Congress Unlikely to Reform Root Cause of Economic Crisis

By
Monday, June 08, 2009 at 6:00 am
Sen. Chris Dodd (D-Conn.)

Sen. Chris Dodd (D-Conn.) (WDCpix)

Not long after foreclosures started to take off in 2007 and the mortgage market’s collapse began to cripple the economy, one lesson seemed obvious: The predatory lending practices that led to the crisis had to be reined in.

But despite massive government bailouts of banks and lenders due to losses from toxic mortgages, that reform still hasn’t happened. As the Obama administration urges lawmakers to quickly enact sweeping health care legislation this summer, the momentum to halt abusive lending practices and overhaul mortgage lending, by contrast, has stalled. A mortgage reform bill that passed the House in May was so complicated and contradictory it wound up angering some of the same consumer advocates who have been battling predatory lending. And – flaws and all – the measure isn’t likely to be taken up in the Senate anytime soon. Senate Banking Committee Chairman Christopher Dodd (D-Conn.) told reporters recently that mortgage reform will have to wait: “We’ve got a lot on our plate. We’ve got other things to do.” Dodd added that “There isn’t a lot of predatory lending going on right now… I’m not minimizing what happened before, and I don’t want to see a repetition of it, but there’s not subprime lending going on today.”

Illustration by: Matt Mahurin

Illustration by: Matt Mahurin

To many housing activists, the lack of action on the predatory lending bill is the final insult of a failed campaign to rapidly reform mortgage lending – something that once seemed like a slam dunk. First, a mortgage cramdown measure that would have forced lenders to write down loan amounts for borrowers in bankruptcy failed, after 12 Senate Democrats joined Republicans in refusing to support it. Then came dashed hopes for a more comprehensive predatory lending bill, and for quick action on it. To some, the window to tackle mortgage reform is open right now, and the time to act is before the housing market recovers and lending picks up again. The failure so far to do so, they worry, means little is being learned in Congress from the most severe financial crisis since the Great Depression – and even less progress is being made to ensure it doesn’t happen again.

“If there was anything that seemed like a sure bet, it was reforming mortgage lending,” said Alan White, a Valparaiso University law professor who studies subprime lending and foreclosures. “But the momentum seems to be fizzling. It’s certainly possible the subprime market could come back in some form someday, and I am surprised there hasn’t been more movement for real mortgage reform. The Blue Dog Democrats are being strong advocates for for the banking industry, and that makes it difficult for the more consumer-minded Democrats to get some kind of regulation passed.”

It gets even more complicated. Housing advocates aren’t eager to launch a high-profile campaign against Dodd over his relegation of the predatory lending bill to the back burner, given that Dodd is in the midst of a tough re-election battle. Should he lose, the next in line to head the Senate Banking committee would be Sen. Tim Johnson (S.D.), the only Senate Democrat to vote against Dodd’s credit card reform bill.

Beyond that, the House bill seems to have split the housing advocacy community, with some supporting it despite its drawbacks, and others strongly opposing it. The controversy is surprising, considering the measure was co-sponsored by Rep. Barney Frank (D-Mass.) chairman of the House Financial Services Committee, who has a history of consumer advocacy. As TWI has pointed out, Frank is trying to promote lending reforms without totally alienating the financial industry.

But it’s the housing advocates who are angry this time. Nine consumer, housing and civil rights groups, including the National Consumer Law Center and the National Association of Consumer Advocates, criticized Frank’s bill, saying it undermines existing state consumer protection laws. The NCLC said the bill would “do more harm than good” by pre-empting the state anti-predatory measures and by limiting the ability to sue Wall Street investment firms that buy up risky mortgages.

“The bill is complex, convoluted, and simply will not accomplish its main goal – to fundamentally change the way mortgages are made in this country,” the NCLC said in a statement.

The bill still won praise from some other consumer groups for prohibiting lenders from steering borrowers into higher cost loans and for requiring lenders to verify that borrowers have the ability to repay their mortgages, a long-sought goal of many housing advocates. And it bans pre-payment penalties, another fixture of subprime lending. But the bill doesn’t apply strong penalties for violating the law, and it includes the limits on legal challenges. The measure seems to have something in it for both mortgage lenders and consumer advocates, which only served to make everyone unhappy, Valparaiso’s White said.

Explained one advocate, who declined to go on the record in order to speak freely: “It’s the most complicated, arcane, ridiculous, confusing piece of crap any of us has ever seen.”

Other mortgage reforms also are running into complications. The National Association of Mortgage Brokers, for example, plans to restart a legal challenge to a new government approved code of conduct for appraisals, which is aimed at keeping lenders and brokers from pressuring appraisers to inflate home values. The new regulation stems from a mortgage fraud lawsuit by New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo. It went into effect May 1 and requires mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to only buy loans appraised under the new standard.

The NAMB and other industry groups, however, contend the regulation isn’t needed and only adds to the cost of buying a home. The NAMB plans to file another legal challenge soon to overturn the rule, after withdrawing an earlier attempt, said NAMB President Marc Savitt.

His group also continues opposing any changes in the way brokers get paid for making loans – something once considered an obvious target for reform.

An industry practice known as the yield spread premium, a form of sales commissions for mortgage brokers, has long been controversial, with consumer advocates contending some brokers misuse it to con borrowers into higher-rate mortgages. Frank’s bill appears to outlaw the yield spread premium – but no one’s entirely sure. “There are four different interpretations of the language right now,” Savitt said. Regardless, he said, “the yield spread premium and mortgage brokers are being used as scapegoats right now. Mortgage brokers don’t develop loan programs and don’t underwrite and approve loans, so how could this all be our fault?”

The problem for mortgage reform, said Margot Saunders, an attorney with the National Consumer Law Center, is that with mortgage brokers and mortgage originators in every congressional District, Congress has plenty of financial incentive to listen to arguments like that from the lending industry – and already does so. As the New York Times noted in an editorial on passage of the House anti-predatory lending measure: “The Senate needs to improve on the legislation and ensure that stronger reforms quickly become law. To do that, Senators will finally have to stand up to the mortgage industry and its all-too-well-paid lobbyists.”

Saunders and others say they’re trying to remain hopeful the Senate will take up mortgage reform again in the fall – but they’re not counting on it. “Congress,” said Saunders, “just acts like homeowners don’t matter.”

None of the current proposals, for example, even addresses the possibility of linking compensation to a loan’s performance, which would cut out incentives for brokers and lenders to make high-rate mortgages that borrowers can’t repay, Saunders said.

But some see some positive signs on reform. Both the Federal Reserve and the Federal Trade Commission are working on new rules for mortgages and other types of lending, which are expected to require greater disclosures of terms and rates. The Obama administration is backing a proposal to create a Financial Products Safety Commission, which would regulate mortgages, credit cards, and other kinds of lending by requiring more consumer protections.

And Congress may be slow to act on mortgage reform not because of lending industry opposition, but because “it’s incredibly complicated” to do so, and “Congress is running out of time” with so many other issues on its plate, said Bert Ely, a banking industry analyst.

Whatever the reason, Congress’ plate is full – and mortgage reform isn’t on it, at least in the near future. In the meantime, 5.4 million mortgages are delinquent or in some stage of foreclosure, and home prices continue to fall.

Comments

34 Comments

johnhkennedy
Comment posted June 8, 2009 @ 6:26 am

A Democratic Congress that refuses to Enforce Our Federal Laws and Protect Our Constitution
will never have the courage for real reform or the courage to get us Single Payer Health Care.

Push Congress to enforce Federal Law. Maybe we can train them to have courage.

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Mortgage, Mortgages - Start gets behind MABS deal to protect struggling mortgage holders - Independent « Mortgage
Pingback posted June 8, 2009 @ 8:31 am

[...] Congress Unlikely to Reform Root Cause of Economic Crisis – The Washington Independent.comNot long after foreclosures started to take off in 2007 and the mortgage market’s collapse began to cripple the economy, one lesson seemed obvious: The predatory lending practices that led to the crisis had to be reined in To many housing activists [...]


Mike Samson
Comment posted June 8, 2009 @ 8:41 am

Coumo put me out of business. No loan broker can call an appraiser and order an appraisal. They send it in to the lender (bank or such) and they find an appraiser or more likely send it to an appraisal management firm. They order the appraisal for a fee and keep some, I get less, by alot, and they get paid for my work and do nothing. If I don't like it I don't get work. So how did this Attorney in N.Y. get to put me out of business? (my phone does not ring much since May 1)…I got no help from any appraisal org.
Only NAMB tried to stop this crap.


Steve
Comment posted June 8, 2009 @ 8:56 am

Lets talk about a new law and forget the old ones. Better yet lets forget about the whole thing all together and hope it goes away. We have laws already in place under TILA with the amendment of HOPEA.

Example; A lender cannot put you in a loan based on fictitious income information that was grossly exaggerated in order to make it appear that you qualified for the loan. This is an illegal practice prohibited by state and federal law and a very common abuse perpetrated on the elderly.

Is this a law already in place or just some words Congress needs to examin next year.

PASSIVE is the economic solution. Ignore the peoples problems, blame it on them, and soon they'll go away.


Congress Unlikely to Reform Root Cause of Economic Crisis
Pingback posted June 8, 2009 @ 1:40 pm

[...] Government, Mortgage Market, Mortgages, News Sources, Predatory Lending Practices, Root Cause News Sources wrote an interesting post today onHere’s a quick excerptSen. Chris Dodd (D-Conn.) (WDCpix) [...]


CS
Comment posted June 8, 2009 @ 3:07 pm

Maybe we need to examine the possibility of creating or enforcing laws against lying, cheating, and stealing. That'd cover all these financial crimes that seem more often than not to be considered “civil matters' rather than criminal. When left to fight it individually in civil court or mandatory arbitration, consumers have little option but to throw in the towell. And if someone does finally hold a company accountable, it's still been overall profitable to lie, steal, and cheat. Even paying fines does no good. Jail time might. Consumers also need better education on financial and legal matters. The lack of accurate info about these things left far too many Americans vulnerable to mortgage scams and the illusion that real estate was their “investment.” Outrageous advertising campaigns by the industry to push homeownership should be considered fraud. Given that it is not seen that way by law, consumers need to know it is baloney, and not enough do.


Thomas
Comment posted June 9, 2009 @ 3:51 am

The only truly “predatory lender” out there, and the 800 lb. gorilla in the room, is the Federal Reserve Bank, whose massive artificial lowering of interest and injections of “cheap money” into the system between 2001 and 2006 was the root cause of the housing bubble and the predatory lenders you are all wringing your hands about. When does the consumer get som blame? I mean, when else in history could an auto mechanic afford a 4500 sq ft McMansion? When did common sense fly out the window?

End the Fed, end the problem.


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Comment posted June 9, 2009 @ 2:31 pm

it seems to be endless crisis :(


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Comment posted June 9, 2009 @ 2:32 pm

but what should the Americans do to get out of it?


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Comment posted June 9, 2009 @ 2:33 pm

in co operation wit others,sure they will get the solutions.


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Comment posted June 9, 2009 @ 2:35 pm

alone,the americans will be ever imprisoned with that fatal crisis.


Understanding Government » Blog Archive » ENOUGH ABOUT CEO PAY
Pingback posted June 10, 2009 @ 11:47 am

[...] and Congress have not acted to kill the subprime mortgage market, have not suggested putting a cap on interest rates, and have not really engaged reform of credit [...]


The Intelligence Report Media
Comment posted June 10, 2009 @ 11:02 am

There is alot that is not being reported these days.
What many people do not know,is the government forced alot of the banks to take tarp money when they didn't even need it…This was done through Henry Paulson when he called them all to Washington back in October of 2008…If told them then,if you don't take the money we will force you with more regulations.
The main cause of this economic down turn is the subprime lending markets…Fannie Mae And Freddie Mac…This problem would have cured itself if the government had not stuck it's nose where it didn't belong and is forbidden to be by the constitution…Obama has spent billions of our tax dollars and it has done exactly what the economists said it would do…and that is nothing….As far as mortgage reform goes..there will not be any…If people would do their research they would find out that the Obama administration and this congress..both sides of the isle are blowing smoke and lying on a daily basis to the american people,,and the programs and spending that has gone on is going to special interest groups that do nothing for the economy what so ever…Do we all remember Obama's shovel ready projects??….There is no such thing..it takes years to make a construction plan to build roads and bridges or to even fix a road..any construction you see going on now,would have went on anyways…The congress and the Obama administration have clearly overstepped their bounds with the american peoples money!


Rein Hollar
Comment posted June 11, 2009 @ 11:53 am

You are wasting time worrying about another subprime meltdown. You have to be made of gold to get a mortgage at any banking institution today. Congress caused the problem by pushing banks to make loans to people that were never qualified in the name of “minorities need help too”. I think everyone learned that giving things to minorities does not help anyone. In any event, the real problem in America is HOUSING and the administration has given up helping anyone other than the unions and special interest groups that got them elected. Here is a reasonable solution that will get America back on its feet and help the people in America that really need it:

SOLUTION:

1. Make the interest everyone pays on their home mortgage a “TAX CREDIT” instead of a tax deduction (immediate income into the hands of all homeowners to allow them to continue paying their mortgage). This could be capped at $12,000 to $15,000 per mortgage and still be extremely effective. People would immediately have an extra $1000 per month to help pay their mortgage or BUY THINGS TO GET THE ECONOMY GOING AGAIN. Individuals with mortgages would not have to refinance (which they can’t do very well anyway due to the loss of value in their homes which won’t allow them to refi) and they would still get major relief.

2. Make the interest individuals receive on Mortgage Backed Securities “TAX FREE”. This will cause investors to be more inclined to buy mortgage back securities in light of the newer lending guidelines and their increased yield based on valuing their investment as tax free. Part of the real estate problem is the lack of liquidity and the fact that investors are reluctant to buy mortgage backed securities. By giving the investors (401 k’s retirement funds, individuals, etc) the benefit of tax free yields they will buy MBS’s.

3. Make the Capital Gains on homes purchased after January 1, 2009, “ZERO” if held for at least 3 years (this includes all home purchases to include investment property, personal residence’s, second homes, etc). This should spur home buying by individuals and investors and the rate could be reinstated at some year in the future when America stabilizes. One could argue that the Government will lose money on future gains in the market but if something isn’t’ done there will be no gains to tax anyway.

The solutions will cost the Federal government, to some degree, in lost revenue but it will at least put money right down to the individual that needs it the most (the average homeowner still tying to make his payments), restore confidence in real estate as an investment (people will buy mortgage backed securities’ again), and investors will see real estate as a preferred investment due to the capital gains savings.

If you don’t fix real estate, all other areas of the economy will continue to suffer.


John Milano
Comment posted June 11, 2009 @ 4:45 pm

Mr. Dodd,

Please try to understand the YSP is not what caused the mortgage meltdown. I have been in mortgage banking for over 23 years and have been lucky to recieve very good training, and I must say very conservative mortgage banking training. You see whether I work for a Bank, mortgage bank or broker it does not change how I originate loans. You can give me layers of management, processing and underwriting but it will still not change how I originate loans. Why? because every Bank, mortgage bank and broker pays this position by commision and each entitiy praises their top originator. This means that an unscrupolis person will find a way to sell their product and get paid, and in some cases handsomly. Want proof? Pick up any one of our trade magazines and read how the top originator is glamorized, kinda like a rock star. Some of the worst contributers actually worked for the Bank (I know this because I was a banking officer and know how they were componsated) and never had to worry about “full disclosure” another political favor. Now let me be very clear, some of these same originators that get paid handsomley are probably the best of the best. They help people buy a home, they are trained, they understand financing, they know how to present different options, they may even get people approved that have been declined by under trained, unprofessional telemarketers. As a matter of fact , why do most people want to work with the best of the best in any industry (doctors, financial planners, etc) and are willing to pay whatever the going rate is but you feel that a mortgage originator should be capped at what they earn even though the world agrees this is the most expensive, life changing purchase they will ever make. You know why? Because of people like you. You should not take a persons ability to make a living away based on your view of mortgage lending, it goes much deeper as I am sure you know. It is very clear now that the dust has settlled that the mortgage broker has not created this meltdown. I ask that you stand up, be a man, and do the right thing. You should not put every Broker in the same pot, some are very good, some are even great. If you would like my support I am willing to give it, if you decline it will be noted. This message will make it's rounds.

Concerned,

John L. Milano


John Milano
Comment posted June 11, 2009 @ 4:55 pm

To all readers:

I need your support, I am willing to put my reputation on the line but I need help. I will be the voice for all of us, I will put in the time, I will try to fix the problem. I have two issues.. one is I need to be capitalized and every red cent will be accounted for, and number two, i will probably need a very good life insurance policy because I believe that honesty could be detromental to my health. If you want honest support please email me and lets talk.
john@centerpointemortgage.com


Sandy K Bratton
Comment posted June 12, 2009 @ 10:33 am

The playing field needs to be leveled for both banks and mortgage brokers. The banks are very quick to point out all the problems with the mortgage brokers however we do not create the loan programs, underwrite the loans, nor do we approve the loan. Most banks do not keep their mortgage loans on their books and are brokering their loans also. All the rules seem to be in question for the mortgage brokers and banks continue with business as usual. Banks are not required to disclose their yield spread premium, their loan officers are not required to have the education requirements imposed on the mortgage brokers ( which by the way I am in complete agreement of mandatory, extensive and continuing education for all!) A bank can hire anyone and put them to work as a loan officer, not so in the mortgage industry. In Oregon we have mandatory education requirements, testing, state audits of offices, registering of all loan originators with the State, criminal background checks and in our office additionally we require a credit report and it takes 3-4 months of training before an employee even takes an application from a borrower and that is after much studying and testing. I agree the sub prime lending had gotten way out of control, but not all mortgage brokers made sub prime loans. Most of us have always had our customers best interest at heart and have provided a great product and outstanding customer service for our clients. Many banks make mortgage loans for their customers thru default as they have a deposit relationship already with the customer, a mortgage broker has to earn each and every customer we provide a service for. They come to us specifically for our reputation in the lending arena! One last point I will comment on. The HVCC is not going to protect or make help the mortgage industry. All it has done is to create more income for the companies that we are now required to order appraisals from. The appraisers have to charge more to the customer so they can now pay a third party, appraisers that have a poor performance level now have a new lease on their business, it is taking 3-4 times longer to get an appraisal completed and we now have appraisers that are not even from our local area and know nothing about the community. This is a perfect example of someone making decisions/laws when they know nothing about the business and have not thought of the consequences of their actions!!! And to think this is all to help the consumer?????


JOHN VINCENTINI
Comment posted June 15, 2009 @ 11:33 am

I am pleased to say the government did the right thing today by not passing this . I would just like to know why Realitors can make 7% on a sale transaction and noone says anything . How about giving them some guidelines on what they can make . Mortgage brokers at the most can make only 4% in NYS and they wanted to cut that . on a 200000 dollar loan a Realitor can make 14000 . There goes the homeowners hard earned equity not to mention how the price of the house has to be higher so the home owner can at least get something . Maybe Realitors should have a limit on if the same realitor lists and sells the house there cap is 3.5 or 4 persent too. Hmmmmm The only thing that needs fixing is the crooks at the banks . Credit scores for mortgages are going up to qualify but the banks by lowering EVERYONES CREDIT LIMITS LATELY ARE CAUSING EVEN GREAT PAYING CUSTOMERS SCORES TO DROP 30 TO 50 FICO POINTS . THINK ABOUT THIS A CUSTOMER HAS 100000 AVAILABLE CREDIT ON HIS CREDIT FILE WHICH COUNTS FOR 35 TO 45 % OF HIS FICO SCORE AND ONLY OWES SAY 35000 ON ALL HIS REVOLVING CREDIT. SO HE IS AT 35%DEBT TO WHAT HE OWES. THEN WHAT BANKS HAVE BEEN DOING NOW IS LOWERING CUSTOMERS LIMIT TO SAY THIS GUY GETS IT LOWERED TO 50000 NOW HE IS LIKE ALMOST MAXED OUT. BOOM DOWN GOES HIS SCORE 30 TO 50PTS OR MORE AND HE DID NOTHING THE BANK DID. MORAL OF THE STORY IS CREDIT SCORES ARE LOWER AND BANKS GUIDELINES ARE TOUGHER THIS IS NOT HELPING OUR ECONOMY . FIX THE BANKS AND START HELPING CUSTOMERS THAT ARE DIVORCED SINGLE MOTHERS ECT… AND PEOPLE THAT HAVE BEEN PAYING THERE MORTGAGES ON TIME . NO MATTER WHAT THERE SCORE IS . THE OLD FHA GUIDELINES THAT SCORE DIDN'T MATTER WORKED FINE AND THE GOVERNMENT FHA LOANS FORCED PEOPLE TO PAY OF THERE COLLECTIONS ECT… THERE FORE CLEANING THERE CREDIT UP AND MAKING THEM RESPONSIBLE.


JOHN VINCENTINI
Comment posted June 15, 2009 @ 6:33 pm

I am pleased to say the government did the right thing today by not passing this . I would just like to know why Realitors can make 7% on a sale transaction and noone says anything . How about giving them some guidelines on what they can make . Mortgage brokers at the most can make only 4% in NYS and they wanted to cut that . on a 200000 dollar loan a Realitor can make 14000 . There goes the homeowners hard earned equity not to mention how the price of the house has to be higher so the home owner can at least get something . Maybe Realitors should have a limit on if the same realitor lists and sells the house there cap is 3.5 or 4 persent too. Hmmmmm The only thing that needs fixing is the crooks at the banks . Credit scores for mortgages are going up to qualify but the banks by lowering EVERYONES CREDIT LIMITS LATELY ARE CAUSING EVEN GREAT PAYING CUSTOMERS SCORES TO DROP 30 TO 50 FICO POINTS . THINK ABOUT THIS A CUSTOMER HAS 100000 AVAILABLE CREDIT ON HIS CREDIT FILE WHICH COUNTS FOR 35 TO 45 % OF HIS FICO SCORE AND ONLY OWES SAY 35000 ON ALL HIS REVOLVING CREDIT. SO HE IS AT 35%DEBT TO WHAT HE OWES. THEN WHAT BANKS HAVE BEEN DOING NOW IS LOWERING CUSTOMERS LIMIT TO SAY THIS GUY GETS IT LOWERED TO 50000 NOW HE IS LIKE ALMOST MAXED OUT. BOOM DOWN GOES HIS SCORE 30 TO 50PTS OR MORE AND HE DID NOTHING THE BANK DID. MORAL OF THE STORY IS CREDIT SCORES ARE LOWER AND BANKS GUIDELINES ARE TOUGHER THIS IS NOT HELPING OUR ECONOMY . FIX THE BANKS AND START HELPING CUSTOMERS THAT ARE DIVORCED SINGLE MOTHERS ECT… AND PEOPLE THAT HAVE BEEN PAYING THERE MORTGAGES ON TIME . NO MATTER WHAT THERE SCORE IS . THE OLD FHA GUIDELINES THAT SCORE DIDN'T MATTER WORKED FINE AND THE GOVERNMENT FHA LOANS FORCED PEOPLE TO PAY OF THERE COLLECTIONS ECT… THERE FORE CLEANING THERE CREDIT UP AND MAKING THEM RESPONSIBLE.


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Sheila
Comment posted June 23, 2009 @ 3:54 pm

It is foolish to think that mortgage reform is the root cause of the current economic crisis. The problem is predatory practices in lending. PERIOD. The availability of large amounts of credit to any and everyone regardless of their ability to repay created this crisis, whether they were buying houses, cars, clothing, vacations, groceries, or gasoline. The entire boom of the last 10 years appears in large part to have been fueled by people living well beyond their means.


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bobccc
Comment posted July 18, 2009 @ 12:13 pm

“housing advocacy group”…aka, ACORN! Just another arm of George Soros' involvement ..they are as crooked as anyone else involved in this fiasco!

My step-son was laid off, he called his mortgage co., they refused to take payments of interest only till he got back to work…when his Income tax return came in, he called them again to pay it up to date…they told him he wasn't in default yet, and that they had to wait till he was in default in order for him to make arrangements to pay!

He was furious and told them he didn't want to go into default!

I don't know who he finances with, but something sounds fishy to me!


webtasarimi
Comment posted August 16, 2009 @ 12:20 pm

housing advocacy group”…aka, ACORN! Just another arm of George Soros' involvement ..they are as crooked as anyone else involved in this fiasco!


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Comment posted September 11, 2009 @ 1:25 am

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Comment posted January 15, 2010 @ 12:14 am

although it is late but good to start


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Comment posted January 15, 2010 @ 5:14 am

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Comment posted July 30, 2010 @ 2:42 pm

My step-son was laid off, he called his mortgage co., they refused to take payments of interest only till he got back to work…when his Income tax return came in, he called them again to pay it up to date…they told him he wasn't in default yet, and that they had to wait till he was in default in order for him to make arrangements to pay!


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Comment posted July 30, 2010 @ 2:44 pm

He was furious and told them he didn't want to go into default!


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Comment posted August 5, 2010 @ 7:49 am

although it is late but good to start


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