff to care about.

“…an America hating, Saudi King bowing, dictator loving, former cocaine addict, racist Kenyan usurper Chicago thug…”

When I read comments like these, I cry for America.


chrisjay
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:17 am

You Birthers are pathetic and your raison d'etre is gibberish. McCain was born in Panama. Palin was born outside of the contiguous 48 states. Cheney was born in a muddy alley to a syphilitic whore and no one know who his father was. Look it up. I read it myself on the internets.


Johnny
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:19 am

Ok, then where is the CERTIFIED copy of the original. You may think arguing semantics makes you correct, but you are sadly mistaken.

As you said, “They NEVER give up the original Certificate of Live Birth”,,,, Why spend millions to keep it away from public scrutiny, especially when he’s holding a public office and his eligibility is in question?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:37 am

Look up raison d'etre in the dictionary, moron.

I read it myself on the internets. . .Internets? wtf? Are you retarded?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:39 am

The questions won’t go away until obama releases his hidden records. All he has to do is make the following official public statement,

“I Barack Obama authorize the State of Hawaii to release and make public all of my records on file.”

That's it. Issue over. But he won't because he's a fraud!! Obama knows that millions of citizens want to see it yet he continues to hide it. What/why is he hiding?

And maybe more disturbing is why don't BHO's supporters want to know the whole truth, especially since there's a reward of $100,000 for proof that Obama is a “natural born” citizen of the United States? The answer is that Obama’s very own supporters also know he’s a fraud!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


chrisjay
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:44 am

I guess you had to look it up; I don't need to. I'm so sorry you are confused. Regarding my use of the term 'internets': wow, you are truly irony-challenged, aren't you?


timmmahhhh
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:47 am

I looked up moiron in the dictionary and it said “refer to captainsteve the dumb ass birther.”


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:49 am

It is clear with these comments on this topic, because it is not an issue, as is clear with all other issues of the day, that FACTS are immaterial to some people. Although they are a minority, really, they make such scandalous allegations and such lies, distortions, and misrepresentations, that they seem like a “movement”.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

You totally mangle the English language yet want to give a pompous lecture? No thanks.

Then you claim no proof will satisfy them? How about showing the proof first? Just a thought.

OBummer, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:53 am

You better go look up irony then too, moron.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:55 am

Take some of your own advice and try to get something right, it was Todd Beamer.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:59 am

You has? Amazing!

The moron Obot's guide to conjugating “to have.”

I has, he has, she has, they has! haha

Yeah! Morons for OBummer unite!!


chrisjay
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:02 am

Why don't you just look up my ass while you're licking it, you feeble minded fat Freeper?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:04 am

As his mother is unquestionably American he is at birth a “natural citizen” of the United States.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Missed the grammar class on tense huh?

Why are OBummer supporters so dumb?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:05 am

You're a frickin' racist. STFU and keep it to yourself.


davidriker
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:09 am

Camiglia has made a fool of herself before, saying in 2000 that George W. Bush would make a great president. She's more than a little whacked out.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:12 am

“Certain papers”? Did I say every frickin' paper in the world did it, or that it occurs in every situation? No. Did you work at any newspapers in Honolulu in 1961? No? Then STFU!

My point stands. Newspaper announcements in 1961 do not prove or disprove natural-born citizenship.

Don't be an argumentative dunce.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:19 am

Granny didn't need to “know” anything other than she wanted her grandson to have U.S. citizenship.

Tell me, if he was born in Kenya, why would they have needed to know anything more than that wanted to insure the ability to obtain US citizenship?


onthebus
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:19 am

The part about Cheney def rings true.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:20 am

You're a racist a**hole. Eff off.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:23 am

Eff off. I'm straight (as in normal). The freak pervs are all on your side.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:26 am

He may not smoke pipe, but I've heard he's smoked a bit of pole in his day.


chrisjay
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:29 am

Captain Asswipe, keep your voice down, you'll wake up mom next room over in the single-wide!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:29 am

Hitler didn't like any dissension in the ranks either. Way to support the 1st amendment! I'm sure OBummer would be proud of you!


chrisjay
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:31 am

you're straight? how'd you know? Angry fat captain-wannabes like you don't get any sex!


chrisjay
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:38 am

These pinheaded Birthers are hysterical-Look at their, ahem, 'spokesperson': Oily Taintz. Have you seen this woman? SNL couldn't have dreamt her up in their most inspired bull session!!


octodad
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:44 am

interesting point is no one questions the birth documentation for mr mccain. both of us were born at u.s. naval hospital, coco solo, panama c.z. i do not have a birth certificate issued by a municipal authority. i have a certificate of live birth issued by hospital. had a hell of a time getting a passport because i do not have a birth certificate, and the passport officials do not recognize my birth documentation as valid.


davidriker
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:47 am

I'm struggling to understand how one of our most distinguished literary critics became a shill for Orly Taitz. Camaglia is gambling with her already damaged credibility by wading in on the wrong side of a town hall meeting freak show.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:49 am

We should all want to:

1. End the controversy about Barack Obama's legal right to be president, being a citizen of Indonesia for about 15 years or more, even after 18 years old;

2. To see if he legally changed his name back to Barack Obama after adoption and living as B. Soetoro, an Indonesia citizen;

3. To see if he legally was naturalized as a citizen of the United States;

4. To see if he attended schools in the United States as an Indonesian foreign student on a student visa;

5. To see if he obtained a scholarship available only to foreign students, including a Fullbright Scholarship while at Occidental College.

6. To see if the surrender of his and his wife's law licences in Illinois had to do with lying about identity or nationality;

7. To see if he swore falsely in application for president, senator in Illinois, or law licence;

8. To gain release of his documents proving his identity, nationality, citizenship and travel to foreign countries;

9. To determine what passport he used to travel to Pakistan in 1981 when travel was forbidden to US citizens;

10. To see if he fraudulently obtained or created a Selective Service Registration and associated print-out that he had not signed up for at age 18 to deceive voters;

11. To see if he swore truthfully before Chief Justice Roberts that he, Barack Hussein Obama, will protect and defend the Constitution of the United States. (Both name, eligibility and purpose)

12. To see if he used his office to get Major Cook fired and his Afghanistan orders revoked to silence his legal attempt to verify Barack Obama's legal authority to be Commander In Chief of the Military and President of the United States. Note that both the president and Major Cook took oaths to defend the Constitution and that is all Major Cook was doing.

13. To see if his father listed on his original full birth certificate is Barack Obama Sr. a British citizen of Kenya; and if the place, date, time and details of his birth are accurately portrayed in the Certificate of Live Birth posted by his campaign. Hawaii official said he was natural-born citizen (That requires two American citizens with no legally divided citizenships.)

14: To see if his adoption by Lolo Soetoro was registered to his birth certificate; and if he hid it with the posted COLB.

15. To see how his sister also had a Certificate of Live Birth from Hawaii, though born in Indonesia, proving it was not necessary to be born in Hawaii to have such a certificate.

16. To see if these are criminal charges of voter fraud to deceive voters to gain control of the US government, forgeries, lying under oath, covering up illegal activity, and any other legal charges appropriate.

17. To see if all these charges can be quickly checked through the Quo Warranto in the Donofrio case.

Answer these and I'll accept the Usurper Fraud in Chief as my lawful president, but not before!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:52 am

They did investigate McCain. . .Congress passed a resolution saying he was natural-born.

Problem is, he isn't! Just another example of fraud and the government pulling a fast one on the people.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:02 pm

This is a typical response from the left. If you don’t agree with someone then insult, bully and threaten.


Larrycraig
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:02 am

Meet me in the mens room and we'll talk.


captainstevehaspenisandvagina
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:10 am

for someone 'straight' u sur tok gay alot


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:17 pm

You talk as though you have an ounce of courage in you to stand before someone who really could kick your ass. You left wing Obama zealots are the wimpiest weakest cowardice people in America. Your bark is farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr worse than you could ever bite.

The left always bullies and intimidates to get their way. Grow up and leave the playground…you are not 5 anymore.

Have the decency to respect others when you enter a legitimate conversation. If it were McCain in the White House you liberals would be holding streets “RIOTS” and burning down cities. It is your way.

The Obama issue is boiling to the greatest threat America has faced since the slavery issue. This Nation is poised for a civil war. I civil war that you liberals wouldn’t even have the guts to face off in.

Crawl back to the cowardice hole you live in and let the patriots protect the freedoms you take for granted.


borges
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:18 am

to the nutcase captainsteve:

well, antarctica is waiting for you you crackhead. Why don't you and all your fox news cohorts and rightist loonies go pack your bags and establish your own u.s.a. — united states of antarctica. There is no place for you dimwits in the united states of america.


jasonabdon
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:27 am

I have a copy Obama's birth certificate. Anybody can get one. The birthers are afterbirthers.


jimw428
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:45 am

Do you mean you have a copy of that photo shopped piece of garbage circulated by the Obama champaign? That document disproves itself by listing his father's race as “African”, which you should know is a nationality, not a race. Furthermore, at the time of his birth, the official designation for his father's race would have been “Negro”. You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a PIG!


csw888
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:45 am

To Captain Puke
You are an unbelievable waste of space. I wish only bad things for you, but most importantly that you leave the United States as soon as possible. I am sure there is a place filled with hateful racist dirt bags (just like you) where you will fit in.


freedom_writer
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:51 am

Can no one refute the “crazy” birthers? Why not just answer their questions and win the argument?

All these personal attacks just create conflict, they don't resolve anything.

A democratic society engages in a discussion; demonizing people is for totalitarian states.

Until Obama releases some information, we are left to wonder why he doesn't. He's the openness and transparency guy, remember?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:51 pm

Oh Capt. Steve your grammatical prowess has destroyed my whole argument!
BTW are you a real serviceman or another conservative poser?


MBBEEE
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:51 am

Birthers DO NOT have a point Execpt on their head! We were told to shut up and sit down when questions about G.W.Bush military record and arrest record and drug abuse record. For the life of me I cannot understand how anyone with one ounce of brain cells could think, a sarah Palin could be pulled. Give a speech in Dallas having her water break and fly for eight hours to the hospital. the days when the president was born it would have taken a good two weeks to fly from Kenya to Hawaii, unless they rode in a UFO! Why we keep giving creedence to these birthers is beyond me……………


MBBEEE
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:53 am

Because it is designed to be a distracrion.


Bitch please. - Just another WordPress weblog - Birther of a Nation
Pingback posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:59 am

[...] The Washington Independent » Paglia: ‘Birthers’ Aren’t Racist, and They Have a Point [...]


Bitch please. - Just another WordPress weblog - Birther of a Nation
Pingback posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:59 am

[...] The Washington Independent » Paglia: ‘Birthers’ Aren’t Racist, and They Have a Point [...]


jimw428
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:06 am

And you accept FactCheck.org as a credible source of substantiation? You claim they have vetted “Obama's certified birth certificate”. I don't know how they could have certified something that has never been released.

As for me, I want to see the long form birth certificate that the state has refused to release.


jimw428
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:15 am

captainsteve is asking all the right questions for all the right reasons. It amazes me that so many of the Obama zealots will defend him at any cost, but are unwilling to defend our Constitution with the same enthusiasm.


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:36 am

African isn't a nationality. Africa is a continent. Kenyan would be a nationality. Let's see ALL the White president's birth certificates. I'm waiting …..
They did answer another frequently-raised question: why is Obama's father's race listed as “African”? Kurt Tsue at the Hawaii Department of Health told us that father's race and mother's race are supplied by the parents, and that “we accept what the parents self identify themselves to be.” We consider it reasonable to believe that Barack Obama, Sr., would have thought of and reported himself as “African.”

Next one please.


Zealot1
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:37 am

Burden of proof is on the accuser.

That means, YOU have to prove he's NOT a citizen, instead of the assumed position that he must prove he is.


darkgable760
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:44 am

Cap Bizarro, you belong in a fruit farm.

Say it with me, “President Barrack Hussein Obama, II.

Come on now, one more time with feeling, “PRESIDENT BARRACK HUSSEIN OBAMA, II.

There…now doesn't that make you feel better?


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:55 am

*He probably doesn't 'hate America'. whether-or-not he was Born in the U.S.A., that's where he chose to live and raise his family. He is overly apologetic about America's 'misdeeds', though.

*He DID bow to King Abdullah, which was not only shamefull, but a serious breach of protocol.

*He wasn't a cocaine 'addict', but used blow recreationally (read his autobio–he ADMITS it; at least he was candid about his drug use, unlike Bill Clinton and Dubya).

*He's no racist, but some of his staff (e.g., Van Jones) and former pastor have been.

*His dad was Kenyan. Whether-or-not he was born in Kenya, he's still of Kenyan extraction (or Irish, by his mother's bloodline).

*'Usurper'? I dunno–nobody but him REALLY knows, one way, or another.

*''Chicago thug'? Well, he lives in the Windy City… However, it's really only his mentor, Da Mare, who deserves that title.


jimw428
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:59 am

Not true!

A candidate must “prove” that he is eligible to be President.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:00 am

I suppose the computer file could've been PCed up/updated, under the 'race' category. The origional, typed form would've had 'Negro', though.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:04 am

It's fine to bash Fox, but don't trust the other mainstream sources, either. They suppress news, as well…just with different biases. A prime example was that bow to King Abdullah.

You should NEVER trust one bunch of sources; you shouldn't always discount other biased ones, either: a broken clock still tells the correct time twice a day.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:08 am

'Barack Hussein Obama II' looks a lot more dignified on a letterhead than 'Barry'. NOBODY wants a 'President Barry'… :@ (Going by that name was another youthful indescretion, like using cocaine.)


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:15 pm

Repeat after me: “Obama and the state of Hawaii already issued the only records that exist for ANYONE born in Hawaii since the state digitized its records.” Or if that won’t do it, how about repeating this one: “Even if he were not born in the United States, Barack Obama would be a US citizen because his mother was a US citizen.”

Give up your doomed crusade and accept that you’re wrong and you’ve been proved wrong, and if you want to get rid of a president you seem to hate above all else, try rebuilding the crumbling opposition by encouraging Republicans in congress to promote reasonable legislation instead of calling their president names. In other words, grow up.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:44 pm

You are an idiot. Read the facts from the right before you enter the conversation. BORN in Kenya means not Naturally Born. YOU MUST BE BORN ON US SOIL.

________________________________


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:46 pm

Nope. Not at all…he was NOT born on US SOIL…candidates for US President must be naturally born.

________________________________


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:19 am

She is not a distinguished literary critic–at least few literary critics would regard her with any distinction. She has always appeared motivated by self-promotion.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:46 pm

I did,
I got his family name right.


eman2u
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:11 am

Capt Steve – It is clear that your issues are deeply rooted in your character. Regarding your 17 points below, NOT ONE is the spelled out as the requirement for being president. NOT ONE. I encourage you to read the Constitution for more info. Can't find it? No problem. Here's the part that matters from Article II, section 1: “No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.” THE COURTS IN HAWAII HAVE VALIDATED HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE. THE U.S. SUPREME COURT HAD AFFIRMED THIS DECISION. SO WHAT EXACTLY IS YOUR ISSUE? I can answer that question by helping you understand YOU. When you see President Obama you have difficulty identifying with him. I understand that. He is half black and you are white. He does not represent what you aspire to become or want to be in life. You cannot accept that more people in this country actually voted for him than against him and the people have spoken. Democracy at work. You may believe you are not racist. But in reality you ARE. Like many of those in the tea bag movement, having Obama as president drives right at YOUR core. Your core is a repressed racist. Keep using the crazy names that are all code for the n-word which is what you really think. Keep staying on the fringe. Keep making your ludicrous claims for this and that. You only help to solidify your position with the crackpots of the extreme right. One last thought: Not all Republicans are racist, but ALL racists are Republican. Think about it. You fit the mold.


PinkToeNails
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:25 am

Camille P has had it in for Obama ever since the light of her life, Sarah Palin, did not make it into the White House. Blah blah blah, Camille.


pvel
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:11 pm

Internets is a Bushism. He may have been a Natural Born Citizen, but not very good with the language.


wildn0102
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:14 pm

The only “usurper” in our history would've been George W. Bush! Remember he was awarded the state of Florida by a 5-4 vote of the SCOTUS. Now that you have received your 15 minutes of shame………..Why don't you do America a favor and Shoo!


zaxxxon
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:22 pm

Many people ask about Mitt Romney's father George, who ran for president, yet was of Mexican birth. The reason; grandfather Romney was a member of a polygamous Mormon Sect that deserted their American roots for the temporary safety of Mexico, in contravention and avoidance of U.S. law.


Wibz
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:34 pm

You could debate for a long time whether 'African' is a race. On some government documents it is. However there is no way that it could be described as a nationality. A nationality would be 'Kenyan' or 'Liberian.'


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:47 pm

Bowing to a foreign dignitary, especially if he is King, is no disgrace. It is a sign of respect. He was in Abdullah’s house.

Remember those photos of W holding hands and walking with the king? Now, that’s distasteful.


jimw428
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:47 pm

I concede the point that African is not a nationality, but Africa as a continent is comprised of many races, including Negro and BTW, Caucasian.

As to obamasneighbor comment that “We consider it reasonable to believe that Barack Obama, Sr., would have thought of and reported himself as “African.”, it's very unlikely he would have done so, since at the time (1961), “Negro” would have been his only choice


cp
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:53 pm

You need a Psychiatrist!! You scare me.


thewaz
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 12:59 pm

Adam:

The man has been president for about 8 months. Much of his major policy
agenda has been to continue the previous president's direction (to the
discomfort of many supporters). His health care initiative is a primary
election pledge (in which he has largely deferred to Congress for details).
He appears to be trying to govern from a (very) moderate left-of-center
position.

What's to hate about Barrack Obama, then?

His winning, it seems, of the last election.
Not reason enough for the barrage of bug-eyed rhetoric.

Example: “Usurper'? I dunno–nobody but him REALLY knows, one way, or
another.”

There are no answers to thoughts of this kind.

Go in peace, Adam.


bigpoppa5442003
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:00 pm

One question, Dont you idiots think that the CIA, FBI, congress , State of Hawaii all vetted the Obama before he ran for presidents. They underlying them is …U are uncomfortable with the man the people of the GREAT USA voted for. Which means you are all wasting our time and yours.


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:07 pm

The picture and the word “liar” are both offensive to some. See, a photo like that brings to mind images of hatred, hostility and racism.

Do you have YOUR original birth certificate? Are you sure YOU’RE not an illegal alien scamming the public? You can claim you’re legal all you want, but right now no one on this board has any reason to believe you.


Levy2009
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:29 pm

You are smoking too much weed, Capsteve. Why the FUCK would someone named B. Soetero change their name to Barack Obama !? What the fuck kind of name is B. anyhow? Where did you get this? You're just pissed that you have a black President, that's all — while you were sitting on your ass smoking weed, browsing the internet for conspiracy theories, he went out and became President of the United States and now you're mad as shit that he made something of his life.

Getting Paglia's approval is like the kiss of death, in my opinion. The intellectual equivalent of George Dubya saying “I'm behind this guy!”


ckerst
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:33 pm

Currently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code fills in those gaps. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are “citizens of the United States at birth:”

* Anyone born inside the United States *
* Any Indian or Eskimo born in the United States, provided being a citizen of the U.S. does not impair the person's status as a citizen of the tribe
* Any one born outside the United States, both of whose parents are citizens of the U.S., as long as one parent has lived in the U.S.
* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year and the other parent is a U.S. national
* Any one born in a U.S. possession, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year
* Any one found in the U.S. under the age of five, whose parentage cannot be determined, as long as proof of non-citizenship is not provided by age 21
* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years
Now STFU


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:46 pm

I think it’s a fair bit more complicated than that. I am not a legal assistant. If it was as easy as you say then the issue would have been settled long ago (as it should have been). But it’s not, and it hasn’t been. The truth, however, is exactly as stated:

Obama was adopted by an Indonesian citizen. Indonesia doesn’t allow dual-citizenships. By giving up his American citizenship in order to acquire Indonesian citizenship Obama would subsequently only he be granted American citizenship, NOT naturalized citizen status, and would NOT ever again meet the requirements of the office. Those are the facts. I’m sorry if you can’t deal with it (and we both know that even if I provided you statute upon statute you would never agree.)


whosesaneanyway
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:50 pm

Let me get this straight, captainsteve. If there were a presidential candidate, let's say by the name of 'Tom Jenkins', whose mother was from Kansas and father was from Ireland, and who happened to be born in Hawaii, and whose 'proof of live birth' was already provided to the media to calm whomever might have misgivings about his nationality, you and your ilk would be vehemently clamoring for him to 'prove' he's American?!? You expect thinking people to believe this (your mission) has nothing to do with race — is this correct?

Before Obama, we have never ever heard so much about birthplaces of presidents or their 'Americanness' legitimacy. Why is that? Oh yeah, none of them were non-White, so they're OK.

(By the way, did W release all the controversial records sought by those who thought his personal history raised serious doubt on his fitness to be president? Or did he somehow get a 'pass'? )

My viewpoint–I think Reagan was not a bad president. Bush Sr was somewhat of an empty suit, Clinton was a pretty effective leader (sex scandalwise, I doubt there are 5 politicians in Washington who haven't done what he got caught doing). W was an absolute embarrassment to the office and therefore the country. I say this based on his actions and his words, despite the obvious shadiness around his election/appointment. However, I continue to believe he'd be a nice enough guy to run the local hardware store. I am not really joking about this.

President Obama may or may not prove to be an effective leader. Like everyone, he has strengths and shortcomings. Branding him a 'secret foreigner/evil socialist' however, sounds like a symptom for some kind of mental disorder. Get thee a grip.


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 1:58 pm

I'm afraid that the “problem”, such as it is, is your unique interpretation of the term “natural-born”. And it is unique–but I pointed this out in a previous posting and won't repeat myself.


kahawa
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:00 pm

And it's very reasonable for a resident of the British colony (that was not yet a country in 1961) to label himself African. Having lived in various parts of Africa in the 50s and 60s, I know that the word “negro” would not necessarily be the choice of an african man to describe his race at that time.


kahawa
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:02 pm

He has released plenty of information. It's well documented. You have to be kidding … what more do you want than the only birth certificate he has (Hawaii went digital on the long form years ago, so by the logic of the birthers, no Hawaiian is a US citizen), and the fact that his mother was a US citizen? My parents are US citizens and all their children were born in Africa. We are all US citizens since birth. Believe me, I went through all the steps to confirm this to get my passport, and so did Obama.
He couldn't have a US passport without possessing documentation (birth certificate, certificate of birth to US citizen abroad, etc.) of his citizenship.

Give it up. The crazy birthers have been refuted, but they just refused to listen.


kahawa
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:03 pm

He has released plenty of information. It's well documented. You have to be kidding … what more do you want than the only birth certificate he has (Hawaii went digital on the long form years ago, so by the logic of the birthers, no Hawaiian is a US citizen), and the fact that his mother was a US citizen? My parents are US citizens and all their children were born in Africa. We are all US citizens since birth. Believe me, I went through all the steps to confirm this to get my passport, and so did Obama.
He couldn't have a US passport without possessing documentation (birth certificate, certificate of birth to US citizen abroad, etc.) of his citizenship.

Give it up. The crazy birthers have been refuted, but they just refused to listen.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:04 pm

pvel, you obviously got the joke but our confused little friend Captainstevie is cluelss, alas


kahawa
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:05 pm

Captainsteve, that “internets” remark was ironic. Can you say “irony”?


kahawa
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:07 pm

Which is why it's become ironic (but only to those who have a sense of humor) to say “internets.”


bob
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:09 pm

your theories would be humorous if they were not so pathetically delusional.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:09 pm

Eff off A**hole. . .calling someone a racist that isn't is racist. YOU ARE A RACIST. Wake up.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:10 pm

NO! No American citizen–ESPECIALLY the President of The Republic–is supposed to bow to any monarch, PERIOD! This was a serious breach of protocol and Obama’s press people knew it: that’s why they tried to keep it off the air (until it got on Youtube and went viral), then made all sorts of ridiculus excuses (“he had to bend over, ’cause he’s an inch taller”).

Bush held hands, hugged and played lovey-dovey with the Sultan of Sodomy Arserapia…but did NOT bow to him. Icky and creepy, sure, but acceptable Presidential behavior: holding hands is a show of affection (*bleh*) between ‘equals’ (heads of state); BOWING is a sign of submission. Obama’s supporters, like yourself, can’t get out of THAT one.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:12 pm

He released plenty of information? Like what? Regardless, with a British father he's not a natural born citizen.

• Original, vault copy birth certificate — Not released — over $1,000,000 spent to conceal — birth certificate — $15.
• Certification of Live Birth — Released – probable counterfeit
• Admitted British/Kenyan citizenship at birth — Admitted
• Hospital of birth — Three hospitals have some claim — 2 in Hawaii 1 in Kenya
• Obama/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Obama/Dunham divorce — Not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Kindergarten records – “lost”
• Soetoro/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Soetoro adoption records — Not released
• Fransiskus Assisi School School application — not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Punahou School records — Not released
• Soetoro/Dunham divorce – concealed by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Selective Service Registration — Released – and proven counterfeit
• Occidental College records — Not released
• Passport — Not released — investigation witness shot dead
• Columbia College records — Not released
• Columbia thesis — “Soviet Nuclear Disarmament” – Not released
• Harvard College records — Not released
• Harvard Law Review articles — None
• Illinois Bar Records — Not released.
• Medical records — Not released
• Illinois State Senate records — None
• Illinois State Senate schedule — “Lost”
• Law practice client list — Not released
• University of Chicago scholarly articles — None


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:15 pm

Then why are you here a88hole? You think because the pres is black I should bow down to him. You are a racist!

If there wasn't anything to this issue, the obamabots wouldn't be here vociferously smearing those who question. Why aren't they at the “truther” or “area 51″ sites? They KNOW this is a real issue, and they don't want the truth to get out!

You think because the pres is black I should bow down to him. You are a racist!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:18 pm

I could turn the tables, and say that Obama haters don’t understand the difference between respect and submission.

And where did you come up with the ridiculous assertion that no American citizen, and especially the President, can bow to a foreign monarch? Don’t you remember Ronald Wilson Reagan, our President, bowing to the Queen of England when they met for the first time?

And how do you know so much about embassy protocol? You a professional?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:18 pm

No you can't debate that. Facts are facts. African is not a race, nor has the tern been used for US birth certificates ever!


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:19 pm

His administration’s attempt to allow the admissability of evidence gleaned from interrogations without legal council present was certainly an innovation of HIS. Ditto the Cybersecurity and Food Safety legislation, the snoop provision (social workers making arbitrary ‘visits’) in his health plan, classifying war vets as dangerous, right-wing subversives…his administration was responsible for that alone.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:20 pm

Explain the irony then. You can't. It's not. End of issue.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:25 pm

Funny thing, I didn't read “natural-born citizen” anywhere. Dingle Barry's father was British Kenyan. Regardless of hi fake Hawaiian COLB, Little Barry could never be natural-born. He's a fraud. Now STFU.


Name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:31 pm

Yeah, they have a point like you have a valid argument to make in their favor.


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:33 pm

So you support investigating the CIA abuses? The attorney general firings scandal under Alberto Gonzales? Cheney’s claim that Iraq “without a doubt” has WMD’S?

Those are all intrusions into the Constitution. I assume you have the same zealotry when addressing them.

What people like me believe is that Obama has a birth certificate. His mother, at least, was a US citizen, a white girl who grew up in Kansas, so Barry would be a US citizen anyway, even if he was born on Mars. He has a birth announcement in a local newspaper in Honolulu in 1962. So, Occam’s razor tells me that he is very likely telling the truth. But you make the claim, against real evidence to the contrary, that he is actually in violation of our Constitution. So the burden of proof is on you, my friend.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:33 pm

He & Mayor Daley are not close. He never was in Chicago politics. He was a STATE senator then a U.S. Senator. Please get your facts right.
So you can bow to a WHITE queen but not an Arab King LOL RIGHT !!!!!!

How is he overly apologetic about America’s misdeeds? : Mass genocide on the Natives. The stealing of their lands.Manifest Destiny. Slavery of Africans.Japanese Internment. Unnecessary racist wars. Jim Crow. And 200+ years of sanctioned racism etc. LOL

Do like who’s President GO BACK TO EUROPE !


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:38 pm

You obviously know nothing about how presidential candidates are vetted. The parties themselves (in this case DNC) are 100% responsible for determining eligibility. I know; I wrote to the State election officials. Google it.

Go to the following link and see. It’s the DNC’s Certification of Nomination document for Obama to run for president. Only one is normally filed. In Obama’s case, two were filed. The difference between the two (both signed by Pelosi) is that one omits the standard verbiage swearing constitutional eligibility of the candidate. They are supposed to say:

“and that the following candidates for President and Vice President of the United States are legally qualified to serve under the provisions of the United States Constitution.”

But that part just happened to get skipped. . .on one. . .both not the other. . .hmmm, very odd!

http://americangrandjury.org/nancy-pelosi-clear…

Nancy Pelosi knew he wasn’t eligible. That’s why she played games with the official certification documents.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Cevale
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:40 pm

Camille has not been relevant for over a decade. She feels the need to say something off the hook to get attention. Once part of popular culture she now has become a culture unto herself. A culture grown in a test tube!


capega
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:43 pm

LOL!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:43 pm

It doesn't matter where the father was born. It's about the father's citizenship at the time of the child's birth. The rest is irrelevant, George was a US citizen when Mitt was born.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:46 pm

Can't address the facts, so you you resort to name calling? YOU should have stayed in school. You and your oBmamessiah are losers.


name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:56 pm

* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years

Read the Whole Comment before posting.


name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 2:59 pm

Learn US LAW before starting Conspiracy Theory,
as has already been posted:

Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years

Even if “Barry” were born in Kenya, he's STILL be eligible to be President of the USA.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:00 pm

Ridiculous. . .who does the president work for? You don't know? Well let me help you. He works for the AMERICAN PEOPLE! He's not the effin' messiah. He's our employee. He applied for the job. The job has qualifications. He's yet to prove that he meets them. He needs to.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:01 pm

HAW HAW HAW!!!


pensivegadfly
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:01 pm

Disqus (and idiot Captainsteve),

No, I don't take the word of a politician as gospel truth. I take the word of Hawaii that Obama was born there; the fact that the form they released is what they release for everyone; the fact the FactCheck.org and Snopes have reviewed the relevant document and put photos on the internet showing it; Nelson's word that she remembers the birth–never said she saw it but she recalls sending a letter about it to her father.

What I don't take as gospel is the work of a tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorist like you who has no reason other then animus for the President to waste so much of your life making up long convoluted explanation of how Obama might not have been born in Hawaii (just like those who make up explanations for how someone other than O.J. might have actually killed his wife and Goldman; or how some nefarious group of evil–but damn sophisticated–plotters might have been able to plant explosive charges in the World Trade Center to help bring them down on 9/11).

So, Hawaii says they have the long form? Where is the link? Where is the proof that the two newspapers that announced his birth were duped? Where is any evidence what so ever that Obama's maternal grandparents lied about his birth? Where is the proof, Disqus? You have none, its all conjecture and speculation. And the proof of his birth some place else has been rounded discredited as forgeries and fakes. People like you trying to make up something to support your bogus claim.

Look guys, you lose. You're wrong, but even if in your strange little minds you are sure you're right, so what. All your efforts are simply a waste of your life's time that could be put to good use doing something else. You lose. Game over. Find a new wacko conspiracy theory.


name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:03 pm

Again, here's US Law:

Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years

You know, the “Dem's” could have used this argument on McCain, but didn't.
Oh right, it was you Wacko Republicans who when after McCain's Panama birth.


name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:06 pm

Are you having a really hard time reading today?

Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years

Even if “Barry” were born in Kenya he'd still be eligible to be President.


IslandGyal
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:08 pm

LMAO, fools, hear and see what they what to hear & see; they look at the world and say; show us things the way we want to hear & see them, not they way they actually are….

Ignorance and delusion is bliss – Rock On!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:15 pm

You're a dumbass. Stop repeating the same stupid error.

In 1961, based on the mother's age, and the law at the time, she could not have conferred citizenship to her baby Dingle Barry with a foreign birth.

Don't be a ignorant fool. Look it up before you spout off.


KIMBER93
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:20 pm

Yes the birthers have a point – on top of their heads.
The smart guy won and they just can't stand it. They wanted someone “just like them” so they wouldn't feel intellectually threatened. Their intellectual firepower is best exemplified by Orly Taitz and Sarah Palin.
This whole thing boils down to anger over the fact that they don't represent “the real America” after all.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:20 pm

Where's the proof? What a stupid question! Who does the president work for? You don't know? Well let me help you. He works for the AMERICAN PEOPLE! He's not the effin' messiah. He's our employee. He applied for the job. The job has qualifications. He's yet to prove that he meets them. He needs to.

About the B/C, click this link to see what Obama’s real birth-certificate should look like. It’s for the two girls (Nordyke twins) that were born at the same day, time and place as Obama claims, and they are known to have gone to early school with Obama.

http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g160/steveb77…

As you could see, unlike the online fakes, the real certificates are very comprehensive. Obama wrote that he has it, in his book “Dreams.”

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:22 pm

Typical lefty scum. . .attacking the person and not their argument.


Kim
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:23 pm

This is crazy: there is a long paper trail from when Obama was the editor of the Harvard Law Review. I'm not going to rehearse the items here (because, as I said, it is a long list), but from his publications for the Law Review to his assistance on two books for one of Harvard's top constitutional law professors, to his votes and his drafted legislation in senate (at both the state and federal level) there is plenty of documentation.

Steve, don't you have a job? I think that you would benefit from an occupation.


Tony
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:27 pm

Except he was born i Hawaii, so problem solved.

What a joke you are..


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:27 pm

You should take your own advice, fool.

US Constitution Lesson #1.

President requires:

Article II, Section 1 No person except a natural-born citizen or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.

Senate requires

Article I Section III No person shall be a Senator who shall not have been nine years a citizen of the United States

Clearly they held a distinction (for POTUS) between a “citizen,” and a “natural-born” citizen. The difference is that Citizen or Native-born citizen could have one citizen parent. “Natural-born” citizen was to prevent dual allegiances and meant two citizen parents and born on US soil.

Other influences were The Federalist Papers, personal papers and the laws of Nations. All resources considered, the only conclusion is SOIL and BLOOD. US soil and the blood of 2 US Citizens. And Dingle Barry doesn’t qualify.


therealtrue100americanpatriot
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:28 pm

Captainsteve-

You have been reported; be prepared to be banned.


Tony
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:29 pm

Screaming into the internets about conspiracy theories.. The sad part is that this is probably a high point in your life.


Tony
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:31 pm

This from the fellow that just called someone a 'dumbass'? And calls the OP scum? Its fun watching your credibility go into the negative, you know, seeing as you had none to begin with. =)


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:32 pm

Ignorance and delusion is obviously working for you. He's not a NBC. He is a usurper.

You are a racist. You think that because the usurper is black, all white people should line up and prostrate themselves. If they don't, you all attack them and call them racist. That is racist.

Go away RACIST!


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:33 pm

jimv428 Not according to Kurt Tsue at the Hawaii Department of Health. You are incorrect ” Negro” was not the only choice.

Explain the newspaper announcements that come from the hospital & not the grandparents/parents. Even if the grandparents/parents did place the newspaper announcement,why, for what conceivable reason ? He would have been a US citizen because of his mother, if not, he easily could have become a naturalized citizen. There is NO way in 1961 they would have thought it necessary for him to be ” a natural born citizen ” because it's no way they would have thought someone half Black with the name Barack Hussein Obama would be President.
1961 it was still illegal ,because of WHITE racism, for interracial marriage to occur in many states, for Blacks to attends certain State Universities etc.

Proud to live near President Obama in Chicago !!!!!!


GiantDee66
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:38 pm

Was McCain born on US soil


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:39 pm

I haven't done anything wrong. You are typical of stupid lefty-loser-libs that you can't debate the issue, so you attack the person.


buckunstoppable
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:39 pm

I wouldn't want this pinhead flipping my burgers.


mycookie100
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:39 pm

OK Camile. The FBI, CIA and Dept of Justice had to CERTIFY THE PRESIDENT BEFORE HE COULD RAISE A PENNY TO RUN FOR THE PRESIDENCY!

SO YOU KNOW BETTER, YOU AND ALL THE BIRTHERS. YOU'VE ALWAYS BEEN WACKY, BUT MY HUSBAND USED TOR EAD YOU, SO I IGNORED YOU BASICALLY.

Now you're just nuts!


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:43 pm

Prove that point I bet you can't. Hispanic isn't a race either. Is it used on US birth certificates ?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:44 pm

But it's okay for Cevale to refer to the OP as, ” A culture grown in a test tube!”?

You're a typical two-faced-lefty-lib-loser.


SlanMan
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:46 pm

It has nothing to do with Hawaii (but good try): Obama was legally adopted by his stepfather, Lolo Soetoro, which made Obama an Indonesian citizen according to Indonesian law. Because Indonesia does not allow dual citizenship, Obama thus lost his U.S. citizenship (if he even had it) when he became an Indonesian citizen in or about 1967. At that point, Obama also ceased to be a Kenyan citizen, according to both Indonesian and Kenyan law. Indonesian law would also have required Ann Dunham (Obama's mother) to renounce her U.S. citizenship for her marriage to Lolo Soetoro to have been considered legal in that country. If, after Obama returned to Hawaii, he applied for and was granted American citizenship he would be a naturalized citizen (like California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger) and not a natural born citizen, and would therefore be ineligible to serve as president of the United States. It is possible that Obama did not even bother to become a naturalized citizen of the United States and remains an Indonesian citizen even today. Appropriate federal records would be on file if Obama made application for naturalization. If they exist, they have not been made public. Are you saying you're perfectly content having a citizen of Indonesia duping America?


americanabroad
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:48 pm

Still at the keyboard Capt. Steve? You need a life.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:56 pm

Why would Steve be banned? Because he has the temerity to question the eligibility of the so called “the Chosen One”? Free speech still counts for something doesn’t it?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:56 pm

No he was not. He was not a NBC and was inelligible to be POTUS, so the Senate merely DECIDED he is a NBC based on the fact he was born by TWO US Citizen parents. While it is true you must be born by two US Citizen parents, McCain failed the requirement of being born on US Soil.

The Senate DECIDED since his Father was in the military and stationed outside of the US at the time of McCain's birth that that qualifies him as a NBC and passed a resolution declaring he was. The problem is the Senate does NOT have any constitutional authority to make changes to the constitution by merely passing a resolution. That resolution is as worthless as the piece of paper it was written on


americanabroad
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:57 pm

Can it get any more convoluted and ridiculous than that?
Not to mention wrong. Dual citizenship is allowed as long as it is acquired “naturally” as in having parents of two nationalities. Also Indonesia has no ability to negate someone's citizenship in another country. It is up to the individual to renounce their citizenship and it is not a simple process. Also parents are not allowed to renounce citizenship for their children,


SlanMan
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 3:59 pm

On the contrary, Obama was legally adopted by his stepfather, Lolo Soetoro, which made Obama an Indonesian citizen according to Indonesian law. Because Indonesia does not allow dual citizenship, Obama thus lost his U.S. citizenship (if he even had it) when he became an Indonesian citizen in or about 1967. At that point, Obama also ceased to be a Kenyan citizen, according to both Indonesian and Kenyan law. Indonesian law would also have required Ann Dunham (Obama's mother) to renounce her U.S. citizenship for her marriage to Lolo Soetoro to have been considered legal in that country. If, after Obama returned to Hawaii, he applied for and was granted American citizenship he would be a naturalized citizen (like California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger) and not a natural born citizen, and would therefore be ineligible to serve as president of the United States. It is possible that Obama did not even bother to become a naturalized citizen of the United States and remains an Indonesian citizen even today. Appropriate federal records would be on file if Obama made application for naturalization. If they exist, they have not been made public. So, no, Dingle Barry is NOT eligible to hold the office of President of the United States.


Andrew DiMartino
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:00 pm

Camille has always been brilliant when she has studied a subject, such as art, but overall, I have always felt that she has very stark intellectual shortcomings, along with an inability to actually determine what is going on. She is also a bit of a attention hound. Her “birther” opinions are a good example of that. Her ability to pioneer thought has always been lacking.


terbor
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:01 pm

Wow, Captain Steve, you are some stud muffin. I have been looking at comments you made over the last 14 hours, that's right, 14 hours. Holy Moley Steve. I have to say “wheeew,” hat's off to you. You even catch people grammatical errors. Because the content and context of what people say isn't important is it Steve. You are the Energizer Bunny of commentary. How do you do it Steve, what is your secret. Hey Cap'n, just one question. How many people have you convinced so far?


SlanMan
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:04 pm

Dual citizenship is NOT allowed if it disallowed in a country like Indonesia that by law requires single citizenship. Indonesia’s policy of not allowing dual citizenship must be respected by the United States in accordance with the Hague Convention of 1930. Further, Obama, as a child, was not specifically required to renounce his U.S. – that would have been an automatic result of his adoption by Lolo Soetoro. Fair or not, the consequence of Dunham’s marriage to Soetoro and Soetoro’s adoption of Obama was that he became an Indonesian citizen… regardless of whether he understood the situation at age five or six.


name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:07 pm

Indonesian Law does NOT supersede US Law. Period.


name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:08 pm

Go back to Indonesia.


midwicket
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:10 pm

You do not understand simple stuff, Captain Steve. Yes, he works for the American people and they went to the polls last year to say that he is qualified. Case closed.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:10 pm

Typical lefty trying to impose their ideas on other people. Go away fascist (take your usurper with you).

I'll do as I please.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:13 pm

You missed his (correct) point.

When Barry was adopted, he became an Indonesian citizen. Then, under US law, he was no longer a US citizen.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:14 pm

He wasn't born in Hawaii. He all know it. That's why your side is fighting so hard to suppress all the records.

If you disagree, then let's see them! Here's the list again.

• Original, vault copy birth certificate — Not released — over $1,000,000 spent to conceal — birth certificate — $15.
• Certification of Live Birth — Released – probable counterfeit
• Admitted British/Kenyan citizenship at birth — Admitted
• Hospital of birth — Three hospitals have some claim — 2 in Hawaii 1 in Kenya
• Obama/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Obama/Dunham divorce — Not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Kindergarten records – “lost”
• Soetoro/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Soetoro adoption records — Not released
• Fransiskus Assisi School School application — not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Punahou School records — Not released
• Soetoro/Dunham divorce – concealed by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Selective Service Registration — Released – and proven counterfeit
• Occidental College records — Not released
• Passport — Not released — investigation witness shot dead
• Columbia College records — Not released
• Columbia thesis — “Soviet Nuclear Disarmament” – Not released
• Harvard College records — Not released
• Harvard Law Review articles — None
• Illinois Bar Records — Not released.
• Medical records — Not released
• Illinois State Senate records — None
• Illinois State Senate schedule — “Lost”
• Law practice client list — Not released
• University of Chicago scholarly articles — None


SlanMan
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:17 pm

I'm not saying that it does. Part of becoming an Indonesian and being adopted by an Indonesian is giving up all other citizenships. Done and over with. America and all other countries recognize this. And if the Messiah gave up his American rights in the mid-sixties he can't conveniently have them back when ever he wants.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:18 pm

Don't post if you don't know anything about the topic. In the USA the people don't elect the president.

Let me guess, you went to public school didn't you?

Go take a basic civics lesson.


Linda
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:35 pm

Paglia its a played out, tired and never too interesting nut job despite her frantic attempts to be provocative. She's never been wound too tight. Like Madonna, her main talent is self promotion.


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:40 pm

Do you know what a fascist is? I do not think you do.


Ray
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:40 pm

If the Clinton's didn't find anything it's not there. Do you really think they wanted Obama to win?


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:43 pm

Dear Captain Steve:

Obviously, I struck a nerve! Which raises an important point. Because you are a stupid idiot don't assume everybody else is. Since you asked the question, let me ask it back. Did you work at any newspapers in Honolulu in 1961?

Of course you didn't!

So what you are doing is what is colloquially referred to as 'TALKING OUT OF YOUR ASS!”

You presumed to compare to separate sections of the newspaper and presumed that they operated in exactly the same way.

They don't!

I do this everyday. And 98% of what you wrote is BS!

Don't get mad because you got caught at it.

But let me give you an example of why the newspaper article matters. There is a legal case taught about hearsay in Law School. The rule is that Hearsay is an out of court statement made to prove the truth of the matter asserted. Hearsay is of course inadmissible unless you can find an exception to the rule. In this legal case a man was fatally injured. Before he died he announced to his companion “I'm dying!” There was a dispute about the policy. At trial the insurance company tried to have the statement excluded as hearsay. His family got it in. Why? Not because the statement was true. But because it had been made! (which defacto made it true by the way.)

The birth announcement in the paper if you read it is not a family announcement celebrating the birth of the family (like a wedding announcement or a memorial.) Its a papers listing of the vital statistics.

So, it is ergo true.

So my advice to you is the following. a-know what you are talking about before you talk and b- STFU up yourself until you do.


name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:46 pm

Hmmm…

Looks like the “Birther” movie is a Total CROCK:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/terry-krepel/birt…


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:47 pm

what is the specific statute? Specifically?


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:48 pm

Wow, misinformed, whiny, and hostile, too- you hit the Trifecta. Congrats.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:49 pm

Of course I do, fool. Here's 2 clips. Go look it up before you pop-off.

2 : a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control

the word fascist is intended to mean “oppressive”, “intolerant”, “chauvinist”, “genocidal”, “dictatorial”, “racist”, or “aggressive”


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:50 pm

I want to say to the birthers what John Wayne used to say to hippies-

America- love it or leave it.


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 4:51 pm

Thank you.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:55 pm

Actually, you did…and I could tell, I caught you. I notice how less verbose you have become here with me. Exhaustion? Or better yet…your logic leaving you? What the newspaper announcement proves is that an event happened. That even specifically refers to Barak Obama. Now either, Obama was born in Hawaii at the time of the announcement, or his family happened to be so shrewd that they were able to plant an announcement figuring that he was gonna be President. Either way, your argument falls apart due to sheer logic. After all, I am an African American. I am a lot older than Barak Obama and I NEVER thought I would live to see an African American President. So you tell me….How did the Obama family become so prescient? Hmmmmm????? Do they have some form of ESP or a strong connection to the force? Or do they possess magical mystical powers that allow them to see the future?

So sofar lets recap. You have constructed a mythical newspaper announcement that is phrased as a report. You have said that the informational form of the certificate is not enough when it is. You have denied then saying that.

Excuse me but do you have even the slightest piece of evidence that any of the nonsense you say is true?

And you don’t have to worry about my age young man…I am grown up enough to Bulls**t when I see it. And so far you are producing a canyon load…LOL…

CAPTAIN STEVE STOP LYING AND PRODUCE SOME EVIDENCE!!


kaoru42
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:00 pm

Yeah, I also wonder if Paglia, my neighbors, teachers, and many people around me whom I don't like are not American.


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:01 pm

The word “fascist” was coined in Italy. It is from the Italian “fascia”, which is a bundle of sticks. All the sticks in the bundle point in the same direction. This connotes unity. Mussolini used the idea as a symbol, when he joined and influenced the fledgling Fascist party, much as Hitler used the swastika for his National Socialism- a simple and direct idea that strikes people's imaginations and inspires them. The hammer and sickle was used to the same effect in the Soviet Union.

The reason you refer to our President as “liar” and “fascist” is because, the sticks aren't pointing in your direction any more. You can't understand why this is happening. You're frightened and angry.

And you don't have enough time to write your own posts, so you Google, cut and paste, and then make the mistake of leaving evidence of your cutting and pasting (2:, what happened to 1:)?


name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:02 pm

We don't “know” he wasn't born in Hawaii. We know he was. We know the “Birther” movie is a total crock.


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:02 pm

Still waiting for the specific statute. Could it be that you're really just scamming everyone?


Anais
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:03 pm

What exactly are the “ambiguities”? I have seen an online copy of Obama s certificate of live birth, which is what Hawaii calls their documents. I have seen copies of the Honolulu newspaper that printed his birth announcement on television. I have read the accounts of Hawaii state officials who confirm he was born in that state. What more does Paglia want? If she wants to see the original, let her travel to Honolulu and ask officials to show it to her. Was this much demanded of George W. Bush? No, everyone just took his word for it that he was born in the USA. I never saw one document proving W was born in this country. I am going to have to rethink my logging onto Salon any time soon if they employ credulous people like Camille Paglia.


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:03 pm

Where did you get that list? You just made all that up, didn't you?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:05 pm

I presumed nothing. I wrote that the newspaper's birth announcement is meaningless. That's a fact, especially when it come to eligibility as a NBC. Grow up.

It doesn't surprise me that, with people like you, the newspapers are losing readers and going broke.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


SlanMan
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:05 pm

You got me there. Digging through Indonesia's laws to find the exact statute that requires an internationally accepted nullification of earlier citizenships is more work than I'm willing to put into this topic. I am happy to send you in the right direction, however. Based on a fairly thorough understanding of the issues, though, there is no way Obama is eligible for the office. Hense, Barry and Co.'s the ongoing and unprecedented obfuscation campaign.


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:10 pm

No, I mean the AMERICAN STATUTE that the birthers say disqualifies Obama as president.

Indonesian law is totally irrelevant to this situation, but, if you're not prepared to back up your claims with facts, why bother making them? All I have right now is your word that there is some obscure Indonesian law, but you yourself don't even know what it is.

When you make claims, you really should be able to back it up with facts. People will trust you more.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:13 pm

Your Bison icon fits you. You're dumb and hard-headed.

Re. . .(2:, what happened to 1:)

You must not understand how to use a dictionary! I wasn't using the #1 definition. I was using the second.

Let me guess, public school? Right?


Cevale
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:16 pm

Captainsteve, you were joking right? Attacking the person you say?The right hasn't done that since Obama first announced? What planet are you from? Lets see your birth certificate to make sure you are from planet Eart!


Linda
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:17 pm

Oh yes, that's logical except they're all in on it, see? It's a vast left wing conspiracy!!!


Linda
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:19 pm

Yeah well you know, us lefty, sorry, us stupid lefty losers are all about attacking the person, you know, with name calling and insults.


Cevale
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:20 pm

CaptSteve, you post the photo of Obama that you do and expect that you have any credibility in this argument. Go drape yourself in the Confederate flag and march to South Carolina where you will have a captive audience. Don't forget your sidearm. Birther!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:25 pm

Paglia is right. There are more logical questions than answers.

What hospital was he born in? Who were the witnesses? Who was the doctor? Those answers are only on the long-form (the one that is sealed, even though some say nothing is sealed). Some say it doesn’t exist. But if it doesn’t then what did the people see that makes them sure of his birthplace, since the short-form is also available to those who are foreign born?

Three different COLBs (Certification of Live Birth (short-form)) have been posted online by Factcheck etc. The first 2 had issues and were replaced. The current one has issues too (too detailed for here, but race of African is one of many).

Some sites have said they “examined” the document. Which one, since they are all different? Why are they all modified? Why not release it/them to independent skeptics? Why not release the long-form?

Three different hospitals have some claim to his birth-place, two in Hawaii, One in Kenya.

Why spend millions of dollars in attorney fees to prevent all documents from being seen?

On top of that, the issue of his Kenyan/British father exists. The concept of natural-born citizenship was to prevent dual allegiances. Why was that never addressed? They did for McCain (IMHO he's not “natural-born” either).

And then the issue of Nancy Pelosi signing two different campaign documents, one without the usual constitutional eligibility statement.

To me there are more serious questions than serious answers. . .so I will continue the campaign to uphold the Constitution!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:28 pm

Have you considered that they had the same backers (Soros etc), and they wanted the issue kept quiet to insure the best probability of winning?


daltonII
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:38 pm

Have you run this right wing nutcase driel by the Republican Governor or hospital administrators at the hospital where he was born?

They ALL concur in their opinion that the documents are authentic.

And what makes you think no one knows what hospital where he was born?


samtaybi
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:38 pm

Do any of these nutballs understand that John McCain WAS born in Panama?
All the while, Obama was born in Hawaii! – Most definitely part of the Good Old USA. Hello!!!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:40 pm

Which part is offensive, the picture or the word liar? The picture was first used on Bush, then adapted to obummer by a lefty. The word liar is because he is a liar.

Not a dime to illegals for healthcare, then he says he wants to legalize them all.
No earmarks. No lobbyists. No deficit spending. Close Gitmo. Get out of Iraq. Lies lies and more lies. And you want me to believe him about his birth certificate? No effin' way!

Obama is a liar, straight-up! I’ll believe him AFTER he keep some old promises.
Watch this video about his past health-care promises. You’ll see obama lie like a dog in his very own words.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3JKDTBOYKg

Nuf said.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:42 pm

I was criticized for th icon I'm using. here's my response.

Which part is offensive, the picture or the word liar? The picture was first used on Bush, then adapted to obummer by a lefty. The word liar is because he is a liar.

Not a dime to illegals for healthcare, then he says he wants to legalize them all.
No earmarks. No lobbyists. No deficit spending. Close Gitmo. Get out of Iraq. Lies lies and more lies. And you want me to believe him about his birth certificate? No effin' way!

Obama is a liar, straight-up! I’ll believe him AFTER he keep some old promises.
Watch this video about his past health-care promises. You’ll see obama lie like a dog in his very own words.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3JKDTBOYKg

Nuf said.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:43 pm

His sister said it was Queens, and that settles it for you does it?


Cevale
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:44 pm

Capt.Crud;
I'm not sure if you could be any more delusional! You guys lost the civil war and need to get over it. You are so paranoid that the Old South is gone for good. Well it is and for the few of you that remain…. attrition and an education past the fourth grade will thin your ranks even more. But until then the majority will have to indulge your ilk and your lunatic conspiracy theories.


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 5:49 pm

So you don't have time to take the 2 out of your cut and paste?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:02 pm

We agree that Obama is a liar, but you’re still a RACIST. Go spew your racist venom elsewhere. Nobody wants a racist around here.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:02 pm

Please show show some restraint Captain and think about your country. We need this man. We can not survive another George Bush.


ricmarc
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:12 pm

to those who think paglia and the birthers have a point please get some mental health help for you are obviously nuts.

obama was born in the united states. there is no question in this regard. it is a fact. you can't deal with a black president so you are grasping at straws. YOU HAVE NO POINT. PERIOD.

john mccain on the other hand was born in PANAMA OUTSIDE THE U.S. ZONE. he was also a prisoner who was captured and tortured by the COMMUNISTS. if anyone would have been the manchurian candidate it would have been him. you nut jobs started calling obama that even though THE BLACK GUY WAS THE GOOD GUY IN THE MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE. DENZEL WASHINGTON WAS IN THE FRANK SINATRA ROLE.

YOU NUT JOBBERS ADORE THAT PALIN FREAK AND IT TURNS OUT EVERYTHING BUT THE WITCH HUNTER BUDDY WAS A LIE. SHE SOESN'T HUNT, SHOOT, GUT, COOK OR ANYTHING ELSE, SHE QUITS!


Anon
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:12 pm

“You got me there… I'm just pulling this stuff out of my butt which is why I can't give you citation.”

If your argument was worth anything whatsoever, you wouldn't have any trouble giving a citation to someplace where the argument is made with a little supporting evidence.

You do realize that only a deeply stupid person would still be going on about this theory? You've had months to watch one argument after another be shown to be completely made up. Remember the ban on travel to Pakistan that never existed? My only question is whether there is someplace in your brain where you realize how moronic your argument is?


ricmarc
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:15 pm

NO WMD'S, NO DRONES, NO CHEMICALS, NO NUKES, NO YELLOW CAKE.

TORTURE, MURDER, DEFICITS AND A WAR THAT HE LIED US INTO, THAT IS GEORGE BUSH, LIAR.


ricmarc
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:17 pm

DID OBAMA'S MOTHER USE THE SAME TIME MACHINE BUSH USED TO GO INTO THE FUTURE TO TORTURE SOMEONE TO STOP A TERRORIST ATTACK IN THE PAST OR DID SHE USE ANOTHER ONE?

YOU HAVE NO POINT. YOU ARE JUST A CRAZY RACIST!


terrisca
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:18 pm

Hm, Dubya went to private schools, right?


ricmarc
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:21 pm

they already have a guy who lived down the street from the obama's that remembers our president being born. right there in hawaii. they won't give him the money though. they want the people who were in the delivery room, people that are all dead because it was over 4 DECADES ago.

we know the hospital and everything else. you just choose to ignore the truth.


bbbbooop
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:23 pm

Is this women a JAP or just another corporate payed whore?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:27 pm

Sorry. You're wrong.

US Constitution Lesson #1.

President requires:

Article II, Section 1 No person except a natural-born citizen or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.

Senate requires

Article I Section III No person shall be a Senator who shall not have been nine years a citizen of the United States

Clearly they held a distinction (for POTUS) between a “citizen,” and a “natural-born” citizen. The difference is that Citizen or Native-born citizen could have one citizen parent. “Natural-born” citizen was to prevent dual allegiances and meant two citizen parents and born on US soil.

Other influences were The Federalist Papers, personal papers and the laws of Nations. All resources considered, the most accepted conclusion is natural-born citizenship requires both SOIL and BLOOD. US soil and the blood of 2 US Citizens. And Dingle Barry doesn’t qualify regardless of where he was born.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:31 pm

You're a low-life racist, straight-up.

Don't you have something to do? Go cash your welfare check or something.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:33 pm

You're mostly right. So what's your point? Just because Bush lied, it's ok for Obama to lie also? Interesting logic, but I'll pass.


pvel
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:36 pm

President Obama is so much better for this country than the idiot he replaced.It looks like some people have a hard time coming to terms with this fact. So they are coming up with lame ass fantasies.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:39 pm

No. . .I left it for honesty. I didn't want to misrepresent my use as being the primary usage. Honesty is not something you would know much about, is it?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:42 pm

You're a RACIST! Keep it to yourself. stfu


Kinsey
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:45 pm

Well, I do honestly think you are a little disturbed. How's that for honesty?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:48 pm

You obviously know nothing about how presidential candidates are vetted. The parties themselves (in this case DNC) are 100% responsible for determining eligibility. I know; I wrote to the State election officials. Google it.

Go to the following link and see. It’s the DNC’s Certification of Nomination document for Obama to run for president. Only one is normally filed. In Obama’s case, two were filed. The difference between the two (both signed by Pelosi) is that one omits the standard verbiage swearing constitutional eligibility of the candidate. They are supposed to say:

“and that the following candidates for President and Vice President of the United States are legally qualified to serve under the provisions of the United States Constitution.”

But that part just happened to get skipped. . .on one. . .both not the other. . .hmmm, very odd!

http://americangrandjury.org/nancy-pelosi-clear…

Nancy Pelosi knew he wasn’t eligible. That’s why she played games with the official certification documents.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND YOUR OTHER RECORDS!!!!!


Katherine
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:58 pm

Do people still listen to this idiot? She is awful, and a phony balony feminist.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 6:59 pm

Nah–background checks are for mere mortals, not politicians. Dubya had a DUI record, Obama has God-knows what else in his file and non-Americans have made it onto the Presidential ballot.

Rogar Calero (Socialist Workers Party Presidential candidate), who was born in Nicaragua, successfully got on the ballot in nearly a dozen states. When, for a lark, some cops in Georgia entered Obama's name into the FBI database, they ended up getting suspended. Some new recruits at Homeland Security got into the same trouble, when they entered Obama's name into the passport records database and got into the same sort of trouble.

Obama IS hiding SOMETHING. This is from the guy who admitted to using cocaine, in his autobiography, so caginess about his past is unusual. It might be his birthplace, or even all the nice Chicago Outfit-types he's associated with. He's had half a dozen tax-cheats and a 'truther' racist in his government, so he's not adverse to shady acquaintances. Unless the Posey bill is passed, there won't be a formal vetting procedure for a President.


capalzo
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:02 pm

Captain,

You can't believe this. If this was the truth and the law, the black guy would not be in office. The election laws, would have removed him from the ballot. The Congress, The Senate, as well as the Conservative Supreme Court, would have ruled against his appointment. This black guy would have never had a chance to get elected, if he was not qualified to be elected. If you don't like the black guy and his politics, it's ok.


Katherine
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:02 pm

Why are you throwing McCain under the bus? He was born in Panama because his father was stationed there as was my grandfather which is why my father was also born there. This has nothing to do with Paglia's absurdity. I've never understood why she has a platform to begin with. Her scholarship is sketchy at best and she's just not too sharp.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:05 am

And he’s STILL President. Now that’s power !


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:07 am

Thomas Jefferson ‘s mom was British too.


capalzo
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:13 pm

Captain,

All politicians tell lie's or half truths. What's amazing about the black guy is, now there's a group of mostly white people upset with his promises. This same group has become constitutional lawyers and constitutionalists. Where was this outcry when the previous administration throw out the Constitution. Steve where were you!!!! Your lack of outrage at the Bush administration, confuses most educated and sane people, to the point, it makes you and others appear, to only be outrage because the guy is black. Seek Help with your issues, so you can help the others.


capalzo
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:18 pm

Call Bush and ask him for his Military Records. If you remember, he never produced them, the disloyal F–k. I see you can relate to this loser Bush. He lied about his military records and covered up many other things about his past. A long form birth certificate, are you kidding. John McCain has never produced his military records, what does he has to hide???? That is really a greater question, with all the rumors about how he collaborated with the enemy. Can you please look into this and get back with me.


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:22 pm

Andrew Jackson, Thomas Jefferson, James Buchanan,Herbert Hoover, Chester Arthur & Woodrow Wilson all had parents born in other countries. Neither of Andrew Jackson's parents were born in America ( So Obama trumps him )

Your turn.

I love living down the street from the Obamas & Bill Ayers too !


capalzo
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:25 pm

Steve,

Come on!! If not the Clinton's, what about McCain. Wouldn't he just wait until day's before the election and blow the whistle on the guy. McCain, wanted to be President, He dug up Ayers, Wright, etc. If there was anything to this, McCain would have laid it out. Does this not end the conversation. The facts are the facts, now what is the real problem with the Black guy????????


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:30 am

The President doesn’t have to answer to you. The President was a resident of Idonesia from 1967 to 1971 only four years.
And travel to Pakistan WAS NOT forbidden in 1991

Law Licenses For Both President Obama & the First Lady:Voluntarily retired and not authorized to practice law
Public Record of Discipline
and Pending Proceedings: None
GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT.


mike
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:32 pm

Just so you know, language of Article II, Section 1 must be *interpreted* to mean that only citizens that were born in the United States can be President.

What it actually states, on the other hand, means NOBODY can be President. “…, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, …” clearly states that only individuals that were alive prior to the adoption can be President.

Also, what exactly does “natural-born” mean? Surely, this must exclude individuals born through caesarean section, or those conceived through in vitro fertilization. Perhaps the Constitution is stating that individuals of mixed heritage should be excluded, because many (most) people at the time of adoption believed a child of mixed race was “unnatural”.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:39 am

Kinsey, I love the USA, and I am under oath to defend the US Constitution. Barack Obama not submitted evidence proving he meets the eligibility to be POTUSA, and Nancy Pelosi, either negligently, or fraudulently failed to properly vet him. So far, his only document in evidence is residency COLB from Hawaii. Neither he nor the state of Hawaii can show the origin of the data transcribed in abstract on his residency COLB. I need to see a Long Form COLB


kmcdevitt
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 7:55 pm

For years now it has seemed as if all of Paglia's contributions to public discourse have been provocative by design, rather than thought-provoking. Honestly, I wish she'd shut up.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 1:03 am

However, all historical records, both paper and microfilm, from 1961should still be archived in a warehouse vault. :)


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:10 pm

Here's the article, re. Pelosi & Obama's paperwork, that some have mentioned here:

http://www.canadafreepress.com/2009/williams091…


HostileKnowledge
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:13 pm

I hear a lot of nastiness and name calling. So please, just one of you Einstein wannabes explain why Obama has gone to such extraordinary lengths to cover up so much of the documentation about his life. His BC is only one document.

So let me see if I have this straight: The reason Obama hides so many documents relating to his life is because he has nothing to hide.

Liberal logic.


a. mcewen
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:21 pm

The President has provided all the proof that is needed. He doesn't have to provide any extra proof.


ricmarc
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:21 pm

because it matters. HE WAS THE ONE NOT BORN IN THIS COUNTRY NOT OBAMA AND IT IS IGNORED BY THE BIRTHERS WHO HAVE NO POINT JUST AS CAMILLE DOESN'T. BY THEIR OWN RULES MCCAIN WASN'T ELIGABLE TO RUN!


ricmarc
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:23 pm

WHY ARE YOU SO STUPID? WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY? BECAUSE YOU ARE A RACIST THAT IS WHY. NO MATTER HOW MUCH PROOF IS PROVIDED YOU WILL STILL BE IN DENIAL!


ricmarc
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:26 pm

YOU ARE SO STUPID IT HURTS.


HostileKnowledge
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:33 pm

I suppose now that your imminence has made this holy declaration that everyone should just sit down and shut up?

Obama is in serious trouble – more than most people know. Van Jones fell and people want to know what Obama knew about Jones and when he knew it. Now ACORN has bitten the dust and calls for an independent prosecutor are loud and crystal clear. The prospect of an independent prosecutor scares the hell out of Obama.

The outing of Obama as a radical socialist will continue unabated. Get accustomed to it!


jimw428
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:35 pm

What does anything Bush may or may not have done, have to do with Obama's eligibility to be President?

You're using one of the two most commonly used Libtard debating tactics:
1. Call the opposition “Racist”.
2. Change the subject to “it's all the fault of George Bush”!


jimw428
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 8:40 pm

Ah, another liberal debating tactic. In the face of legitimate questions, revert to shouting and name calling!


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 1:44 am

The “nice try” goes to you.

First, I doubt your facts on Indonesian law. Show me where that law can be found. (Kenyan law is irrelevant given that I will shoot down your claim in the following paragraph, but I don’t see any citation in your post to Kenyan law either).

Second, even if that is the law in Indonesia, which I strongly doubt, show me where in any US law or code it says that if a foreign country, which does not allow dual citizenship, grants citizenship to a U.S. citizen that the U.S. citizenship ends. There is a small problem of jurisdiction there buddy. In other words, if you get divorced in Colorado and the Colorado court grants your Missouri real estate to your wife, the state of Missouri can say sorry, Colorado courts have no jurisdiction to award Missouri land. The U.S. could care less what Indonesia says about who is and is not a U.S. citizen.

Of course, the truth of your nonsense screed comes out whey you you accuse him of duping America. Look, you voted for the old guy with the mentally-challenged running mate, they lost. So, as I said, again, you guys lose. Its over, move on.

Pensive

________________________________


Name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:05 pm

reported


Name
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:08 pm

captainsteve-

you have been reported for being abusive; hopefully you will be banned.


Linda Wyatt
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:20 pm

Birthers really are nutjobs. It does not matter where your parents are born to be a natural born citizen.My mothers parents wre both foreign born,but since she was born here,she is a U.S. citizen by birth. The state of Hawaii has public records proving Obama was born in Hawaii. How did he get a passport without a birth certificate. All U.S. passports list the country of birth. Where is the proof that Obama's mother ever set foot in Kenya.? Even nutjob Bill Oreilley investigated the claims and found proof of his U.S. birth. In order to be president you have to been born in the United States. A military base in Panama does not qualify. You have to be born in one of the 50 states. I bet dumb birthers dont believe in evolution or global warming.


Adam
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:20 pm

I hardly think B.O. is a 'socialist'.

ACORN was essentially an old, mob-style (a la 'The Great McGinty') vote-fraud machine, masquerading as some sort of anti-racist/anti-poverty initiative. Obama's massive (over $700M–the largest in history) campaign kitty came largely from huge corporations and very capitalist donors. The 'lots of small donors' line was crap. Obama's donors included Microsoft and Google, medical-financial (HMO) firms and pharmaceutical companies, which is reflected in the Obamacare legislation he's flogging. The feared, 'socialistic' Public Option has the support of most HMOs/insurers, since, like Medicaid and Medicare, it pulls risky clients from the insurers' actuarial pools. Obama's media-telecom donors can also count on their man to kill the Bush FCC's whitespectrum reallocation (broadband) plan. Agribusiness giant Monsanto gets an extra special treat, with the appointment of Michael Taylor.

Obama has gotten more dough from unions. However, union pension funds and other institutional investors (TIAA-CREF, &c.) are essentially large, capitalistic entities onto themselves. Marx, Engels and Smith never saw THAT coming. These unions' pension funds have large ownership stakes in some of the big, scary corporations that the lefties claim to hate.

Like, the GOP, the Democrats are firmly in the pockets of big money…just different big money (oil vs. auto companies, r[ei]nsurance and banks vs HMOs). Until there's a serious overhaul of campaign finance (strict donation caps, bans on corporate and union donation), going all the way down to the local government level, it'll be business as usual.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:22 pm

Don't like to hear the truth huh? Get used to it. There's millions more of me. Thx to Obama's plummeting poll ratings, his desire do eliminate the First Amendment will go down in flames like the rest of his community organizer cronies in ACORN just did.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:24 pm

Touche. . .case closed.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:27 pm

You reported me for calling a racist a racist? That makes you a RACIST too! Keep it to yourself. stfu


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:30 pm

Neither McCain nor Obambi ate natural-born citizens. Dingle Barry's dad was British. He wouldn't have been legally eligible for POTUS even if he had been born in the White House.

He's a usurper. Get him out.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:35 pm

Question for all of Barry's upporters:

If Osama Bin Laden (a non US Citizen) impregnated a US Citizen, and the offspring of that union was born in a hospital in Hawaii, would the offspring be a “natural born citizen” and eligible to be POTUS?

Please just answer YES or NO.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:38 pm

The entire Constitution has to be interpreted. What's your point?

In this issue they allowed two types of citizens:

1) a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution. That for say George Washington et al. No one alive fits this.

2) a Natural-born citizen (as opposed to just a citizen). Obama isn't. Obama's a no go. (not to be confused with “pay-go”. . .another of his many lies)

The difference is that Citizen or Native-born citizen could have one citizen parent. “Natural-born” citizen was to prevent dual allegiances and meant two citizen parents and born on US soil. Other influences in that interpretation (not me, but historically) were The Federalist Papers, personal papers and the laws of Nations. All resources considered, the most accepted conclusion is natural-born citizenship requires both SOIL and BLOOD. US soil and the blood of 2 US Citizens. And Dingle Barry doesn’t qualify regardless of where he was born.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:40 pm

You're a RACIST. Go spew your racist venom elsewhere. Nobody wants a racist around here.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:41 pm

BINGO! Head of the class!


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 2:43 am

Nobody is 100% anything, but Obama is a Marxist/Socialist/Radical Leftist.

Please tell us what you say he is?


ricmarc
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:44 pm

YES YOU MORON.


ricmarc
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:45 pm

good grief! the birthers are racist and anyone who thinks obama isn't qualified to be president do to where he was born needs their head examined. you are all just a bunch of matt drudge fans coming here and posting out right stupidity. how stupid are you people? is your racist hate making you so blind that you can't see the forest for the trees?

THERE IS NO PROOF THAT OBAMA WAS NOT BORN IN THIS COUNTRY. ALL YOU ARE DOING IS TRYING TO DE-LEGITAMIZE THE PRESIDENT BY SAYING HE ISN'T QUALIFIED TO HOLD OFFICE.

YOU ARE NOTHING BUT A BUNCH OF FIFTH COLUMNISTS AND ENGAGING IN SEDITION. SHAME ON ALL OF YOU!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:50 pm

It's much worse than that my friend. As far as Dingle Barry's supporters are concerned, Bin Laden's squeeze could be here only one day, drop her baby, take it back to Afghanistan or wherever, raise it as an Al Qaeda fighter, and it would be eligible to be POTOS, all because it was a US citizen (anchor baby).

They don't know how messed up is their logic. Of course they won't answer your simple question.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:50 pm

Wrong!…the offspring is a US Citizen but not a “natural born citizen.”….


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:51 pm

More lefty tripe. (Didn't you forget to call him a racist though?)


HostileKnowledge
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:52 pm

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carol-m-swain/a-f…
A Few Thoughts About President Obama's Birthday, the Need for Disclosure, and Transparency
SNIP:
Only great men (and hopefully one day, great women) can ascend to the highest office in the land. And yes, that includes President George W. Bush and others we sometimes malign. It is critical for scholars and biographers to be able to study all aspects of the lives of our presidents. Unfortunately, President Obama, who promised healing and transparency, has created unnecessary distractions by refusing to release sealed documents that would shed more light on who he is, and the forces that helped shape his identity. Although some may argue that the sealed records are none of our business, I would have to disagree. Once a person becomes the President of the United States, in my humble opinion he or she should belong to the people; therefore, the ordinary rights of privacy should no longer apply.

Carol M. Swain
Political Analyst, Professor of Political Science and Law at Vanderbilt University

Professor Swain is black, so you Obama liberals can hold onto your ranting about racism.


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:54 pm

Where's the BANANA?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:56 pm

Ricmarc wrote: “…birthers are racist and anyone who thinks obama isn't qualified to be president…”

You're correct! Not only is he not qualified but he's also not eligible!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 9:58 pm

Nobody said it matters where the parents were born. It only matters what their citizenship is at the time of the baby's birth (both must be US citizens). . .and the location (born on US soil).

What do you about Global Warming? You saw algore's movie, ans now you're an expert?

My degree is in science, and I've spent 30 years working with meteorology in my career.

The AGW panic is nothing more than fear-mongering to gain power over the world economy.

Don’t believe the hype. CO2 is plant food. It is historically low now (380ish ppm). All the carbon in oil and coal deposits was in the atmosphere in the past. There is NO TIPPING POINT. It could go to 2000ppm and not be an issue. Big fat Al Gore is a big fat liar!

If CO2 falls much lower we are in trouble. CO2 and global temperatures are below long term normals. There is virtually NO risk on the higher side, especially for CO2! Look at this 600 million year chart for proof.

http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g160/steveb77…


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:01 pm

crickets


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:03 pm

You're a racist to see everything in racist glasses. Go way RACIST. Nobody wants a racist around here!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:04 pm

Bananas don't handle heat very well! haha


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:10 pm

Think so? Let's chat. How about Theoretical Physics or something and see who's stupid. Any ideas on the wave/particle nature of Gravity? How about Cosmology? Tell what you make of the ratio of space energy density and mass energy density in the Universe?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:15 pm

more crickets


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:22 pm

I presume you wish she'd shut up so this issue would go away. Correct?

How about just asking OBAMA, to STOP HIDING and SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS?

Ever think of that?


Silence Do Good
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:25 pm

…more crickets…..


pvel
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:31 pm

I am so proud Mr. Obama is our president and not McCain or Bush. You right-wingers have a problem. It is called losing. Get over it.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:33 pm

Then perhaps she might demonstrate her point by showing us some of the other Birth Certificates that Presidents have released. Also only a Conservative would announce that there are blacks who do not have prejudice against their own race. Ms. Swain blames Obama for the continuing racial discord in America and said this “The election of President Barack Obama has not been the healing balm anticipated. If anything President Obama's stances have heighten rather than ameliorated existing racial and ethnic tensions.” And she has attacked the Southern Poverty Law Center. She appears quite often on Lou Dobbs' TV Program and as a Huffington Post writer described her. “The Clarence Thomas of Conservative Academia”. Quite often conservatives hide behind a black face in the effort to sanitize their ideas. It does not mean that they aren't racist…She also stated that Southern Poverty Law Center, which has attacked Lou Dobbs NOT because he is “conservative,” but for his anti-immigration extremism, which has ranged from repeating demonizing myths about Hispanic immigrants to including graphics on his show which were taken from white supremacist websites.


HostileKnowledge
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:37 pm

1. Occidental College records — Not released
2. Columbia College records — Not released
3. Columbia Thesis paper — “not available”
4. Harvard College records — Not released
5. Selective Service Registration — Not released
6. Medical records — Not released
7. Illinois State Senate schedule — “not available”
8. Law practice client list — Not release
9. Certified Copy of original Birth certificate — Not released
10. Embossed, signed paper Certification of Live Birth — Not released
11. Harvard Law Review articles published – None
12. University of Chicago scholarly articles – None
13. Record of baptism– Not released or “not available”
14. Illinois State Senate records–”not available”

Of course, Obama worshipers will tell you that he isn't releasing relevant documents because he has nothing to hide.

This is liberal logic.

“Liberalism is totalitarianism with a human face”
~ Thomas Sowell


gypsyexpat
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:46 pm

I do not believe any of your rantings. You did not graduate with a science degree. I don't believe you because I have seen no proof and because I can tell from your ravings that you are not an educated man.


gypsyexpat
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:49 pm

Obama is certainly not a radical socialist. I am. And I know one when I see one. He's way too far to the right and he is being extremely nice to people like you. I'm tired of it. We are never going to get our country back on track until he ignores you and does what he has to do to repair the damage that George Bush and his wars have done to our country.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:53 pm

Race race race. . .It's always about race with you. YOU ARE A RACIST!


gypsyexpat
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:53 pm

Ms. Paglia likes to draw attention to herself by saying anything provocative. She hopes to get her audience back – who have long since lost interest in anything she has to say.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 10:58 pm

Think so? Let's chat. How about Theoretical Physics or something and see who knows science. Any ideas on the wave/particle nature of Gravity? How about Cosmology? Tell me what you make of the ratio of space energy density and mass energy density in the Universe? Or the cosmic background radiation?

Answer a simple one. Is it possible to see back in time? I mean actually watch an event happen that has already occured?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:00 pm

Funny how you lefties threw Paglia under the bus faster than Obama and his old-white-granny!


gypsyexpat
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:01 pm

You are wasting your breath Captain. Obama is not going away. He will be president for at least 4 years. He will do the best he can with all the knowledge he has that we don't have access to. Hopefully our country will end up for the better. We are lucky that he is a very intelligent man, very well educaated and a good man. Let him do his job so we can do ours and the world will be a better place. Can you imagine the mess our country would be in now, if he was taken out of office? Please let him focus on getting our country out of the hole we have been dragged into for the past 8 years.


HostileKnowledge
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:03 pm

Certainly, nobody is immune to slurs from the left. BTW, I'm not a conservative. I'm a Classical Liberal.

You probably have no idea what this means. Run over to Wiki and see if you can pick up an understanding of it. Good luck…

The Soviets, masquerading under the mantle of communism, murdered around 63 million people in just under 70 years in the Soviet Union alone. Actually, the academic community and MSM made this deadly masquerade possible because they called the Soviets “communists.” So much for “education” and “journalism.” Even the little schoolchildren in the Soviet Union knew they were not ruled by communists.

The Soviets were actual-existing socialists. They told their slaves that communism was the GOAL. They told their slaves that communism, once achieved, would be the real “heaven on earth.”

In fact, socialism equals slavery, misery and eventual death.

Communism = Socialism = Liberalism = Progressivism = Socialism…

Well, you get the idea. They are all one in the same. They change identities like some people change their underwear.

Tyranny never rests. Those of us who treasure liberty must be vigilant – always.


gypsyexpat
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:05 pm

I never liked her from the get-go. Did you? She has always been attention-seeking and will say whatever attracts the most irrate citizens.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:09 pm

You're right, but don't forget:

• Original, vault copy birth certificate — Not released — over $1,000,000 spent to conceal — birth certificate — $15.
• Certification of Live Birth — Released – probable counterfeit
• Admitted British/Kenyan citizenship at birth — Admitted
• Hospital of birth — Three hospitals have some claim — 2 in Hawaii 1 in Kenya
• Obama/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Obama/Dunham divorce — Not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Kindergarten records – “lost”
• Soetoro/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Soetoro adoption records — Not released
• Fransiskus Assisi School School application — not released by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Punahou School records — Not released
• Soetoro/Dunham divorce – concealed by Obama — released by independent investigators
• Selective Service Registration — Released – and proven counterfeit

And then there's the passport issue where people are starting to “turn up dead.”

Lt. Quarles Harris Jr was a key witness in a federal probe into Obama's passport information that had been stolen from the State Department. He was fatally shot in front of a DC church.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:15 pm

The Soviets came to power using many of the same techniques at the modern day lefties. Very eerie actually!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:16 pm

more crickets


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:21 pm

I didn't have much of opinion. She wasn't on my radar. Assuming you are correct in the factual portion of your claim, it does not change the veracity of her opinion, be it right or wrong. Although I agree your premise that being a bomb thrower for its own sake is not attractive.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:27 pm

Some thoughts I share with a Patriot friend.

MR. Barak Hussein Mohammed is NOT an American, He is NOT a Citizen and
therefore, he is NOT an African American and he has NO Slavery ties, only
through HIS KINFOLKS that WERE THE SLAVE TRADERS. He is ARAB AFRICAN
Indonesian MUSLIM
You People are worried about a Birth Certificate, Where in the Hell is his
Citizenship Papers ?????????? He did NOT come to OUR Country the Legal way,
he snuck in as an Illegal and somehow, got Funds From Taxpayer Money as a
Foreign Student, as Barry Soerotor A/K Barry Obama, Barak Onama, Barack
Obama, Barak Hussein Obama……..THINK ABOUT THAT, ALL OF YOU DIPSTICK
LIARS AND THIEVES IN OUR GOVERNMENT.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:50 pm

Reading is fundamental!

Actually, it was Mr. Hostileknowledge who raised the issue of race with his comment…”Professor Swain is black, so you Obama liberals can hold onto your ranting about racism.”

I was pointing out that her race is not a defense.

Please invest in a couple of hours with McGuffie's Reader each day. Then you will learn how to read…


captainsteve
Comment posted September 20, 2009 @ 11:56 pm

You wrote:

“Quite often conservatives hide behind a black face in the effort to sanitize their ideas. It does not mean that they aren't racist.”

That's a racist remark. I read your other racist posts too. You're a racist. Many whites will give your BS a pass, maybe because they feel guilty. Well I've got nothing to feel guilty about. I call it like I see it. You're a racist.


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:01 am

Jesus was a Socialist


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:06 am

PAID


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:09 am

Ah, how sad. Context is everything young man. Do you see what I mean about learning to read?

No, it is not a racist statement. THAT IS PRECISELY WHY HOSTILEKNOWLEDGE USED IT. To prevent criticism of the statement on the grounds of racism. Strom Thurman did the same thing. In his famous statement walking out of the Democratic Party he said this. “And I want to tell you, ladies and gentlemen, that there’s not enough troops in the Army to force the Southern people to break down segregation and admit the nigger race into our theatres, into our swimming pools, into our homes and into our churches.”

It is perfectly fair in the nature of criticizing a piece of writing to raise the motivation of the author. He was using her race as a shield!

That speech was made July 17, 1948. So it was hilarious to listen to him in the Clarence Thomas hearings to say “Give a black man a chance!”

By the way, I was born in 1955. I had to travel through the South at the height of its resistance to go to the funeral of my Grandfather. So like the rest of your posts, you clearly don't know what you are talking about.

So call it anyway you want. Like most of your statements its tautological, uninformed and wholly lacking in any factual basis.

But nice try anyway..You aren't going to wriggle out of the crap you've been writing. I am on you like sauce is on spaghetti! LOL


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:24 am

To Harold Franklen, In response to your post that got buried somewhere.

I don't waste my time with racists. It's obvious you're a racist. I don't care if you're 12 or 112. You've been a racist so long you probably don't even know you are one.

Jesse and the Rev. and the rest of the professional race-baiters have you convinced that people ought to kiss you a**. You get away with institutional racism through BET, NAACP, Congressional Back Caucus and on and on. That's racist BS plain and simple. Obama made a career out of that. I have no respect for people like you or him.

If you weren't a racist and you really wanted to end racism, you wouldn't even notice what color the president is. You'd want what's best for the country, and you'd care if he shares your values or not. With Obama, for me, he DOESN'T! He's a Marxist/Socialist/Leftist.

If you gave a rip about anybody but yourself, you'd encourage him to release his stuff and quit hiding, and put this behind us, so we could all believe he got it fair and square, and ALL AMERICANS could support him. He promised openness. If you weren't a racist, you'd ask him to keep that pledge, but you won't, cuz I'm white and you're a racist and this is your chance to get even.

WTF part of that don't you get?

Enuf said.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:29 am

Once again. . .it's all about race race race. You're a racist, like I said.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:33 am

You are fillibustering. Which I love because it shows how empty your arguments are. Lets recap shall we…First, You claimed that the announcement in the paper proved nothing. Yet somehow you are unable to divine the difference between a family announcement and the news. Moreover, you refused to explain how the family could somehow know he was going to be President..Hmmmm…Now when your friend tries to use another black persons rantings as coverage, you blame me for pointing it out. Sitll you have yet to produce an iota of evidence. And now you desperately try to scream racist because I caught you and your friend hiding behind her shield. It was legitmate criticism or was it not fair for example to point out this dichotomy as it happened with Strom Thurman?

You are unable to tell the difference between an informational copy of a Birth certificate and an unrestricted version..

You even had the temerity to throw in my face a question you couldn't ask in the affirmative yourself…Talk about Chutzpah…

But do continue..I enjoy the mad rantings you continue to put up…


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:37 am

And again, as I will point out, it was your ally who raised the issue…I just called him on it! Your hypocrisy hurts doesn't it?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:40 am

Go away racist. Non-racists don't want you here being a racist.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:47 am

ooohhhhhh snappy comeback LOL…I will bet you were one of those kids who used that term “stupidhead” LOL..


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:47 am

You are no more a liberal than I am a chicken. It makes you feel good to scream epithets..But you flagrantly reject any law you don't approve of…

Your analysis is wrong, its incorrect and its banal. Again, if your acolyte Ms. Swain has any information to support her position, I would love to hear it. But again, she doesn't present any!

So in response you go off on this tangent about “Socialism”. Cute


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 5:48 am

Birfers, your schtick is redundant; we all understand your tinfoil-hat premise and we have dismissed it as gibberish. Please save us the broken-record mantra and at least bring something to the table with entertainment value. Take CaptainAsshat for example. He’s game for mixing it up with those of us who don’t have one chromosome too many, so he’s worth a chuckle now & then. Stop boring us and get on with the freak show!


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:50 am

I'm on to you captainsteve and you know it…


borderraven
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:58 am

LONG FORM COLB

http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/assets/gif/M1…
http://passportsusa.com/wp-content/gallery/pass…
http://passportsusa.com/wp-content/gallery/pass…

On day of birth a hospital produces a frameable certificate for the parents, and originates a LFCOLB that is microfilmed for convenient retrieval and and archived in a vault. For a fee copies are made from the microfilm and processed on photographic paper.

The residency COLB displayed on the Democratic propaganda website FactCheck, does not satisfy me as meeting the requirements for POTUSA of the COTUSA, and I dare any Supreme to accept such flimsy evidence. That COLB contains data transcribed in abstract from a point of origin. I demand that point of origin!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 1:21 am

You're correct. Plus on page 26 of his book, “Dreams from My Father,” he said he has it.

Only the long form proves place of birth. The short form was/is available to both Hawaiian and non-Hawaiian born residents. I should add though that Obama's short form is an obvious forgery.

The questions won’t go away until obama releases his hidden records. All he has to do is make the following official public statement,

“I Barack Obama authorize the State of Hawaii to release and make public all of my records on file.”

That's it. Issue over. But he won't because he's a fraud!! Obama knows that millions of citizens want to see it yet he continues to hide it. What and why is he hiding?

And maybe more disturbing is why don't BHO's supporters want to know the whole truth, especially since there's a reward that continues to be increased (currently $25 million) for proof that Obama is a “natural born” citizen of the United States? The answer is that Obama’s very own supporters also know he’s a fraud but choose to overlook it for political agenda reasons!

Link to a current lawsuit. . .(very thorough).

http://69.66.218.3/public/patriotsHeartVsObama/…

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US YOUR LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND OTHER RECORDS!!!!!
.


voiceofreason
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 1:22 am

I don't know what scares me more, your incoherent ramblings, your complete luck of understanding of the concepts of communism, socialism, and liberalism, or the fact that you think wikipedia is credible source of information…


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:44 am

A Natural Born Citizen eligible to be President YES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And they could do the sex part in a cave in Pakistan. Don’t give him any ideas now.


pensivegadfly
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 1:48 am

captainsteve:

Bull hockey. Where is your legal citation that only the long form proves birth? You don't have a legal citation because there is no such rule or law. The photocopies you sent to me of twins were made in 1966, when Hawaii was living, like the rest of us, in the carbon copy age, as opposed to Obama's, which was released in the digital age.

Furthermore, Obama's certificate says that it is “prima facie” evidence to prove birth in any court. Prima facie means that the person presenting the document satisfies his/her burden of proof, thereby shifting the burden of proof to you to prove the opposite. You have not done so. All you have is rank speculation. That would not even survive an objection in a court of law.

Sorry, but you have proved only that you hate Obama and will believe anything that might feed your fantasy. As I said, your proof is equal to the proof used by those who argued that some unknown evil people killed O.J.'s wife and Goldman rather than O.J.

Your a moron, but I'm curious, what it the message in painting Obama with black over the eyes and red around the lips?


HostileKnowledge
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 1:54 am

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/new…
Obama open to newspaper bailout bill

One must suppose that these nearly bankrupt newspapers will be controlled by the government. Will the government show these newspapers how to make a profit? Will Obama create a Ministry of Truth?

Anybody that can't see what these socialist cockroaches are doing is totally blind.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 2:38 am

Citation? It's not about a legal citation, it's about the State's Registrar and Hawaiian policy.

If a Hawaiian family adopts a baby from Korea, the short form birth certificate would name Hawaii as the place of birth. There are many (4) ways to get a Hawaiian short form, not including lying on the application. The short-form proves nothing.

The Kenyan usurper is a liar and a fraud. Until he releases his hidden records, I see no reason to believe otherwise.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 2:41 am

Please go look up Socialist in the dictionary and then explain you statement.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 2:50 am

He will bail-out his friends, ie whatever media that gives him a free-pass. . .just like he let Lehman fail, but Goldman was saved. He'll punish those who question with a “fairness doctrine.”

He's a dangerous anti-American, anti-freedom, anti-liberty Marxist/Socialist/Communist, Radical Islamic sympathizer, Saudi King bowing, dictator loving, former cocaine addict, racist Kenyan usurper Chicago thug lying fraud!

Needless to say, I'm not a fan of his!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 2:59 am

Why I have a Joker/liar icon:

G.H.W. Bush. . .caught in lies.

Bill Clinton. . .caught in lies.

G.W. Bush. . .caught in lies.

B.H. Obama. . .caught in lies (said he never heard Jeremiah Wright speak an anti-white message in 20 years in his church, promised no lobbyists in cabinet, all bills reviewable for 5 days, no deficit spending, balance budget, no health-care for illegal aliens etc)

You name the president . . . ALL caught in lies.

Now Obama, who comes out of the Chicago political cesspool, arguably the most corrupt political system in the country, is a saint worthy of complete trust, and you’re going to believe his background story even though most of it has been hidden?

The Obamites are either really naive and pathetically stupid, or part of the bigger fraud. Even if it turns out at the end of the investigation that he is 100% on the up-and-up, Obama’s past needs to be fully explored if for no other reason than to send a warning to ALL politicians: cover-ups are NEVER okay!!

The birthers aren’t crazy. OBAMA VERY LIKELY IS COMMITTING THE BIGGEST FRAUD OF ALL TIME!!!

Americans have a right to know whether their president is a natural-born citizen in accordance with the Constitution.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE!!!!!

Read this if you REALLY want to know all about it.

http://www.friktech.com/2009/born.pdf


Check Your Facts
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 3:12 am

No one's going to take legal action against Obama concerning his citizenship because no one takes the Birthers seriously. These are the same people who think he's a Socialist, Muslim, Communist, anti-white/America/Christian, foreigner, who wants to kill your grandma.

Obama could personally go to Afghanistan, kill Osama Bin Laden with his bare hands, sink all the Somalian pirate ships on the way home and pay off our debt to China with the recovered pirate treasure. Even then if he went to a birthers house with his birth certificate in one hand and home baked cookies in the other and the birthers would still hate him. There's nothing anyone can say to these people. It's like arguing with a drunk.

As for racism and the birther movement…
The shoe fits.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 3:15 am

Free money! (oBama welfare types like that). New offer!!!

$50,000 to anybody in the media who can answer this question about Obama…

The vast majority of the leftist mainstream and alternative “conservative” media have repeatedly called any American who has demanded that Barack Hussein Obama release his supposed Hawaiian birth certificate to prove he is a natural-born citizen, as is required under the United States Constitution, a fringe-kook-conspiracy-theorist-wing-nut.

So here is my question with $50,000 cash to anybody in the media who can answer the following 3 part question:

1. What hospital in Hawaii was Barack Hussein Obama born in?

2. Who was the attending physician who delivered BHO?

3. What time was BHO born?

Answer those 3 and you collect! 50 G's Git yu a Cadillak an sum sweit dubs!

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2009/09…


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 3:23 am

The guy bowls 33 and throws like an 8 year old girl. He couldn't kill a hamster with his bare hands (I know he's a heroic fly killer, but I'd prefer he used a more sanitary method and not wiped it on his pants and then rubbed his fly gut hands together).


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 3:36 am

Blacks can be racist toward other Blacks. Some Blacks owned slaves.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 3:46 am

By the way, I thought about that statement you quoted. Where does it say that all conservatives are white? I made a remark about political orientation. Not race! It seems that reading comprehension continues to be a problem for you. I suggest you work on that…


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 3:47 am

Good lord, there are all sorts of problems with that sort of thing. But those two are two ignorant and clueless to know that…Thanks for the backup..


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 3:54 am

His concept of Classical Liberalism is basically libertarianism. Thus he sounds like Ayn Rand on roids.

The problem with that form of Liberalism is noted in the very article he cited to me.

In the 19th century, the voting franchise in most democracies was extended, and these newly enfranchised citizens often voted in favor of government intervention into the economy. Rising literacy rates and the spread of knowledge led to social activism in a variety of forms. Those calling themselves social liberals, called for laws against child labor and laws requiring minimum standards of worker safety. The laissez faire economic liberals considered such measures to be an unjust imposition upon liberty, as well as a hindrance to economic development. Thus, 19th century social liberalism marked a split from “classical liberalism.”

In short child labor is o.k. because banning it interferes in the owners economic interest. What? are there no work houses for the poor?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 4:10 am

Question: What is the opposite of Viagra?

Answer: Nancy Pelosi!


chrisjay
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 4:43 am

I see that CaptainDouchebag has adopted the graphic image of Obama-in-white-face made famous by the bovine brigades of teabaggers we've been being entertained by on the news. He doesn't seem to realize what a transparent psychological cry of anguish this image reveals about him. “Stop being black!” is what he is demanding of our president. Douche, you need to go back to your pathetic online role-playing games in which you can manipulate digital images and create your little identities; there you can be the captain of anything you want. Too bad you can't wish away the president's race by putting some white-face on him. Scary world outside your bedroom, isn't it shit-for-brains?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 10:29 am

AH, I TOUCHED A NERVE…GOOD. I KNOW WHO YOU ARE AND SO DOES EVERYONE ELSE. NOW GO TO THE MIRROR, PUT ON YOUR WHITE HOOD AND PARADE AROUND YOUR TRAILER. FYI, I HAD A CHANCE TO REVIEW YOUR MANY, MANY POSTS. YOU SEEM HAVE A LOT OF TIME ON YOUR HANDS. IS THE KKK NOT KEEPING YOU BUSY ENOUGH?


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 10:32 am

CAPTAIN STEVE – WHY DID YOU NOT USE THE PICTURE OF YOU IN YOUR WHITE HOOD WITH YOUR PROFILE? THAT WOULD BE MORE APPROPRIATE, NO?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 5:53 am

You're a racist a**hole. Eff off. The image was first used by the left with Bush, then adapted to Dingle Barry by a dumb$hit lefty like you. The liar caption defines your teleprompter reading messiah fraud Marxist to a tee. You best hurry to the ER and have them extricate your head from your arse (unless you just like it in there).

Get lost racist. NOBODY here thinks it's ok to be a racist a**hole like you.


chrisjay
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:03 am

captain assranger, where did you learn the clever tactic of calling us racist? Isn't that a Glenn Beck thing? I've perused a few of your postings and this seems to be a nervous tic for you. Your habit of doing this over & over is truly infantile. For someone who thinks he's so smart you sure are redundant. Just a one-trick Republitard? I didn't come here to be bored, so put on your tinfoil hat and get on with the freak show!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:08 am

You're doing it again. No discussion of the thread topic, everything's about race race race with you. You've probably been a racist so long that you don't even know you are one. Get lost racist! Take your racist rants elsewhere.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:13 am

Question: Who Am I?

I was born in one country, raised in another. My father was born in another country. I was not his only child. He fathered several children with several women.

I became very close to my mother, as my father showed no interest in me. My mother died at an early age from cancer.

Later in life, questions arose over my real name.

My birth records were sketchy and no one was able to produce a legitimate, reliable birth certificate.

I grew up practicing one faith but converted to Christianity, as it was widely accepted in my country, but I practiced non-traditional beliefs & didn't follow Christianity, except in the public eye under scrutiny.

I worked and lived among lower-class people as a young adult, disguising myself as someone who really cared about them..

That was before I decided it was time to get serious about my life and I embarked on a new career.

I wrote a book about my struggles growing up. It was clear to those who read my memoirs that I had difficulties accepting that my father abandoned me as a child.

I became active in local politics in my 30's then with help behind the scenes, I literally burst onto the scene as a candidate for national office in my 40s. They said I had a golden tongue and could talk anyone into anything. That reinforced my conceit.

I had a virtually non-existent resume, little work history, and no experience in leading a single organization. Yet I was a powerful speaker and citizens were drawn to me as though I were a magnet and they were small roofing tacks.

I drew incredibly large crowds during my public appearances. This bolstered my ego.

At first, my political campaign focused on my country's foreign policy. I was very critical of my country in the last war and seized every opportunity to bash my country.

I knew which group was responsible for getting us into this mess. It was the free market, banks & corporations. I decided to start making citizens hate them and if they were envious of others who did well, the plan was clinched tight.

I called mine “A People's Campaign” and that sounded good to all people.

I was the surprise candidate because I emerged from outside the traditional path of politics & was able to gain widespread popular support.

I knew that, if I merely offered the people 'hope' , together we could change our country and the world.

So, I started to make my speeches sound like they were on behalf of the downtrodden, poor, ignorant to include “persecuted minorities” like the Jews. My true views were not widely known and I needed to keep them unknown, until after I became my nation's leader.

I had to carefully guard reality, as anybody could have easily found out what I really believed, if they had simply read my writings and examined those people I associated with.

I'm glad they didn't. Then I became the most powerful man in the world. And the world learned the truth me.

Who am I?

Answer: ADOLF HITLER (or Obama, take your pick).


Jason
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:15 am

Why don't you guys give it a f******g rest? I think your brain capacity is falling by the minute from all this computer time. Do something that makes things better for god's sake!

Jeeez!


chrisjay
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:18 am

CaptainBirfer I am trying to help you out of your rut but you are not cooperating. I want you to take a couple of deep breaths and calm down. Maybe then you can gather your wits and come up with something interesting. I don't want to be dissappointed by your next posting, so please focus!


chrisjay
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:30 am

Jason, stop and think about this a moment: this is a thread full of BIRTHERS!! There's nothing constructive to be had here, just lowbrow, freakish entertainment: you may be in the wrong room…


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:33 am

Obama is hardly a charismatic speaker. Mr Teleprompter is as dull as a month-old razor. Canada's self-described dullard PM Steven Harper shone like an infomercial adman, by comparison, when Barry-O was up in Ottawa (he even thought he was in “Iowa”). Obama's poor daughter, Sasha, has to correct her dad, when he forgets what city he's in…he also thinks America has “57 States” and doesn't “speak Austrian”. Obama's certainly not as dumb as, say, Dan Quayle, so there's something very wrong here. His lips have an on-again/off-again cyanotic coloration: this could mean something like transient ischemic attacks (he still is a heavy smoker and used cocaine years ago–REALLY bad for the cardiovascular system). Interestingly, Joe Biden–who had an aneurysm, BTW–seems to be bigger chick-bait than B.O. Weird–maybe some women have this Blake Carrington fetish going.

At any rate, the 'Obama is such a charismatic speaker that I tinkle down my leg' Chris Matthews stuff is media hype, to promote their man as some sort of Second Coming. I wouldn't doubt that his autobio ('Dreams from my Father'), which he can't recall the title of, was ghostwritten. (False authorship has been a pattern with Oprah's booklist.) Obama isn't anybody exciting, or scary. He's just a pleasant-looking milquetoast with an attractive wife and cute kids that made a Great McGinty for the big money and Richard M. Daley-types who put him into office to do their bidding. He's not captain of the ship–the companies and benefactors who coughed up his $700M campaign tab are.


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:36 am

Nancy Pelosi is no Rachel Nichols, but she isn't really homely, either. She's MUCH better looking than, say, Hillary Clinton.


Jason
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:45 am

Good point. It is pretty freakish isn't it…
Hey Mr Scientist captain steve, you should try putting your energy toward more constructive things. Like baking brownies or something. The world would be a much better place with more brownies in it.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:45 am

381 cosmetic surgeries and 2834 Botox injections ago she may not have looked too bad, but you didn't set the bar very high with ol Thunderthighs herself!


pbg
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:57 am

So captainsteve doesn't find a 69-year-old woman sexually attractive!
That's good to know.


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 6:59 am

The birthplace/eligibility issue is but one problem with B.O.–certainly, not the worst. Something is very wrong with the political system, when it costs over half a billion to run a campaign. Like the Bushes, Reagan et al, those corporations, unions and wealthy patrons DO expect something for their donations. What's really a BIGGER problem with Obama is the extent to which the media-telecom industry funded his campaign, and the extent to which they've been covering his butt.

As for racism: if Condi, or Colin Powell were in the White House, the Bubba bloc would be dancing in the streets. Color may be an issue with the Stormfront types (and their Rev. Wright, Nation of Islam and Van Jones counterparts), but it's Obama's political background and positions on real issues that piss off the rednecks. Obama's ties to ACORN and the Daley Democratic Machine make even latte liberals queasy. Obama also irritated and frightened the God and Guns crowd with his overtures to Islamists (including that bow), being wishy-washy over Russia's invasion of Georgia, trying to send Guantanamo-held terrorists to people's hometowns, his Food Security, Cybersecurity and Healthcare (especially that social worker snoop provision) legislation, and attempts to demonize American gun owners and veterans. Worst of all is the slobberingly stomach-turning coverage of the Big O in the media (not just Oprah Winfrey…HOW MANY covers of Men's Health has Obama been on? HOW MANY talk shows?)

Obama sucks. So did the Bushes (DUI Dubya and Barfing Bush), Bill 'Peyronie's Disease' Clinton and Ronnie 'I Luv the Mujaheddin' Reagan. There has to be serious campaign reform, going all the way down to the local government-level. Absolutely banning corporate and union donations, as well as capping individual donations around $1K could be a start.


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:01 am

What's hillarious is that a Muslim liberal came up with the Obama=Joker image. I wouldn't've minded being carricatured as Heath Ledger. Even though he's dead, he had a child with Michelle Williams.


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:03 am

The newest falsehood goes like this: Obama was legally adopted by his stepfather, Lolo Soetoro, and thus lost his American citizenship in favor of Indonesian citizenship. Sorry, that’s bogus, too. Because Obama was born in the U.S., he could not lose his citizenship as a child. It could be revoked only if he became a citizen of another country as an adult, and if that country didn’t permit dual citizenship. A glance at the relevant statute shows that all the conditions for loss of nationality are reserved for people over 18 — except for treason, fighting for a hostile army and formal renunciation of citizenship, all of which Obama was a bit young for at age 6. In two of those cases, his citizenship still would have been safe as long as he affirmed it when he turned 18. (Loss of citizenship for treason has no exemptions.) Factcheck.org

Proud to be the Obamas neighbor in Chicago. And Bill Ayers too.


HostileKnowledge
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:06 am

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/new…
Obama open to newspaper bailout bill

One must suppose that these nearly bankrupt newspapers will be controlled by the government. Will the government show these newspapers how to make a profit? Will Obama create a Ministry of Truth?

Anybody that can’t see what these socialist cockroaches are doing is totally blind.


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:08 am

Hitler didn't eat meat. Obama does. Hitler killed 6 million Jews. Obama has killed no one. Hitler hated Blacks. Obama loves Blacks. Obama tolerates morons like you. Hitler would gas you. Hitler>Obama in the one instance.


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:09 am

Wish it had been your mom the night you were conceived.


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:11 am

He was born in manger. Dec 25 just after 12:00 a.m. You racist inbred.


obamasneighbor
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:13 am

Obama was NEVER part of the Daley machine.


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:16 am

Obama's Kenyan dad was a Muslim by birth, though hardly a practicing one (probably agnostic, liked his liquor). Obama's stepdad is of Indonesian extraction. Neither were 'Arab', any more than my North-Eastern European/Irish-British/Central Asian ancestors were Romans, Greeks, Ethiopians, or Semites, because they were Christians and Jews. There are many Arab-Americans (most, in fact) who are Christians. 'Race' and religion are totally different things. Your typical Orangeman would rather have Bishop Tutu over for dinner than Pope Benedict. Since neither Michelle, nor Malia and Sasha wear bags over their heads, we can safely assume he's NOT a Muslim. Not that that'll help him with the Islamists. Under Shari'a law, apostacy is punishable by death; they probably harbour less ill-will toward ('natural-born Christian') Bush.

Regardless of B.O.'s backstory, he should be more forthcoming about his personal (birth certificate, medical file, college records) and professional (lobbyist records) information. Otherwise, the suspicions will fester. Anyhow, didn't he promise 'Openness and Transparency'?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:16 am

I hear ya. Speaking on his own he's a bumbling fool. Check the latest goof. He bombed his own daughter's name, and a little lying thrown in to keep up the lie-a-day record..

President Obama Refers to Daughter by Wrong Name During CNN Interview

Obama's daughter is named Malia. His half-sister's name is Maya.

Editor's note: The second clip in this playlist is a post that compares President Obama's statement about Sasha's health to that of Michelle Obama. President Obama seems to be mistaken — Sasha did not have meningitis.

http://www.breitbart.tv/president-obama-refers-…


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:20 am

Again, TIAs, or something.

McCain the Geezer (rightfully) had to submit his medical file for review; no less should be demanded of Obama and Biden.


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:22 am

Oprah's a closet Scientologist. Obama's REAL name is 'Xenu'.


HostileKnowledge
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:23 am

obamasneighbor ,

Your buddies over at Daily Kos are missing their favorite analinguist. Hurry home!


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:24 am

Daley endorsed him. NOTHING goes through Chicago without Hizzonah's nod.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:24 am

You would be proud of an un-repentant terrorist like Ayers. All those scum-bags are rotten peas-in-a-pod.

Forget the citizenship argument. His birth-father was British. He cannot be natural-born.

I saw the Kenyan usurper throw a baseball and bowl a 37. No way is he an American! Period!


captainsteve
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:29 am

Obummer came out of the Chicago political cesspool, arguably the most corrupt political system in the country. He's no saint worthy of any trust, but you’re going to believe his background story even though most of it has been hidden?

You Obamites are either really naive and pathetically stupid, or part of the bigger fraud. Even if it turns out at the end of the investigation that he is 100% on the up-and-up, Obama’s past needs to be fully explored if for no other reason than to send a warning to ALL politicians: cover-ups are NEVER okay!!

Americans have a right to know whether their president is a natural-born citizen in accordance with the Constitution.

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE or get out of my house!


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:58 am

You've got it backwards: the media-telecom industry controls the (Obama, House, Senate) Democrat government. These are the firms that paid heavilly into the Dems (and some GOPers) PACs.

I'm thinking that the BIG prize for these firms is who gets the whitespace, when TV finally goes digital. They REALLY got screwed, when the Bush FCC gave it to the broadband folks.


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 8:04 am

Both Naomi Campbell and Victoria Beckham threw baseballs pretty well, at some games, or other–and they're BRITS! They also looked a lot nicer than B.O…


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 8:07 am

One thing I'll give Obama is that he puts mustard on his burgers. Condimentless burgers are a sorry thing.

Hitler liked having his niece give him golden showers…okay, I'll stop before we all puke.


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 8:08 am

Oh, I forgot–unlike Hitler, Obama doesn't “speak Austrian”. :p


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 4:06 pm

Just saw your comment re z-big in ArutzSheva. . .I agree. . .good on ya.


Ellid
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 11:25 am

You already posted this. Even worse, you didn't correct the numerous errors about Hitler (he was never anything but a Catholic, albeit non-practicing; his father never abandoned his family; he joined the Nazi Party in his early twenties, not his thirties; he never hid his actual beliefs and opinions, but laid them out in Mein Kampf; he supported capitalism and blamed the Jews for society's ills; he had been a political activist for almost fifteen years when he became Chancellor and had tried to become Chancellor at least twice before succeeding; and so on and so on and so on).

Really, if you're going to post this sort of slop on the Internet, you should do your homework. After all, don't you supposedly have a Mensa card? And where IS that Mensa card, btw? Why won't you produce it? WHAT ARE YOU HIDING? WAKE UP, AMERICA! CAPTAIN STEVE IS A LIAR!!!!!!


Ellid
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 11:27 am

Why are you offering $50,000 you don't have?


Ellid
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 11:29 am

Wrong. It would list Korea as the place of birth.

You not only are an arrogant, ignorant liar, you're an idiot. So much for that Mensa membership!

Speaking of which, where is your Mensa card? Why won't you show us that, or your college records? Or your birth certificate? How do we know your name is “Steve” anyway? WAKE UP, AMERICA! DEMAND CAPTAIN STEVE'S MENSA CARD BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE!


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 5:08 pm

no response…


chrisjay
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 12:23 pm

Uh oh CaptainCrunch, we got trouble! before we could get you up to fighting form, outta nowhere comes Adam who is so far to the right he seems to hate even Saint Ronnie and the Bush boys! Now THAT's what I'm talking about, we have a serious freak show going on here..Orly'd be proud.Cap'n, I'm in suspense waiting to see if you're gonna give Adam a big sloppy kiss or run the other way as fast as you can. Ah, good cheap entertainment…


Anonymous
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 8:54 pm

Dear Adam,

No, I don’t take the word of a politician as gospel truth. I take
the word of Hawaii that Obama was born there; the fact that the form
they released is what they release for everyone; the fact the FactCheck.org and Snopes have reviewed the relevant document and put photos on the
internet showing it; Nelson’s word that she remembers the birth–never
said she saw it but she recalls sending a letter about it to her
father.

What I don’t take as gospel is the work of a tin foil
hat wearing conspiracy theorist like you who has no reason other then
animus for the President to waste so much of your life making up long
convoluted explanation of how Obama might not have been born in Hawaii
(just like those who make up explanations for how someone other than
O.J. might have actually killed his wife and Goldman; or how some
nefarious group of evil–but damn sophisticated–plotters might have
been able to plant explosive charges in the World Trade Center to help
bring them down on 9/11).

So, Hawaii says they have the long
form? Where is the proof? Give me a link to prove that Hawaii says it has a long form for Obama but will not release it. Futher, where is the proof that the two newspapers
that announced Obama’s birth were duped? Where is any evidence what so ever
that Obama’s maternal grandparents lied about his birth? Where is the
proof? All I see so far is limited solely to conjecture and speculation.

Pensive

________________________________


terryfrank.net » Paglia On the Birthers
Pingback posted September 21, 2009 @ 5:04 pm

[...] According to the Washington Independent, the exchange was “compelling.” [...]


Adam
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 5:57 pm

I also like musicals, open-source software and women with 'man hands', so consider yourself warned.


monkey99
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 7:07 pm

The birthers DO have a point.

It's on the top of their heads.


pensivegadfly
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 8:50 pm

No, capt'n, a “citation” means a explanation about where the authority you rely upon can be found. So if there is a state policy for the registrar in Hawaii, that policy will be written in black and white in the laws or administrative rules of Hawaii. And as I said, you have no idea whether the claims you are making are true or not because you can't point us to the law or rule. For example, Obama's birth certificate has a “citation” at the bottom to HRS 338-13(b). That refers to a specific section in the Hawaii Revised Statutes. You can follow the citation and look up what the law says.

You have no legal citations to support any of your claims about what the rules or laws of Hawaii are. You say that if a Hawaii couple adopted a Korean baby, the birth certificate would say that Hawaii was the place of birth. Prove it! Point us to the rule, law, or (legal) opinion that says so. Can't, can you? There are four ways to get a short from, you claim. Oh. Where is the citation for that?

Your problem is how one sided you are. If it fits your theory–Obama should not be President–you will accept any claim, no matter how unsupported and no matter how deep in heresay. But if it doesn't fit your preconceived theory, you will look incessantly for anything that might case the slightest shadow of inconsistency, and are ready to take that to the bank. As I said, you're just like the jurors in the OJ trial, ready to believe anything to let OJ off.

________________________________


pensivegadfly
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 8:51 pm

No, capt'n, a “citation” means a explanation about where the authority you rely upon can be found. So if there is a state policy for the registrar in Hawaii, that policy will be written in black and white in the laws or administrative rules of Hawaii. And as I said, you have no idea whether the claims you are making are true or not because you can't point us to the law or rule. For example, Obama's birth certificate has a “citation” at the bottom to HRS 338-13(b). That refers to a specific section in the Hawaii Revised Statutes. You can follow the citation and look up what the law says.

You have no legal citations to support any of your claims about what the rules or laws of Hawaii are. You say that if a Hawaii couple adopted a Korean baby, the birth certificate would say that Hawaii was the place of birth. Prove it! Point us to the rule, law, or (legal) opinion that says so. Can't, can you? There are four ways to get a short from, you claim. Oh. Where is the citation for that?

Your problem is how one sided you are. If it fits your theory–Obama should not be President–you will accept any claim, no matter how unsupported and no matter how deep in heresay. But if it doesn't fit your preconceived theory, you will look incessantly for anything that might case the slightest shadow of inconsistency, and are ready to take that to the bank. As I said, you're just like the jurors in the OJ trial, ready to believe anything to let OJ off.

________________________________


RedGraham
Comment posted September 21, 2009 @ 11:45 pm

If we ever get to see the original BC & it does turn out BHO was born in Honolulu the correct hospital would be listed, the fathers race would be biracial or “colored” & junior's citizenship would be Brit or maybe dual. Which he remained until being adopted in Indonesia. Barack Obama has never been even for a half of a second a natural-born U.S. citizen as required by the Constitution. Barack Obama needs to resign NOW.


monkey99
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 1:30 am

RedGraham,

I rest my case.

See below.


resplazapunchbowl
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 5:56 am

FBI INVESTIGATION OF VP AND PRESIDENT

I am thoroughly baffled by the lack of comment from bloggers, pundits, Congressman and White House spokesperson concerning the federal governments immense security investigation agencies, long-established and promulgated/streamlined/consolidated by National Security Directive 63 (1991) and Executive Orders 12958 and 12968 (1991). Under provisions of the latter, every federal employee, Representative, Senator, Cabinet member, VP and President, must undergo some degree of background checks starting from National Agency and Local Checks (NALCL) and Single Scope Background Investigation (SSBI) for access to national security information, from confidential to top secret and sensitive compartmented information (SCI) and higher. This requires submission of a 13 page Standard Form 86 (Access to Classified Information). The SSBI for the VP and President is conducted by the FBI and is coordinated with the Office of Presidential Personnel, which also handles all White House staff and Cabinet members. The Office of Personnel Management's Federal Investigative Services Division (OPM FISD) handles the bulk of all federal investigations work currently. OPM FISD Investigation Notices show that simultaneously with a check of national agencies, and investigator will obtain a copy of the birth certificate along with a statement of authentication/verification from the states bureau of vital statistics. The staff of OPM arranges procedures with individual states and advices investigators accordingly. A check of state department files are made to verify citizenship status and identification of subject of investigation. In addition, the SSBI is an extensive and in-depth investigation of one's education, financial, medical, criminal, civil/court, military files, and interviews of neighbors, associates, listed and unlisted references, for personal characteristics, associations with social/political activities, (drug, gambling, drinking), relatives, foreign travel and relatives, residences,and more. There is great reluctance by most persons who experience these investigations to discuss such matters, because of the sensitive privacy issues involved.. Lastly, every time there is a classified briefing in any federal/defense office in the world, the security officers of each office is obliged by law to obtain or forward the degree of clearance required by each participant. No clearance, no entry, period. NO ONE IS GIVEN A FREE PASS REGARDLESS OF RANK OR POLITICAL POSITION. THAT IS THE LAW OF THE LAND. Why are Republican Congressman proposing legislation requiring a future POTUS to show his birth certificate when they know well how they are cleared for federal positions and access to classified information. Since 9/11 there is heightened awareness and improved cooperation by all federal security and state/city security and law enforcement agencies.
GROW UP BIRTHERS!. You and your crazy conspiracy nutters have insulted and demeaned the integrity and efficacy of our dedicated federal investigative agencies, hurled vile and despicable accusations against the legality of Hawaii's Statehood and validity of its modern certification of live birth, showed utter disrespect for our Republican Governor and her Director of Department of Health and Chief of Bureau of Vital Statistics, falsely accused our two leading newspapers the Honolulu Advertiser and Honolulu Star Bulletin with “fraud and planting” of Barack Obama's birth announcement in their Aug 1961 newspapers 48 years ago, and reprehensibly insulted all of Hawaii's citizens by your nonsense. HAVE YOU NO DECENCY, SHAME OR CLASS???


chrisjay
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 5:57 am

It was frickin' hilarious to read the judge's ruling on your Queen bee Orly's most recent legal farce. I dunno if I've ever seen such a comprehensive legal smack down eva ! Then, of course Captain Rhodes sez “I never gave that whack job permission to litigate on my behalf!”. You Birfers are comedy GOLD!!


chrisjay
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 6:09 am

Punchbowl, the answer is no. Birfers are shameless. You can't shame the delusional, but you can try and derive a bit of low rent humor from their rambling rants. If you continue to attempt to appeal to their reason, you'll probably end up in a rubber room right next to them and have to listen to their interminable layers-of-the-onion conspiracy theories (which they will have written out on the walls in pencil) long after Obama's 8 years as president are elapsed. You should remain on planet earth and pursue normality with your critical faculties intact. I may stay on here a while and shove bananas thru the bars a little longer…


chrisjay
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 6:21 am

The cockroach hallucination again? I'm pretty sure it'll diminish if you get your meds back in balance. Speaking of newspaper control, how do you feel about the foreign-owned Murdoch behemoth controlling everything you see & hear in the Fox bubble? Numb? Euphoric? Hard to tell with the meds & all, huh?


ernest
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 6:35 am

Some huge news will be breaking in the next few weeks. Obama has been caught in a massive fraud and it is legally damning to his Presidency and it cannot, by law, be kept from the public or the courts. Hawaiian officials have totally annihilated him and very soon, he will be indicted and tried for federal criminal activities. Taitz is not involved. Obama needs to go ahead and call the movers and kiss the children good bye, he's off to “Club Fed” for a long, long, long stay. Fraud is a very serious offense. I'll not disclose more at this time, except to say this is going to be much bigger than Watergate. THIS IS HUGE.


Lawyer
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 6:44 am

So anyone who questions Obama's background, who was the ONLY candidate whose background most certainly was NOT vetted, should be ashamed? YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOURSELF, YOU'RE A PAID LIAR or a BLIND FOOL. In just a few weeks, we'll see who looks foolish! Obama is going to face federal criminal fraud charges, I've seen the OFFICIAL evidence, not just some wishful thinking provided by an individual.


chrisjay
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 6:48 am

OMG Ernest, I got the SAME transmission from planet Zultran as you did! I was sitting in my tree out back patiently adjusting the metal coathanger antenna on my tinfoil hat and BAM! The signal was suddenly clear as a bell. Whoa dude, you've spilled WAY too much of the secret message. You heard Commander Ogma, we weren't supposed to tell the earthlings just yet. I think you're in deep doodoo.
C Ya, wouldn't wanna be ya…


ernest
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 6:53 am

Obama is NOT, by his OWN admission, a “natural born Citizen”, therefore his Presidency is illegal and every official act he has taken while in office will be nullified “ab initio”, that is “from the beginning”…I hope all you Obamawhores have your crying towels ready, Obama's days as a con-man and illegal “President” are within a few short weeks of being finished. That much I can PROMISE.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 6:11 pm

I made the statement that Hawaiian birth certificates can be amended. An obamite lefty loon “loud-mouth” as usual immediately claimed that was untrue. Here's the statute. The lesson? Don't trust the obamites. They are deceivers, just like their messiah.

“Who is Eligible to Apply for an Amended Certificate of Birth?
provided by law (HRS §§338-17.7, 338-20.5), the following persons may apply for an amended certificate of birth:
* A person born in the State of Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health and
1. has become legally adopted, or
2. has undergone a sex change operation, or
3. a legal determination of the nonexistence of a parent and child relationship for a person identified as a parent on the birth certificate on file has been made, or
4. previously recorded information in relation to the person’s surname and/or the father’s personal particulars has been altered pursuant to law.
* A person born in a foreign country who has been legally adopted in the State of Hawaii.
How to Apply for an Amended Certificate of Birth
For a person born in the State of Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health and has become legally adopted
* An amended birth certificate will be prepared upon receipt of a certified copy of a final adoption decree or an abstract of the decree, and after payment of any fees.
For a person born in the State of Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health and has undergone a sex change operation:
* An amended birth certificate will be prepared upon receipt of an affidavit of a physician that the physician has examined the individual and determined that the individual has had a sex change operation and the sex designation on the individual’s birth certificate is no longer correct, subject to further investigation and submission of additional information if deemed necessary, and payment of fees.”
“For a person born in the State of Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health and a legal determination of the nonexistence of a parent and child relationship for a person identified as a parent on the birth certificate on file has been made:
* An amended birth certificate will be prepared upon receipt of a final order, judgment, or decree of a court of competent jurisdiction that determined the nonexistence of a parent and child relationship for a person identified as a parent on the birth certificate on file and the person, and payment of any fees.
For a person born in the State of Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health and previously recorded information in relation to the person’s surname and/or the father’s personal particulars has been altered pursuant to law:
* An amended birth certificate will be prepared upon receipt of an affidavit of paternity, a court order establishing paternity, or a certificate of marriage establishing the marriage of the natural parents to each other, and payment of any fees.
For a person born in a foreign country who has been legally adopted in the State of Hawaii:
* An amended birth certificate will be prepared upon receipt of a certified copy of the adoption decree or the certificate of adoption, and payment of fees.
Note: Any additional application forms that may be required will be provided by the Department of Health after receipt of the necessary documents in support of the establishment of an amended certificate of birth.”
“Any person to whom a Certificate of Hawaiian Birth has been issued may submit a request to amend an entry, including a legal change of name, on an existing Certificate. A request to amend a Certificate of Hawaiian Birth will, however, be considered to be and treated as an application with the Department of Health for registration of a late certificate of birth in current use, unless a standard birth certificate for that person already exists in the vital records of the Department of Health. Should there be a situation of dual registration, the requested amendment will be made to the standard birth certificate on file if the required documentary evidence in support of the amendment has been submitted and evaluated to be adequate. If there is no standard birth certificate on file, an applicant is required to submit documentary evidence of the birth facts necessary to support of the registration of the late certificate of birth. If approved, the late birth certificate will be registered in place of the Certificate of Hawaiian Birth, which must then be surrendered to the Department of Health.
How to Apply for the Issuance of a Late Birth Certificate in Lieu of a Certificate of Hawaiian Birth
Upon receiving a request to amend an entry on an existing Certificate of Hawaiian Birth, the Registration Unit of the Office of Health Status Monitoring will send:
1. notification to the requestor that the amendment request is treated as an application for registration of a late certificate of birth, and
2. instructions on procedures for and submission of required documentary evidence in support of registration of a late certificate of birth.
If the amendment request is subsequently withdrawn, all documents received in support of the amendment will be returned. If the requestor elects to proceed with the application for registration of a late certificate of birth, the documentary evidence submitted in support of registration will be reviewed and evaluated for adequacy. If the application is approved, a late birth certificate will be issued and the original Certificate of Hawaiian Birth issued to the applicant must be surrendered to, for cancellation by, the Department of Health. No filing fee is charged for the late birth certificate.
Further Information and Assistance
For information, call (808) 586-4540 during regular business hours (7:45 a.m. – 4:30 p.m. HST).
Counter service is available Monday – Friday, except holidays, from 7:45 a.m. – 2:30 p.m. Appointments are preferred.”
“Vital records (birth, death, marriage, and divorce certificates) on file with the Department of Health may be amended (i.e., changes, corrections, additions, deletions, or substitutions) upon submission of the required documentation.”
“Who is Eligible to Apply for an Amendment?
An original entry on a birth, death, marriage, or divorce certificate may be amended by either the private request of an individual or an order of a court of competent jurisdiction. An amendment includes changes, corrections, additions, deletions, or substitutions.
How to Apply for an Amendment
An amendment may be made upon application, but only with the submission of required documentary evidence in support of the amendment. The evidentiary requirements can differ, depending on whether the amendment is court-ordered or, if requested by an individual, whether it materially affects the validity and integrity of the record.
In most cases, a fee of $3 is charged for each request for amendment of an item or group of items on a given certificate.
When information originally entered on a certificate is amended:, 1) a line is drawn through the incorrect entry and the correct data is inserted, 2) what information was amended and on what authority, the date of the action and the initials of the reviewer are entered on the certificate, and 3) the notation “altered” is written or stamped on the certificate.
Once an amendment of an item is made, that item will not be amended again without a court order or, if a person’s name is to be changed, without a change of name decree.”

http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/vital-re…


monkey99
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 6:15 pm

WOW!

The mental illness factor jumped since I been away! What are you birthers huffing, anyway? The lunacy just gets worse and worse (or better and better, by my observation). You know, you toilers can't quit, it would be a depressing day when it stops.

So, my message to all you toilers: Keep it up!! It's a great day when I can come to this blog and laugh my ass off at your nonsensical, insane, lunatic fringe idiocy!!


Adam
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 6:38 pm

The saga continues:
http://community.sandiego6.com/blogs/richards_b…


bearclaw
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 7:57 pm

No kidding. I posted here last Friday, just kind of poking fun at the birther village idiots (especially the Cap'n), and to my amazement they are still posting on this same story days later. This is really wonderful — it clearly is meeting some of their obsessive/compulsive needs (an important function with the shortfalls in mental health funding). Hey birfers — watching you wobble and foam and howl at the moon is just so much FUN. Please keep it up. I'll check back in few days!


bearclaw
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 8:08 pm

Thanks for translating the Latin, Ernie! And for your authoritative interpretation of Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution. I am in awe of your legal knowledge. Had I known of your brilliance, I would not have spent three years in law school, and the last 20 years practicing law. (I thought “ab initio” was an exercise device!)

Can I check back in with you in a couple of weeks, and laugh at your unfulfilled prophecy?


RedGraham
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 8:39 pm

What saddens me most about this never-ending Obama-Soetoro/birth-citizenship mystery is that there is considerable conflicting evidence and few people even want to know the truth. Others actually rudely ridicule those who want to know the truth. What could possibly be so scarey about finding the truth? Orley Taitz should be sainted, Alan Keyes should be president, & Chuck Norris should be governor of Texas.


resplazapunchbowl
Comment posted September 22, 2009 @ 11:26 pm

Mr Lawyer or whatever,
Your lowering of any discussion to personal name calling and uniformed statements are just what the birthers are typically doing. If you must know I am an eighty two year former military/federal worker with 42 years of combined service in counterintelligence investigations and positive intelligence operations, assigned for 22 years overseas plus 10 years in Washington DC/Virginia/Md and vicinity. I am also a veteran of the korean war and served in a combat zone.
I have been closely connected with defense security investigators and its security adjudication process and have read at least 15,000 case files of background investigations. I have been trained by the Army and Air Force Intelligence and CIA and also worked for a short time for the state's Child Support Enforcement Agency. Therefore, I do have some knowledge of national security, intelligence and investigation matters. FYI every time there is a classified briefing/meeting in any federal/military offices anywhere in the world, all participants must be cleared prior to attending. This is the responsibility of the security officer of the host agency and the security officer of the participation agency. No clearance, no entry, no exceptions regardless of rank or political position. In the old days, everything was in the form of military orders and/or verification documents carried by participants. I understand everything is handled electronically today,as have the two million background investigations conducted by the Office of Personnel Management's Federal Investigative Services Division in 2007.
Considering all the accusations and counter accusations that have been taking place, I believe that if a Congress Oversight Committee can examine all facets of this contentious problem with the full cooperation of the FBI (who conducts investigations on VP and President), and the Hawaii state authorities,the findings should satisfy most,but probably not the die hard birthers. However, I must conclude that the White House, Congress, FBI (having conducted a Single Scope Background Investigation on POTUS), and several courts have judged the birthers claim as frivolous, and patiently allowing them to blow steam until exhaustion takes over and they keel over.


chrisjay
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 12:04 am

Holy S**t !!! JACKPOT!!! Just goes to show if you're a little patient with these “special” people you might get rewarded with a posting like this one. We need a drumroll and a fanfare: Ladies and gentlemen, I give you the Birfers holy trinity———–Orly Taitz (natch)—————Alan Keyes(!!!!!!) and……………..wait for it…………….Chuck Norris (gasp). You heard me. CHUCK NORRIS !!!!!
god I love the internet


chrisjay
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 12:35 am

Captainstevie, your posts are gibberish whether they have 25 or 2500 words.
Pop quiz–answer quickly and without peeking at your last posting:

what are the counter hours mon thru fri?

how much is the fee for each request?

is there a filing fee for a late b.c.?

who must submit an affadavit in the case of a sex change?

Damn, capt, you've been studying: good score!!

I'm going to post the rules of the NJ state lottery and I will be quizzing you tomorrow, so study hard, K?


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 2:18 am

No there isn't. But any accusation that can be thrown out is generally acceptable to the Birthers.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 2:21 am

Of course they can be amended. Quite often people print incorrect information on them which is then usually followed up by a statement from them. “You made a mistake”. The point not to be forgotten is that not everything can be amended. A court ordered delayed registration of birth for example (which is what you are alleging Obama's certificate is) cannot have the birth location amended purely on the statement of the family.


Adam
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 4:13 am

Birther-schmirther. There's other serious issues with Obama that are being overlooked–things like the ACORN mess (which B.O. claims to know nothing about) and this:
http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/08/obamas_d…


Adam
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 4:18 am

It's not the folks who don't want to know, but the media which doesn't want to ask. The mainstream media can't be expected to provide unbiased, penetrating coverage of the politician whose campaign they funded.

I suspect things like whitespace spectrum reallocation (a multibillion dollar issue) are what the media-telecom sector wanted out of Obama.


Adam
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 4:24 am

The die-hard Barry-O fans really don't find nagging questions about The One to be acceptable, to the point of flat-out denying that they exist. A case in point is that Obama HAS previously stated that Queens–not Kapi'olani–was his birthplace. A sillier thing is the problem Obamamaniacs have with their hero's admission that he abused cocaine…they somehow think that only DUI Dubya was into blow. (I guess they really haven't read Barrack's books.)


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 5:17 am

Its not that most people don't accept questions. They simply don't accept questions lacking any legitimacy..


RedGraham
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 5:59 am

How's this? Attorney General Orley Taitz, Surgeon General Ron Paul, & President Phyllis Schlafly?


chrisjay
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 7:14 pm

I followed your link & agree that this is worthy of more scrutiny. As for ACORN, I think you'll be very dissappointed. The ACORN affair will have a shorter half-life than the Birfer extravaganza. Here's the irony about these over-the-top movements: They end up jading the public about being wary of the subject. I still have a copy of the classic Clinton Chronicles video. It pulled together all of the outlandish charges against Bill & Hillary and serves as a great retrospective of the Clinton-haters' movement. After millions of dollars and even an (unsuccessful) impeachment, what was gained? A second term and historically high popularity numbers for Bubba after 8 + years of relentless and well-funded attacks. Maybe if Obama's detractors calmed down a bit and stopped acting as if the world were coming to an end, they'd start to notice that not all Demos, and fewer and fewer Progressives even agree with the guy most of the time. The hysterical and hateful attacks only serve to make the Party circle the wagons and defend the guy.


Adam
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 7:51 pm

Yeah, like the Repugnants, the Dumbs (and every other political party on Earth) have severe internal fractures. Like the Obama-Hillary thing, something along these lines is opening up, over the NY Gubenatorial Race:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/20/nyregion/20pa…


captainsteve
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 11:46 pm

Keep polishing that turd.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 23, 2009 @ 11:49 pm

You're right. Last I looked, he said he was “native-born” on his own website fight the smears.

Regardless, the guy's a fraud.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 12:55 am

Don't need to. You are producing enough offal for the both of us..


Lawyer
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 8:53 am

Don’t fall for Obama’s tricks. Obama is ADMITTEDLY NOT Constitutionally legal to hold office. “Obama republished – at his web official site, Fightthesmears.com – only that part of the Factcheck.org analysis which stated that the President was a British citizen at birth. Obama republished this word for word thereby admitting the truth of the following assertion:
“When Barack Obama Jr. was born on Aug. 4,1961, in Honolulu, Kenya was a British colony, still part of the United Kingdom’s dwindling empire. As a Kenyan native, Barack Obama Sr. was a British subject whose citizenship status was governed by The British Nationality Act of 1948. That same act governed the status of Obama Sr.’s children…” There it is, a CONFESSION that came straight from Obama. How much more proof do you folks need before you understand the TRUE situation?! Birthplace is NOT the issue, “natural born Citizen” status is ONLY AVAILABLE if BOTH PARENTS were U.S.Citizens at the time a child is born. THAT IS LAW.


Lawyer
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 8:55 am

Don’t fall for Obama’s tricks. Obama is ADMITTEDLY NOT Constitutionally legal to hold office. “Obama republished – at his web official site, Fightthesmears.com – only that part of the Factcheck.org analysis which stated that the President was a British citizen at birth. Obama republished this word for word thereby admitting the truth of the following assertion:
“When Barack Obama Jr. was born on Aug. 4,1961, in Honolulu, Kenya was a British colony, still part of the United Kingdom’s dwindling empire. As a Kenyan native, Barack Obama Sr. was a British subject whose citizenship status was governed by The British Nationality Act of 1948. That same act governed the status of Obama Sr.’s children…” There it is, a CONFESSION that came straight from Obama. How much more proof do you folks need before you understand the TRUE situation?! Birthplace is NOT the issue, “natural born Citizen” status is ONLY AVAILABLE if BOTH PARENTS were U.S.Citizens at the time a child is born. THAT IS LAW.


Lawyer
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 8:59 am

Don’t fall for Obama’s evil tricks. Obama is ADMITTEDLY NOT Constitutionally legal to hold office. “Obama republished – at his web official site, Fightthesmears.com – only that part of the Factcheck.org analysis which stated that the President was a British citizen at birth. Obama republished this word for word thereby admitting the truth of the following assertion:
“When Barack Obama Jr. was born on Aug. 4,1961, in Honolulu, Kenya was a British colony, still part of the United Kingdom’s dwindling empire. As a Kenyan native, Barack Obama Sr. was a British subject whose citizenship status was governed by The British Nationality Act of 1948. That same act governed the status of Obama Sr.’s children…” There it is, a CONFESSION that came straight from Obama. How much more proof do you folks need before you understand the TRUE situation?! Birthplace is NOT the issue, “natural born Citizen” status is ONLY AVAILABLE if BOTH PARENTS were U.S.Citizens at the time a child is born. THAT IS LAW, RESEARCH IT, UNDERSTAND IT, THEN COMMENT STATING FACTS, DON''T CONTINUE TO REPEAT THE SAME OLD WORN OUT DEMOCRATIC PARTY PROPAGATED DISINFORMATION and LIES…


Lawyer
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 9:09 am

YOU ARE A PROVEN PATHOLOGICAL LIAR! F.B.I. NEVER CHECKED OBAMA'S BACKGROUND. I AM IN POSSESSION OF AN OFFICIAL HARD COPY STATEMENT FROM THE DIRECTOR OF THE F.B.I. PROVING WHAT I AM SAYING IS TRUE. Does it make you feel like a big shot to lie? The president does NOT have to qualify for a clearance, his position ENTITLES him to know the entire story. How foolish are you? Ohhh, sorry! You just self-proved my point! B/S on your “42 years”, I know better. No one whose spelling and grammar are as atrocious as yours has EVER worked in the field of intel – I KNOW FIRST HAND! God deliver us from the lying Obamawhores!


Lawyer
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 9:22 am

Name calling? You post nothing but OUTRIGHT and OBVIOUS LIES, then you're shocked when someone calls you on it? LOL, LOL, LOL, YOU REALLY ARE A COMPLETE IDIOT! First of all, it is very easy to see you've NEVER served with ANY agency. Second, you have developed absolutely NO ability to employ clear, concise, and proper wording, which is one of the FIRST lessons in ANY class on gathering, recording, and disseminating intel (how could anyone possibly decipher your incoherent ramblings? The only thing you could accomplish would be to cause innocent people to die, YOU ARE NOT FOOLING ANYONE BUT YOUR MENTALLY-ILL, DELUSIONAL SELF, YOU PATHOLOGICAL LIAR!)


Lawyer
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 9:26 am

“ACORN” will be investigated, prosecuted, and dissolved. “Non profits” and “not for profits” cannot violate the law and continue to operate. Look up the IRS code and see for yourself. ACORN will soon be but a bad memory.


Lawyer
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 9:31 am

Doctor Ron Paul, M.D., (Obstetrician and Gynecologist) was the ONLY truly honest, patriotic, and extremely intelligent candidate for President.


chrisjay
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 5:52 pm

“Lawyer” and friends,
Your special brand of crazy is become tiresome and the entertainment value is beginning to seriously lag. At this rate I may have to start looking farther afield for cheap giggles; Anybody here know a good blogsite for alien abductees?


davidvine
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 8:40 pm

I have to laugh! It may be––though I doubt it––that President Obama is not constitutionally eligible to hold his office by virtue of his place of birth, but amid all of this brouhaha, nobody has yet pointed out that that particular criterion is just part of a package that has to date included being white, male, and heterosexual. The whole package is a bunch of racist, patriarchal, homophobic rubbish that should be revisited and changed to reflect America's commitment to truly EQUAL human rights.


bearclaw
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 9:56 pm

I'm finding it a bit difficult to believe that your are a lawyer. I am a lawyer, and your analysis is silly:

(1) The U.S. Supreme Court has never authoritatively interpreted Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 of the U.S. Constitution.

(2) There is no record of a debate on the “natural born Citizen” qualification during the Constitutional Convention. This clause was introduced by the drafting Committee of Eleven, and then adopted without discussion by the Convention as a whole.

(3) You assume that parentage is the key to being “natural born”. There is at least as strong an argument that “natural born” refers to being born within the United States. See the dissenting opinion of Justice Benjamin R. Curtis in Dred Scott v. Sanford 60 U.S. (19 How.) 393 (1857).

(4) By your analysis, Chester Arthur was not qualified to be President.

(5) If your argument is that “dual citizenship” at birth disqualifies one from the Presidency, we have a serious problem. Each nation determines its own rules of citizenship. If another country (let's pick Zimbabwe) were to pass a law stating that all persons born in the U.S. are also citizens of Zimbabwe, then how could anyone born in this country become President?

I dare you to respond without using the “all caps” feature. Just see if you can do it, “lawyer.”


Big George
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 11:02 pm

No matter what side you are on, or what you believe, the simplest way to end the discussion is to produce the authentic certificate. Why let this continue to fester.


Adam
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 11:11 pm

Great idea…but the amendment should be done FIRST, then a non-'natural born' American elected.

Rule of Law is the cornerstone of democracy.


you must be joking
Comment posted September 24, 2009 @ 11:50 pm

Women from other countries- Cuba and Mexico are just a couple of them- have died trying to step foot on American soil so their children can be born American citizens. There has never been any question, if they made it to our shores before giving birth, that child was now a citizen of the United States.

We have a president born to an American on American soil. Just because the state no longer puts out the same kind of certificate they used to, we have all these people screaming he isn't eligible to serve. Well, guess what folks? They don't ask you what kind of certificate you want, what you want it to look like. If you go to a courthouse (usually) in the state in which you were born and ask for a copy of your birth certificate, after ascertaining you are entitled to it they will give you a certificate. Most states now have vital records on computer, at least up to a point. They access your record on the computer and print out a certificate for you. It usually includes the date you asked for it, along with the information you need to prove who you are. After printing, it is usually embossed with a stamp and signed by a deputy clerk or someone authorized to do so, or sometimes with a signature stamp.
I had a certificate, smaller than a half sheet of 8 1/2 X 11. I misplaced it and needed a birth certificate. My daughter was able to go to the courthouse in my home state and because a child can request a parents birth certificate, she obtained a new one for me. It is a fancy, full 8 1/2 X 11 paper that was loaded into printer specifically to print out a vital record. It has the basic information needed by a state or the US government to ascertain I am a U.S. citizen and that's all. I didn't get a choice. There is no “long form” anymore. My grandchild, born in 2005, has a certificate just like my new one. Evidently most states have gone to this new method. So the president doesn't have a choice about what the state of Hawaii gives him now. Why anyone would expect that he would have the original, issued when he was an infant, I'll never know. I don't. It got lost somewhere along the way. The copy I used to have was like the original, but they don't give them out like that anymore. President Obama is not hiding anything, he produced what Hawaii gave him. If he were not a citizen, born in Hawaii, they would not have given him the certificate they did. They have no reason to produce something that isn't in their files. The state officials in charge of vital records has stated time and time again that they have seen the original information, probably on microfiche. They gave him a certificate that is accepted by passport offices, drivers license offices, visa offices, social security offices, public assistance offices, insurance offices and every other official office that requires it. It is not the presidents fault they have changed the way they do things in vital records. No one not affiliated with the president, spouse, child, grandparent, sibling- has a right to his certificate. They do not give out information like they used to. Could be because of identity theft and privacy rights but the president didn't write the rules. His campaign posted the scanned document online. That is an official birth certificate. Get over it folks. He is eligible to be, and is, President of the United States..


you must be joking
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 1:02 am

And if you believe that I have a bridge to sell you if the guys in the white coats don't catch up with you first. That jacket they are holding surely has your name on it. And don't worry, the meds they give you will soon have these delusions under control and you won't be hearing those voices anymore. I'd be willing to bet that LAWYER will be, or at least should be, right there in the ward next to you!


borderraven
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 1:45 am

“I am not aware of any birth certificate records that have been destroyed by the department,” Janice Okubo, public information officer for the Hawaii DOH, told WND. “When the department went electronic in 2001, vital records, whether in paper form or any other form, [were] maintained. We don’t destroy records.”

Okubo affirmed that beginning in 2001, all vital records, including birth records, moved to electronic formats.

“Any records that we had in paper or any other form before 2001 are still in file within the department,” she insisted. “We have not destroyed any vital statistics records that we have.”


borderraven
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 2:02 am

The corporations own and control the media, who works for media, what media says, who is seen or heard in the media. Political parties are conglomerations of corporations. Every four years the DNC, Inc. and RNC, Inc. nominate their top employee to compete for CEO of America, Inc. The US Constitution has become an inconvenient guide, they would rather burn.


davidvine
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 2:15 am

So the laws, in the history of our nation, that enshrined prejudice, and those that still deny rights, benefits, and protections to a deselected few should be obeyed? Read Thomas Paine. Read the Declaration of Independence. “When in the course of human events it becomes necessary…” Full enfranchisement, not the rule of law is the cornerstone of democracy. Laws can be unjust. Equality never.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 2:18 am

No its not…

The case is United States v. Low Hong, Circuit Court of Appeals, Fifth Circuit.Circuit Court of Appeals (1919).

The case deals with rights of a citizen, and Low Hong was a United States citizen. What is interesting is how and why the court also described him as a “natural born citizen”.

The first part of the case states what the parties agree on:

This is an appeal by the government from an order discharging the appellee on a hearing in a habeas corpus proceeding instituted by the latter. The appellee’s amended petition for the writ alleged that he is a citizen of the United States, that he was born in San Francisco 25 years ago, and that he was being held by virtue of a warrant issued by the Secretary of Labor commanding that appellee be taken into custody and granted a hearing to enable him to show why he should not be deported in conformity with law. A demurrer to the amended petition was filed, and a return was made to the writ, which averred that petitioner’s arrest and detention were in pursuance of a warrant of the Secretary of Labor, duly and lawfully issued under the provisions of section 19 of the Act of Congress of February 5, 1917 (39 Stat. 889, c. 29 (Comp. St. 1918, Sec. 4289 1/4jj)).

The Court ruled that since everyone agreed that Low Hong was a citizen, he could not be held under a law that only applied to aliens. What is interesting is how the decision was worded:

A mere claim of citizenship, made in a petition for the writ of habeas corpus by one held under such process, cannot be given the effect of arresting the progress of the administrative proceeding provided for. United States v. Sing Tuck, 194 U.S. 161, 24 Sup.Ct. 621, 48 L.Ed. 917; United States v. Ju Toy, 198 U.S. 253, 25 Sup.Ct. 644, 49 L.Ed. 1040. But an admission that such claim is well founded dispenses with any necessity or occasion for waiting for the Secretary of Labor to render a decision on a question that does not exist. An admission that one held under such process is not an alien is an admission that he is not subject to be detained under that process. What occurred on the hearing in the instant case amounted to an admission that the Secretary of Labor was without power or jurisdiction to have the appellee kept in custody under the warrant issued. The averments of the amended petition show that the appellee is a natural-born citizen of the United States. United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649, 18 Sup.Ct. 456, 42 L.Ed. 890. The truth of those averments being admitted, the immigration officials were not entitled to retain the appellee in custody until the Secretary of Labor should in the summary proceedings pass on the question of deporting one who was admitted not to be subject to be detained or deported under the process under which he was held.

Both parents do not have to be natural citizens. You nearly need be born on U.S. Soil. If your parents are foreign citizens than it is up to you to decide your citizenship.

Low Hong was born in the United States about 1894. His parents were likely not!

he citation immediately following the statement that Low Hong was a “natural born citizen of the United States” is the Supreme Court case United States v. Wong Kim Ark. Wong is a case in which the Supreme Court decided that an child born in the United States to two alien (Chinese) parents was a US Citizen under the 14th Amendment. Note that the Wong decision said “citizen” and not “natural born citizen”. However, one can easily argue from the majority opinion in Wong that “natural born citizenship” is implied. Here it appears that the Low Hong decision agrees, using the phrase “natural born citizen” and justifying the language by Wong.

Your argument is so weak as to be stunning in its ineptitude. You should have learned in 3rd grade civics that one of the ways you achieved citizenship and thus became able to become President was that YOU were born on U.S. Soil.

But there is a case..Perkins v. Elg, 307 U.S. 325 (1939)

Read that one…


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 2:20 am

In Lynch v. Clarke, 1 Sandf. Ch. 584,:

“Upon principle, therefore, I can entertain no doubt but that, by the law of the United States, every person born within the dominion and allegiance of the United States, whatever were tlie situation of his parents, is a natural-born citizen.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 2:21 am

Thank you…


borderraven
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 2:22 am

chrisjay, you really should go to http://www.scribd.com and search for KEYES v OBAMA, I think it will enlighten you. And be sure to look screen-right for a scrolling list of documents.


borderraven
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 2:32 am

bearclaw, We're just bidding time until court action picks up again, in a couple weeks. Judge Carter has extended time to allow plaintiffs to gather more evidence, serve subpoenas, take depositions, etc. You may remember defendants passed on their opportunity. BTW–The case is gaining momentum in the media, Orly will be busy.


you must be joking
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 5:22 am

I never said any records were destroyed, only that they probably scanned. Much easier to go through than the actual paper. Doesn't matter. What I said was they no longer give out birth certificates in the manner they used to, the supposed “long form” that everyone keeps screaming about. It seems that many states have changed to a form like the one the president has online and that I now have.


RedGraham
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 5:28 am

So in a nutshell the Obama was born a Brit or dual-citizen before he became an Indonesian named Barry Soetoro.


borderraven
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:02 am

So then, you must be joking, would you conclude that if Obama's original vital statistic birth record exists, and if he was birthed in Hawaii, that the Hawaii Department of Health would have it on file at Hawai‘i State Archives Kekauluohi Building, ‘Iolani Palace Grounds, 364 S. King Street, Honolulu, Hawai‘i 96813? I await discovery. Hey perhaps subpoena duces tecum and a quo warranto will make Obama bring his records into daylight. What do you think?


chrisjay
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:34 am

The only thing festering is the remnant of your brain. False premise. The certificate on record has been authenticated six ways to sunday. Birfers are having a circular argument with themselves. Law and logic are not invited to the discussion.There was never a moon landing. The government is hiding embalmed aliens. Clinton killed people who exposed his drug ring. The earth is only 5000 years old. Richard Gere had a gerbil surgically removed from his anus. Rush Limbaugh is a patriot. Saddam Hussein planned 9/11. Al Gore is a shape shifter. Rosie O'Donnel is a secret hetero.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:39 am

Patriots, read the latest report by Leo Donofrio.

He has very credible evidence (and is preparing legal action) that the State of Hawaii violated their own laws and are complicit in the cover-up of Obama's vital records. Hawaii actually has very liberal FOIA (freedom of information act) policies with very few restrictions. The full details can be viewed at the following web-page.

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/

.


you must be joking
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:54 am

I don't think that is a building under federal jurisdiction- I think that is a state matter. But you don't believe the director, who has stated more than once that she has seen the records, they do exist, and the president was born in Hawaii as stated on his birth certificate they gave him and he has posted? And you won't believe the republican governor who has stated the same? Both of these women have repeatedly said they (the state) has the records and they are on file and they have provided the president with all he needs to prove his birth. It's good enough for the passport office but not you? Please.


RedGraham
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 8:15 am

In the video “Mama Sarah Obama: Exclusive interview from WTHR-TV”
Mama Sarah says “Obama came to Kenya the first time to bury his father”
It would not be hard to remember that “yes we saw Obama the first time when he came home to bury his dad”.
Obama father died as to The Obama File in 1982. when BHO2 was 20-21 years old.
Did Obama become a Kenyan Citizen when he was in Kenya to bury his father?
Sorry, I missed the part where “they” explained how “You’re a racist” constitutes a legal defense!
It’s very simple. According to his own testimony, Obama’s father was a nondeclarant alien. Regardless of whether he allowed his Kenyan citizenship to lapse or he formally renounced it, Obama is a United States citizen by operation of law.
He’s not a natural-born citizen.
He’s not eligible to hold the office of President.
It gives me no pleasure to “pretend” that Obama isn’t President, because I’m not pretending. I’m morally certain that Obama is not now President.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:00 pm

I can only imagine what “captainsteve’s” teeth look like…


Anonymous
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:06 pm

LOL!

I’m just so happy that people like “captainsteve” got their little asses kicked so severely last November!

That’s why they’re so bitter and angry. They lost. And they’re completely without any power or influence now that Bush is gone.

People like “captainsteve” will go their graves, seething with anger. I’m glad they lost. And I’m glad there is absolutely nothing they can do about it.

America is increasingly young, black, brown, Latino, Asian, urban and liberal. And those trends are only going to increase.

Soon, only white southern men and rich country club men will be voting for conservatives. That’s not enough to come close to regaining power.

Hey “captain” (yeah, right!): Your president is a black, liberal Democrat with an African/Islamic name. I suggest you get used to it. It’s only the beginning!

Ha ha!


Anonymous
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:10 pm

Adam,
The end of the your posting, in which you said, “There has to be serious campaign reform, going all the way down to the local government-level. Absolutely banning corporate and union donations, as well as capping individual donations around $1K could be a start.” was right on the mark.

The earlier stuff makes you seem a bit unhinged. Where did you get this drivel from anyway? Just thought I’d let you know,


Anonymous
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:12 pm

I’m glad you’re wasting your time on this “captainsteve”, and your remaining shreds of credibility. Do you know how nutty you sound?


Johnny
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 5:14 pm

unsub


JimCap
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 5:59 pm

I think that “captainsteve” likes hiding behind an fake identity where he can post his bizarre ramblings. In real life, he'd probably find most people—outside of his fellow wackos—avoiding him when he starts with his idiotic ramblings.

Also, “captainsteve”, you might want to pick up a book about the English language; you apparently have some problems with spelling and grammar. Don't you? Are you a citizen?

“captainsteve” either needs his tin foil hat adjusted or his diaper changed. Maybe both?


captainsteve
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:37 pm

Must read links. Latest evidence of cover-up (lying) by Hawaii Department of Health, Communications Director, Janice Okubo.

She has been lying about the freedom of information laws in Hawaii. The s**t is going to hit the fan!

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2009/09…

In case you haven’t seen this, below is a repost of what I was sending yesterday.

More proof of Obummer's questionable connections and manipulation. It turns out that Dr. Chiyome Fukino, the Hawaii records keeper that publicly stated that Obam’s birth certificate is on file and that he is a citizen, and Obama have past ties.

Read more here.

http://thepostnemail.wordpress.com/2009/09/25/f…

In case you haven’t seen this, below is a repost of what I was sending re Donofrio’s work.

Patriots, read the latest report by Leo Donofrio.

He has very credible evidence (and is preparing legal action) that the State of Hawaii violated their own laws and are complicit in the cover-up of Obama's vital records. Hawaii actually has very liberal FOIA (freedom of information act) policies with very few restrictions. The full details can be viewed at the following web-page.

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2009/09…

.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:55 pm

Must read links. Latest evidence of cover-up (lying) by Hawaii Department of Health, Communications Director, Janice Okubo.

She has been lying about the freedom of information laws in Hawaii. The s**t is going to hit the fan!

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2009/09…

In case you haven’t seen this, below is a repost of what I was sending yesterday.

More proof of Obummer's questionable connections and manipulation. It turns out that Dr. Chiyome Fukino, the Hawaii records keeper that publicly stated that Obam’s birth certificate is on file and that he is a citizen, and Obama have past ties.

Read more here.

http://thepostnemail.wordpress.com/2009/09/25/f…

In case you haven’t seen this, below is a repost of what I was sending re Donofrio’s work.

Patriots, read the latest report by Leo Donofrio.

He has very credible evidence (and is preparing legal action) that the State of Hawaii violated their own laws and are complicit in the cover-up of Obama's vital records. Hawaii actually has very liberal FOIA (freedom of information act) policies with very few restrictions. The full details can be viewed at the following web-page.

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2009/09…

.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:57 pm

Must read links. Latest evidence of cover-up (lying) by Hawaii Department of Health, Communications Director, Janice Okubo.

She has been lying about the freedom of information laws in Hawaii. The s*** is going to hit the fan!

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2009/09…

In case you haven’t seen this, below is a repost of what I was sending yesterday.

More proof of Obummer's questionable connections and manipulation. It turns out that Dr. Chiyome Fukino, the Hawaii records keeper that publicly stated that Obam’s birth certificate is on file and that he is a citizen, and Obama have past ties.

Read more here.

http://thepostnemail.wordpress.com/2009/09/25/f…

In case you haven’t seen this, below is a repost of what I was sending re Donofrio’s work.

Patriots, read the latest report by Leo Donofrio.

He has very credible evidence (and is preparing legal action) that the State of Hawaii violated their own laws and are complicit in the cover-up of Obama's vital records. Hawaii actually has very liberal FOIA (freedom of information act) policies with very few restrictions. The full details can be viewed at the following web-page.

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2009/09…

.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 6:59 pm

Must read links. Latest evidence of cover-up (lying) by Hawaii Department of Health, Communications Director, Janice Okubo.

She has been lying about the freedom of information laws in Hawaii. The s**t is going to hit the fan!

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2009/09…

In case you haven’t seen this, below is a repost of what I was sending yesterday.

More proof of Obummer's questionable connections and manipulation. It turns out that Dr. Chiyome Fukino, the Hawaii records keeper that publicly stated that Obam’s birth certificate is on file and that he is a citizen, and Obama have past ties.

Read more here.

http://thepostnemail.wordpress.com/2009/09/25/f…

.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 7:00 pm

In case you haven’t seen this, below is a repost of what I was sending re Donofrio’s work.

Patriots, read the latest report by Leo Donofrio.

He has very credible evidence (and is preparing legal action) that the State of Hawaii violated their own laws and are complicit in the cover-up of Obama's vital records. Hawaii actually has very liberal FOIA (freedom of information act) policies with very few restrictions. The full details can be viewed at the following web-page.

http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2009/09…

.


Adam
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 7:59 pm

Going back to the Magna Carta, rule of law is THE basis of representative democracy–no ifs, ands, or buts.

If the United States wants people born out-of-country, or holding dual citizenship, to be able to be elected President, there has to be a Constitutional amendment FIRST. Then, Roger Calero, Arnold Schwartzeneger, or whoever, can have a shot at the Presidency. Meanwhile, people like John McCain and Barack Obama have to prove that they play by the rules.


davidvine
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 9:03 pm

Adam, let me guess… You're not one of the equal-tax-paying citizens of this country whose FULL contribution to society doesn't earn him the SAME rights, benefits, and protections everyone else gets? The Magna Carta was a step in the right direction, but you are dreaming if you call it “democracy”. Rule of law as a notion is encoded (weakly) in the Magna Carta, basically as a means of restraining the worst actions of the king on behalf of the interests of a group of his privileged subjects. You don't get it, do you? That's not democracy. Democracy means “of the people, by the people, and for the people”––ALL the people––not of, by, and for a handful of rich and powerful white, male land-owning nobles. But the point is, we have to be BETTER than that. If the laws are, as in the case of the rule about birth on US soil, just plain silly, we have to change them. (And incidentally, I wonder if the founding fathers would have judged the generation that came just before them essentially unfit to lead their compatriots, simply because they had been born in England.) If, on the other hand, the laws are repressive, unjust, or barbaric, we have to disobey them… as a means of motivating those who are the recipients of accidental, undeserved privilege to stand up for true equality.


RedGraham
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 9:20 pm

A big thanks to all truebelievers known as “birthers” or “birfers”. Our crusade is finally coming to an end. The Great Usurper's days are numbered. Let us continue to fight the goodfight & run the race set before us. The reward for our efforts and the answer to our prayers is nigh.


Ann Wyatt
Comment posted September 25, 2009 @ 10:04 pm

Birthers are nuttier than a fruitcake. My mother was born in New York.She is a natural or native born citizen. Same thing. Her parents were born in 2 different countries. If your born in America you are automatically a citizen. It doesnt matter where your parents were born. Obama had to show a legitimate birthcertificate to get a U.S. passport. If you are born in another country and become a citizen,your country of birth is on your passport. obama's mother never visited Kenya.Obama is more of an American then McCain. Since McCain was not born on American soil. It has to be one of the 50 states. Schwarzenegger was born in Austria, he cant run either. McCain 's election would have been illegal. Idiot Palin could have been president.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 26, 2009 @ 12:28 am

You're wrong on almost every point. You should do a little research before you post, unless you just want to deceive like the fraud-in-chief (which you likely do).

Natural and native are not the same.

he hasn't proven he was born in America. The COLB is available to non-US born.

In 1961 if born in Knya, he would not have automatically become a US citizen.

We haven't seen his passport. Some have tried. Two have ended up dead.

Stanley did visit Kenya to meet the family.

You're rare correct comment is about McCain not being eligible, but neither is Dingle Barry.

Go back to school. Maybe they'll let you be in the class with the indoctrinated kids chanting barack hussein obama.


you must be joking
Comment posted September 26, 2009 @ 2:35 am

If he were born somewhere other than Hawaii the birth certificate that is online would have said where he was born. They do not give birth certificates that use Hawaii as the place of birth UNLESS the person was born there. It doesn't matter how much you guys try to stir up or say otherwise, you lost this battle and the war before you ever started. You are wrong and no matter what kind of crap you manufacture, the black man is the legitimate president of the United States. It really is starting to get ridiculous, no, it has been ridiculous all along but now it is getting to the point of bizarre. You guys obviously have no life or anything worthwhile to spend your money on because you keep doing this with that crazy woman who professes to be an attorney. She keeps filing the same stuff in different courts with (sometimes) different plaintiffs but the complaints are the same. Do you really think the federal laws and precedent are going to change between states? That is just wishful thinking. For all of you that keep giving Oily Taters money, you are throwing it down a black hole and you will never see it again, nor will you ever get anything from all this except perhaps ulcers and a whole bunch of people laughing at you. There will be those who believe you need to be hospitalized in a psychiatric facility. I have no doubt some of you should, especially Oily Taters. When people refuse to live in reality, medications or locked rooms are required. I really hope you all get the help you need. We have enough mentally challenged people on the streets, we don't need more. A bunch of you keep posting here or someone with multiple personalities is doing it all. Please get help. You all need it.


you must be joking
Comment posted September 26, 2009 @ 2:36 am

Dream on.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 26, 2009 @ 2:54 am

COLBs like the one obama shows online were/are available to children born elsewhere. One example is adoption. Hawaii law then said any child presented within a year of birth could get a Hawaii COLB. It's meaningless.

Not that it matters.

Obama's father was British. He cannot be a natural-born citizen.


you must be joking
Comment posted September 26, 2009 @ 3:45 am

We have had several presidents who had one parent who was not a citizen. If they were eligible to be president, then so is President Obama. He is a natural born citizen because he was born here and has a least one parent who is a citizen. If the Congress and the Supreme Court have all said he is able to be president, he's president. I don't think the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court would have sworn the president in (twice) if he hadn't believed he was swearing in the rightful president. He is, after all, a conservative.

In 1961, as now, they didn't let 18 year old young women adopt, nor did mixed race couples get to adopt. In some places it still wasn't legal for a black man to marry a white woman. Stanley Ann Dunham Obama gave birth to a son in Hawaii in 1961. I know 18 is too young to start a family, but it happens all the time.

And seriously, we all have some racism in us, of some kind, we may not even be aware of it. (Racism is not just by whites toward blacks.) I think it would behoove us all to do the soul searching and look deep within ourselves to find and deal with what we may have hidden. For all of you birthers who keep insisting that your dismay with Obama being president isn't based in racism, I really think you need to figure out where you have it hidden, because it is based on those deep feelings you may not even recognize for what they are. The president has a US passport, which means he had to satisfactorily prove his citizenship when he obtained it. If he didn't have one, there would have been no files to go through. He is the rightful president and you got to give this up. You don't have to like his policies or even like him, but he is where he should be because we put him there. You have to respect the office even if you don't like the person or party he belongs to. He is our president.


captainsteve
Comment posted September 26, 2009 @ 4:43 am

You're a scum-bag racist. Don't bring the racist crap with me. I'll tell you what I tell all racists. Eff off.


you must be joking
Comment posted September 26, 2009 @ 6:13 am

I'm not the one searching for any reason possible, no matter how farfetched and ridiculous, to demean and want removed from office the duly elected black President of the United States. The truth hurts doesn't it dude? You know your objection is based in racism and you can't stand for anyone to remind you. The fact is you, and all you mentally ill buds just like you, still can't accept the fact that so many people voted for the black man. But millions of us did so I guess a whole lot of us were able to see past his color wern't we? And yet you still can't accept the fact he is the president. Get over it. Grow up and deal with your racist and down right nasty attitude.


chrisjay
Comment posted September 26, 2009 @ 3:39 pm

Calling Birfer-bashers “racist” is as irrational as all of your other takes on reality,Captain. “I know you are, but what am I?” is Peewee Herman's line


resplazapunchbowl
Comment posted September 26, 2009 @ 11:33 pm

THE SIMPLE TRUTHS

Hawaii's REPUBLICAN GOVERNOR Linda Lingle has drawn a line in the sand, “NO INFORMATION IN THE SO-CALLED “LONG FORM OR VAULTED FILES” OF OBAMA'S BIRTH RECORDS WILL BE RELEASED TO THE PUBLIC” THIS IS PROHIBITED BY FEDERAL PRIVACY LAWS (specifically the medical records privacy law of 1999).
Hawaii;s post-2001 “CERTIFICATION OF LIVE BIRTH” is a valid (THREE TIME SUPREME COURT VALIDATED) document which meet all federal and state requirements for birth and citIzenship purposes. The OLD “CERTIFICATE OF LIVE BIRTH” IS NO LONGER REPORTED BY HOSPITALS AND WILL NOT BE ISSUED.
Hawaii's hospitals now transmit records of birth electronically, minus any information deemed to be in conflict with current medical records privacy laws.
The old certificate of live birth was essentially a hospital's internal admin record of birth, WITHOUT THE OFFICIAL STATE SEAL It simplified the work of the states Bureau of Vital Statistic since it only required the stamped date and stamped signature of the Registrar of the Bureau. Multiple names, signatures, positions, dates or addresses,were required placing the entire burden of its preparation on the hospital staff.
In 2001, Hawaii and most states modernized and electronically digitized their data base. New laser printed “CERTIFICATION OF LIVE BIRTH” became the valid and acceptable birth certificate THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY. Legal challenges were denied three times by the US Supreme Court.
Hawaii's Director of the Department of Health and Chief of Vital Statistics have OFFICIALLY AND REPEATEDLY EXAMINED/VERIFIED/AUTHENTICATED/VALIDATED/VOUCHED for the accuracy of information in Barack Obama's post- 2001 CERTIFICATION OF LIVE BIRTH.
The strident “show me the real certificate” demands are ASININE, JUVENILE AND COMPLETELY LACK ANY LEGAL MERIT. SO LIVE WITH IT BIRTHERS. YOU'RE WASTING OUR TIME!! President Obama has already provided (the first time in history) his VALID BIRTH CERTIFICATE WHICH IS PROOF OF HIS HAWAIIAN BIRTH AND HAS NO FUTHER OBLIGATION TO YOU NUTTY BIRTHERS.


resplazapunchbowl
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 1:09 am

BEWARE OF ORLY TAITZ
Here's one for FACTCHECK or HUFFINGTON's NEW INVESTIGATIVE UNIT. On AUGUST 4, 1961, in the spic and span ward of the Kapiolani Maternity& Gynecological Women's Hospital, 1309 Punahou St., Honolulu, Hawaii, Eleanor C. Nordyke, age 34, was in premature labor pain. In the same ward, also suffering labor pain, was Stanley Ann Dunham, Barack Obama's late-mother. At 7:24 PM that evening Barack Obama was born. Eleanor Nordyke gave birth to two twin daughters named Susan “Nunu”and Gretchen “Nini.”the following afternoon starting at 2:12 PM. The twins attended the Noelani Elementary school in Manoa, located about a mile and a half from Kapiolani Hospital with Barack Obama as classmates. This relations continued at the prestigious Punahou High School from seventh grade in 1973 until graduation in 1979. During those years Eleanor Nordyke became acquainted with Ann Dunham Obama, and had closer relations with Barack Obama's late grand mother, Madelyn Dunham, who resided only a few blocks from the Kaipolani Hospital and by whom Barack Obama was raised. Punahou was located less than a mile from the Dunham apartment. Today the hospital is still located at the same address but is known as Kapiolani Health, an Affiliate of Hawaii Pacific Health, Kapiolani Medical Center for Women & Children. It was and still is one of the finest hospital in Hawaii.
On August 13 and 14 1961, Hawaii's two leading papers the Honolulu Advertiser and Honolulu Star Bulletin respectively announced Barack Obama's birth of Aug 4, 1961, along with his parents name and address on Kalanianaole Highway, Honolulu. This information was provided by the Bureau of Vital Statistics as a public service, but no longer do so because of the privacy law. The birthers have charged that these birth announcement by the two papers were planted by Obama's parents and grandparents with the complicity of the hospital, bureau of statistics, and two newspapers in 1961 in anticipation of Obama's run for the Presidency of the US in 2008, forty seven years later. They said he was born in Africa but Ann Dunham flew into Honolulu to fraudulently register his birth in Hawaii on/about Aug 8-12,1961.
Eleanor Nordyke presumably received a copy of a “Certificate of Live Birth” from the Bureau on Susan Nordyke, which showed the hospital name,time of birth, attending physician/nurse names, with dates and signatures, along with other family data. This was presumably furnished to the Advertiser by Eleanor Nordyke, which published same. This caused an outcry by birthers and doubters who refused to accept the laser printed post-2001 “Certification of Live Birth” furnished by Hawaii state to Barack Obama in June 2007, which he placed in the internet in 2008 during his presidential campaign. Birthers termed the Obama- furnished certificate as a “forgery” and adamantly refused all statements by Hawaii State officials concerning its validity and legality.
Now we have a chance of obtaining a sworn testimony of a live witness to Barack Obam's birth at Kapiolani Hospital, Eleanor Nordyke is now 82 years old and lives with her husband, Robert A. Nordyke, age 90, in Honolulu. He is a retired physician. The chief of staff at Kapiolani was a Dr.Rodney West, who was last connected with the Straub Hospital in Honolulu. If still living, he may have information on Ann Dunham's attending physician and nurses. Now all of this may have no effect on the birthers and conspirators because their agenda and aim is taking President Obama down from his perch and nothing will satisfy them. All thinking Americans must be thoroughly aware of this sinister/dastardly political attacks, consider all the available factual data against forged and false documents/statements heaped on an unsuspecting public by the likes of ORLY TAITZ, a crazy woman of murky origin but definitely foreign,and rise to the challenge and defend our precious democracy.


Harold Franklin
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 1:33 am

Now you and I both know that Jesus himself could come down himself and the birthers still wouldn't believe it. Props on an excellent piece of research.


Anonymous
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 8:29 am

Jeez, Raven, you mean that in addition to the 2 or 300 “documents” you birfers have posted here, the great Alan Keyes has a whole new cache for my edification? Tell you what: I’ll put it on my list of ‘things to do’…


you must be joking
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 3:58 am

Perhaps Oily Taters is a foreign operative, sent here to disrupt the government in America. She is, no doubt, guilty of sedition, by promoting people take up arms against the government of the United States. I heard her say it on one of the many video's where she is promoting her birther agenda. You cannot unsay what comes out of your mouth. We all know she is not a NATURAL BORN CITIZEN of the United States.

However, the data you have provided in detail, resplazapunchbowl, would convince any of those who are of stable mind about the folly of continuing this outlandish journey with Oily Taters. I fear, however, too many of those who follow blindly down the primrose path would not be convinced had they been present at the birth themselves. I have sincerely begun to fear for the mental capacity of many of the blind mice who follow this heavily foreign accented Pied Piper. In this day and age of slashed budgets and closed facilities and little help to those who may need it, after so many of them have given their money to the shrill voiced piper, how will they ever afford to pay for their mental health care on their own?


Adam
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 5:45 am

According to some nutty Obamamaniacs, Orly and Binyamin Netanyahu are Zionist agents, working in cahoots, to thwart the B.O. Administration:
http://simplyjews.blogspot.com/2009/08/wayne-ma…

Gotta love it, when the 'left'-wing crazies and Muslim antisemites hold hands.


chrisjay
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 6:31 am

Oh Adam, leave it to you to ferret out some obscure “lefty” anti-Semites and then suggest an equivalency between these fringy characters and the huge plague of hate spewing from the Birfer right against barry HUSSEIN obama.


borderraven
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 8:40 am

resplazapunchbowl, creative writing? Foolish! At least the Nordyke twins can show a certified copy of their vital statistic records, while Obama can only show a wad of toilet paper to wipe the poop from his grin.


borderraven
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 8:45 am

Ann Wyatt, at the time of your birth, were one or both of your parents either a native citizen, a natural born citizen, or a naturalized citizen?

Also, at the time of your mother's birth, were one or both of her parents either a native citizen, a natural born citizen, or a naturalized citizen? Your mother may be a native born citizen, but might not be a natural born citizen.


Jason G
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 5:20 pm

Here's the problem with movements like the birther movement. The movement itself is coated with teflon. Any type of logic or law that gets between their beliefs and theories or doesn't fit with their specific ideology is sloughed off. It's a very non-stick ideology.
If ever we have a democratic female president I'm sure we will hear them again spouting about how the US Constitution says specifically refers to the president as “He”. Fact is, it does refer to the president as “He”. Does this mean that we cannot have a female president without changing the Constitution? Of course it doesn't. But we'll see where the birthers lie on this one when the time comes.


pvel
Comment posted September 27, 2009 @ 6:52 pm

I am not at all worried about President Obama. I do worry that the birthers are not playing with a full deck.


resplazapunchbowl
Comment posted September 28, 2009 @ 12:18 am

For those of you birthers and doubters that believe President Obama is getting a”free ride” in gaining access to the nation's most sensitive intelligence, I have the following advice. And this is especially for the edification of “Lawyer” who appear to be a “friend of the Director F.B.I.” which he claims told him the “FBI did not investigate Obama.” You give away your age and lack of knowledge by using periods in the abbreviation FBI, It has always been known as FBI not F.B.I. I certainly would like to see your “HARD COPY STATEMENT”(whatever that means) you claim you received from the top G-man. BTW what's his name? Why don't you have it published by your Orly Taitz. You also appear to be high school drop out judging from your grammar. Apparently you cannot follow complex, compound sentences.
My advice: research and read: History of Soviet Espionage in the US; Robert Hansen, senior FBI agent, undetected for over twenty years as a spy for Soviet intelligence: ;Aldrich Ames, long time Soviet mole in the CIA; Julius and Ethel Rosenberg, who sold US atomic secrets to the Soviet; Alger Hiss, high state dept official, a communist mole; and espionage by numerous low ranking US military personnel. Also, Harold “Kim” Philby, high ranking British political figure, long time agent for the Soviets, and Richard Sorge, Soviet super spy, posing as a German journalist in Tokyo, Japan, during WWII. Espionage investigations costs the FBI and nation an estimated 100 Billion dollars per year. An FBI investigative guideline states: “ESPIONAGE CAN BE COMMITTED BY ANYONE.”
The FBI uses applicable federal laws, including Hobbs Act to investigate violations by public officials in federal, state and local governments. The 39th VP Spiro Agnew (Nixon's VP) was forced to resign on charges of extortion, tax fraud, conspiracy, but was allowed to plead no contest to a single count; and the pending case of Governor of Illinois Rod Blogovich. and also a sitting congressman.
The FBI considers its most sensitive and highest impact investigation is concentrated on public officials of the executive (White House) and legislative branches at both the national (Congress) and local levels. Public officials is meant as any person elected, appointed, employed or otherwise has a duty to maintain honest and faithful public service. There is very little public information of FBI investigations of VP/POTUS, probably because of the special protective shield required by the US Secret Service under its security requirements. There are six boxes FBI background investigations of candidate for VP Nelson Rockefellar in President Ford's library. Strict FOI laws are applicable.
Here's another tidbit. Before and after Dec 7, 1941, Gen Short and Admiral Kimmel, military commanders in Hawai; Edgar Hoover, FBI; and numerous other high military and civilian officials were never given access to “MAGIC,” the reading of Japanese diplomatic and Imperial Navy codes by US code breakers. VP Truman had no knowledge of the atom bomb until the death of FDR in April 12, 1945. He learned of its success in late July 1945, while meeting Winston Churchill and Joseph Stalin in Yalta. All this was based on “ThE NEED TO KNOW,” security protocol.
Also research National Security Directives, Executive Orders,and FBI web site in relation to security investigations and procedures.
Today there is tremendous awareness and strategic plans to defeat threats posed by foreign terrorists, domestic hate and fringe groups and therefore a strict conformance to all security laws and protocols are in effect. After reading all of the above, if you believe that the US still has such loose security allowing top politicians free or easy access to sensitive security information, then I have the Brooklyn Bridge to sell you.


resplazapunchbowl
Comment posted September 28, 2009 @ 12:18 am

For those of you birthers and doubters that believe President Obama is getting a”free ride” in gaining access to the nation's most sensitive intelligence, I have the following advice. And this is especially for the edification of “Lawyer” who appear to be a “friend of the Director F.B.I.” which he claims told him the “FBI did not investigate Obama.” You give away your age and lack of knowledge by using periods in the abbreviation FBI, It has always been known as FBI not F.B.I. I certainly would like to see your “HARD COPY STATEMENT”(whatever that means) you claim you received from the top G-man. BTW what's his name? Why don't you have it published by your Orly Taitz. You also appear to be high school drop out judging from your grammar. Apparently you cannot follow complex, compound sentences.
My advice: research and read: History of Soviet Espionage in the US; Robert Hansen, senior FBI agent, undetected for over twenty years as a spy for Soviet intelligence: ;Aldrich Ames, long time Soviet mole in the CIA; Julius and Ethel Rosenberg, who sold US atomic secrets to the Soviet; Alger Hiss, high state dept official, a communist mole; and espionage by numerous low ranking US military personnel. Also, Harold “Kim” Philby, high ranking British political figure, long time agent for the Soviets, and Richard Sorge, Soviet super spy, posing as a German journalist in Tokyo, Japan, during WWII. Espionage investigations costs the FBI and nation an estimated 100 Billion dollars per year. An FBI investigative guideline states: “ESPIONAGE CAN BE COMMITTED BY ANYONE.”
The FBI uses applicable federal laws, including Hobbs Act to investigate violations by public officials in federal, state and local governments. The 39th VP Spiro Agnew (Nixon's VP) was forced to resign on charges of extortion, tax fraud, conspiracy, but was allowed to plead no contest to a single count; and the pending case of Governor of Illinois Rod Blogovich. and also a sitting congressman.
The FBI considers its most sensitive and highest impact investigation is concentrated on public officials of the executive (White House) and legislative branches at both the national (Congress) and local levels. Public officials is meant as any person elected, appointed, employed or otherwise has a duty to maintain honest and faithful public service. There is very little public information of FBI investigations of VP/POTUS, probably because of the special protective shield required by the US Secret Service under its security requirements. There are six boxes FBI background investigations of candidate for VP Nelson Rockefellar in President Ford's library. Strict FOI laws are applicable.
Here's another tidbit. Before and after Dec 7, 1941, Gen Short and Admiral Kimmel, military commanders in Hawai; Edgar Hoover, FBI; and numerous other high military and civilian officials were never given access to “MAGIC,” the reading of Japanese diplomatic and Imperial Navy codes by US code breakers. VP Truman had no knowledge of the atom bomb until the death of FDR in April 12, 1945. He learned of its success in late July 1945, while meeting Winston Churchill and Joseph Stalin in Yalta. All this was based on “ThE NEED TO KNOW,” security protocol.
Also research National Security Directives, Executive Orders,and FBI web site in relation to security investigations and procedures.
Today there is tremendous awareness and strategic plans to defeat threats posed by foreign terrorists, domestic hate and fringe groups and therefore a strict conformance to all security laws and protocols are in effect. After reading all of the above, if you believe that the US still has such loose security allowing top politicians free or easy access to sensitive security information, then I have the Brooklyn Bridge to sell you.


RedGraham
Comment posted September 28, 2009 @ 6:36 pm

I really am getting sick of this “duly elected” stuff the anti-birthers are throwing around. I know McCain was a pretty lame candidate but ACORN & Move-0n.0rg is what got the Obama elected.


youmustbejoking
Comment posted September 28, 2009 @ 11:58 pm

Sorry RedGraham – don't care if you don;t like “duly elected” President Obama was elected by PEOPLE, citizens and adults of voting age who voted for him. ACORN and move-on didn't elect him, we did. And he had a lot of people voting for him. His inaugration was a sight to behold, with more people than Washington DC has ever seen at one time. The mall was packed with people wanting to see the most historic inaugration since the first one. No matter what you nutjobs say or do, we have elected a black man, and yes he was “duly elected” by the people of these United States. He is and will remain our president. There will be no removal from office or impeachment or any of the other things your oily taters keeps trying to claim. He is a natural born citizen of the United States and was elected by a majority of the people and he wone a large majority of the electoral college votes. End of your story- just the beginning of ours.


youmustbejoking
Comment posted September 28, 2009 @ 11:58 pm

Sorry RedGraham – don't care if you don;t like “duly elected” President Obama was elected by PEOPLE, citizens and adults of voting age who voted for him. ACORN and move-on didn't elect him, we did. And he had a lot of people voting for him. His inaugration was a sight to behold, with more people than Washington DC has ever seen at one time. The mall was packed with people wanting to see the most historic inaugration since the first one. No matter what you nutjobs say or do, we have elected a black man, and yes he was “duly elected” by the people of these United States. He is and will remain our president. There will be no removal from office or impeachment or any of the other things your oily taters keeps trying to claim. He is a natural born citizen of the United States and was elected by a majority of the people and he wone a large majority of the electoral college votes. End of your story- just the beginning of ours.


RedGraham
Comment posted September 29, 2009 @ 7:59 pm

As I mentioned previously I was very proud of my country for nominating a guy who is almost half-black over Hellary but then I found out about his birthplace/citizenship issues. That Constitutional requirement means more to me than any economic or healthcare issues.


RedGraham
Comment posted September 30, 2009 @ 7:07 am

So our history books will be full of lies just like in Russia.


mystylplx
Comment posted October 4, 2009 @ 7:01 am

He has no birthplace/citizenship issues other than those that were entirely invented by birthers. You obviously don't give a damn about the Constitution or you wouldn't be a birther.


RedGraham
Comment posted October 16, 2009 @ 7:53 am

When I joined the United States Army I had to show my original long form birth certificate.
When I became a police officer I had to show my original long form birth certificate.
I didn't point Army officials to some website with a jpeg image of what “appears” to be a certification of live birth document. Which by the way, is NOT valid evidence in any court of law that I know of.
Additionally, I didn't hire Perkins Coie to fight release of said long form and I didn't send DOJ lawyers to do the same thing.
If every soldier has to provide the original bc then the Commander in Chief should follow the same rules. that is unless he has something to hide.
Obama is hiding something.


mystylplx
Comment posted October 16, 2009 @ 8:11 am

Yeah well, yes… except you're completely full of crap.

No one gets their “original.” No state gives out the original; the best you get is a certified copy, which is exactly what Obama has shown. It's prima facie evidence in any court in the country, just exactly like a certified long form copy. It's the only kind of BC HI gives since the 80's, and they're not the only state that exclusively gives short forms. It's perfectly good enough to join the military with.

And if you were getting sued over these lies and BS you'd “send lawyers” too. That's what people do when they're being sued. That's how it works.


Majority Will
Comment posted October 16, 2009 @ 5:45 pm

Hawaii Health Department spokeswoman Janice Okubo is quoted as saying the department “does not have a short-form or long-form certificate …. [What Obama released] is the same certified copy everyone receives when they request a birth certificate.

You're a little, mad barking dog on a short chain.


Majority Will
Comment posted October 16, 2009 @ 5:46 pm

If I accused you of being a pedophile, would you hire a lawyer?


RedGraham
Comment posted October 17, 2009 @ 5:55 am

Obama has a way out of this. He could do the honorable thing and resign before any indictments making Biden the legal president. Biden could then pardon Obama of treason, falsifying documents, etc. Everybody wins except then that goofy Biden would be our prez. But oh well.
Judge sets court date in 'birther' case filed by Wiley Drake
By Bob Allen (from The Examiner)
Thursday, September 10, 2009
BUENA PARK, Calif. (ABP) — The so-called “Birthers” claimed a small victory Sept. 8 when a federal judge set a tentative trial date of Jan. 26, 2010, for a lawsuit claiming that President Obama is constitutionally ineligible for his office.
“We won again,” Wiley Drake, a former second vice president of the Southern Baptist Convention, said of the ruling by federal judge David Carter. Drake is one of several plaintiffs in the lawsuit alleging that Obama cannot hold his office because he does not meet the constitutional requirement that the president be a “natural-born” citizen.


RedGraham
Comment posted October 17, 2009 @ 7:17 am

When people are being sued for something they are not guilty of the say “go ahead and try to sue me” and don't hire anybody to do anything.


RedGraham
Comment posted October 17, 2009 @ 7:19 am

Keep telling yourself that nonsense and who knows, maybe you can convince those who really don't want to know the truth anyway. Like Hitler said “The bigger the lie the more people will believe it.”


mystylplx
Comment posted October 17, 2009 @ 8:49 am

That's one of the stupidest things you've said yet. People who respond that way to getting sued, or being charged with something, lose the case, whether they are guilty or not. 100%. Sometimes they even lose the case even if they do hire a lawyer, whether they are guilty or not. It happens all the time.


mystylplx
Comment posted October 17, 2009 @ 8:54 am

Obama does have a way out of this. It's called, “ignore the nutjobs.” Seems to be working just fine. Let his lawyers do their jobs while he's busy running the country. That's as it should be.

Birthers are irrelevant. Not even gadflies because gadflies are at least able to get your attention. Obama isn't even giving birthers that much.


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Iriewilkinson
Comment posted September 10, 2010 @ 3:55 am

So, now that you see just how non historic the election of the first black president was, how much of a continuity with his predecessor, whom I guess you see as a lily white bumpkin racist, what do you think?

I know youmustbejoking will never read this all these months on and I speak as a liberal here who doesn't see anything in the tea party but neocon republicanism.

Yet, even if you voted for obama as a liberala and all that, you must be getting pretty tired of sanctifying him and going on about how historic his election is, seeing as he's an incompetent conservative that spits in your liberal eye in favor corporatist war mongering, huh?

But odn't expect a liberal to change their mind based on facts, they have more ideology than any “nutjobs”.


youmustbejoking
Comment posted September 10, 2010 @ 5:03 am

I'm not sure how you come to the conclusion that the election and inauguration was “non-historic”. The first time we do something different, i.e. electing a black man, it is historic. Just because you don't like his politics doesn't mean it is any less historic.

I think the president has done a great deal in his short time in office but I am not blind to the things that haven't changed. I also think there are plenty of things we don't know that compels a president to act/do in a certain manner. I wish the president would quit trying to be bipartisan because the right will never work with his administration in an open and honest manner because they don't give a flying flip about the people that are suffering in this country- they have proven that over and over.

I do not and have never “sanctified” the president but I know he isn't an “incompetent conservative” and he inherited two wars that he must deal with. I don't have to like war to know that we can't just cut and run just because we have a new president in office. I think he has a very difficult road and I believe none of us really know what a person faces when they are elected to the office of the President of the United States. I have watched quite a few presidents go through the office in my years on this earth and I have watched them all age before their time with the weight of the office.

Have you stopped to consider what could be being accomplished if the republicans would work with the democrats and the administration instead of just saying no?

Of course, this article was about was about the “birthers”- who won't be satisfied no matter what evidence is presented about the presidents birth. For them I said he is the duly elected president- elected by the people. They need to shut up and go away. We are tired of hearing from tin foil hat people.


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Comment posted April 26, 2011 @ 3:12 pm

Camille Paglia is in deep denial. The evidence is clear — and mounting — that the “birthers” are indeed motivated by bigotry, not just racial animus against the nation’s first black president, but also by a misplaced Islamophobic bias, based on the false belief that the president is a Muslim.

That the “birthers” continue to wage their jihad against the president in spite of all their claims against him being thoroughly debunked — still insisting that Obama was born in Kenya when, in fact, his mother never set foot anywhere on the African continent — should by now tell all but the most dim-witted that these people simply cannot countenance a black man being president of the United States.

Then there are poll after poll after poll revealing that the “birthers” are almost exclusively white, predominantly male and most heavily concentrated in the South. That they are also overwhelmingly Republican is beside the point.


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“We won again,” Wiley Drake, a former second vice president of the
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 B.S.! Judge Carter THREW OUT Drake’s lawsuit!


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