Liz Cheney Sympathizes With the Birthers

By
Wednesday, July 22, 2009 at 9:48 am

Joan Walsh saw this last night: Liz Cheney, the most famous former principal deputy assistant secretary of state for near eastern affairs in American history, appeared on Larry King’s CNN show and fielded a question about the Obama birth certificate conspiracies.

Her first response, after being shown a video of a birther screaming at Rep. Mike Castle (R-Del.), and after James Carville suggested it was a problem for Republicans: “I think that the Democrats have got more crazies than the Republicans do.” Then she excused the birth conspiracy theories by bashing the president. The whole transcript is worth reading, as Carville and King give Cheney multiple attempts to crawl back out of the fever swamp. (UPDATE: Here’s the video.)

CHENEY: But setting that aside, I think that — you know, one of the reasons I think you see people so concerned about this, I think that, you know, this issue is people are uncomfortable with having, for the first time ever, I think, a president who seems so reluctant to defend the nation overseas; a president who sits through completely venomous screed by Daniel Ortega and then his only response, when the United States has been hostilely attacked, is to say, hey, you know, basically, I was only there at the time.

CARVILLE: That’s so…

CHENEY: And, you know, we’ve seen this — James, don’t interrupt me.

CARVILLE: Sure…

CHENEY: We’ve seen this again and again and again, where this president seems to sort of want to…

KING: But what does…

CHENEY: …create moral equivalence.

KING: …that have to — are you saying that…

CHENEY: I think it makes people…

KING: Are you saying because he’s a Kenyan?

CHENEY: No, I’m not saying that.

KING: Oh.

CHENEY: I’m saying that people are fundamentally uncomfortable…

KING: The question was about (INAUDIBLE).

CHENEY: …and they’re fundamentally, I think, increasingly uncomfortable with an American president who seems to be afraid to defend America.

KING: All right…

CHENEY: Who seems to be afraid to stand up for what we believe in.

KING: All right, James, do you want to answer that?

CARVILLE: Yes, I do.

CHENEY: And I think that the kind of thing that you saw…

KING: All right, let him answer, Liz.

CARVILLE: Again, you know…

CHENEY: …is indicative of sort of a general…

KING: James, go ahead.

(LAUGHTER)

CHENEY: …feeling of discomfort.

KING: Again, Liz, let him answer.

James, go ahead.

CARVILLE: Yes, I guess we’re supposed to — a volume of words I certainly lost.

(LAUGHTER)

CARVILLE: But again, these people…

CHENEY: I’m quality too, James.

CARVILLE: …again.

CHENEY: But go ahead. Sorry.

CARVILLE: You’re right. I’ve been accused of hurling facts around.

Let me hurl a fact around. These people are poor — these poor pathetic people are believing stuff, just like — just like Ms. Cheney tonight. She refuses to say this is ludicrous because she actually wants to encourage these people to believe this. It’s just a simple thing. This is a nutty thing. There’s nothing to this. I disagree with this president’s policies.

They can’t say that. They can’t say that because…

CHENEY: James, I am…

CARVILLE: …they’re scared they’ll lose the…

CHENEY: …I — James, sorry…

CARVILLE: …this sort of nut wing of their party.

CHENEY: Sorry, James.

KING: We’re out of time, guys.

(CROSSTALK)

CARVILLE: That’s their problem.

CHENEY: I am more concerned — James, I think that there’s plenty…

KING: We’re going to have you back.

(LAUGHTER)

CHENEY: …to be concerned about with this president.

CARVILLE: Right.

CHENEY: And I think that…

KING: All right…

CHENEY: …we’ve got to look forward in terms of…

(CROSSTALK)

CHENEY: …the things that he’s doing to the country going forward…

(CROSSTALK)

KING: All right. Thanks, guys.

CHENEY: …the direction he’s going to take us in.

KING: James Carville and Liz Cheney. By the way, Liz, quickly, are you going to run for office?

If Republicans actually punished this sort of shameless apologizing for conspiracy theories — and for excusing reservists who refuse to obey orders from their president because they believe in those conspiracy theories — all this talk of Cheney running for office will be a joke.

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Comments

91 Comments

Mini-Cheney Supports Birthers « David Pleasant
Pingback posted July 22, 2009 @ 11:05 am

[...] a comment » It certainly should come as no surprise that Liz Cheney supports the birthers. That is one evil [...]


robertfromphila
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 2:11 pm

Right wing nuts, whose leadership is summarized by having spokesmen like Dick and Liz Cheney, and Rush Limbaugh, and Glen Beck, etc are all for Free Speech, but only as long as they're not drowning you out.


rickahyatt
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 2:29 pm

Where's The Birth Certificate?


PowayOldTimer
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 2:31 pm

Liz Cheney interrupts everybody else and then tells them not to interrupt her.
It is hard to respect someone who shows no respect to others.


Hiltop04
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:33 pm

Question for any birther,

I don’t have my original BC anymore (left it in California by mistake after college), but I got a certified copy of my BC from my state (NY) which is no where near as detailed as my original BC was…am I still a citizen?

Also, the hospital I was born in (Cumberland in Fort Greene, Brooklyn) doesn’t exist anymore, so does that mean I was never actually born?


rickahyatt
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 2:37 pm

From Red China to the infiltrators & traitors here, do the Socialist Democrats attack with vehemence those they cannot win the argument with. It's always some branch of “Mental Health” attack, as in “Right Wing Nuts.”


mantis
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 2:47 pm

Where's your brain?


revjmike
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 2:59 pm

As far as I know there is no Socialist Democrat party here in the USA. In fact, right now we have a congress and president who tend to be a little bit right of center much of the time, though left of center in some areas as well.

As for the crazy “birthers,” how can you argue with someone who “knows for sure” what isn't true at all?


The Birthers: Who Are They, and What Do They Want? [Conspiracies] | Newstion.com
Pingback posted July 22, 2009 @ 4:02 pm

[...] to keep the base riled up, and maybe to win the attention of a few more suckers. From Lou Dobbs to Liz Cheney to Camile Paglia to Sean Hannity, hacks who don’t give a shit will throw the birthers a bone [...]


vwcat
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:06 pm

One, Cheney says the birthers are just very concerned about this president. As someone pointed out on another site, the birthers began long before the election!

Two, I do hope Cheney continues to embrace them. She is doing so for cynical reasons – a chip off the ol' block. But, doing so makes her seem a bit too fringe and loony to the majority of Americans.


mortimerpeacock
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:06 pm

I'm happy to argue, Rick.

What's your evidence that Obama was born in Kenya?

Do the birth announcements in 2 Honolulu newspapers not convince you that Obama was born in Honolulu? What about the birth certificate he released during the campaign?

Can ANY concrete evidence convince you that Obama's an American citizen, or are you having too much fun with this nonsense to ever give it up?


kathleenhusseininmaine
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:07 pm

The woman will not be interrupted, nor will she STFU.

rickahyatt, you can't disprove a negative. People think right-wing birthers are nuts because they are obsessed with this to the point of hysteria. Did you HEAR the woman in Delaware? She's beside herself.

Liz Cheney is a cooler customer, but she's just as rabid.


rickahyatt
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:16 pm

It's not called the “Socialist” Democrat Party, it just IS.
My brain's right here, thank you, and my background is a life in espionage and Military Intelligence, thank you. http://www.rickhyatt.freeservers.com
And to tell it to you straight, the CIA knew in 1977 about the overall economic and infiltration agenda the other side has had since then, and counter-run it. This is probably, for most of you, the only “America” you even know. I was ordered to remember, and was sent to ground with this secret of just how young they groomed their future (Economic in this case) “Manchurian Candidates.” And the Socialist State of Hawaii (They are half-way to Red China in EVERY way you can think of) gladly came up with their “CLB” to convenience this current convenient dissolution of the Constitution. Even then the argument was about letting foreign Asians into the country through this method of rubber-stamping foreign BC's, and it could lead even to this current dilemma. A CLB is NOT a BC! The bottom line is, simply so WHERE'S THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE? This is but a convenient way, I'm sorry to disappoint you for the Powers Who Be to lure out all the moles, and then pull the rug out from under The Big O. As for Congress, Gary Condit was another known infiltrator with his “Disposal For Hire” services that got him into, and out of, Congress. As the curtain now comes down with the failed KGB-type institutionalizing of “National Health Care Police,” you see the rats scurry to jump ship. It IS The Big O's “Waterloo,” and I LIKE THAT.


PolishBear
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:22 pm

ALSO:
There are plenty of people who believe that the Apollo moon landing were an elaborate hoax.
There are plenty of people who believe that the Earth is only 6,000 years old.
There are plenty of people who believe that they'll be raptured up to Heaven in their lifetimes.
There are plenty of people who believe that human beings walked side by side with dinosaurs.

And what saddest of all is that MOST of these people reside in the United States, supposedly the most advanced country in the world. Go figure.


jbnt729
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:25 pm

Chris Matthews showed it last night on TV. Here's another article from snopes.com

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcerti…

This is obviously a non-issue for any rational person. For the utterly crazy people out there, such as the screaming ranting woman at the town hall meeting it doesn't matter how many times facts are shown to her.


rickahyatt
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:25 pm

Again, you've proven my point. Just as in Red China, the government pays hordes of netizens to reach out and drum down political opposition at web sites – And usually by attaching their “Mental Status.” The country is full of “Mental Health Prisons” for the dissidents, and that's what they have institutionalized in the US, formerly the free-est country in the world.
You probably have little idea of military history, but try to image a country so split by civil war beliefs that brother would fight brother. Do you think that they, or in any other war, did that with calm minds? So, grassroots Americans are seeing what's being taken from them at the top by corruption, murder, deceit and spycraft, and are finally rising up in great emotion. That's called “Patriotism,” by the way. There's a saying, “If it doesn't work in the ballot box, and if not in the jury box, then it's the bullet box.” The Big O couldn't have done the country a bigger accomplishment than that in which he has done to awaken the Sleeping Giant – Hence, who then, does control him, whether he knows it or not?


strangely_enough
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:27 pm

Defending torture and the lunatic “birther” fringe. What the hell is wrong with the Cheney family? It's like the Manson family of American politics.


strangely_enough
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:29 pm

You are nuts.


jbnt729
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:30 pm

rich,

Do you know what other crazies people like you have something in common with? The people that think 911 was an inside job by the Bush administration and that the Holocaust never happened.

You are demanding the birth certificate eventhough any sane person know that it is non-issue.

Perhaps you can give those people that think Bush was behind 911 evidence that he wasn't?


Birther Scorecard « One Utah
Pingback posted July 22, 2009 @ 4:39 pm

[...] Liz Cheney, former State Department official and daughter of Dick Cheney [...]


cinderellafe
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 3:51 pm

Yes. Any certified birth certificate will show the date, time, weight, size, doctor, hospital, etc. on it. Obama's doesn't have this information. In fact, Obama is spending money on lawyers to not release his certified birth certificate. I understand redacting secret information but if Congress can debate on what 'is' is, then why can't America see the original document? If Obama wants to ever claim the most transparent administration evah!!!11!!!1 then he must do this. Simple.

I know I had to go back to the DMV in Maryland 3 times with more documentation and divorce papers to get my license. While Obama hasn't released his school or college, visa, and medical records, it seems un-American to fight Americans asking for the one document to verify a requirement of the Constitution. This story has all the makings to end up in the National Enquirer but then again, they broke the story about Edwards affair, child, campaign money bribes, campaign staffers silence, wife's participation in cover up, etc. Funny how partisan media look now crying wolf.


marvinthalenbergmd
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 4:07 pm

See,in 1961 a group of conspirators knew that a newborn baby , black and with a Muslim name, was going to be elected president of the United States 46 years later.. So they took his 18 year old mother on a journey half way around the world to have a baby in a primitive country with no hospitals(by turbojet, by the way)and then flew her back.
They forgot that since his mther is was an American citizen, the baby to be president is too.


PaulB
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 4:12 pm

Not to be picky but there's an error in the transcript above. The transcript quotes Cheney paraphrasing Obama: “…when the United States has been hostilely attacked, is to say, hey, you know, basically, I was only there at the time.” What she said (and what Obama said) was “I was only three at the time.” In this case the typo totally changes the meaning of the sentence.


Wendy
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 4:13 pm

I do not know where this man obama or whatever his name is was born.
I do know, it was not at either of the two hospitals in Honolulu. No hospital now claims his birth and no one can find any attending hospital personal, even after a reward was offered!
This man came to power within the chicago thug machinery, plain and simple. (plus funded by the good islamists).


jjfitz
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 4:20 pm

Obama is black. Obama is a Democrat. Obama is the President. Most voters know that your real issue is one of the previous.

Most Americans don't want to live in your new world order dystopia. Random fact for ya. The voters will never come to care about the importance of your make-pretend important questions and ever-moving hate-motivated requirements.

Here's how it's going to go down: Either President Obama will leave office at the hand of the voters or the 22nd amendment. Get used to it.


jenny
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 4:22 pm

Wow Rick, that was beautiful. What street corner do you regularly preach from, I'd like to come by and check out your act.


benwha
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 4:52 pm

The Birther movement – the greatest thing ever conceived by the democratic party. yes I mean the democratic party. They were smart enough to subversivly manipulate the far right wingers into believe Obama's citizenship is questionable. Therefore, as their rhetoric grows, the republicans look more and more anti-reflective of the American citizenship as a whole. It causes them to look racist, etc.

It is genius, pure genius.


Matt Taylor
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 5:07 pm

Cheney family members have long since believed that the rules should only apply to everyone else.


mantis
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 5:11 pm

Wow, nice website. You might be the craziest birther yet. This guy actually believes he is a East German Stasi Manchurian Candidate. Seriously, this is the title of his website:

I am STASI Markus Wolf's genetically engineered son, a designed Manchurian Candidate with Celiac's Disease, originally targeted to communize inheritance rights, but turned in the '70's by the CIA to lure Wolf to the West. This culminates now with the overall Obama Agenda to take over our country at the top by such means of infiltration. Now that the 4th of July is over, we'll see some real fireworks in D.C. because of me.

And the page description:

Rick A Hyatt is STASI Markus Wolf's genetically engineered eldest son and 'Double-Blind Manchurian Candidate Study' subject. I was originally designed by he to be used against inheritance legal loopholes that would have been used by the Obama Administration to communize property rights. But turned in '77 by the CIA to prove to Congress such could exist within Congress itself.”

Craziest birther evah.


LaLee
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 5:13 pm

You said: “No hospital now claims his birth and no one can find any attending hospital personal, even after a reward was offered!”

AHEM.

The Buffalo News, January 20, 2009:
“When Barack Hussein Obama places his hand on the Bible today to take the oath of office as 44th president of the United States, Barbara Nelson of Kenmore will undoubtedly think back to the day he was born. It was Aug. 4, 1961, at Kapi’olani Medical Center for Women & Children in Honolulu.”

http://www.buffalonews.com/494/story/554495.html


The Birthers: Who Are They and What Do They Want? « Famous Celebrity News
Pingback posted July 22, 2009 @ 6:19 pm

[...] to keep the base riled up, and maybe to win the attention of a few more suckers. From Lou Dobbs to Liz Cheney to Camile Paglia to Sean Hannity, hacks who don’t give a shit will throw the birthers a bone [...]


LaLee
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 5:19 pm

Hey can i see your birth certificate which shows “the date, time, weight, size, doctor, hospital, etc. on it”?

“I know I had to go back to the DMV in Maryland 3 times with more documentation and divorce papers to get my license.”

I don't know what DMV you went to but when i go to get my drivers license i don't have to have or bring “long form” BC.

“While Obama hasn't released his school or college, visa, and medical records, it seems un-American to fight Americans asking for the one document to verify a requirement of the Constitution.”

It's also UN-AMERICAN TO ASK SOMEONE'S PRIVATE RECORDS WITHOUT LEGAL AUTHORITY OR SUBPOENA.


slimslowslider
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 5:26 pm

Holy wow. Amazing. Please elect this man president of Birferville (sorry Orly, but you ain't a natural born citizen)… More blinking!


jjfitz
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 5:44 pm

Wow. I had to vote up your post for being brave enough to wade thru that long enough to report that much back here. The site was so batcrap crazy that I had to run out and buy ten more guns.


mantis
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 5:50 pm

Well, I noticed that the page title was longer than would displayed, and curiously started with “I am STASI Markus Wolf's genetically engineered son,” so I just had to look at the source code and see the rest. I didn't read much past the title and description as the page itself was clearly that of a lunatic. It had all the telltale signs: varying font size and color, lots of all caps writing, blinking text, tons of exclamation points, and it looks like one huge unorganized screed. Why do all crazy people's websites look the same? Is there a free “Web Design for the Deranged” course available somewhere?


jjfitz
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 5:56 pm

I'm aghast at this one. I just never saw any site like that. It makes PrisonPlanet look like the New York Times.


jjfitz
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 6:02 pm

I'm no linguist Rick, but is bullet box some sort of veiled threat?


The Birthers: Who Are They and What Do They Want? [Conspiracies] | eMediaOne
Pingback posted July 22, 2009 @ 8:01 pm

[...] to keep the base riled up, and maybe to win the attention of a few more suckers. From Lou Dobbs to Liz Cheney to Camile Paglia to Sean Hannity, hacks who don’t give a shit will throw the birthers a bone [...]


brendanm
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 7:24 pm

But why would anyone want to divorce you?


disbar_the_birfoon_lawyer
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 7:31 pm

Wow…Republican Party…self-destructing.

It is a beautiful, beautiful thing!


disbar_the_birfoon_lawyer
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 7:35 pm

Dave…GREAT SHOWING ON MSNBC LAST NIGHT!!!!!

BRAVO…BRAVO…BRAVO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Keep us the amazing work…you have a TON of support! (all of us at politijab.com, for starters)


jenny
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 8:55 pm

Dude– you gotta check out rick hyatt's webpage (see his post above)– pure batcrap crazy. Schizophrenia makes curious specimens.


jenny
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 9:00 pm

Even if Obama were to come to your house and show you his birth certificate, and have ten witnesses to the birth, and show you the notice of birth from the Hawaiian newspapers, AND a republican Justice of the Peace from Hawaii to confirm that “yes it is a real birth certificate”, you STILL wouldnt believe.

So you can stop asking a question to which you can never receive a satisfactory answer.


rickahyatt
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 10:45 pm

Sounds to me that you're pursuing an argument for deliberate espionage intervention in paving his “Perfect Legend,” or believe that it's simply identity theft. In that case, what did they do to the poor Barry Soetono, and what is The Big O's real name?
NOTHING you can say to me or as if about me will detract me from remembering what I was ordered to remember in 1977: That there were three major from-young groomed operatives key to infiltration of the Congress & the Presidency & destruction of Property Rights; Gary Condit, a Barry Soetono, and ME. As the illegitimate son of former East German Stasi General Markus Wolf, was I BRED to be the perfect spy; Utilized in an attempt to get at a soldier's inheritance, and would have subsequently been legal precedence in an inheritance case known as “Chris S.” Further, I've been the poster boy the SDem's have long believed to be their blackmail power over the Conservatives in the “Nationalized Health Care Mind Police” Coup D'Grace of our capitalism – and that has to do with my '70's involvement with CIA GHW Bush, as I was used to lure Wolf to the West.
Google for my site on freeservers if you wish – But just know this:
I'm not sure if you can read all that well, so just LOOK AT THE PRETTY PICTURES… on my site.


mortimerpeacock
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 10:55 pm

I rest my case. The man's paranoiac modern-day Bircher. Or a dumb cracker that can't deal with a black president (against whom I have my own criticisms, none of which have to do with birth certificates).


captainsteve
Comment posted July 22, 2009 @ 11:07 pm

I saw obama throw a baseball and bowl 37. No way is he an American!

OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE!!!!!


The Birthers: Who Are They and What Do They Want? | Pop News Daily
Pingback posted July 23, 2009 @ 12:11 am

[...] to keep the base riled up, and maybe to win the attention of a few more suckers. From Lou Dobbs to Liz Cheney to Camile Paglia to Sean Hannity, hacks who don’t give a shit will throw the birthers a bone [...]


24AheadDotCom
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 12:07 am

Oddly enough, Weigel has repeatedly refused to respond to all the interesting things about this issue. For instance, last week, CNN's Kitty Pilgrim said (transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0907/17/ldt.01.html):

The Republican governor of Hawaii, Linda Lingle, on record, she says Obama was indeed born in her state…

Can anyone find anything at all that backs up that statement?

I'm going to reiterate what I said at the link: Pilgrim is a liar.

Now, instead of posting yet another content-free insult, you can actually do CNN a good turn – and make me look bad – by finding any form of valid documentation – i.e., a clear statement directly from HI's governor – that matches CNN's claim.

Note: I'm not talking about hearsay or a distorted AP report. I mean, find the actual original documentation of HI's gov. “validating” BHO's cert as CNN claimed. That must be an actual original quote from HI's gov in which she said anything like that.

Note: The 10/31 statement from the HI DOH doesn't qualify, since it's not from HI's governor.


24AheadDotCom
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 12:08 am

Wikipedia, Snopes, and even Obama himself can't make up their minds on which hospital he was born in. The people who claim to know for a fact where he was born can't even get his birth hospital straight.


birfers are dumber than dumb
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 1:49 am

Oddly enough, you're a crazy birfer asshole.


JohnC
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 2:09 am

The implication you're making is that Linda Lingle wouldn't have made the statement because she's in on the fraud, too. Let's see now, the conspiracy includes the president, his administration, the media, the entire Hawaii government, the manufacturers of the microfiche of the Honolulu Star-Bulletin and the Honolulu Advertiser, and Hawaiian hospitals and libraries. Or, alternatively there is no conspiracy because the facts are exactly as they are portrayed. I'll take what's behind Door Number 2.


JohnC
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 2:10 am

What for? Like that is going to stop a single conspiracy theory…


JohnC
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 2:12 am

I think its actually quite disturbing. The Republican Party is going down the tubes because it is increasingly viewed as home of the Know-Nothings and people who have at best a tenuous grasp on reality.


JohnC
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 2:14 am

Not releasing his long-form birth certificate – when we all know damn well what it says – may be the most brilliant thing Obama has ever done. He's giving the birthers enough rope to hang themselves, and they're jumping at the bait.


captainsteve
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 2:26 am

well then at least drop the charade of him representing everyone and being a uniter. i'll fight him EVERY step of his time as a usurper in chief.


JohnC
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 2:27 am

Actually, I will do something rare and take the side of the birthers on this single point. If – and that's an awfully big IF – Obama was born outside the United States, there is a strong argument that Obama would not be a citizen by birth under the law as it is currently construed. Under the laws of the time (1961), as the sole U.S. citizen parent of Obama, Stanley Ann Dunham (Obama's mother) would have to have been a resident of the United States for at least five years after the age of fourteen. She was eighteen years old at the time of her son's birth. Although the law was supposed to ensure that the citizen parent had some connection to the United States beyond his or her childhood, the unintended consequence was to mathematically prevent persons under the age of 19 from conferring the citizenship to their child, even if they had otherwise lived their entire life in the United States save for the moment of birth to the child.

This seems like an absurd result, and in 1986 the law was changed but not made retroactive. Athough a couple courts have upheld the tough-luck 19-year limit, I doubt that a court would overturn an election based upon the absurd result of a poorly-written law. Of course, in the extremely unlikely case that a court were inclined to do such a thing, Congress would certainly step in an change the law, just as they appeared ready to act last year to ensure John McCain was eligible to be President.

Unlike McCain, however, there is no serious evidence that Obama was born outside of the United States, rendering this argument one big hypothetical at best. There are no serious legal arguments for the proposition that a person born on U.S. soil is not a natural born citizen. Since Obama was born in Hawaii, he is a natural born citizen.


JohnC
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 2:34 am

This type of paranoid pseudo-reasoning reminds me of the conspiracy theory that Denver International Airport is a monument to the New World Order, with its underground structures standing ready to exterminate the masses.

You think I'm kidding? Conspiracy theorists have even made a video about it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tmy0PMgm-Q0

There is simply no end to the craziness out there. As H.L. Mencken once said, “No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of Americans.”


mantis
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 2:59 am

Dave Weigel answer for CNN this instant!


JohnC
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 3:26 am

Well you obviously can't please people who think you're some fraudulent phony. But I do think Obama can serve to unite rational people.


rickahyatt
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 3:32 am

I rest my case ditto: When the Acorn CHICOM netizen hordes of PC correctors cannot win the argument, they attack with “Mental Illness” accusations like “Paranoid” like this Acorner has slandered me with.
Thank you for so kindly being so obvious.


captainsteve
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 3:35 am

He can't please me? Why do you make claims that are untrue?

He can please me. He can STOP HIDING AND SHOW THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE!!!!! He can demonstrate that he is constitutionally eligible as a NATURAL-BORN citizen to be potus.

He obviously is ether a fraud or doesn't care a rip about me. You appear to be in that same camp. Forget the law. Forget the evidence, just call me a kook, and hope it goes away.


rogerg
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 4:09 am

I too have lived an exciting life of espionage. In my spare time, I advised my good friend Sly Stallone on how to rescue our POWs kept by communist fiends in the documentary, Rambo II. Professionally, though, you'll find I singlehandedly defeated the whole north vietnamese army in 1971 simply by seeding the ho chi minh trail with very sticky bubblegum. Espionage is like that. Sometimes, simple is genius. Of course, it was all fouled up by communists back in D.C., but that is another story.

One of the things that gets me hot under the collar is the way the pinko press publicizes these “birther” people. Again, my years of espionage experience serve me in good stead, and I am one hundred percent sure that “birth” had nothing to do with Barry Hussein. Rather, you will find he is a cleverly put together robot. The truth is, he wasn't born at all! But is the media, which goes into the garbage when it comes to looking for spots on a true american heroine, Sarah Palin, a non-quitter if there ever was one – will that so called media ask whether it is true that there are little screws behind Obama's ears? No. A thousand times no, because they come to bury liberty, not defend it. These so called birthers make me sick because they simply are more of the same old same old screen. I saw it a million times in Nam. I'd be coming up with brilliant plans – for instance, using rubber cement fumes to make old charlie mass hallucinate, from stragegically placed 50 gallon tubs – and communist higher ups were always countermanding me. It made me sick!!!!
So let's have a real investigation. Ask Obama to calculate Hamiltonian fluxions. He will, of course, be able to do it super fast – superhuman fast – because he is nothing more than a robot with a 5 gigabyte motherboard for a brain. As for who put him together – well, just ask who killed Vince Foster, will you? Or are you to afraid to face the truth!
Commander Spence “Dogspit” O'Reilly.


Matt Taylor
Comment posted July 23, 2009 @ 4:18 am

Yeah how dare they let your lack of evidence, outrageous accusations and complete unwillingness to accept any facts contrary to your bigotries interfere with debating your lies calmly and rationally?


joydegraffenreid
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 3:02 am

Liz, if you think Obama was not born a US citizen because he is black then you should show the world your penis because you are not a woman! Why do you want to be a white man who hates humanity? You need to shut the f up because you embarrase women and humantiy.


Anonymous
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:49 am

Your post is so full of bullshit that it’s difficult to read it close up because of the nauseating smell.

Let’s just take the most obvious part. Link, please, to the alleged Congressional debate over the definition of “is?” Oh, you just threw that in there for dramatic effect?

Great, thanks. Makes it easier to understand the rest of the hysterical nonsense in your post.

One more thing. Please post the birth certificate you used to get those divorce papers. Along with proof that you didn’t forge it. Don’t use forged proof. We can tell.


Anonymous
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:55 am

One question, rick…

Have you considered actually reading what people write, instead of listening to the comic-book hero voices in your head?

You were asked for evidence to support the contention that President Obama was born in Kenya, etc.

How did that come across to you as “an argument for deliberate espionage intervention in paving his ‘Perfect Legend…’”

Seriously, this is why people invented ad hominem attacks. Trying to ask a serious question just to humor you in the throes of your conspiracy theory ends up getting you to respond with gibberish about international espionage. Gadzooks.

Get help. Or start putting cereal in your sugar in the mornings, kiddo.


The Birthers: Who Are They and What Do They Want? | ExclusiveRumors.com
Pingback posted July 24, 2009 @ 6:55 am

[...] to keep the base riled up, and maybe to win the attention of a few more suckers. From Lou Dobbs to Liz Cheney to Camile Paglia to Sean Hannity, hacks who don’t give a shit will throw the birthers a bone [...]


stephenperry
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:13 am

The best part of the transcript is where Liz Cheney says “I'm quality too, James.” The transcript does not record whether she sniffed at the end of the sentence to indicate how hurt she was.

If she really was “quality” she wouldn't have gone on TV and excused a conspiracy theory while simultaneously bashing the sitting President. A guy who, by the way, had that very day extended her father's Secret Service protection for another 6 months, which is unheard of for a former VP (particularly given that no other VP even got SS protection as FORMER VP's).

I wonder what “quality” means to Liz Cheney? Not what it means to me.


stephenperry
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:17 am

But JohnC, if we keep opening Door Number 1 over and over again, we'll eventually get to go inside. And then go inside Door Number 1A. And then 1B, 1C and so forth.

Door 1N leads us to the airport terminal, where we all get to go to Oahu and watch Geraldo open the Birth Certificate Vault to find out there's nothing in there, just like with Al Capone.

Except a birth certificate that says some black kid with a funny name was born in Hawaii a long time ago. Which, of course, we already knew.

But still, Oahu! I'm overdue for vacation. Let's string this thing out.


stephenperry
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:19 am

Yeah? Well I live in California, and I've been to flyover country. No way is this land just made up of Baywatch types. Careful with your snark. I'm sure, for example, that you'd humiliate yourself in any athletic endeavor whatsoever.

And besides, he's President of the United States. He can suck at baseball and bowling all he wants. You suck at those things and you're not President of your own homeowners' association.


stephenperry
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:21 am

Hey, you may want to go see JohnC. He said something about looking behind Door Number 2 that you may be able to apply here.


stephenperry
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:30 am

My vote goes for nominating Judge Sonia Sotomayor to the Supreme Court.

That was a win-win-win.

She's eminently qualified, and a woman, and a Latina.

Even if the GOP had laid rose petals at her feet, it would be a huge win for Obama (amplified by the rose petals and assorted glowing things they could have said).

But when the GOP showed its ass and made it look like they viewed her as a disobedient little girl who needed a talking-to about her manners, and a racist herself for being on the board of the Puerto Rican Legal Defense Foundation, then they just may as well have handed her a broom and dustpan, called every Latino and Latina a wetback and been done with it a lot easier.

Look for Obama to “sweep up” among the Latino vote both in mid-terms for fellow Democrats and himself in 2012.

I'd be shocked if the GOP didn't permanently alienate a significant share of the Hispanic population that ALREADY hadn't crossed the GOP off the list. I grew up in Albuquerque and went to college and law school in Los Angeles. I don't think it's a stretch to say I understand what values most Hispanic people have. Hard work, love of family, and pride in accomplishment, like most everybody else. And Judge Sotomayor had her family there and they were obviously proud of her for her hard work and achievement. And then the GOP stuck it to her, knowing it didn't even have the votes to make any sort of difference to her ascension to the bench?

Piss-poor. Just inexcusable. And everyone I know, Latino or otherwise, sees it pretty much the same way.

But yeah, holding onto the vaulted-original is also a nice touch. As is the White House Press Secretary's habit of calling on the guy from WND once in a while to lighten the mood by having him ask nutball conspiracy theory questions about this stupid non-issue.


stephenperry
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:33 am

Very good catch; I wondered about that. Thanks.


stephenperry
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:37 am

lol @ “blinking text”

What, wasn't the all-caps writing, replete with extra exclamation points, enough to grab the eye?

Please tell me there's audio, too. And a mission statement.


stephenperry
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:43 am

“the government pays hordes of netizens to reach out and drum down political opposition at web sites”

See, that's where you lost me. Batshit. Crazy. Everything else you say is something I don't want to step in or I'll track it all over my carpet.


stephenperry
Comment posted July 24, 2009 @ 10:46 am

Hey JohnC, I think it was “the masses,” not “Americans.” Big difference.

Let's check with Tuci78. He fancies himself something of a Mencken enthusiast…


liz cheney
Pingback posted August 30, 2009 @ 1:45 pm

[...] Full Feed from HuffingtonPost.com – http://www.huffingtonpost.com/raw_feed_index.rdf|||The Washington Independent » Liz Cheney Sympathizes With the BirthersJoan Walsh saw this last night: Liz Cheney, the most famous former principal deputy assistant [...]


rick133333
Comment posted August 30, 2009 @ 3:36 pm

I spent 3 years in the US MARINE CORPS from 1966-1969 and I find it offensive that Lizzy Cheney thinks she is a patriotic American because she wears a flag pin on her lapel.What a CROCK !!!!! Join the Marine Corps Lizzy and then we will talk.


liz cheney – ???
Pingback posted August 31, 2009 @ 12:15 am

[...] Full Feed from HuffingtonPost.com – http://www.huffingtonpost.com/raw_feed_index.rdf|||The Washington Independent » Liz Cheney Sympathizes With the BirthersJoan Walsh saw this last night: Liz Cheney, the most famous former principal deputy assistant [...]


liz cheney – ???
Pingback posted August 31, 2009 @ 12:15 am

[...] Full Feed from HuffingtonPost.com – http://www.huffingtonpost.com/raw_feed_index.rdf|||The Washington Independent » Liz Cheney Sympathizes With the BirthersJoan Walsh saw this last night: Liz Cheney, the most famous former principal deputy assistant [...]


A U.S. Congresswoman is a “birther” | Factonista
Pingback posted September 9, 2009 @ 6:47 pm

[...] speech tonight? Charles Boustany, himself a birther. From Bill Posey (R-PA) to Lou Dobbs (R-CNN), Liz Cheney to Sean Hannity, the far right is apparently much more eager to embrace the notion that a [...]


melaniemarsh
Comment posted September 29, 2009 @ 2:37 pm

She never said anything about whether or not he was born in the U.S., she was simply advocating for those people who question the facts surrounding this issue. Overall, she was addressing a much bigger question as to where our president's loyalty lies, based on actions he has indisputably took. As soon as the Democrats start distancing themselves from people like Michael Moore and people who believe the Bush administration pulled off 9/11, I will give be able to take their incredulity at “birthers” more seriously. Let me ask you, which would be harder to fake, a birth certificate or a national disaster of astronomic proportions coordinated by four different airplanes? A thinking person would naturally say the birth certificate, especially given that Osama Bin Laden had wanted to do something like this for years and has taken credit for it. Stop insinuating that people who dare to question Obama's motives are “poor” and “dumb”. If you want to have civilized conversation, as you say you do, citing Mr. Joe Wilson's comment of “you lie!” as uncivilized, even racist, then stop belittling the vast number of Americans who are simply concerned in the most sincere way about the direction this country is going in. It is a soft option to simply dismiss every critic as simply uninformed or frightened by scare tactics, as in the case of the health care debate. Please take a second to THINK in an unbiased fashion about what I have said and if you feel the need to respond please do so in a CIVILIZED fashion. That is the only way we as Americans will be able to pull together and stop the partisanship which is what the majority of Americans say they want…


mhperr
Comment posted September 30, 2009 @ 1:12 am

Can not wait for her to run, maybe she will answer al the questions about her crooked father he and Bush hushed up over eight years ago. She is a bigger idiot than her father, Bush or Sarah Palin's pathetic incompetent ass. It will be a pleasure for her to have to face the entire nation instead of hiding behind Repuclican carpetbaggers and taking cheap shots without having to face the world and it's scrutiny. Can not wait to vote against her either. She should team up with Sarah Palin and they can be cheerleaders for the crooked, Republican, State's Rights, carpetbaggers who are supporting them.


mhperr
Comment posted September 30, 2009 @ 1:43 am

Republicans started taking cheap shots at President Obama and his family, including the clothes his children wear, before the inaugaration. The attacks have been vicious and non stop before he ever made a speech as the president elect and they have not stopped. If there was this much discourse about the presidency during the Bush Cheney eight years, maybe we would have not ended up in two wars, high unemployment, banks needing bailouts, no relationships with the rest of the world and drug cartels fighting over who are going to send the most cocaine into the US. The Republicans have the most dismal record of failure, waste, mismanagement and greed in many many years. The republicans have nothing to discuss, they failed at everything for eight years in a row. What is there to discuss? The republicans are the one's who resorted to name-calling, verbal attacks, trying to hold town hall meetings hostage and drawing signs threatening to bring weapons to future town hall meetings and making carcatures of President Obama looking like Hitler. Where is the basis for rational serious discussion on issues? The last time I saw a map, Hawaii was still a part of the US so to question President Obama's right to run for president is mean spirited, low class and a farce against him, his family and the nation. The behavior of those disagree with the president is not simple discourse, it is threatening, mean and vicious and way beyond what is needed to make a point. I saw the swastica's, caricatures and foul names in the newspapers and on news channels. The behavior goes way beyond what was done when Bush pardoned Cheney by executive order, sent troops into Iraq, bailed out the savings and loans around the country and Wall Street. None of these problems were created by the current president, he inherited them from the republicans who were in power for the past eight years. To blame Obama for them is wrong and to threaten to bring assault rifles to the next town hall meeting is even more wrong.


melaniemarsh
Comment posted September 30, 2009 @ 1:36 pm

To over generalize Republicans as being all bad and Democrats all good or vice-versa is not a helpful discussion. Each party is made up of individuals. I voted for Bush twice and thought in the case of the Iraq war that he made the right decision. I did not agree with some of his fiscal decisions though. I do not blame Obama for everything that is facing our nation right now, nor do I blame Bush. Some decisions and situations are so nuanced that they can't be simply pinpointed as one or another person's “fault”. I do hold Obama responsible for the decisions he makes now as to what to do with them. As far as his right to be the president, I really do not question it. Whether I agree or not ,I respect and accept that he got the majority of votes of my fellow Americans and therefore deserves to be president. This is still a democracy and I am glad it is. I am just weary of being demonized for not bowing down to worship him. It seems any time anyone questions or raises a point that doesn't speak to Obama as being wonderful and always right they are automatically called a “racist” by someone or something not fit too print. I know that is not EVERY democrat, but is that really fair? I haven't heard of anyone threatening to bring an assault rifle to a town hall meeting, but if they did that is indefensible. All the outtakes of town hall meetings I have seen were comprised of people who were just sincerely concerned. So before you jump all over them for daring to speak out, ask yourself why are they really there. Could it be possible they are concerned for the safety of their elderly and sick family members if the health care system is vastly changed? Could it be possible that they are concerned about the further debt that their children and grandchildren might inherit? These are valid and shared human concerns. They should be allowed to show their concern in anyway that is non-violent.
The interesting thing about these town halls and this TEA party phenomenon is that for most of these people they have never been politically active before. It is simply that they feel things have gone too far and they are trying to let their voice be heard. And for every one that is speaking out at town halls and showing up at TEA parties there may be hundreds more at home who are echoing those same sentiments. I am one of them. I respect those people who are against the wars in Iraq and/or Afghanistan because I sense that the majority of them are concerned over the death tolls of our soldiers and the innocent Iraqi lives. It has been a costly war, so if you feel it was unjust you would be quite concerned. I am concerned about the president's advocation of a new healthcare system and especially one involving a public option. Why? Is it because I am a racist or I just don't like Obama? No, I lived in Canada for a year and saw their healthcare system as being much worse than ours. Now I know we are not Canada and we are not Great Brittain, but the concerns over their seriously dangerous inadequacies are fair to have. Do you really want a system in which people have to wait long periods of time for life-saving surgery? This is what I saw in Canada and have heard of in Great Brittain. Am I being a bigot to want to say “no thank you” to have the government involved even further with my very life? Whether you think these questions are valid or not, I am not coming from a place of anger, bigotry or partisanship. I have two children and I want to see them grow up in the safest, best nation on this earth. I think that is what we all want, even if we have disagreements on how to get there. So before you go over-arching on how “Republicans” are causing all the problems and are responsible for everything wrong in this country, try to think about the everyday average American citizen as he/she goes about their day. We're not all obsessed with how the first lady wears her hair or whether or not she wears shorts (by the way I think she should, as a Mom, the more comfortable the better). What I care about are the SUBSTANTIVE issues which are going to effect myself and my family in the coming decades. We could go on and on about how disrespectfully Bush was treated as president or how Obama has been charicatured as Hitler (Bush was called Hitler as well, the comparison is wrong in both cases) but arguing over whose party is the most underhanded and mean-spirited will get us nowhere. There are always going to be random lunatics on both sides. I will acknowledge this and try to respect those Democrats who are arguing from their heart and their soul in sincerity their cases and concerns for our country, will you do the same with their Republican counterparts?


mhperr
Comment posted September 30, 2009 @ 3:34 pm

Your comments have a more respectable feel to them than the general tone of the people getting the press with pictures of assault rifles on signs, and the rest of the overdone protests which appear to be threats against the president. Speaking out and disagreeing with eachother to find solutions is much different than the name calling and threats which the media enjoys promoting. But no one can deny the intensity of the attacks so early in the Obama presidency. This concerns me since they are overtly hostile and many times fabricated, distorted or overblown.

President Obama has been attacked for decisions he made and those he had not made yet. He is constantly called a Nazi, socialist and other names he has not been given a chance to live up (or down) to. I do not remember a sitting president being called a liar in a formal national address, which interrupted the proceedings. Bush made a lot of mistakes, but worse than honest mistakes any person may make, he deliberately lied to the American people about WMD and now we are bogged down in two major wars simultaneously. These wars are draining our economy of resources which are needed in many other areas.

The problem of voting along party lines is merely a symptom of the problems our country faces. As I stated earlier your comments does not come close to the tone of the hatefulness and mean-spirited attacks leveled at Obama who has yet to finish his first year in office. This nation will suffer for a long time to come because of the poor attitude of the last administration's decision to ignore the world and do what it (Bush)wanted to at home and abroad.

I do not consider myself “Liberal” but open-minded. I have no problem supporting any candidate who has good ideas and will be willing to fight to see them inacted on behalf of all people regardless of party affilliation. This is not what is happening in politics now. The names people are called are given weight by the tone in which they are mentioned as if Republican means more informed and more thoughtful, conservative is more spiritual and more value laden and liberal as meaning loose values and anything goes. This is not true and never has been.

The whole debate over what direction the conurty should ge can be helpful but not at the barrel of a gun or continued threats by any side against another. The sex scandals have shown us that integrity and accountability is needed throughout our political system. Threats will merely encourage people to take a hard line and entrench blind loyalty to party's which do not deserve support and protection.


David Ogden
Comment posted February 15, 2010 @ 3:31 pm

Liz Cheney is awesome. I'd love to see her run for President.


David Ogden
Comment posted February 15, 2010 @ 8:31 pm

Liz Cheney is awesome. I'd love to see her run for President.


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The Birthers: Who Are They and What Do They Want? | SomaliWeekly News
Pingback posted April 23, 2011 @ 12:28 am

[...] to keep the base riled up, and maybe to win the attention of a few more suckers. From Lou Dobbs to Liz Cheney to Camile Paglia to Sean Hannity, hacks who don’t give a shit will throw the birthers a bone [...]


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